Bad Luck or Bad Recruiting

[Macca 17,113]

Putting aside those players picked outside the top 5, (where "expectations" for an A grade player is much lower) does anyone genuinely believe that any of Sylvia, McLean, Morton, Watts, Scully, Trengove or Toumpas would have become A grade footballers if they had have been developed elsewhere? (there's still time for Jimmy and 1 or 2 others to become very good players but not sure about A grade)

In my opinion you could put these players in the best system in the world and they might not have gotten a great deal better. That's not to say that our level of development has been "par excellence" - it hasn't.

A top player is self driven and has the natural ability to back it up. We've simply been dreadfully unlucky with our drafting of top 5 prospects. It's easy to play the blame game but sometimes there's no easy answer to a complex set of circumstances.

These kids that are drafted at 17 years old are too young to evaluate with any sort of level of accuracy. The results speak for themselves and it's not just our club that picks the "wrong" candidates.

Edited August 23, 2014 by Macca

[jnrmac 20,276]

What are you now? Peter Sellers as Chauncy Gardener??

I can buy the best plants from the best nursery - if i stick them into my poor soil at home and don't water them or give them nutrients - they whither and die - nothing more certain.

[Axis of Bob 11,906]

I can't agree with any argument that says that we have excessively valued outside skill and pace over inside grunt.

If you look at our team now, we are competitive in one area (inside ball winning) and woefully uncompetitive in the other (carrying and using the footy). I know that it is more popular to drip your testosterone around yelling about how we are too soft, but the reality is that we are losing because we lack running power and skill, not grunt.

I hope that we look at drafting some runners who can use the footy and get into space, rather than getting more inside grunt.

[old dee 24,003]

I can't agree with any argument that says that we have excessively valued outside skill and pace over inside grunt.

If you look at our team now, we are competitive in one area (inside ball winning) and woefully uncompetitive in the other (carrying and using the footy). I know that it is more popular to drip your testosterone around yelling about how we are too soft, but the reality is that we are losing because we lack running power and skill, not grunt.

I hope that we look at drafting some runners who can use the footy and get into space, rather than getting more inside grunt.

I hope we recruit players who can hand pass 5 metres to position and hit their team mate and not his boot laces, a metre over his head, behind or in front of him. Being able to hit a target 20 metres away by foot would also help.

Beyond that I don't care what position they play, if they are socially reprehensible, kick their cat , swear at their mother or are racist .

[Little Goffy 14,754]

Those players you listed would all be better at other clubs, despite the fact that just about every player to leave Melbourne in recent years has not improved under the development of their new clubs?

Petterd

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2009), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Richmond is clearly the best of his career.

Martin

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2011), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Brisbane is clearly the best of his career.

Rivers

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2004), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Geelong is clearly the best of his career.

Bennell

Well... it is only his first season at West Coast. But his numbers are better than any previous season and he has played all but one game. I guess we'll see this weekend.

Of course, then there's the pile of players who went to other clubs and never saw the light of day there either, like Morton, Gysberts,

The results for players leaving Melbourne are mixed and do not show a consistent pattern. But there are definitely recent cases where ex-Melbourne players have gone on to much better times at their new club.

[titan_uranus 25,176]

Petterd

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2009), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Richmond is clearly the best of his career.

Martin

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2011), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Brisbane is clearly the best of his career.

Rivers

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2004), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Geelong is clearly the best of his career.

Bennell

Well... it is only his first season at West Coast. But his numbers are better than any previous season and he has played all but one game. I guess we'll see this weekend.

Of course, then there's the pile of players who went to other clubs and never saw the light of day there either, like Morton, Gysberts,

The results for players leaving Melbourne are mixed and do not show a consistent pattern. But there are definitely recent cases where ex-Melbourne players have gone on to much better times at their new club.

This is Bennell's second season with West Coast.

I'd agree with you on Petterd and Martin, but I don't think this year is Rivers' best of his career. I just think he's going OK. Also, it's quite difficult to compare any season of his at Geelong with any season of his with us. Which is part of the problem with comparing draftees, too.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Petterd

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2009), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Richmond is clearly the best of his career.

Martin

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2011), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Brisbane is clearly the best of his career.

Rivers

Despite showing great promise early on (especially 2004), he never took the next step with us. His second season at Geelong is clearly the best of his career.

Bennell

Well... it is only his first season at West Coast. But his numbers are better than any previous season and he has played all but one game. I guess we'll see this weekend.

Of course, then there's the pile of players who went to other clubs and never saw the light of day there either, like Morton, Gysberts,

The results for players leaving Melbourne are mixed and do not show a consistent pattern. But there are definitely recent cases where ex-Melbourne players have gone on to much better times at their new club.

I forgot about Rivers, he has been good for Geelong but easily won the Rising Star at Melbourne and was better then.

I agree about Martin but and whilst Petterd has been solid for Richmond he had been no better than at Melbourne.

[jnrmac 20,276]

Every one of our players that has left has gone to a better side.....

[Moneider96 1,045]

Every one of our players that has left has gone to a better side.....

lol

who is exactly worse than us that they could go to?

Edited August 23, 2014 by Moneider96

[Deecisive 1,709]

we have recruited the same as every other club, it defies logic to think that we have gotten every pick wrong. The difference between us and other clubs is obviously our culture and development. We take a good potential player and do not develop him we allow them to cruise along, whereas in other clubs you need to work hard to earn a spot in their side sometimes waiting several years. We often played our new recruits early as we often lacked quality players. We have often had to pay players up front to use our salary cap potentially giving these guys a level of comfort that they would not get elsewhere. How many times have you seen players playing badly or playing not so well then turn it on for the last few games and then resign then go back to their old ways once the new season starts.

At the same time a lot of bottom clubs have had their first round draft picks come in and have an immediate impact on the game, where as ours have not, this I think is a factor of they type of players we draft, we have tended to go for the lean greyhound look rather than the something more solid worker with reliable skills. I would love to see the MFC come out and say how they are going to improve their development process for younger players, so that supporters and would be draftees have a better idea of what we are doing. Obviously the $wan$ academy would provide us with some ideas on what we could do. Is there anything to actually stop us doing something like that, it may allow us to develop a few youngsters who may have allegiance to the club for taking them in and teaching them.

[Bendigo Demon 115]

It's recruiting, not development.

If players like Gysberts, Morton and Maric were any good they would have thrived under the development at their new clubs but they didn't. Martin is probably the only current former Melbourne player who is playing better at his new club than at Melbourne.

I don't agree Clint. By the time these kids get to a new club, they are so far behind what is expected in every facet of their development as professional footballers they are lost causes. With Martin, as good as he is playing, he still would not have got a game at Brisbane except that the 2 ruckmen in front of him got injured. Crazy I know, considering his performances since he has returned.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I don't agree Clint. By the time these kids get to a new club, they are so far behind what is expected in every facet of their development as professional footballers they are lost causes. With Martin, as good as he is playing, he still would not have got a game at Brisbane except that the 2 ruckmen in front of him got injured. Crazy I know, considering his performances since he has returned.

If they had talent they would thrive at their new clubs. Players are very quick to adapt.

[titan_uranus 25,176]

If they had talent they would thrive at their new clubs. Players are very quick to adapt.

That's a silly blanket statement.

Taking away a player's key development years, inhibiting their growth, drilling into them terrible standards, and having them swept into a swamp of mediocrity, can only have a negative impact on anyone. Some will be able to make an adjustment but it should be perfectly understandable if other players have their careers severely hampered due to being here and going nowhere when they should be blossoming.

[Redleg 41,952]

I can't agree with any argument that says that we have excessively valued outside skill and pace over inside grunt.

If you look at our team now, we are competitive in one area (inside ball winning) and woefully uncompetitive in the other (carrying and using the footy). I know that it is more popular to drip your testosterone around yelling about how we are too soft, but the reality is that we are losing because we lack running power and skill, not grunt.

I hope that we look at drafting some runners who can use the footy and get into space, rather than getting more inside grunt.

Agree. Last week as in quite a few games we won the contested possession but butchered the ball and turned it over.

We don't have the pace or skill to hurt sides. Apparently Stretch would be a good start in that area. We need quite a few more. Then we need some fit key forwards to straighten us up.

[dee-luded 2,959]

I can't agree with any argument that says that we have excessively valued outside skill and pace over inside grunt.

If you look at our team now, we are competitive in one area (inside ball winning) and woefully uncompetitive in the other (carrying and using the footy). I know that it is more popular to drip your testosterone around yelling about how we are too soft, but the reality is that we are losing because we lack running power and skill, not grunt.

I hope that we look at drafting some runners who can use the footy and get into space, rather than getting more inside grunt.

I don't think people want us to draft all inunders.

I think the people are saying they don't want anymore choirboys who are too afraid to mix it when they must.

I think the masses want us to recruit inside runners, those who will play hard & run hard. simple really. but they have to have the odor of testosterone & not Chanel No.5 .

we're really getting into the area of talking about the club winning back the trust of its supporters after a terminal amount of poor results over 50 Years. & deflating players.

they don't want anymore moloneys, or anymore gysberts cooks mortons.

[ILLDieADemon 804]

I'm on the bad luck side.

If you think about it there are around 800 players in the AFL that range from 18 to 35 years of age and there are 100 new players drafted each year. Considering the average AFL player career is 6 years they are pretty low odd to get a 10 year player let alone an A Class player out of the draft.

 

[Return to Glory 8,453]

Now I don't know if this has been posted before as I was just sent it....but some reasonably funny albeit tragic reminders.