Neeld is not the problem

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

An average losing margin of 74 points =12.38 goals. Can someone please tell me, in history of the AFL/VFL, has any other team been so poor 9 rounds in? Maybe University? Doesn't matter, they're not here any more and have not been around for eons.

No doubt the players must shoulder some blame, but if you lack a leader/coach, a FD which is cohesive and has a vision which is shared and bought into by the players and an administration which hums along as it should, then you have a massive problem, which must be fixed. If you do not have the personnel which can fix it, then the ones you do have, must move on. Simple as that.

What confronts us now is basically unprecedented. Something drastic has to take place.

[66frank 63]

I hate the AFL with a passion, but I can't wait for them to take us over.

I'm sick to death of all the spin thats been spewed out over the last 50 years by everyone including present and past boards and supporters (including myself) .

I'm a 40+ year member and I now DEMAND progress, I don't care how its achieved!

Edited May 26, 2013 by 66frank

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

An average losing margin of 74 points =12.38 goals. Can someone please tell me, in history of the AFL/VFL, has any other team been so poor 9 rounds in? Maybe University? Doesn't matter, they're not here any more and have not been around for eons.

No doubt the players must shoulder some blame, but if you lack a leader/coach, a FD which is cohesive and has a vision which is shared and bought into by the players and an administration which hums along as it should, then you have a massive problem, which must be fixed. If you do not have the personnel which can fix it, then the ones you do have, must move on. Simple as that.

What confronts us now is basically unprecedented. Something drastic has to take place.

Yes GWS

Let me preface what I am going to say, by saying I went to Crown to watch the game on the big screen, I walked out 5 minutes before half time, absolutely disgusted by what I saw

Unfortunately for the next few days we are going to have topic after topic, with page after page of the same thing, what is it going to achieve, nothing, personally I regard the playing list as a shot duck mentally, it is going to take a lot of hard work to get it anywhere near being a conistent side

But I also don't think drastic changes to anything at the Club is going to be the answer.

I think the problem is nobody, from the President downwards, has any idea why, when we send a side out who have been professionally prepared with structures and game plan in place, it all falls to bits so easily, does anybody on here apart from blaming the coach, we are fit enough, we have enought skilful players.....it is not the game plan, because that is so basic....so what is it, it is not the players not playing for Neeld, that is a cop out

You can see Neeld and his team being as frustrated as the supporters, he doesn't want to have the whole team behind the ball for the whole game, but we needed it yesterday

The only glimmer of hope yesterday and I didn't watch it, was the report we went back to some semblance of structures etc in the third quarter, the playrers pulled their finger out and we actually won a quarter

We have some talent on our list, but to see them not produce it is galling

[Red N Blue Society 165]

I hate the AFL with a passion, but I can't wait for them to take us over.

I'm sick to death of all the spin thats been spewed out over the last 50 years by everyone including present and past boards and supporters (including myself) .

I'm a 40+ year member and I now DEMAND progress, I don't care how its achieved!

I wholeheartledly agree.

We will still be the Demons.

We will still be Red N Blue.

We will still be Melbourne.

Bring in the AFL to run us. Because we clearly cant function with the people there now while all these other clubs flourish and win.

Oust the clowns who dont demand effort & consistancy and a winning culture and most of all A FLAG!

I too have been a member for a long time in 25 years. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! We are not here to be ridiculed any longer by opposition fans and clubs and the media.

This year was looking so good for me personally before it began...Now if I'm watching on Tv I turn off before qtr time...I cant watch it. Its pure rubbish.

To any MFC club board members reading this....its so bad right now I cannot see a light at the end of the tunnel period.

We as Members BLEEEEEED for you!!!!!! HOW ABOUT YOU BLEED FOR US!!!!!

Sorry Demonlanders...my pain is at its threshold now..Im mentally tired from our club.

[Grand New Flag 3,227]

We got rid of 14 players last year - we can't get rid of the whole list.

If we have any chance of a furure it is by giving the players and supporters a clean slate (hope) and that starts with the coach leaving - then players/coaches rs with bad attituteds etc.

Add to that the 12 we go rid of in 2011 and Neeld is responsible for turning over 26 of 42 players. More than half the list.

Make no mistake, these are Neelds hand picked troops. If he picked players that can't play, are not up to it, and most importantly don't try, then THIS IS HIS FAULT.

He needs to be put out of his misery.

[Grand New Flag 3,227]

Yes GWS

Let me preface what I am going to say, by saying I went to Crown to watch the game on the big screen, I walked out 5 minutes before half time, absolutely disgusted by what I saw

Unfortunately for the next few days we are going to have topic after topic, with page after page of the same thing, what is it going to achieve, nothing, personally I regard the playing list as a shot duck mentally, it is going to take a lot of hard work to get it anywhere near being a conistent side

But I also don't think drastic changes to anything at the Club is going to be the answer.

I think the problem is nobody, from the President downwards, has any idea why, when we send a side out who have been professionally prepared with structures and game plan in place, it all falls to bits so easily, does anybody on here apart from blaming the coach, we are fit enough, we have enought skilful players.....it is not the game plan, because that is so basic....so what is it, it is not the players not playing for Neeld, that is a cop out

You can see Neeld and his team being as frustrated as the supporters, he doesn't want to have the whole team behind the ball for the whole game, but we needed it yesterday

The only glimmer of hope yesterday and I didn't watch it, was the report we went back to some semblance of structures etc in the third quarter, the playrers pulled their finger out and we actually won a quarter

We have some talent on our list, but to see them not produce it is galling

The game plan is a significant factor.

[DemonOX 8,801]

Add to that the 12 we go rid of in 2011 and Neeld is responsible for turning over 26 of 42 players. More than half the list.

Make no mistake, these are Neelds hand picked troops. If he picked players that can't play, are not up to it, and most importantly don't try, then THIS IS HIS FAULT.

He needs to be put out of his misery.

We also need to be put out of our misery GNF.

[Gorgoroth 13,024]

If this was his first year I'd agree, but in your second year you can't get the players to try. You have failed as a coach.

Neeld tried to do the right thing and down the track we will acknowledge his part in getting us Dawes, Clark and Hogan.

But it comes down to getting the best out of the players and in that Neeld fails week after week.

Other than 1 good quarter we would be winless this year.

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

The game plan is a significant factor.

Is that the only feeback I get, sort of proves my point doesn't it, the game plan is basic

[Pipefitter 2,168]

Neeld is not the sole problem. He's one of the many problems. We are basically back to 2008 now. We are only 9 rounds into a rebuild remembering Neeld came into a club that was marketed as the best available coaching job. 4 years into a rebuild, ready for someone to come in a reap the rewards of baileys work. Neeld got nothing out of that list. So now he is building Neelds list. Sure there were holes in our list, but a full rebuild? I don't think it was needed. A capable coach would have got us close to finals last year. Instead here we are, lower than we've ever been.

So do you give the guy benefit of the doubt to see out his contract remembering he will only be 2 years into the rebuild where results like the weekend are expected (as they were in 08-09)? Or do we say sorry buddy, you've made way too many mistakes already and we don't trust you to improve your decision making skills to get this team to where it should be?

Neeld is a Huge problem. The anger displayed at him from supporters is like none I've ever seen at this club. It can't be healthy for him, and it's not healthy at supporters. We shouldn't be hating our coach and our players. But as he says, "it is what it is". Yes it's unfair that Neeld is copping the brunt of 6 years of frustration from the supporters but the situation has reached tipping point. We needed the best leader we could possibly find, we unfortunately ended up with this guy.

2 interviews with players moved on last year and playing reasonable footy at the moment (moloney and petterd) that really confirm some of our fears of neelds man management skills. They both credit this years form to a coach that believed in them. The answers in the interviews were almost identical.

Neeld will go, and I hope for his sakes it's sooner rather than later. We have to remember this guy is a human, has a family. It would be pretty horrible being mark Neeld. I really can't imagine what he is going through. The guy has the right intentions, has come in with his vision and he's style of tough leadership he thought was required to turn it around.

I honestly think one of the big problems is the admin wanted to bring in someone to change the sick culture of the club when it was obvious our football department is the reason for this horrible culture. It's poor, unorganised, unprofessional, no structure. Peter Jackson has already identified this. Neeld you will go, but rest assured the rest of the clowns in the office will be Walking out with you.

[machine11 142]

hannath got selected before we could recruit him.

And who agreed to 3 yr contracts for Jamar, Pederson and McKenzie.

Who recruited Gillies, Rodan, Byrnes and Pederson and failed to leave a spot on the list for Jack Hannath.

The Coach.

[jazza 1,323]

The game plan is a significant factor

the gameplan has nothing to do with poor performance

lookaway handballs are something the harlem globetrotters do, i was disgusted with this behavior yesterday

jamar and frawley just dont try when the going gets tough, this was evident last year and this

j howe looks to have improved and gone from a high marking bit player ,fitness looks better and skills are improving

the gameplan becomes irrelevent when the fd is now looking at what we have and what we dont have,

clearly we have senoir players who dont work hard enough on the field to set examples, thier giving themselves and the club

nothing . a poor showing to the young men on this list.

[titan_uranus 25,045]

The OP is both right and wrong.

Neeld is not the sole problem. Those who suggest otherwise are being too simplistic.

However, Neeld is definitely a source of our problems. He cannot escape liability for his poor game-day coaching, his poor PR, his poor player selection, and his apparent inability to implement his gameplan or instil confidence.

Let's not howl down the OP for showing support for the coach. But, Dr M, I don't think it's correct to absolve Neeld of all blame.

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

Moloney is being made to look good by Simon Black, interesting that Brisbane are playing well when Black is back at full fitness

Petterd was given a role, he still was making the same mistakes as when he was a Dees player

Jack Hannath was going to be rookied, the Fremantle interest was unknown

Neeld won't give a toss about abuse being hurled at him by supporters

To categorize people who are trying to do their job under stress as 'clowns' really shows class, try being a bit constructive rather than destructive

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

The OP is both right and wrong.

Neeld is not the sole problem. Those who suggest otherwise are being too simplistic.

However, Neeld is definitely a source of our problems. He cannot escape liability for his poor game-day coaching, his poor PR, his poor player selection, and his apparent inability to implement his gameplan or instil confidence.

Let's not howl down the OP for showing support for the coach. But, Dr M, I don't think it's correct to absolve Neeld of all blame.

the gameplan has nothing to do with poor performance

lookaway handballs are something the harlem globetrotters do, i was disgusted with this behavior yesterday

jamar and frawley just dont try when the going gets tough, this was evident last year and this

j howe looks to have improved and gone from a high marking bit player ,fitness looks better and skills are improving

the gameplan becomes irrelevent when the fd is now looking at what we have and what we dont have,

clearly we have senoir players who dont work hard enough on the field to set examples, thier giving themselves and the club

nothing . a poor showing to the young men on this list.

Jazza, you are wasting your time, posters on here don't really care about the Club, they only care that they support a winning team, when it is not winning they turn on it

Agree I thought Jamar's game was the worst I have ever seen him play, the fact that he is fitter than he has ever been shows that it is all mental

[biggestred 5,140]

yesterday the players were mentally broken after freo KICKED THEIR 2nd GOAL!!!!

we are soooo poor mentally its not funny.

the Richmond player who said the easiest team to play was us because they knew we would break eventually was spot on.

and the worst thing? this has nothing to do with skill level and everything to do with attitude and mental fortitude.

WE HAVE NONE OF IT AND IT DISGUSTS ME

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

The game plan is a significant factor.

GNF - you'd find this hard to believe but I don't disagree with a lot of what you have to say - but some statement I think are just silly as it is not as simple as 1 problem that is wrong with MFC

Like the above one - A game plan as a style of play a team wishes to execute (in basic broad terms). When 18 pr22 players getting beaten in every 1 v 1 contest or if the team only truns up for 1 qtr please elobarate to me what you think the coaching staff can do to implement their game plan when every (bar probably a handfull) player on the ground is getting beaten in their positions

We had no winners on any line of the ground (none in defese, mids or forwards could put their hands up and say we won our position)

I think it is pretty shallow thinking if you believe the team is executing to Neelds game plan. I don't think they are executing a game plan at all.

I'm pretty sure Neeld and others said at the start of the game in the Fox lead up you can't just bomb - All i saw all game was players boming the ball to position - are the players taking the [censored] or do they not listen to instructions??? WTF

We played ok in the 3rd when Freo dropped their pressure - I can only assume there is too much work left to do by too few players

I think Neeld needs to be blamed for the state of the team but at least acknowledge that the MFC played 1 qtr of comepetitive footy and it took them until the 3rd qtr to do it and that is what angers met he most

Analyise the 3rd qtr game style to get an idea of the game plan - the rest is unacceptable rubbish

Edited May 27, 2013 by Unleash Hell

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Jazza, you are wasting your time, posters on here don't really care about the Club, they only care that they support a winning team, when it is not winning they turn on it

Agree I thought Jamar's game was the worst I have ever seen him play, the fact that he is fitter than he has ever been shows that it is all mental

That is so wrong, It insults me and others on here who have supported this club, been members of it and been there through all the bad times. We have parted with our hard earned mate. In my case I have been a member for 43 years. I say that for no other reason, but that it is fact. Any supporter has a right to expect their team to give something back. More importantly, we feel for the players. We don't want our guys suffering in the way they must be right now.

Do not ever accuse me of not caring bout my footy club. It is because I care so much, that I want to see the changes which are necessary.

Fellini - Satyricon (1969) More at IMDbPro

In first century Rome, two student friends, Encolpio and Ascilto, argue about ownership of the boy Gitone, divide their belongings and split up. The boy, allowed to choose who he goes with, chooses Ascilto. Only a sudden earthquake saves Encolpio from suicide. We follow Encolpio through a series of adventures, where he is eventually reunited with Ascilto, and which culminates in them helping a man kidnap a hermaphrodite demi-god from a temple. The god dies, and as punishment Encolpio becomes impotent. We then follow them in search of a cure. The film is loosely based on the book Satyricon by Gaius Petronius Arbiter, the "Arbiter of Elegance" in the court of Nero. The book has only survived in fragments, and the film reflects this by being very fragmentary itself, even stopping in mid-sentence.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

yesterday the players were mentally broken after freo KICKED THEIR 2nd GOAL!!!!

we are soooo poor mentally its not funny.

the Richmond player who said the easiest team to play was us because they knew we would break eventually was spot on.

and the worst thing? this has nothing to do with skill level and everything to do with attitude and mental fortitude.

WE HAVE NONE OF IT AND IT DISGUSTS ME

Yep weak mind set no doubt - I don't like potting players but L Dunn leads that pack

So many example from the Freo game highlight your point biggestred - MFC players look for easy targets - they don't back their skill

Look at the Cats, Freo, Swans they can hit a man in a zone who leads up and has a player on them - MFC players don't even look to use these blokes - how many times from kick ins or defense did MFC take the easy option and bomb to the Freo zones?? Thats not game plan, that is soft execution.

Neeld is not blameless in this but with all the anger some other factor need to be pointed out

I don't know how to communicate this without the video but our skill level and execution is Surburban footy level - then we drop our heads and the game is over

[Fat Tony 5,276]

Moloney is being made to look good by Simon Black

Moloney's worst two games of the year have been the last two weeks and those were the only games in which Black has started on the ground.

[rpfc 28,781]

In many ways we have a great number of peope to blame for where we are at, perhaps too many to make blame worthwhile. From trades made long ago, to kids we didn't pick up for sanctions, to missed opportunities in important drafts, to a bad culture formented over generations, to poor list management, to never rectifying our lack of a midfield, to spurning Junior McDonald, to playing to players fears of their own incompetence and lack of experience.

Neeld is not to blame for any of that save for the last one and some small things here and there.

But he will, as all coaches do, see his destiny defined by what we do on the field. And what we have done on the field can be summed up in many words - none of them pleasant...

The confidence that has been shattered since 186 was never repaired and while I don't want Jackson to act on Neeld until he knows what to do with the FD, I knew after the Essendon game that the MFC would move on before 2014.

Our players and not great, they are not world beaters, but they can do more and play better than what they have shown. Is this entirely Neeld's fault? No, but he will own it.

And that is footy.

Edited May 27, 2013 by rpfc

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

That is so wrong, It insults me and others on here who have supported this club, been members of it and been there through all the bad times. We have parted with our hard earned mate. In my case I have been a member for 43 years. I say that for no other reason, but that it is fact. Any supporter has a right to expect their team to give something back. More importantly, we feel for the players. We don't want our guys suffering in the way they must be right now.

Do not ever accuse me of not caring bout my footy club. It is because I care so much, that I want to see the changes which are necessary.

Fellini - Satyricon (1969) More at IMDbPro

In first century Rome, two student friends, Encolpio and Ascilto, argue about ownership of the boy Gitone, divide their belongings and split up. The boy, allowed to choose who he goes with, chooses Ascilto. Only a sudden earthquake saves Encolpio from suicide. We follow Encolpio through a series of adventures, where he is eventually reunited with Ascilto, and which culminates in them helping a man kidnap a hermaphrodite demi-god from a temple. The god dies, and as punishment Encolpio becomes impotent. We then follow them in search of a cure. The film is loosely based on the book Satyricon by Gaius Petronius Arbiter, the "Arbiter of Elegance" in the court of Nero. The book has only survived in fragments, and the film reflects this by being very fragmentary itself, even stopping in mid-sentence.

Which bit don't you get the players are the problem at the moment, if you know how to fix the obvious baggage they are carrying then let Mark Neeld and the rest of the coaching staff know, because they are not sending them out to go into their shells and not chase, tackle etc, I don't absolve Neeld from blame as he is the one picking the team, but drastic changes will acheive what?

Do you think you are on your own with the "suffering' you are feeling, er no, but some of us at least try and be constuctive in what we post, angry doesn't even cover how I felt when I walked out of the Crown, but today I am attempting to discuss reasons why it is happening, not post "Sack [censored] everybody, it's everybody's fault"

Have you whinged and whined for the whole 43 years or just the last few, constantly doing that is not supporting, it is being destructive, I pay my money as well old chap, I also try and put something back into the club by volunteering, so don't sit on your high horse trying to tell me you are the only deserving soul.

Also you are nowhere near why I use Satyricon as a nickname, but you have the correct reference point

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Which bit don't you get the players are the problem at the moment, if you know how to fix the obvious baggage they are carrying then let Mark Neeld and the rest of the coaching staff know, because they are not sending them out to go into their shells and not chase, tackle etc, I don't absolve Neeld from blame as he is the one picking the team, but drastic changes will acheive what?

Do you think you are on your own with the "suffering' you are feeling, er no, but some of us at least try and be constuctive in what we post, angry doesn't even cover how I felt when I walked out of the Crown, but today I am attempting to discuss reasons why it is happening, not post "Sack [censored] everybody, it's everybody's fault"

Have you whinged and whined for the whole 43 years or just the last few, constantly doing that is not supporting, it is being destructive, I pay my money as well old chap, I also try and put something back into the club by volunteering, so don't sit on your high horse trying to tell me you are the only deserving soul.

Also you are nowhere near why I use Satyricon as a nickname, but you have the correct reference point

In my advanced years, I am not technically savvy. So can someone tell me how I can "ignore" a dolt and a troll on here. Is it in my settings?

[binman 43,822]

Easy done Iva - and you will enjoy the respite from trolldom. Go to your name at top right. Click and the button for manage settings then navigate to set ignore settings.

[Sir Why You Little 37,151]

In many ways we have a great number of peope to blame for where we are at, perhaps too many to make blame worthwhile. From trades made long ago, to kids we didn't pick up for sanctions, to missed opportunities in important drafts, to a bad culture formented over generations, to poor list management, to never rectifying our lack of a midfield, to spurning Junior McDonald, to playing to players fears of their own incompetence and lack of experience.

Neeld is not to blame for any of that save for the last one and some small things here and there.

But he will, as all coaches do, see his destiny defined by what we do on the field. And what we have done on the field can be summed up in many words - none of them pleasant...

The confidence that has been shattered since 186 was never repaired and while I don't want Jackson to act on Neeld until he knows what to do with the FD, I knew after the Essendon game that the MFC would move on before 2014.

Our players and not great, they are not world beaters, but they can do more and play better than what they have shown. Is this entirely Neeld's fault? No, but he will own it.

And that is footy.

Must agree with all that rpfc. Not addressing the root problems of 186 and the fall out is the main reason our list is mentally shattered today.

Big changes are needed upstairs and in the coaching department.

I have no doubt the coaches are trying but it is not working, and hasn't since Round 1 2012.