Melbourne Business Community function 1/10/12

[the_russian 17]

I am not too happy about the 60 % going to 75 % comment So what they are suggesting is that we have come from 50% and the tripe they served up during 2012 was 60%If that is so its a disgrace !You get 50% for just turning up dont youSo 2013 we will be at 75% 2014 ?% and 2015 ?%Sounds like spin to me.Anyway cant wait till we hit 100%. Should be magnificent!!

Part of this was to do with the age of our list, having a young list means they're not ready to be doing 100%, which is why it's a gradual process to get to that point.

It was also touched on with the drafting of mature players, they're in more of a position to take on the pre-season workload, which is why more clubs are using later picks on mature players, whereas an 18 year old coming in a month after pre-season has started has no chance of getting to 75%/80% because the body just isn't ready for it

[Gorgoroth 13,016]

75% is probably right if they were at 60% otherwise we will end up like Essendon with half the side out with hammies and dropping off in the second half of the year dramatically.

[rjay 25,073]

Sounds to me like they have a plan that they are sticking to and I'm happy with the approach they are taking. After arguing this point through the year re Cloke that we don't need to over spend on a messiah figure as we have done this in the past and come badly unstuck, the club seems in good hands.

I'm looking forward to future announcements as to who is coming to the club.

[Bonkers 994]

75% is probably right if they were at 60% otherwise we will end up like Essendon with half the side out with hammies and dropping off in the second half of the year dramatically.

True. Even if they are giving us a bit of spin, I trust Misson & Craig to get the list to the right fitness levels in time. They both have the runs on the board over a long period in the game with other clubs.

There were a few positives I took away from the meeting. The introduction of combat training for our players is well overdue. All finals have an element of body on body combat so it's great that the club is going down this path. Also the type of player Neeld is looking for as well as the character traits to belong to the club, not just as a player but employee. He wants winners/competitors in all positions throughout the club. From my perspective the club is addressing the culture & genuinely trying to be the best.

In regards to player movement I believe they will try to attract 2-3 premiership experienced players through free agency & also trades. Whilst I can't make comment on certain players discussed throughout the meeting, what I gained from the meeting is that we are in a predatory position to take advantage of deals, but will not pay overs. Don't be surprised if similar to what happened with Mitch occurs again.

[Cards13 9,117]

Who will be the first to complain about contact injuries next season and blame Neeld/Mission?

PS thanks for the info WJ

[beelzebub 23,382]

Im not surprised at teh passing on Goodard, Cloke Tippet etc. They arent what we require. I am however suprised and a little annoyed if we havent looked seroiusly at Lynch. I suggest he's exactly what we need at this present juncture of development ; i,e anothe strong target to ably help Clark and provide some meaningful addition to the scoreboard. We DO need to taste some success. Q woulnd be a long term addition but a 2 year effort to help lift us off the bottom rungs wouldnt go astray.

I agree with the suggestion that hopefully the war-chest isnt squandered.

Im a bit concerned. its seldom in this game you get to claim all your goodies. To forego a shot at some seems folly.

A littel bit of faith just melted for me

[Dr. Mubutu 866]

Who will be the first to complain about contact injuries next season and blame Neeld/Mission?

PS thanks for the info WJ

Don't be surprised when it's somehow Bohdan's fault......

[Whispering_Jack 30,631]

I think many people are somewhat bedazzled by the achievements of the Sydney Swans and their recruiting people and are automatically assuming that we can just go out and do the same thing. Some even think this can be achieved by throwing around $'s alone.

If you analyse who the Swans' most successful recruits from trading are, you'll find that they were generally unloved or low paid players not able to get regular games at their clubs. They came as bargains and not high profile players to who you simply throw money at and they will come and perform. Kennedy, Shaw, Mumford and co were in nowhere near the same category as a Goddard or a Tippett who are commanding substantial offers or Lynch, who also appears to have changed clubs in the hunt for $'s. We're only one day into a four week marathon so let's see what happens over the coming weeks.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

I attended a forum conducted at AAMI Park this evening on the MFC's approach to free agency, trading and drafting. The Melbourne Business Community function was hosted by Chris Connolly with speakers Mark Neeld and Tim Harrington.

Some of the general information about FA and trades has been published on the websites of the AFL or club or discussed at previous meetings while there were some mildly sensitive issues that can't really be expanded on publicly but no specific players who we were seeking over the next month or in the draft were named.

Suffice to say we did gain an insight into the type of player the club is seeking but that was predictable. We should know by now that Neeld wants those who play hard contested football. He wants players who uncompromisingly want to be the best in the game. Those who are happy just to be AFL footballers need not apply.

Neeld says things will be different in 2013. The players now know how they are expected to present themselves on 29 October when the pre season starts. The volume and intensity will be lifted from 60% to around 75% of the optimum as part of a 3 year plan to get the team up to the standard of the leading clubs. One of the innovations we will see is the introduction of combatative training designed to harden players in mind and body.

Naturally there was discussion on players (there was the usual Jack Viney stuff but we need to wait seven days for the outcome) and while I won't elaborate here and now, it's clear that most of the rumours we've been hearing and reading about are simply not true.

I can say that we never made a 7 year offer for Cloke and were never seriously interested (for various different reasons) in the four free agents confirmed earlier today (Goddard, Pearce, Chaplin and Knights) or in Lynch or Tippett, nor has there been an offer made for Wellingham. In some cases to bid for these players at 8% of the salary cap is not warranted in the stage at which the club is at present.

In short, the rumour files and such threads both here and elsewhere on the Internet are way, way off the mark. Some of the stuff is complete bollocks!

The club will get involved in the right deals and we should get what hopefully will be a good mix of 18 year olds and more seasoned players including possibly some from the state leagues but the scuttlebutt and innuendo is just that!

Anyway, I just wanted to say well done to the club for keeping us informed. The lack of any sizzling news might disappoint some but I was impressed at how these guys are sticking to what they call their "premiership plans" and persevering undaunted with their programme to rebuild this football club.

Interesting read and most of us would agree with old players that max out salary cap arent really going to help us in anyway where we are at.

So where are the rumours coming from? From the club saying they will 'leave no stone unturned' and then now claiming that they never lifted these stones? From player managers trying to inflate value? Or from newspapers just hungry for a story? Also I have heard we havent made an offer to Wellingham (although 4 years and 500K was mentioned on facebook) but that we will go hard on him. Did you get that indication?

Lastly with Viney - what rumours do you mean? Rumours that GC will nominate him or that we will or wont take him at pick 3? Because I know the answer to this one.

[stuie 7,374]

I think many people are somewhat bedazzled by the achievements of the Sydney Swans and their recruiting people and are automatically assuming that we can just go out and do the same thing. Some even think this can be achieved by throwing around $'s alone.

If you analyse who the Swans' most successful recruits from trading are, you'll find that they were generally unloved or low paid players not able to get regular games at their clubs. They came as bargains and not high profile players to who you simply throw money at and they will come and perform. Kennedy, Shaw, Mumford and co were in nowhere near the same category as a Goddard or a Tippett who are commanding substantial offers or Lynch, who also appears to have changed clubs in the hunt for $'s. We're only one day into a four week marathon so let's see what happens over the coming weeks.

The difference I see is that the Swans already had a few gun players and they added those "unloved" players to that mix. We don't have those gun players.

[Hannibal 5,814]

You mean we're not going to pay silly money to players that clearly don't deserve it ? Even though we have a salary cap to satisfy ? You mean they're not going to make kneejerk decisions because impatient supporters want to see action now ? Who would have thought ?

Those that have a "fast food" mentality won't be happy that they may not be sustained as quickly as they'd like. But perhaps some fibre won't do them any harm in the longer term.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

You mean we're not going to pay silly money to players that clearly don't deserve it ? Even though we have a salary cap to satisfy ? You mean they're not going to make kneejerk decisions because impatient supporters want to see action now ? Who would have thought ?

Those that have a "fast food" mentality won't be happy that they may not be sustained as quickly as they'd like. But perhaps some fibre won't do them any harm in the longer term.

Totally agree with your sentiments but then why did the club continually suggest that 'no stone would be left unturned'? Why say that at all?

[stuie 7,374]

You mean we're not going to pay silly money to players that clearly don't deserve it ? Even though we have a salary cap to satisfy ? You mean they're not going to make kneejerk decisions because impatient supporters want to see action now ? Who would have thought ?

Those that have a "fast food" mentality won't be happy that they may not be sustained as quickly as they'd like. But perhaps some fibre won't do them any harm in the longer term.

You mean none of the good players available want to come to the 16th placed team for the same money as their current top 8 team? How silly of them.

[Axis of Bob 11,841]

Totally agree with your sentiments but then why did the club continually suggest that 'no stone would be left unturned'? Why say that at all?

Why do you assume that 'no stone unturned' = making offers to everybody? A scattergun approach?

I would think that 'no stone unturned' was to investigate all options available. This includes looking at players like Knights, Goddard, Chaplin etc and then making a decision on whether or not we should pursue them, and how hard we should pursue.

[rjay 25,073]

Totally agree with your sentiments but then why did the club continually suggest that 'no stone would be left unturned'? Why say that at all?

I'm sure the stones have been turned "Norm" and that's where the rumours have come from. It's just they haven't found anything under the stones turned yet. Let's see the wash up at the end of November.

[stuie 7,374]

I'm sure the stones have been turned "Norm" and that's where the rumours have come from. It's just they haven't found anything under the stones turned yet. Let's see the wash up at the end of November.

Oh nooooo stonewash?!

[wonnabeeri 277]

This might be a good time to point out that it is possible for everyone to attend events like this. There is generally a membership group for everyone. I am a future fund member and absolutely love what I get out of it each year. A great way to support the club. Link below.

http://www.melbournebusinesscommunity.com.au/

[Dr. Gonzo 24,274]

Lynch, who also appears to have changed clubs in the hunt for $'s.

I don't think this is the case. WCE offered Lynch only one year, he has also struggled to cement a spot in their forward line. I think he is leaving for opportunity and length of contract, not $$$.

We're only one day into a four week marathon so let's see what happens over the coming weeks.

I agree.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

Why do you assume that 'no stone unturned' = making offers to everybody? A scattergun approach?

I would think that 'no stone unturned' was to investigate all options available. This includes looking at players like Knights, Goddard, Chaplin etc and then making a decision on whether or not we should pursue them, and how hard we should pursue.

Im not saying that I necessarily am, im suggesting that it gives that impression...

[beelzebub 23,382]

You mean we're not going to pay silly money to players that clearly don't deserve it ? Even though we have a salary cap to satisfy ? You mean they're not going to make kneejerk decisions because impatient supporters want to see action now ? Who would have thought ?

Those that have a "fast food" mentality won't be happy that they may not be sustained as quickly as they'd like. But perhaps some fibre won't do them any harm in the longer term.

then again...too much fibre just gives one the sh!ts !!

[hardtack 10,626]

Totally agree with your sentiments but then why did the club continually suggest that 'no stone would be left unturned'? Why say that at all?

Perhaps they mean "no stone will be left unturned" in their pursuit of players that have experience and meet both the attitude and economic requirements... bypassing the likes of Cloke, Goddard and Tippet doesn't necessarily mean they are reneging on that statement.

[Dr. Mubutu 866]

I think many people are somewhat bedazzled by the achievements of the Sydney Swans and their recruiting people and are automatically assuming that we can just go out and do the same thing. Some even think this can be achieved by throwing around $'s alone.

If you analyse who the Swans' most successful recruits from trading are, you'll find that they were generally unloved or low paid players not able to get regular games at their clubs. They came as bargains and not high profile players to who you simply throw money at and they will come and perform. Kennedy, Shaw, Mumford and co were in nowhere near the same category as a Goddard or a Tippett who are commanding substantial offers or Lynch, who also appears to have changed clubs in the hunt for $'s. We're only one day into a four week marathon so let's see what happens over the coming weeks.

To be fair, I think Mumford was. Swans tabled an offer there was no way Geelong could match.

On the other hand, a highly under-appreciated factor in their success may well be the one thing that they continually point to as a weakness: the Sydney media don't really care for them unless they're winning.

Compare that to the Melbourne football media cycle, and it's plain to see that as PEOPLE, they're under far less of a strain from these external sources.

IMO, this is far more of a strength than the oft-repeated extra salary cap room.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

Thanks WJ

Appreciate the feed back

[Devo 104]

Appreciate the post, WJ.

What Neeld and Harrington are saying is very sensible. Although, it's easy to form the impression that the club is spinning the outcome a bit after the stones were turned. That's OK though, there are worse sins that can be committed (i.e. not turning the stones at all).

I think the approach that will be taken at the end of the day will be the right one for where the club's at. We grow our own and complement them with some standard bearers from preferably successful clubs. They don't have to be stars, just honest players who know what it takes to be successful and can model and enforce the standards set by the footy department. There will be no miracles or shock signings of marquee players, just several years of hard graft largely with what we have. When there is maturity and depth across the list down the track, we can then go after the big FA targets. That is the path to success when starting from the bottom of the heap like we are.

[Undeeterred 3,124]

You mean we're not going to pay silly money to players that clearly don't deserve it ? Even though we have a salary cap to satisfy ? You mean they're not going to make kneejerk decisions because impatient supporters want to see action now ? Who would have thought ?

Those that have a "fast food" mentality won't be happy that they may not be sustained as quickly as they'd like. But perhaps some fibre won't do them any harm in the longer term.

It is an interesting question though - what's 'silly money'? I would thought paying overs for a big name for a couple of years is not going to make a dent in our long term plans.

Even if you just look at departures, and ignore the fact that we already only pay (I think) the minimum 92.5% of the TPP, we must have almost a million bucks just to break even. I wouldn't have thought paying a Wellingham or Lynch that for a couple of years is a big deal, even if it is overs.

When our junior players come on, hopefully they will be worth a fortune. But they aren't now, and filling that gap with a couple of players on more money than they are worth wouldn't be the end of the world, I reckon.

Equally, we could bring in nobody, front load the bejesus out of everybody's contracts, and have even more money to play with down the track...

I should say, I'm not advocating paying one player like Wellingham or Lynch $1mil a season! Ooops. More just saying that, with that additional cap space freed up by Green, Moloney and, sadly, probably Rivers, we can afford 2 or 3 players to make up that shortfall.