2010 Player Review - # 3 Clint Bartram

[Demonland 70,611]

Kicking still lets him down at times but played the defensive back pocket role well. Enjoyed his best year since his debut season - Luke Holmesby melbournefc

Games MFC 2010 21 Career 80 Goals MFC 2010 2 Career 14

[Mad_Melbourne 873]

bartram was nearly our most improved player in the side this year, he really nailed that small defender role and was rarely beaten. he was and will be an important clog in our defense for years to come. his courage and hard tackling/chasing were real features of his game this season.

[Bay Riffin 1,454]

bartram was nearly our most improved player in the side this year, he really nailed that small defender role and was rarely beaten. he was and will be an important clog in our defense for years to come. his courage and hard tackling/chasing were real features of his game this season.

absolutely top notch defensive work this year, fast, great tackling, good reader of the play gets involved.

However kicking is worst in the side. that is our downfall down back. If only his kicking could improve.

[Nasher 33,607]

However kicking is worst in the side. that is our downfall down back. If only his kicking could improve.

Statistics don't back that statement up. I know stats aren't everything (and sometimes they're not anything) however I think in this case it has merit.

When I think back to the worst of Bartram's kicks (one game he put it OOF twice in a row), they have ALL been on occasions when he's had no specific target to kick to and is just trying to hoof it forward. So basically if he's got a solid target to hit, my gut feel would be to trust him to hit it. It's only when he's not presented with any valid options that I would not trust him to get the job done. As the side plays better footy and gets better at presenting appropriate options, I'd be confident that we'll see less errors from Bartram.

I'd love to see a statistical breakdown of his error rate for short kicks versus long ones, as my gut feel is that he'd be reliable with the former and hopeless with the latter.

[rpfc 28,084]

Statistics don't back that statement up. I know stats aren't everything (and sometimes they're not anything) however I think in this case it has merit.

When I think back to the worst of Bartram's kicks (one game he put it OOF twice in a row), they have ALL been on occasions when he's had no specific target to kick to and is just trying to hoof it forward. So basically if he's got a solid target to hit, my gut feel would be to trust him to hit it. It's only when he's not presented with any valid options that I would not trust him to get the job done. As the side plays better footy and gets better at presenting appropriate options, I'd be confident that we'll see less errors from Bartram.

I'd love to see a statistical breakdown of his error rate for short kicks versus long ones, as my gut feel is that he'd be reliable with the former and hopeless with the latter.

I hate that statistic.

Kicking efficiency includes the multitude of short switches across the back that Clint does quite a bit of.

He is a better kick than he has been, and had a career year in 2010.

But don't tell me he is one of the better kicks in the team because of statistics; my lying eyes tell me he isn't.

[Nasher 33,607]

I hate that statistic.

Kicking efficiency includes the multitude of short switches across the back that Clint does quite a bit of.

If he's such a poor kick (as per the assertion of the post I replied to) wouldn't you expect there to be errors amongst those as well? I've seen those short switches across the back go horribly wrong enough times to realise that there's plenty of scope for error there if someone's a wonky kick.

But don't tell me he is one of the better kicks in the team because of statistics; my lying eyes tell me he isn't.

I didn't tell you that . It's not like you to put words in people's mouths. Bad day?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Kicking efficiency includes the multitude of short switches across the back that Clint does quite a bit of.

He is a better kick than he has been, and had a career year in 2010.

But don't tell me he is one of the better kicks in the team because of statistics; my lying eyes tell me he isn't.

Agree and your statement highlighted has been overlooked by many posters blinded by an early history of howlers.

He had a great 2010 and needs an equally good 2011 to maintain his spot. Until better options develop, he is the 1st choice for the smal defender role.

OOC atm but should get a 2 year contract at market rates imo.

Not the best kick but certainly not the worst in the side. Did some great stopping jobs this year.

[rpfc 28,084]

I didn't tell you that . It's not like you to put words in people's mouths. Bad day?

Slander!

Yes. Bad day.

But if you are positing that this stat can be read into as a guide for kicking ability then you cannot only apply to a few, or one. I think you are a guilty of picking and choosing stats.

Pains me to say it, Nasher. It does.

Now clean out your desk.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Kicking efficiency includes the multitude of short switches across the back that Clint does quite a bit of.

I was thinking about this the other day. If you look at the best defences going round at the moment, there's always one or two players who have some great strengths that are balanced out with not-so-great kicking. I reckon there's ALWAYS room for a Stevie Baker type, provided three things accompany him:

1) He is uncompromising in his matchups. He's been 100% in that this year.

2) He knows his kick is modest, and adjusts accordingly. Let him be the one who switches.

3) He's the only one (maybe room for one more) selected in the back six who has suspect delivery. When the pressure's on coming out of defence, it's important the team continues to take the game on. If he's the only guy that switches then it's a good thing as it keeps the opposition guessing. But if he's one of three, then that relieves the pressure on the opposition, and places it firmly back on the ineffective kicks in the side.

When you look at our starting back six, (Rivers, Frawley, Garland, Bartram, Davey, Grimes), there's a lot of cause for concern in there in terms of delivery. All four names are genuine AFL players, no doubt about it. But of them, I trust only Garland and Davey completely. Frawley isn't a pretty kick, but deserves to be spoken of highly. The others, Rivers, Bartram and Grimes have some suspect delivery. In Rivers' and Grimes' case they are smart players who know their weaknesses and adjust accordingly, but to be honest, while they'd have to be among the best sets of 6 in the league for spoils and goals against... I don't think too many teams would fear them on the rebound. It's no coincidence that when Davey went down we struggled. Even against other bottom 8 sides.

[Guest Deefence]

Played 21 out of a possible 22 games, missed R1 due to injury IIRC.

Is only 21, and I feel will be at this club until he turns 30.

Yes, we all hold our breaths when he is kicking in. But his efficiency isn't as bad as many make it out to be. Skills improved a lot over the year, and particulary when wearing his nice yellow boots

Was given a 1 year contract last year, almost as a test, to see how he would perform. In my eyes, deserves a 2 year contract after his performance this year.

This club is trying hard to get games into players, Clint is on his way to 100. Injury and personal issues stopped him from reaching that this year. Will get in 2011.

If Brucey leaves next year, will be the second most experience backmen we have.

Barty gets high marks for this year, definite B+, if not an A.

[Nasher 33,607]

But if you are positing that this stat can be read into as a guide for kicking ability then you cannot only apply to a few, or one. I think you are a guilty of picking and choosing stats.

You're probably right, however if I didn't mention the stat at all (as I used it purely as a segue to the remainder of my post - it wasn't the core point), I believe my point would still stand - that is that his kicking seems to be okay when presented with a feasible short-medium distance target.

Like I said though, I've got nothing at all to back that up other than what's etched in my memory.

[drdrake 3,137]

You have to give credit to this guy he proved a lot of people including me wrong. He is now a very important part of our back six. He is hard, quick and has a footy smarts. I listen to Bill Brownless on Sunday and he was right our back six are strong defensively but all have disposal flaws. When Grimes is fit he brings quality to the back line but when you have Bartram, Frawley, Garland, MacDonald, Bruce, Morton, Rivers back there we lack the quality go to man.

Bartram will improve when our back 6 lines up like

Bartram Frawley Garland

Grimes Rivers Strauss or Blease

If we can get Grimes fit and one of Blease or Strauss to improve and cement a spot we can carry Bartrams poor kicking as he will be our defensive stopper and won't need to attack.

Don't forget this guy has a very good engine as a first year player he tagged some of the games best and won, he would have been a better option for Harvey in the last game. Great year, stay fit and Bartram will be a better player in 2011

[Prof 15]

bartram was nearly our most improved player in the side this year, he really nailed that small defender role and was rarely beaten. he was and will be an important clog in our defense for years to come. his courage and hard tackling/chasing were real features of his game this season.

Any other good Dutch players we can recruit?

[Gouga 562]

Not the best kick but certainly not the worst in the side.

Very happy with Barts' season, but just wondering who is a worse kick RR?

[jayceebee31 759]

A very solid contributor whom can still improve and will.

[Adzman 2,154]

Bartram had a ripper season. Still can butcher it by foot, the other stuff tends to make up for it. If he can sort his kicking out, he will really make it hard for other to take his spot.

He was a big reason why the demons could apply pressure around the ground. Has to have one of the biggest engines in the AFL.

[ickey_11 145]

Very happy with Barts' season, but just wondering who is a worse kick RR?

Bruce, Jamar, Rivers

Edited September 14, 2010 by ickey_11

[e25 5]

All this arguing about statistics and how good a kick Bartram is...

His biggest problem is his decision-making. It makes bad kicks worse and good kicks not as good as they should be.

Watch him when he gets the footy - more often than not he chooses the wrong option or spends so long looking for an option that they all dry up.

Unfortunately he is not blessed with the vision and instincts that better players possess.

[Red Sox 2]

A super season by Bartram. For now he has claimed his spot in the best 22.

His kicking is poor and because of this his spot will be under threat in 2011.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Bruce, Jamar, Rivers

Into that list: Jones, Martin

Out of the list: Jamar.

[Harrisonrules 273]

E 25 spot on

Slow mind, rarely creates play further down the field. Good players rarely stop. They are looking for 2 or 3 moves to follow the one they make. They know if something closes, 2 others open up and so the play powers forward. Davey's our best exponent of this. Bartram mostly stops props and looks for easiest option. His leg speed is good, plays close well, but mind is slow and robs him of the creative aspect your backline needs to rise into the top four. Hand and foot skills are below average. Some seem to like him, so be it we have different opinions. I'm looking for more.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,930]

Great year from Barts as he got the most out of his abilities. Was rarely beaten as a lockdown small defender and learned to play within the deficiencies that he has.

[Deeoldfart 8,001]

Clint stepped up a notch or two this year, and well and truely earned his new contract. He reinvented his game as a small defender, and his ability to lock down on dangerous small forwards became a very important factor in our defense. IMO his decision making and disposal under pressure were streets ahead of where they were in previous years.

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,293]

Clint stepped up a notch or two this year, and well and truely earned his new contract. He reinvented his game as a small defender, and his ability to lock down on dangerous small forwards became a very important factor in our defense. IMO his decision making and disposal under pressure were streets ahead of where they were in previous years.

Fantastic effort for a bloke who`s head must have been close to the chopping block last year. Had a traumatic year off the field last year and I`m rapt for the bloke. I didn`t think he`d make it but he may become a very important player for us in the coming years as a small forward stopper as you suggested Dee