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Big call. Let's make our way from useless to mediocre before we go calling 'dynasty.'

I've been waiting for MFC success for a very long time, being born just weeks after their last premiership. But there is something in me that will celebrate big time when Trenners plays again. He is almost a living symbol of all the horrible junk that happened 2009 - 2013. I still reckon he is a natural footballer who at his best is an absolute gun. I hope to be at his return game and I hope he becomes everything his youth form show3d he could be. It is about time we had ad good luck story after Scully, Clark, etc...

I wonder if all this good news is because we've actually exhausted the Universe's supply of bad luck over the past nine years.

I suspect Roos takes the (old) "chairman of selectors" role, but Goodwin gets the team he wants. I think Goodwin is effectively the senior coach and Roos more a director of football, but both will be careful to avoid using labels. I reckon it's a very collaborative approach and Jackson and Roos have been the architects. All just "gut feel" of course.

All good news tonight from Mark Stevens of 7 News:- • Angus Brayshaw's knee was tested today. He's ahead of schedule and will play VFL this weekend. He "looks a lock for Round 1." • Christian Petracca will play a practice game at Casey on the weekend of AFL Round 1. He's "finally ready to launch." • Jack Trengove is also set to join Petracca in same hit out coinciding with AFL Round 1 for his "first game in basically two years." • Heritier Lumumba will play VFL again this week. He's "pushing for Round 1."

This talk of 'AFL power' and 'failure to fight' is 50% rubbish and 50% delusion. It's time some here stopped feeling persecuted and left that attitude to others, like Collingwood and Western Bulldog supporters. One sign of real strength is to take charge of your own actions and consequences. A fine was appropriate for Pedersen. If it had been a player from another club in the same act toward a Melbourne player, some on here would be calling for a week or two. Accept the error, take the penalty, and run.

Perhaps you should watch the game rather than shake your head. Saints kicked 4 goals for the quarter. Goal 1: Salem kick out to Roberton who kicks long to front of goal where Bruce out marks Oscar McDonald. Garland not involved. Goal 2: Salem clears defensive 50 to Ross who kicks into Billings inside 50 on the lead. Garland not his opponent and not involved. Goal 3: Point kick out to Wagner who kicks across goal where Billings intercepts and kicks goal. Garland not involved. Goal 4. Garland kicks across goal to Lonie who marks and finds Billings 20 metres on his own and goals. Garland involved and responsible for turnover. So he didn't give away 3 goals. He was involved in one goal. Shake your head all you like but you're wrong. Reality is Garland is obviously respected by the FD who offered him a new contract last year. You don't. That's fine but don't make stuff up to pot him.

If Trengove is taking the field for a practice match on the same day as round 1, I really hope the club has a plan to show him running on, getting a kick, laying a tackle and just being out there. Half-time on the MCG screens and on TV, a compilation video of the journey back, finishing with a few snippets of footage from the practice game. Yes please.

They're two different emotions. Trenners will get a tear welling whereas Trac will be uncontainable excitement. That didn't translate very well.

I love watching him think in traffic. He seems to love trying to read a couple of moves ahead. I've noticed a couple of times him harassing the player trying to get the ball out (making him think he is being tackled) while looking to assess what the options are and throwing himself at that option to effect the next tackle. He's still young, can you imagine what his vision is going to be like in 5 years, if that is how he reads play now.

I'm more excited by seeing Jack run out. I expect Petracca to come out and play well. I am not so sure I expected Jack to run out at all so it will warm the heart when he does. (sentimental old fool)

In the immortal words of the 12th man, "get him up here I wanna boof him"

lol this guy... A disaster... A blokes career could've been over, missed 2 years, yeah I'm sure he'd consider getting his body and fitness right for 6 weeks a "disaster." Fair dinkum there's some [censored] written.

Dunno why some people are writing off Omac and Wagner. Yeah, they were sloppy at times but the knew where the ball was and went in hard. Not all players adjust to the pace of AFL in their first couple of games. Give them 2 years. If the sloppiness is still there then we can say goodbye, but I think that they will become servicable players.

Just hope both boys have a good hitout and no injuries.

OUT! 4 weeks Deserved - he lined up the kid!

I find it staggering that anyone would even motion towards putting the red line through Neal-Bullen already.

No chance, I've not seen a draftee at Melbourne come in and have such an immediate impact like Oliver has had.

There'd be something poignant about Trenners lining up against Richmond on Anzac Eve. That's what I'm hoping for. Also, if he comes back then, he'd have a pretty solid run of games at the 'G (apart from 1 away trip to Metricon).

I don't want a dynasty. I just want 1 premiership and then obscurity for the next ten years. Is that too much to ask?

I think Goodwin/Roos like what Frost brings, i.e. speed, pressure, structure. He was OK yesterday. He kicked the ball inside 50 to Pedersen (goal), kicked the ball inside 50 to Bugg (hanger/goal) and did the knock on to Watts, who side handballed to Garlett (goal). But yes, it's close. What a great problem to have. I reckon Kennedy and Bugg play, And I'm the first to admit I didn't see that happening a month ago. I see Harmes missing if Lumumba plays. Frost or Oliver won't play if Matt Jones does. And what happens when Petracca is ready, as he's a certainty, and Trengove rediscovers the talent we all saw those years ago ? Oliver is a must for me. Forget this "hold him back" BS. He makes us better.

Roos, like most great leaders, has built a great team of coaches & assistants around him, getting the right people into the right jobs in the football department. They work as a team, which is far better for us than depending on one person, even one person as capable as Roos. Like all great leaders, Roos is aware that he's not the best person for everything that's needed for sustained success. If we get into the "it's Roos" or "it isn't Roos" argument, we miss the point. It's the team that Roos has built. Whatever Roos's capabilities as coach, it's his leadership capabilities that we have needed most. And part of those leadership capabilities is making sure that he can step out, when the time is right, without us missing a beat.

Update: Jetta I Dunn I GarlandSalem I T. McDonald I VinceBugg I Viney I BrayshawvandenBerg I Hogan I KentGarlett I Pedersen I WattsR: Gawn I Tyson I N. JonesIC: Frost I Harmes I Oliver I Kennedy E: Grimes I M. Jones I Stretch

"It is understood representatives for Dank were baffled by the ruling" They know how to pick 'em. If you ever need legal advice, ask Hird or Dank who their lawyers are, then go to someone else.

See this is where it becomes obvious to me, there were no records kept, and they kept him on the pay role for how long? how many legit supplements programs would be allowed to go on for more than a week without constant updates and comprehensive records to show it was worth the hundreds of thosands of dollars they were investing?

Immigration laws state that people can be denied entry to the country purely on character basis, without criminal charges. I would assume then that it can be extended to citizens of other countries already here.

And you'll find the Garland and Grimes haters will just make things up. Just look at Jnrmac's little effort yesterday on Garland. I'm undecided on Grimes and whilst I love the guy I think he will struggle to get a game in a full team this year. Harmes, Bugg and Kennedy have made it hard for Grimes, Stretch and ANB and the prospect of Trengove and Petracca confuse the situation even more. If we have a good run with injury I think Grimes will struggle because it would appear that the FD don't rate him much either. But like Trenners I hope he can find his early career form.

I want 3 flags over ten years. That way we will be close to becoming a power club that can pizz all over Eddiewood, Hawks and the Cats. One flag is not enough to ensure our survival. No going back.

This. Mental scars. For all the back and forth on the relative merits of Grimes and Garland there's something about the pair that just doesn't seem to fit our current model. They may contribute but they lack aggression in demanding the ball and moving it quickly with intent. Somewhere toward the end of the third term Garland did well to find some space and mark just forward of center from a short pass. The forward line is flooded but Garland just seemed indecisive and slow to react. (Players running past on both sides?). Then kicked it laterally out of bounds in the direction of Grimes who was leading away from the ball. That was our old game plan. Probably overstating it but the whole passage at the time felt indicative of the pair not really adjusting to what we're trying to put in place.

There were some interesting interpretations of "not 15" on Sunday

Was told recently by a club employee / acquaintance not to expect either Trengove or Petracca at AFL level until round 5-7 at the earliest as we wanted them to be bullet-proof before playing, but that could just be an attempt to manage expectations & lessen the hype.

It's everything. The size, pace, agility, aggression, skill, and best of all he makes really good decisions in a split second. It's great to see a player with such footy nous.

And he attributes team mistakes to Garland. With every opposition goal kicked there will be an MFC player at fault. Garland must be easy to spell.

When Grimes first started he was a handy half back flank who would play on a half forward flank, use his height (he was tall for a flanker then) and work rate to intercept mark away from that opponent. Then he'd run off and guys like Rivers or Cam Bruce would get him the ball and he'd kick it out to the next player and away we went. He was a decent back flanker. He missed some time with injuries and the forward pressure started to make life harder for back flankers without accurate kicks. Then Mark Neeld came in and preseason was about getting super fit to run hard and defend. His reward for that was the captaincy. Lacking fit midfielders Jack was thrown in to the middle without any training in clearance play. He ran hard, tackled pretty well and had some decent games. But again more injuries and no real improvement. He returned to the back flank under Roos and eventually shed the captaincy. He still worked hard and took some marks, but his skills just weren't picking up fast enough to keep up with the modern game. His only option was safe sideways footy. So now he's send to the wing where he can use his best remaining AFL attribute which is his ability to run. Plus his ability to read the play will help him position well to be the outlet for the backline. A decent mark as well so he can retain possession. Hopefully he can then get the ball out in space and move it on to the right target without being under such presssure. Plus he'll defend well, although a lack of pace off the mark might be exposed. I think it's the right move and he'll be good wing depth. But the bad flaws in his game are still there. Besides the average kicking skills (which aren't the worst for a wingman) it's his lack of awareness that really lets him down. He was outmarked 3 times on Sunday waiting for the ball instead of going hard at it and we know about his infamous hospital handballs. The reality is his prime development years were wasted running laps, injured or burdened by leadership. His kicking has improved since 2014 but I just don't think he'll get the awareness back (if he ever had it). If they pick him I'll live with some mistakes knowing at least he works on them and the coaches have devised a role to hopefully suit his game. That's the best we can hope for.

Agreed. Even in today's Slobbo article on Drugendon it is always everybody elses fault except Drugendon. They shouldn't be in the AFL this year it is a disgrace that a bunch of drug cheats will have such a bearing on the 8 after 22 rounds those that play them twice have a massive advantage...

According to Essendon the players weren't given anything illegal. The only reason they can't prove this is Danks failure to have kept records that I would assume would have been the minimum requirement of his contract with the Club. If I had contracted someone and they were this negligent you bet I'd be suing them. They should have insurance to cover this sort of negligence. So the question then arises. Why aren't Essendon suing him? Hmmm, maybe just maybe, it wasn't him that lost them. Maybe just maybe it was someone else in the Club. Why would that be so. Only one reason I can think of.

lol, seriously? How about we let these players actually do something and maybe we also wait til we have won 15 games in the year. Sone show some promise, but at the moment the word dynasty should not be uttered anywhere near these players and this club. Start talking Dynasty after winning a flag. no one talks about the saints of a few years ago.

We're all quite rightly in a buoyant mood but someone around here is going to be cynical so I may as well give it a shot. This is not a knock on Taylor but to praise him and the recruiters for recruiting a dynasty is rather overblown. Frawley walked. No big decision and we were fortunate to score a number 3 pick because we had been crap. (See also pick 2). Petracca and Brayshaw were touted as the best mids available. St Kilda needed a KPF and allowed us to select both. No decision making necessary. Again, in ways, we were lucky (in the end at least) to receive some currency for Mitch Clarke. We spent it on Lumumba who has performed well down on expectations. We scored Bernie for around the same pick the year before. He may come good, but part of our dynasty? Garlett's abilities were clear so there was no genius involved in identifying untapped talent and there were evident reasons for his downturn in form. We took a punt on behavioral issues. It has proved a good punt to date but we also benefited from mad Mick throwing him away for the proverbial packet of chips to make a statement. We paid for Sam Frost with an early second-rounder (again around the Bernie mark). He may become a useful addition but he's a long way from being identifiable as a future dynasty utility or KPP at this stage. We did get some later picks in return. ANB and OMac both slid from memory. Again, fortunate, if they prove to be decent selections. There are some okay signs but again we're along way from discussing them as components of any speculated dynasty. Ditto Stretch, a father son (can't recall where he was bid) who is also yet to fully force his way into the team. Newton seems a good pick up for free to add some depth. Great recruitment is relative to making tough, seemingly speculative calls (Oliver) and the currency available. Our rookie drafting was excellent.

Why stop there? Let's not miss the one in the middle this time.

Gotta love the pop psychologists and pure guess work of several on this site! "Mental scars" please! Grimes and Garland haven't been molested as children, nor done a tour of duty in a war zone... so can we ditch the pop psychology and start to assess their performances based on what they did and what we assume they were meant to do? For example, both are back men... which generally means they're responsible for stopping an opposition forward, how did their opposition forward go? were they damaging? defensive rebound, delivering the ball forward and setting up attacking rebound, Are they implementing the game plan? are there skills ok?are they creating effective forward moves? as senior players (and Garland in the leadership group) there role is also to assist and guide those around them, cover for them and generally support the less experienced players (i.e. OMac, Wagner), are they doing this well? or is it impacting their effectiveness? I don't know the answers to these questions, but I put no credence in player evaluations that simply look to gain approval by regurgitating to old prejudices and group think without reference to their actual role and performance. And I reckon we owe our players the respect to actually analyse their work objectively before we bag them out.

And some people in the media wonder why Paul Roos is paid what he is. Worth every penny n then some.

Ummm. Not sure what the tone is behind the screen, but I'm definitely confused. If serious, I'm not entirely sure what I'd be receiving a ban for... Unless this place is a dictatorship...? I simply made a rebuttal to your comment and for the second time, my first post was tongue-in-cheek. I was making a point that it's going to be a difficult game. Calm your farm DL. EDIT: Please tell me this isn't the infamous Rhino Richards using a different avatar?

Far too early to make this call i want to see results first.

I hope I don't put the mozz on him but J Watts seems to have clicked. Loved his work over the NAB cup. I was also very surprised at how ready Oliver seems to be. Ruthless tackling and amazing handballs. Love that Salem is doing the kick-outs instead of Tmac! The only losers I saw were the teams we played against

It's not the length matters it's how he uses it.

Lol...at 24 Treners is old guard. Can't wait to see the "I was wrong" post when he starts carving the game up.

Standard kneejerk media.. It's like watching a [censored] 4ths cricket captain change his field after ever boundary is hit!!

inspiration really to all, IMO.

Will be a really special moment to see the number 9 back out on the G, jack has had a horror run but has handled himself brilliantly, he is an inspiration to anyone going through long term injury and i have no doubt he's been a huge part in Christian petraccas recovery as well!