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From this... To this... Others may attempt the backflip. No-one will ever rival the master

Melbourne's problems pre-date even the draft. I choose to take some solace in that we now appear to have coherent professionals in leadership positions, a much improved trade and draft performance, and are steadily clawing our way back to respectability. Personally (setting aside the merger point of departure) I think the real Hawks contrast would have to be with the Kangaroos. 2 premierships, a runner up, and 8 consecutive finals appearances from 1993-2000, and they were still an off-field basketcase that has barely survived, and remains dubious despite routine finals showings. THAT is a contrast with Hawthorn. There's another two clubs in Victoria that have eminently failed to turn periods of prominence, and the presence of outright stars of the game, into lasting support and standing - St Kilda and Footscray. I'm glad that at least the Bulldogs have a hopeful outlook for the near future, but St Kilda is in real trouble if their 2015 hype turns out to be a false dawn. And I for one still believe that the Saints haven't even finished their decline yet, never mind starting to climb back up. Trouble brews. For all that we have had a disappointing time as a club (for most of the past 50 years) somehow we have a very, very resilient supporter culture. For Melbourne supporters, even losing means something worth turning up for. We are the last of the great, loyal club cultures, 'we' mean something. I for one will be fascinated to see what happens when that resilient, determined supporter culture finally gets matched with a capable corporate unit and a winning football department.

After last night they officially take the reign off collingwood as the most disgraceful and feral animals going around. And don't someone give me oh every club has them etc, they go to an extreme level. The video footage of a freo supporter hitting a woman in the crowd is seriously low act of the highest order. I have been to games before where you get the odd melbourne supporter being a tool but the WA are two steps above. Disgraceful

Bit of warning next time I was eating lunch!!

Deserves it? Nobody 'deserves' a flag. You should earn it. He's cantered through the season doing very little of note, more poor games than good, playing for a club where his position is at its easiest, feeding off a culture, list and gameplan which have been cultivated, developed and proven over a number of years without him having any impact whatsoever. Spending years losing at Melbourne (and not putting 100% effort in at all times whilst doing it) does not mean you have earned or deserve a flag.

He was more than happy to take a nice pay cheque from the club for all those seasons. I don't care that he left but the way he speaks is disrespectful and idiotic.

A few mistakes or failures along the way are fine so long as they aren't allowed to linger (Michael Newton style) and the overall churn of good decisions keeps building. Have to remember that Hawthorn made a few proper draft clangers, Mitch Thorp being the top contender. Geelong absolutely blew a couple of drafts around 2002-2004, but had possibly the greatest draft run of any club ever in 1999/2000 This is why Geelong have a great big haul of players retiring now, and not so many experienced top players left to take up the senior leadership. They have just 4 players in the 25-28 age range; Selwood, Hawkins, Dawson Simpson, and Mitch Clark. So mistakes were made, but not enough to stop them becoming one of the all time great teams. As for Melbourne, well, we had an appallingly barren run for a long time, that is well documented. Barely a draft brought us more than one long-term player, for almost a decade. Things began to turn a little when we managed to get Hogan & Viney in 2012, and the Salem/Tyson double-up 'trick' in 2013. But a quick look at our 2014 draft is mindblowing. By next season, all seven of our selections may well be in our best 22. Even if it doesn't come to such phenomenal results, there will be more players on the field for us aged 18-24 than aged 25 or more. As for on the full list... not even one quarter will have had a 25th birthday. The only other club making any success out of such a young list profile is the Bulldogs... if only we could get our hands on the kind of youth development expertise that they had, or which Geelong put to work when making the most of their superdrafts.. oh... wait... who's that softly spoken guy with the beard that's been seen around the club lately? "Everything is going to plan"

So brave of Frawley to jump ship at the Demons and run off to ride the coat tails of the back to back premiers. So, so brave.

His 0.8 goal assist average would best at the club alongside Brayshaw. Averages 27 disposals but also 6.5 tackles, ranked 8th in the league. 10.2 contested possession average is equal with Vince. Against Geelong he had 33 disposals, 7 inside 50s and kicked 3 goals. And he's still only 22 years old.

I'm underwhelmed by Melksham, but you have to back Roosy. Many times when he was at Sydney I laughed at the players they picked up only to be wrong. If you go back through the list he hasn't missed on too many: 2002 Nick Davis - Pies Craig Bolton - P/S Brisbane 2003 No trades 2004 Darren Jolly - Melbourne 2005 Ted Richards - Essendon 2006 Peter Everitt - Hawks 2007 Marty Mattner - Adelaide Henry Playfair - Geelong 2008 Rhyce Shaw - Pies 2009 Mark Seaby - Eagles Shane Mumford - Geelong Ben McGlynn - Hawks Josh Kennedy - Hawks 2010 No trades MELBOURNE 2013 Daniel Cross - Bulldogs FA Aiden Riley - Crows FA Viv Michie - Freo Dom Tyson - GWS Bernie Vince - Adelaide 2014 Ben Newton - Port FA Jeff Garlett - Carlton Lumumba - Pies Sam Frost - GWS I'll back him, Goodwin and Macca to make this one a positive trade too.

Zac Smith was on the outer for a while, now it seems to be Gorringe. I guess you could say, Gorringe is the new Zac. Thank you, I'm here all the time, try the fish.

He still has one match left to cost them a premiership. Please, football Gods, make it happen. Dropped defensive mark in the dying seconds followed by Josh Kennedy goal to win the match for the Eagles.

They say only a mother could love a mug like that. Surely even Mrs Daniher has her moments of doubt.

You're going about that terribly. Your 4th post here was to tell a respected poster they had no football knowledge and should be embarrassed. All over the incredibly complex topic of body language on the field. Completely unwarranted. We have enough angst in this joint without you adding to it for no good reason.

Really Stak? after all these years you're still throwing that one up?

I posted some Melksham highlights from the 2009 TAC Cup Grand Final on the TAC Cup thread. Melksham was arguably BOG in that game and it's clear from the package that he was something of a talent back then. I haven't been a big follower of Essendon on field but something obviously happened with Melksham in the past couple of seasons. I suppose that I'm speculating but it was Melksham who was named as one of the prime examples of Bomber players ... ahem ... "bulking up" big time in early 2011 when whatever unknown substances were apparently injected into 34 players at the club and perhaps the constant adverse publicity surrounding the saga has taken its toll. It could be that a change of scenery will do him the world of good if the chips fall his way at CAS.

We did this a couple of years ago with Neeld and it was a waste. It's akin to Malthouse cutting and running on their forwardline of Betts, Garlett and Waite. It'd be a dumb decision to cut and run on Toumpas. Float him for trade by all means, but if you can't get something decent for him in return (probably part of a package deal), keep him, back him and hope he comes good.

Get ready for some epic whinging in the Scott presser. It is going to be glorious.

Oh no. Lyndsay Thomas is coming on. Time to hate North Melbourne again.

The North V WCE game is a clear advertisement of how poor the modern game can be. If I want to watch a tackle-fest I can turn over to channel 9 and watch Melbourne Storm. Ball-up followed by 8 players tackling each other, followed by pressu re d possesions and on it goes. I hate Hawthorn, but boy their football is really good to watch: contested ball followed by incredible kicking and team footy. WCE are an excellent team and have played brilliantly this year so North bring that boring, slow, defensive footy that is simply carp to watch, bring the game down to a crappy game of who can win the tackle count. Moments of good footy in this final series, but in the main it has been a snooze.

Meth Coke have got to get their shite together or this could be a repeat of '99 Fond memories of watching that game in Koh Samui with an Essendrug supporter Had already bought his Granny Ticket Never saw him again...

Biggest diving, whingers in the league

He's been charged with common assault, disorderly and obstruct. The courts will come down hard with a $400 fine and/or a community based order.

Pretty much summed it up in your first sentence AF.

I just think back to the Dom Tyson trade.. not even a word leaked out until out of the blue on the day the deal was done it all caught us off guard.

Please......Can we all stop whineing about Hawthorn. They are a great club and use trading and free agency very well to build a winning side. Buddy went via free agency and they did not miss a beat. People whined about Brisbane a few years ago, saying they were unbeatable and would win flags for ten years. Didn't happen. Instead of hating them I admire them, a very good CLUB, both on and off the field. And good on James Frawley, played a very solid game on one of the best forward in the game and I hope he does really well next week. If you gotta hate then go ahead I don't think he will give a stuff.

Lol get a load of this bloke.

The Eagles players are pretty bad in the staging area as well to be fair. The Roo's mids look fried. Wait for the blowout. Eagles by 10 goals plus.

Effectively confirming what most people think of you...

I'd take it in a nanosecond.

Never seemed like a particularly shape bloke though.

Over it. [censored] Hawthorn.

Frawley played really well last night. I didn't like his comments afterwards though, it shown a real lack of class for mine.

that we are horrifically inconsistent.

Frawley was on cruise control after the 2011 season - overall, his career at Melbourne was a fail considering his talent. In my eyes he'll remain our greatest disappointment in recent times ... he wasted his obvious talent with us but I'm happy to see the end of him in all honesty - he was of little value to us anyway. Many here were (or are) more frustrated with others but those others didn't (or don't) have Frawley's ability. However, the compensation we got for him is already working in our favour. Frawley finished 8th, 7th & 9th in our B&F in his last 3 years with us (2012. 2013 & 2014) ... for a person of his ability, those outcomes were unacceptable. In those same 3 years Nathan Jones went 1st, 1st and 1st. Terlich and Matt Jones finished 3rd & 4th respectively in the 2013 B&F. He might get a flag with the Hawks but he gave us SFA, all things considered. Footnote: The B&F is a great guide - Flower only got 1 B&F award but was 2nd four times and 3rd twice (plus, he also got a 4th and a 5th placing)

I would rather be in Bali than ever put on a Whorethorn jumper Chip is allowed to do what he wishes, but his 2014 season is what i remember He was in cruise control This is exactly what the MFC must rid themselves of, highly paid players preserving themselves so they are fit when leaving. Frawley should have spent half of last year at Casey.

Melbourne should offer a 3rd round selection. If Bummers say no then should talk with Melksham about walking for free and stating that the club failed in its duty of care i.e. not knowing what he was injected with. I remember that card was being played with Ryder as Essendon didn't want to trade him as he was under contract and their only decent contract. Also happy for him to come to the club. Still young enough to have an impact for a few years. It is dissapoibting thst he isn't the franchise changing player like Dangerfield but he still gets a spot in a best 22 and that is what Roos does. Continues to just keep making the 22 better.

How did he figure? Did Col organise a round of drinks cards the night before?

The first two need to go as they are not helping us improve, simple as that. I would rather try a couple of delisted players who might make it, or draft some more youngsters.

You've just got to love the Freo supporters... particularly the guy in the number 10 Freo jersey who started abusing anybody and everybody and when approached by a woman who told him he was ruining it for the kids, punches her in the face. Seriously, there is a very good case for banning the sale of alchohol completely from these kinds of events. I hope the guy does jail time considering all of the publicity the violence against women campaign has been receiving lately... there is absolutely no excuse!

Toumpas is clearly trade bait which is why we haven't signed him. The MFC have stayed out of the media and have been very quiet with their plans for trade week. If we can't find a home for him he will be given a one year deal. I just want our list to get better, reality is toumpas staying or going makes little to no difference next year.

We can get the Melbourne supporters out first tho

Okay, so living closer to the MCG makes you a better judge of what's going on in footy. Get a grip.

Ill break rank. Id like Dangerfield, but not ANY price.

Good point. Legs are fairly unimportant...

I'm sure this has been mentioned, but think it deserves a re-mention. Another failed attempt by Ross Lyon. His teams always stumble near the final hurdle. He'll never win a flag. I like it.

10 - 15 years ago Hawthorn were a club down the bottom with not many fans. Now they are possibly the best side ever and have a massive membership. Hawthorn shows that it's possible and are a cause for hope, not despair. Rather than worry about how well Hawthorn are going, how about we knock them off their perch?

North will get shat on tomorrow, nothing surer. They are pretenders and were lucky to face another, frankly, pretending team in Richmond then a remarkably flat Sydney (missing their 4 best players to boot). The way they've carried on all week is frankly laughable. The way they are parading themselves around as if they actually stand a chance is laughable. If, by some miracle, West Coast find a way to lose tomorrow, next Saturday will feature the single biggest winning margin in a grand final the game has ever seen. As for Hawthorn, 5 Grand Finals in 8 years. There's something very, very wrong with the state of the game if AFL HQ actually have the gall to come out and say "the competition has never been more even!" at any point in the next 6 months.

Yeah you got me, I fly over to watch the footy because I'm lonely....? Your wit has got the better of me CnB, other posters don't need to read this rubbish. You're ignored.

Nah, I'm no troll. Just a bit of light hearted banter. Thought I'd throw a couple of lures. Unless of course your comment was a pun too?