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I think you've interpreted "to rate him incredibly highly" too strictly. I don't think many if anybody would rate his output highly to date, in that respect he has been exceptionally disappointing when measured against his draft position. But many can see his qualities and rate them highly. He has elite qualities. Ball handling, speed, vision, decision making and execution. These attributes have been negated because of his unwillingness to go and get the ball and understand the defensive side of football and without those qualities you are of little if any value. I held on to "Watts hope" until about the middle of May where I finally declared my hope/optimism broken. I should have done this earlier because from about mid June we've seen a Watts who is much more aggressive and positive. We can all pontificate on why it is what it is and I think it is a combination of maturity/development/toxic environment/ management of expectation/learning the game/finally understanding. But the reality is Watts is now a dangerous player. With improvement he could become a significant player and with his elite attributes and in a good team may approach the player we were expecting. The other intangible with Watts is how loyal he's been to the club, how much he loves playing with his team mates and how much the other players enjoy having him around. Without performance that is meaningless but it's valuable if he commands a spot in the team based on output. How good do you think he'll be? That's the question. It's easy to critique his journey to date but so much more difficult to predict the destination. He may ultimately be a bust but he could also be elite. Not many have that as a possibility.

What's next? Stuie serving the next two week suspension that one of our players gets? Actually that's an idea I can get behind...

He's a finisher - and a classy one at that. To rate him as a diabolical dud is utterly nonsensical. It seems modern footy has passed you by.

If I give you a dollar will you stop being a bellend for ten minutes?

Funding player brawls. Hmm. I admit I enjoyed the Jones wrestle, but I am very uncomfortable with this idea.

Phew. I thought you'd started a thread about me. ?

This argument depends on whether you are talking about Watts as a player, Watts as a pick, and whether you realise that it doesn't matter anymore where he was picked. It just doesn't. He just helped us beat a team we hadn't beaten since 2 years before he arrived at the club - you would have to tie yourself up in metaphorical knots to argue the player on the weekend a 'dud.' And some of the 'hate' was more than 'disappointment,' B59... It was petty, over-the-top vitriol that became a race in 'who can make the most disgraceful statement' about a player, and a Demon no less. He isn't 'out of the woods' yet either - he has to continue with this form to cement himself as a HFF/wing in what, I hope, will be a good team over the next 5 years.

I don't think this view holds water anymore. That No. 1 draft picks should become stars is a view that belongs in 2000 I think. There have just been way too many of them that haven't for me to be able to hang on to that idea. There is obviously a higher probably of yielding a star with the first pick, but a failure to do so doesn't make the player unworthy. We all hoped that Jack would become elite. We're all disappointed that he hasn't. I think you need to adjust your expectations and valuation of what No. 1 draft picks should be though. They're no less of a lottery than any number pick in the draft. You said yourself he's showing he will probably be valuable going forward - in a lottery that is a good result. Not the best, but good, and certainly better than dud, mistake etc.

I agree, this 'knowing where the match is being played' stuff has to stop now

Not your usual Jack Watts thread. He has been fantastic the last 5 or 6 weeks. He has chased and tackled along with his usual high efficiency with the ball. I was starting to lose faith with him but he has been fantastic the last few weeks.

thumbsdown

*bump* Melbourne FC ‏@melbournefc 9m9 minutes ago Today would have been the great Robert Flower's 60th birthday. We miss him dearly.

One of the problems of AFL is that kids are taken and drafted far too early. There are exceptions and someone like Brayshaw comes to mind. However, we see many players that take 4-6 years to develop physically and mentally. The time it takes to transition from adolescents to young men. Ideally young players should be held back and not drafted until 21-23 years of age. The comparison is someone like Watts or Gawn, and someone like Vandenberg. The latter has a hard body and mind. Also we are seeing more and more young kids that come to a club with injuries or develop serious and sometimes chronic injuries. Others would know better but I understand that in other sports like American football, players are drafted at a later age. Basically kids are pushed far too early. They are thrown into a tough physical sport and subjected to intense pressure and public scrutiny. No one likes criticism, not even adults, but one can only imagine what kids between 18 to 20 must feel. They are given far too much money at a young age, but that's another story.

One of the more ridiculous comments I've read on this site. Jack Watts is becoming a vital Cog in a young team that's going places,and easily one of the most skilled players in the competition.

All stupidity and infighting aside, I’m surprised to see so many people on a Melbourne footy forum opposed to what is essentially a small voluntary donation to their favourite footy club.

i'm not even gonna post in this thread anymore, i'm just here to read

Really struggle with the dislike of Garland. He certainly isn't perfect but he is easily in our best 22. If you want to get rid of him put up a viable replacement that would be an improvement! Grimes I see as a first drop defender to cover for any injuries. Again, is you want him gone then who plays that role?

I think the coaching staff always wanted that, but mismanagement of our list through really poor periods of draft has led to a period in our football history that we all will not look back on fondly. The problem Watts faces/faced is one of expectation, expectation of his impact from the start of his career, right through now to expectations of his poor performances and thus they are continually highlighted. Whilst, as he said in the interview, he would love to remove all the lapses that he has, players have lapses in concentration and they will continue to happen wit hall players it is just we as fans and also the media choose to highlight the lapse from a prefferred whipping boy rather than anyone else. Do I think that the supporters have had any impact on Watts game? No Do i think that the supporters have had any impact on the style of football we play? No Am i happy with the changes that both Watts and the coaching staff have made? Yes I think you will find that supporters of the Melbourne football club who boo'd Jack Watts are knobs and really can't call themselves supporters. Whilst a trade was always an option for Jack, he was never going to be delisted and I am stoked about the way he has been able to play the last 2 months and hope he can carry it through the rest of the year. That being said, if he has one or two games where he falls below the standard he is starting to set, watch all of the stander critics talk about how he is not in our best 22 and how he is a waste of a football player.

I heard Port went after Gawny last year before they targeted Ryder and he had no interest in leaving then. I can't see him leaving now. I'm sure the club has an offer in front of him but at the same time I don't begrudge Max from playing a big 5 weeks so he can then point to a sustained patch of form as a reason for a really good contract.

The way he swoops his fringe to the side. When he points to the spot he marked the ball and makes the man on the mark walk back to it.

stuie we don't think you jump on your "moral high horse" we all know it is a moral high-chair

i'd rather the money go towards paying for good intel. about Dean Kent's hamstring injury(ies)...

Better get there early, dont wanna miss out on getting a seat

I'll spend every minute of the following week harassing all the North fans I know. So that's zero minutes.

Geeze I wish he had kicked that goal. The step and then the jets to go past two players like they were standing still. Would've been a great one for the highlight reel.

Can anyone remember the last time we asserted ourselves physically? It's been a long time. I liked it.

I backed him as a kid - he looked out of his league, but kids take time right? Then after a couple of years I went to warm on him. He was no longer a kid, but he seemed scared of his own shadow and made stupid mistakes all the time. After that he went down back and looked like a gem for a bunch of games. Hello? Is this the kid we were hoping for? Then he went cold. very cold. And I'll admit that I would have smiled if we got anything under the first 30 for him in return But... In the last 6 or so weeks he looks like the player that we hoped for - slick, fast, strong and committed to the win. Hmm. I need to see more of it before I'm 100% sold, but I'm sitting on a comfortable 99% right now. His straight line run from the FP to set up Vince on the weekend was great. He looked so much bigger and stronger than any of his opponents, and he knew it. That gave me more joy that even his 'best point of the decade' run gave. I hope he builds on this because when he does those things it is as good as any other star in the game, and like an iceberg I get the feeling that 9/10ths of his true talent is still hidden. Oh, and to that [censored] Collingwood fan that wanted to punch me back a couple of years ago. I was right. He isn't the worst #1 pick ever. Josh 'What is a football' Fraser still holds the title.

We play NM at the MCG.

I love the way he has little wrestles with his opponents. Let's chip in $2 each to support him

Little stu's going to have to tell his FB group he failed them and DL wasn't interested. I bet they won't be surprised though. What a plonk lol

I see a bad moon rising (aka new evidence) ... WADA finds 'abnormally high' TB4 levels in Essendon players

I can't wait for Watts to become a bonafide star of the AFL. The guy is gonna turn into the most loved Demon when he starts consistently tearing games apart. It'll be the feel-good turnaround of the decade. Go Watts!

Stuie can you organize demonland to chip in some cash for me and get rid of my warning points. Ta

I'll buy the whole club a round of drinks when they deliver our first flag in over 50 years... My annual membership and weekly attendance should do the rest. I don't believe rewarding mediocrity breeds success.

I would think it was a good idea if Stuie didn't.

Actually, I'll answer my own question. I think we should give any player who plays the same number of games for the Melbourne Football Club as did Robert Flower a medal called the Robert Flower medal (or trophy). To date, only David Neitz would be eligible. It would reward consistency, performance and loyalty as any player that plays 272 games for the MFC must have achieved each of those three attributes, just like Robbie Flower did.

This is an often under rated factor. He clearly is a great club man and his team mates love him. That's clear. In a team sport it is critical to have blokes like Vince and Watts around the club. He's also a solid citizen with his head on straight and seemingly good values. On top of all that he seems like a ripper bloke. Roos (and all coaches) talk about how critical good culture is and Watts is one of those blokes who brings people together and connects them. His team mates also now trust him onfield and the pattern him being ignored on leads seems to be long gone (and perhaps was a symptom of the culture problems at the club?). A related factor is he rarely misses through injury which suggest a high level of professionalism in his preparation and training. In short he is reliable. Crucially we are more likely to win when he plays well. If you look at our wins in the 3 years he has been a vital element in almost all of those games (the win over the bullies this year being perhaps the once exception this year). He is involved in so many of our scoring chains, either through direct assists or scoring involvements (eg def taps, handballs to space, accurate kicks to the corridor etc etc) that it could be argued he is our most influential player in terms of our chances of winning and losing. It dumbfounds me how anyone could argue that a 23 year old 100 game player that is the best user of the ball in the team, has the best footy brain and helps us win is a dud selection. On an unrelated point another area he is becoming important is going third man up and hitting it to advantage (reflecting his basketball background perhaps). I have lost count of the times he has gone third man up and hit to straight to a running player to set up a scoring chance.

I wasn't aware of there being multiple entities of any of those players. Why don't you just say 'players such as...' and then name them. Unless Bretreton had a brother or two I'm not aware of and wtf are you talking about anyway, is this comment supposed to be some sort of discussion? small handful of posters are starting to wreck this site with absolute drivel in every thread

I don't have any money, but I am assured by my good friend and business acquaintance, his Holiness the Prince of Nigeria, that if I send him $1000 to cut through some red tape in his country that he will then deposit the sum of one bajiilion dollars into my account. I think we should do this instead. I am willing to split the proceeds. Half a bajillion for me, half a bajillion for the Jones fund.

Myers? Why Myers? Such a strange target.

A lot of focus has been rightly placed on Jack's hardness, tackling and work ethic but I've been equally impressed with his clean hands around the contest and his clearance work.

Can't read it but I've been saying for a long time now that this commission is totally conflicted and will not make decisions for the betterment of the game but quite willing to line their own pockets. Mike 'I leave the room' Fitzpatrick has been an absolute disaster as Chief and with Dill the likeable as CEO we have a rudderless organisation...

To be fair, it doesn't say anything about leaving for better pay.

you mean there are other types of managers?

$1000 fine for Jones for wrestling. Money well spent I reckon.