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Bernie Vince will have the biggest Mad Monday this club has ever seen!

Jesse Hogan to become the first player in VFL/AFL history to win his club's goalkicking playing only 4 games.

Roos takes into account the collective wisdom of Demonland and delists 36 players at seasons end.

A baffled Roos in 'fit of pique' endeavors to employ Neeld as a consultant. Neeld declines with the words ... "It is what it is" Later on we sign 6 free agents who all agree to come to our club for less money. The AFL then get confused with the whole compo thing and grant us 3 priority picks.

Ben Kennedy is too short. If he went to St Kilda they'd set him alight.

Our ball movement and decision making is the number one thing that kills us and that's plain obvious from looking at either a Melbourne game or key stats from our games. It's not anything else. I've pointed out in previous posts that we've either matched it or come close to matching it when it comes to contested ball winning, (bar a couple of horrors). Our turnovers, slow decision making, poor skill execution and players not willing to hit up targets for fear of missing or making a mistake is what has killed us most this year. It's glaringly obvious. I don't know how posters are still going on about being beaten at the contest. It's the number one area we've improved most in this year and we are matching it with teams. It's simple. We no longer have trouble winning the ball. We have few problems over-possessing the ball with dinky sideways kicks in our backhalf, (which are mostly pointless possessions). But we have major problems holding onto the ball and trying to move it forward with purpose and potency. It's almost non-existent.

And how do you propose doing that hogan? Magic beans?

You're the most consistent poster on this forum. I'll leave it there.

Satyriconhome learns the definition of 'irony'.

Actually Bob. I don't think Jack Trengove's testing serves your argument very well here at all because if Petracca and Brayshaw test as well for their endurance, they would be definite shoe ins in terms of their ability as footballers to run in games.Also, one of the last players I recall whose style was criticised for relying on power at under age level was Ollie Wines. I believe there are some around Demonland who may have regrets that we overlooked him. Of course, it works both ways because others knocked Jackson McRae because he was a virtual unknown in junior circles and people had no idea about his stamina. Although physical testing remains important, there are other tests you need to apply and that is whether a kid can actually play football. I think we finally now have recruiters who can discern that a lot better than the mug who had the job a few years ago.

Dawes and Frawley haven't produced? Boy we all see things differently.

Grimes hits a target, Howe takes a hangar then hits a target,Bail keeps the ball in the postcode of Melbourne after a disposal and chippa signs with Cleveland.

Melbourne to announce it will field a standalone VFL team from 2016 (which will actually become 2015 when Casey Scorpions fold).

This is a reason why ROK is a must for us. Take Cross out of our lineup and look at the big on field leadership hole we have atm. Its no wonder we are playing so poorly since Cross hasbeen out. ROK is similar to him. We are still a young side that lacks experience and on field leadership.

you were going along fine there beats......................until you blamed bananas...........sacrilege!

Didn't hurt Freo this week.

As an assistant coach, it doesn't mean he is the coach in waiting. If he wants to get into coaching then why wouldn't he want to spend a year or two under Roos to kick it off.

I've seen enough from you I think. Welcome to my ignore list.

Ling must be fairly intimidated stepping into the void left by Brian Royal.

PRELUDE: As many of you know I have been a strong advocate of Sydney's Tom Mitchell, I wrote a thread to target him prior to his AFL debut and have continued to raise the point that he should be in our sights. In that regard I have found it strange that a player like him, who is constantly performing in the seconds at a high level can not crack into the senior side of Sydney while the likes of Brandon Jack and Zac Jones (haven't performed as highly in the seconds) have continued to get games ahead of him. It's only made me speculate that maybe he has refused or delayed contract talks until the end of this year (currently being his third season) when he most likely falls out of contract. Due to this lack of senior games and my somewhat obsession it caused me to follow him in the NEAFL and in doing so I have come across yet another quality young player that is certainly worth targeting. His name is Shane Biggs. Related Tom Mitchell thread: http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/33604-a-target-in-tom-mitchell/ BIOGRAPHY: Shane BIGGS: Age 22, Height 187 cm, Weight 84 kg. http://www.sydneyswans.com.au/player-profile/shane-biggs Third season at the Swans, originally selected at pick 13 of the 2012 Rookie Draft. Made his AFL debut in round 23 of 2013 and in total had three senior games (two during the 2013 finals). Will be out of contract at the end of this year and will either need to be elevated to the senior list or delisted. We should put forth a proposed trade that should see him come cheap (3rd or 4th round pick) and here's why. NEAFL statistics (averages for 12 games total with 1 goal total): 32 disposals, 21 kicks, 10 handballs, 5 marks, 2 tackles, 0 HO, 1 FF, 1 FA, 3 I50, 5 R50. * Before people get on their high horse saying "It's the NEAFL - a sub par competition equivalent to the VFL reserves", I rate him so highly because his numbers are close to Tom Mitchell's, and Ryan O'Keefe's while higher than the likes Jonathan O'Rourke. Mitchell's NEAFL stats (averages for 5 games total, with 6 goals total): 35 disposals, 14 kicks, 21 handballs, 6 marks, 5 tackles, 0 HO, 1 FF, 1 FA, 5 I50, 1 R50. O'Keefe's NEAFL stats (averages for 8 games total, with 4 goals total): 30 disposals, 16 kicks, 14 handballs, 5 marks, 9 tackles, 0 HO, 2 FF, 2 FA, 5 I50, 2 R50. O'Rourke's NEAFL stats (averages for 8 games total, with 4 goals total): 26 disposals, 13 kicks, 14 handballs, 6 marks, 3 tackles, 0 HO, 1 FF, 1 FA, 4 I50, 1 R50. Here is also a list of disposals stats BIGGS collected per game: Rd.1 = 29, Rd.2 = 28, Rd.3 = 31, Rd.4 = 29, Rd.5 = 25, Rd.6 = BYE, Rd.7 = 30, Rd.8 = 42, Rd.9 = BYE, Rd.10 = 26, Rd.11 = 28, Rd.12 = 32, Rd.13 = 30, Rd.14 = 50. OVERALL I think he could be a very good pick up at a very cheap price (3rd or 4th round pick). I would certainly have him on the list ahead Blease, Tapscott, Strauss, Nicholson, and Byrnes. Some old footage but shows he also has some dash about him:

Prediction No 2. Stuie will invite me to be his "friend" on D'land.

I also agree with beezlebub in that several weeks ago I obtained the same info and posted it on this site! AT THIS PIONT I WOULD PREFER HE GOES, this will give us some room to move re trading and manoeuvring ( and plenty of spare cash) for other more pressing needs. I think he is looong gone. So lets start preparing for 2015 without him!

I can understand it impacting the player but I think the teamates wouldn't give it a second thought

Including you?

Roos Kirk Ling Stone Mcpherson Rawlings Allison Mathews looks good to me

We will beat Port by 5 points this sunday.

Demonland posters will actually realise that everybody is entitled to an opinion, no matter how far it differs from theirs (may spoil some of my entertainment, but hey I can live with it)

Il win my supercoach comp.

nice work Ig'

I'm also warming to ROK, depsite his age I'd rather than a slow gun than slow young dud thats currently on our list. Plus he could be backup for Cross, we're missing him at the moment.

Anyone think that we might add both Brett Kirk and Cameron Ling as assistant coaches at seasons end?

Considering he's 1. from Sydney, 2. relatively tall for a mid, 3. mature, and 4. not a big name.... he sounds like the kind of player Roo's would target.

Yes it is good to ponder BM.But I doubt 26 disposals and JW will ever go in the same sentence

There are a hundred variables. Its about what you can get. he may not like a player but cant get anything for him. If he's contracted he stays. I disagree with you! It certainly can be a mindset but Watts has never shown it. Look that can be OK with some players. Steven Stretch comes to mind. One of the first picked every week yet not physical. Interestingly i have seen plenty of times when our players won't kick it to Watts who has run 30m on a lead. Its as thought they are saying 'stuff you I'm not giving you an easy ball'. there is somethig wrong and I suspect the club knows what it is. For me I'd trade him.

Yes, but a few weeks ago Bail was working his way back to being a productive player - now he is 'part of the problem.' I am sorry to say this - but this list will not be fixed this October. It will take 3 years. Bail being delisted for Pick 105 is not 'making the list better' it is in fact - doing the opposite. I am using Bail as an example here but the notion 'anyone would be better than...' is the stupidest reason to get rid of someone. At the end of 2007 and in the next couple of years we got rid of pros and replaced them with kids because 'that's how you rebuild' - well we now know that is BS. You make the list better by bringing in talent and making sure you space out the deletion of those that won't make it strategically so that you can maximise the amount of high end talent you bring in over these 3 years.

And our severe lack of them

I think it matters little if he is the anointed one IF we are a smart football club. I have repeatedly said that succession plans in business are not set in stone and I am hoping that we take the same philosophy. If the successor is not up to it - you go to plan B. It is true that you don't know how a person will transition from an assistant to a head coach - Neeld being the perfect example however I would hope that after two years that whoever is selected as the next coach will get the Roos tick of approval at the end of his next two year apprenticeship - "I have every confidence that A B or C, after the last two years as my understudy will make the transition to head coach" or conversely "After two years I am not convinced that A B or C is quite ready so I will stay on for another 2 years and further educate the assistant" or " "After two years I am convinced that A B or C is not cut out to be a head coach - I have instructed the MFC to look outside for a new coach". The idea that you anoint a successor but after his assisting period, even though you are unsure of him having the right stuff to make it as head coach, you plough on anyway is hopefully something that someone, with the abundance of grey matter of Roos, would not allow to happen.

Confidence in his body, his game and his fitness. Should be good for us with a full preseason under his belt.

This hurts my feelings, supermercado. I have a thread on the board right now and mine is better than this one. Nicholson is OOC this year. Tyson got a three year contract. Sigh...

If you don't get the ball the rest amounts to zero

Disagree. It's a mindset thing, t and being bigger than everyone else has a habit of changing that. Besides, while he doesn't run in hard at the contest there are a thousand other players from a range of other clubs who are similar - effect a tackle, but don't dominate it (don't tell me Watts doesn't tackle at all, he clearly does). Most of those players don't hold a candle to the skills that Watts possesses.

why stop at one with Cross...we need to find another similar

Really???? He kept Bartel to 15 touches and 1 goal 1. He only had 8 touches himself and is still working back from a fair ot of time off but I would have thought that was a win for him on the day. I recon out defence stood up well yesterday. It was the same old story of the midfield getting spanked starving our forwards of quality ball and our defence on a hiding to nothing. I dont think anyone in our defence will volunatrily be let go. They have done a good job all year as well as being plucked clean to fill vacancies in the forward line. The vast majority will go from the midfield. The backroom will be trawling the comp looking for developed class to fill mifdfield gaps as a priority. Delisted will be Blease, Strauss, Nicho and Tappy. There will be a whole bunch on the trade table as well but that could be anyone.

Actually, the majority of Demonland has had a blindspot where Grimes is concerned, until recently. Some people are now beginning to realise that Jack was massively overhyped and this was most probably off the back of his undoubted excellent leadership off field. Jack used to be able to get the ball, but he's never been a good user at AFL level. Now he rarely wins his own ball and his disposal and decision making haven't improved. I'd argue he's gone backwards. Roos clearly wants players who are versatile. He has played a few positions, but to detriment of the team. Strength is apparently one of his assets, but he gets consistently beaten in one-on-ones. However, when Grimes is on song, he can read the play well in front of him and chop off opposition forward thrusts with intercept marks. Finally, he plays in arguably one of the most important roles in a modern AFL team. As a half back flanker, he should be setting up the play, but he's simply not a good disposer and struggles one-on-one. His worth to the team is minimal. I love that he loves the club, but when his contract is up, he should be put up for trade or delisted. He's played over 80 games now. We know what we get with him and we've seen him go backwards under Roos. Time's up soon.

Ground management.There used to be six grounds ( 1980's ) that hosted games most weekends with two games / ground. There are now two grounds to host those games most weekends The surface of the MCG and Death park could not handle that many games. It is all about TV spreading the games over the max. hours of a weekend. They are not interested in what happens at the grounds only what they can televise. In Case you missed it the TV channels run the game now e.g. Clash jumpers!

I reckon he'd get a game at most if not all of them. Rather have him than the Silvia thanks.

and josh says "sure pj, good idea, i hadn't thought of that"

Whoever made this thread is an idiot.. The last CEO that made list management calls went real well didnt he?? Seriously, have a think before posting drunk..

I doubt there will be too many players involved in trades. More likely, I suspect Roos and co will adopt the same approach as last year and use one or two of our higher picks for some more established players - especially if Frawley leaves. Players on the chopping block will be those who have been around a while and can't break into the side. There are plenty of them around including Tapscott, Blease and Strauss for starters. Dan Nicholson is another. And as guys like Salem and Barry come on and Trengove comes back, pressure will come on guys like Bail, Terlich, McKenzie and Matt Jones. Even Grimes. I suspect Watts, as one of only 3 or 4 genuinely good kicks in the team, will be safe for now. We aren't suffering for endeavour, we lack skills once we get the ball and fail to hurt the opposition. The greatest improvement will come as we cycle out blokes who can't kick or make decisions for those who can. As I said, we have plenty of them to choose from.

Contested possessions 88-88 Clearances 28-25