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Now for some good news, according to the injury report Mitch is back Running and training with the Rehab group, and his foot is actually going quite well

Just a heads up Frosty.... If you are going to get stuck into arguably our best player for being "terrible" the last four years, you might want to remember that he was an AA in 2010. And that he has a significant hamstring injury that will prevent him from 'firing up', as you say, for the next 3-4 weeks. 'Terrible' is how I would describe this thread.

The year Ratten was our mid field coach we were top of the ladder at the round 18 mark. If that doesn't impress you then your a hard man to impress chippy!

LOL

Firstly, his name is Kevin. Secondly, "analising" the list sounds pretty painful

No by 18 years old your technique is hard to change, but what can improve is your decission making. I don't think our players are bad kicks I just think they make the wrong decision. Tom McDonald is a prime example along with Sam Blease, they just run themselves into trouble so instead of have an easy kick they pannick and are force to rush. It is also about kick placement, we kick to where players were rather than space for them to run on to. Our players confidence is shot completely shot, all they are thinking about is stuffing up. Jack Grimes has a nice kick for some reason he just tries to nail it low and hard all the time.

That would explain why he was on the 5:30am flight out of Melbourne the other week.

Bit hard against 10,000 inside 50's and no pressure up the field every week, he probably is the best full back in the comp really and the thing that has changed is we have gotten worse.

ZOMG ROOS COMING 2 MELB LOL ROFLAW!!

I spoke to Misso last week. He says there is no issue with the injury. He'll be 100%. The mid season problem was apparently caused by a screw moving and rubbing against a toe. This was causing too much pain to continue so it had to be removed. It wasn't actually a complication with the injury itself. Apparently he's going as expected after the surgery. They are just being conservative so he's ready to go for the pre season.

Big question is, how does this effect his photography?

i really doubt carlscum would cough up pick 9. but if they did i'd take it in a flash

Imo this is exactly why we should trade him, i reckon we'd get a first round pick and he is clearly not commited to the cause, that attitude will be seen by the younger players and spread, need more blokes like Nathan Jones who are hell bent on turning things around, not fair weather players like Watts.

Actually really good, we'd prepared for the worst but she's a great baby... Might all change when I tell her she's a Melbourne supporter though...

How's Frawley gone this year. I remember games on Hurley (Ess), Jones (WB), Franklin (Haw), Hawkins (Geel), Petrie (North), J, Riewoldt (Rich) and Tippett (Syd) where all those players barely won a one on one against Frawley and made very little impact on the scoreboard or game. At times he's looked a little under the weather and despondent but it's hard to blame him. I've got him down for only one truly bad game for the year and that was against West Coast and on the guy who is leading the Coleman and probably the best forward in the comp right now and that's Josh Kennedy. Frawley is our number 1 important player and must get a contract extension to stabilise the club. If I'm the new coach of Melbourne the first thing I do is go straight to Frawley and getting him extended.

He's a photographer from W.A but now lives in Melbourne.

so, does that mean the afl should withdraw from the wada umbrella? we surely can't sign up for wada but ignore their player responsibility and sentencing protocols, can we? if wada accept this reasoning from the afl the face of professional sport will be changed worldwide

Great idea Red. However, it needs to be informal - I don't want to be signing autographs but I want people to feel free to touch my robe.

I think that all the contributors to this thread that live in Melbourne should get together at the end of the year for a drink to drown our sorrows and to meet each other. I suggest around mid to late November so we can also discuss the drafting and trading that has been done. By then all will be finished except the PSD and Rookie draft. We could arrange banana daiquiris or banana smoothies and banana cake, banana bread, banana chips and other banana delicacies. What do you all think?

Karnezis told lions he wants out back home to Victoria. Perfect PSD pick 2 if we secure Adams via a trade

Anyone that thinks we have a strong forward line is not thinking straight. We don't, our backline would stand up pretty well with Frawley and Garland but not the forward line. Reckon we should trade Boyd if we had a chance to get him, no way. We will pick up mids, trade and develop some. You just don't get the opportunity to get once a once in a generation forward line. Ask the doggies. I know our mids are weak, we all can see that but don't be blinded by it and think we are ok in other areas of the ground, we are not. There won't be any A grade mids on the table apart from free agents and pensioners so unless the dogs want to give up Griffen then I would say no deal. From what I see in the coming draft Aish is the x factor mid, the grunt is Crouch and another Vic country boy who might be a bargain buy down the list is a kid called Holman. Very tough and hard at it.

How do you sell Ratten to the members and Sponsors?IMO the new coach as well as being a good coach needs to have had a premiership or near it success. Every one needs to believe the new coach is a cast iron good coach. 2014 is not going to be much better than this year. We cannot afford to have anyone that will have their ability questioned next May when things are crap. IMO Ratten does not hold that rating.

Surely it's Roos or it's Choco if both said no for some reason it's Eade.

I believe adam came through as a priority draft pick for the Jerusalem water wells he never played at full back and was drafted as a forward, it was his junior year that he played in the backline and showed the right stuff that sent the water wells members into a state of frenzied devoutness and even got him on the leadership group for the following year. alas he career petered out after a olive oil enrichment scandal. you can read about this in the old isreali herald reports by mighail sheazan

Jones seemed to improve a lot from 2009 to 2012 though that may have been more to do with decision making. Now he is quite a good user of the ball though not elite. I'm of the opinion that anything can be improved with hard work.

"we have no leadership" I know how to fix this. trade our two best leaders. good logic. possibly the stupidest thing ive ever read.

Gary, Caro and Lloyd all agreed on FC that Watts needs to man up and take responsibility and not hold the club at ransom and that leaving the MFC would be the easy way out Gary pointed to the example of Port last year who were a basket case, yet Travis Boak and Jackson Trengove both signed up when they were without a coach and said they want to stick around and turn things around for the Power Lloyd said Watts isnt doing himself any favors by saying hes holding out to see who the coach will be

The last days of The Hird Reich?

Belief brings a lot of skill into the game. All these players can play. You don't get drafted if you don't tear up the lower leagues. It's lack of belief in the style; in the team; in their team mates; in themselves; and in the club. Sure we're not going to be world beaters if that changes and nothing else does, but we'd be a different team with belief. Remember 87? Remember 2000? Were those teams suddenly that much more skillful leading into the last 6 or so games? Did they learn some new technical thing? Nope. They had faith in themselves, their teammates and the club. Dunno how you get it back, but if we can we'll stop being that rabble that we are.

Wooden spoon possible Not only possible; but probable, and appropriate for what is very clearly the worst team in many years. Sad fact but true.

Extremely unlikely. This isn't like a hamstring tear where scar tissue can create a weakness. Clark will be fine. The club is just being overly cautious because of how important he is.

Thank you Dr Al for your assesment I think I would prefer to hear from the others who posted re Clark's injury FMD Demonland should be renamed "for pessimists only"

Very good hardtack. he may well be the final straw for me. Not sure I could put up with him as well as the crap that will be 2014

Direct swap for Ro Bail?

I'd be wanting Martin & their first round pick & also somebody that can help him through rehab & possibly a school teacher to help him add & subtract.

Surely Adam was a father - son pick??

Quite frankly, I am not worried about how we deliver the footy, we don't get it enough. Give me a hard running mid that gets 20 uncontested possies and farks it up 6 times than a beautiful kick who gets it in space 7 times a game and never screws up. Kieran Jack is a rough kick. He is a superb footy player.

Tell that to Collingwood!

A lot of the points I was going to make have been mentioned but playing within limitations is very important. For example, Tom McDonald should never be allowed to kick across the face of goal.

Beat me to it. And Melbourne's falling off towards the end of the season in the mid-00s was certainly not exclusive to that year. They did it basically every year leading into the finals. We should have seen all of this coming. The club was never great at its height in the 00s. It was only ever "really good", and this always seemed to be enough.

dAgree with the removal of Captaincy, don't agree with the trades. New coach to give the Captaincy to Jones, or even perhaps to Dawes and allow the 2 young kids to flourish. Keep in mind Grimes has just come back from injury and was solid before he was i injured, averaging quite well in disposals (and in Supercoach ). And i feel Trenners is actually improving game by game and becoming that impact type player in a Bartel like mold. He is only 21 too. .

he also said that Dean Laidley has been told he isn't one of the 5

Davey should be dropped. Probably Byrnes too. In something of a slightly radical move, I'd consider dropping Howe - his work ethic is abysmal. Surely Strauss is deserving of a call up. I think it's also probably time to have a look at at least one of Taggert, Tynan and Davis. Pedersen stays. As much as most of us here don't like him, he was one of our better players v GWS. He worked a lot harder than many of our 'leaders'. Blease is not a scapegoat - he's a chronic lazy underperformer. One good game for Casey shouldn't be enough to get back in.

For all those harping on about 'Business Minds' you'd be well served to have a look at the vast majority of our board over the last 10 years. The feeling around town has been that most business people check their business brains at the door when they serve on a footy club board. If football has been your business, then maybe you'd be well served running a football business? It's not exactly a radical thought. Edit: iPhone doucheyness

We are talking about a man with no presence whatsoever. I do not understand what the benefit would be. Who cares about media contacts!

Priority picks are a massive red herring. Fool's Gold even. No matter how many high picks we are gifted, they are not going to help us unless we get our player development right. As handy as it might be to get pick 1 and trade it off for a quality mid or two, it is a bandaid solution to a deep-rooted problem and I would prefer the club to address the issue head-on instead of covering it up again. There is a massive flaw in our system that leads so many talented players to fail to reach their potential, and we need to identify the deficiency and fix it before we can get the club moving in the right direction.

We are far from tanking, we are just outright pathetic.

Thank you for waving the white flag, we know your view, you are also not alone in that view. I understand why you and others feel like that. I feel sick about our plight, but I won't quit and I expect my club not to either.I would prefer to dig in for the fight and a tough one it will be. Every year there is a club at the bottom of the ladder, that is pathetic and is an easybeat. The last couple of years that is us. I am ignoring GWS because they clearly will rise with more games experience. Our task is huge, but not impossible. I have invested 55 years in this club and I am not prepared to have it be for nothing. We have a good CEO. I believe we are about to appoint a good Footy Manager at season's end. I hope we appoint a good Coach. We have a new recruiting Manager about to have his first go for us at this year's draft. We are now looking strongly at development of players, rather than simply drafting them. We have a major ally in the AFL. In the short term they can help with finance, sponsorship and draft assistance. We need to be ruthless with our list. We hopefully have Clark back next year and a fit Dawes. Jesse will also play. We need to draft well and will have the chance to get a couple of the best young mids. We MIGHT be able to trade in a couple of experienced mids. If we put a top pick up or someone like Watts we might be able to get some more experienced mids in. If we cherrypick like the Tigers did for needs, there are players out there not getting a run at their clubs, who may add experience and hardness. I am not saying we get these guys necessarily, but players like Bell, Laidler and Duigan at Carlton are not being played and will leave and are hungry. Sewell may be on the outer at Hawthorn, especially as Cooney is being mentioned and even Martin to go to Hawthorn if Buddy leaves. A new coach can develop a new culture if there is significant change in the list. Adding 5-6 good mids and quick skillful players can change our list substantially. Over a year or two these players could completely change our game. Players like Viney, Toumpas, Fitzy, Clisby, Terlich, Blease, Gawn, Kent, Taggert, Tynan and McDonald etc can improve. Most agree our backs, forwards and rucks will be ok. We are pathetic in the midfield and couple that with a lack of disposal skill and pace and knowledge of a simple game plan, explains our current state on the field. We saw Port being beaten by GWS, have no money and being called the Melbourne of last year. Look at them now. It can be done. I agree it will not be easy to entice stars to our club, in fact it will be probably be impossible at the moment. However do we need stars now, or players with talent and hunger who are prepared to do whatever it takes, not in the Bombers' way, to forge successful AFL careers. Those players are out there, we just have to find them. I think of Barlow and even our Matt Jones from the VFL. What about other clubs in the AFL and the other clubs around the country. There are players who have been overlooked or are not getting a game, we must identify a few and get them.They are the sort of players who would come to us. They could provide the hard bodies, skill and experience that we need for the next period to get us competitive and back in the game again. I could go on, but I have made my point. WE ARE NOT FINISHED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I potted him. And he has been an abject failure. Anyone who thinks they're getting bang for their buck from this draft pick number 2 is border-line certifiable. But I also remember the talented junior and first year player I saw. Which is why his present poor movement, lack of instinct, lack of initiative, lack of aggression, lack of class, etc. is one of the greatest mysteries I've seen in football. And yes, everyone has an opinion as to why. There won't be a supporter in the country who doesn't want him to be the player we envisaged. He's one of the reasons we're as crud as we are.

We take Boyd and look to trade others.