TEAMS: Rd 23 vs Geelong

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,962]

As an asides, I'm quite happy to see big Steff Martin is still not right to step out onto the paddock for the Dogs.  He was looking good for them and I think really added to their side early this season before he got injured.  Particularly with Bruce out, I think they would have loved to get him back in for this game, when the double chance is all of a sudden on the line for them.  Hopefully it's a sign of his fragility and venerablility for the Dogs come finals.

Absolutely nothing against Steff personally (quite the contrary), but I'm tired of seeing players that we developed get recycled and contribute to the success of other teams at the expense of our own.

Edited August 19, 2021 by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

[DeezNuts 624]

5 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Am I the only one who would prefer Jones in the team over Sparrow?

No, not the only one on this occasion- Jones could do the job yet bow out gracefully without impeding on Neitz’s record

Edited August 19, 2021 by DeezNuts

[deanox 10,045]

4 hours ago, A F said:

I love JJ, but he's been nowhere since being moved onto the wing in that Brisbans game. If you look at his tackle numbers between rounds 1-13, he was top 10 in the competition (despite registering a tackle when playing wing). He's struggled to make an impact with his tackling or spread since.

Sparrow's tackle numbers last week were akin to Jordon's earlier in the year. I'd say that's why he's been kept in ahead of JJ. If Sparrow fails to match his tackle pressure of last week he'll be replaced by JJ. I think the MC like that really defensive role ages that can play off half back or half forward and add to the mid rotation.

For the season:

Sparrow averaging 7.5 disposals @69% DE, 123m gained, 1.8 SIs and 2.6 tackles, 

Jordon averaging 16.9, disposal @ 72% DE, 215 m gained, 3.3 SIs and 4.5 tackles.

 

I know that is averages not the last few weeks: Sparrow's last 3 has been his best of the season but I do think Jordan has been a pretty constant contributor. He has kept disposals pretty consistent but tackles dropped right off as you said: has his role changed?

[Garbo 1,559]

5 hours ago, Turner said:

honestly i'm not upset about the smith over hibbo call, we probably weren;t expecting sav to be dropped given blic will play deeper in defence more often without stewart so he would've second rucked to stanley, and they will keep us accountable in the air so having a capable extra tall would help us out. 

kadinia park is also narrow therefore less space to use run and kick which is hibbos strength and means more long deep bombs onto packs and crowded areas, suited to the athleticism and aerial ability of smith over hibbo.

im genuinely more upset about melk losing his spot ahead of sparrow, hear me out coz i know this is already polarising... we've looked better in the last two weeks with our inside 50s compared to the middle stretch of the season. due to the lack of wings u can afford to play gus through the guts more to take sparrow/jordons minutes + harmes increases his gametime and u can start melky/spargs/tmac on a wing and allow them to drill the ball onto chests going i50. alternatively i wouldn'tve been mad if tmac was left out for melky to hold his spot for the same reason, having less talls forces us to kick shorter and sharper which suits our forwards, BBB, fritsch and melky on the lead particularly rather than kicks to packs which suits the cats defenders, Kola, henry, hendo and blic who will knuckle everything.

anyway im not mad about the changes and definitely backing us in feeling pretty confident of a win

The argument to keep Melksham for his ball use into 50 only makes sense if he actually gets it. As it stands he got so little of the ball last week any difference in our efficiency as a team is just psychosomatic 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I’ve become increasingly sensitive to how the media portray us now that we are good. People like Eddie and Derm really struggle to acknowledge it (while their teams are poor especially), always providing excuses for the opposition and so on.

But this headline really got my goat:

Melbourne, the top team in the competition, the only team to be in the top four all year who are coming off a convincing win have “dumped” veterans (to bring in three very good players).

While Richmond, the reigning Premiers who have had an abhorrent season and will miss the finals can drop almost half their team and they are just “changes”.

[Boots and all 1,000]

12 hours ago, Jaded said:

I don’t know how Sparrow is in ahead of JJ. Unless JJ is sore he is just a better player. 
 

He looked sore on the weekend.

[Fritta and Turner 4,675]

13 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

I disagree with Smith holding his spot over Hibberd and Sparrow holding his spot over Jordon.

But, neither is an egregiously bad decision.

If Port wins, I truly hope Smith proves me wrong. 

Mr Titan, I have been meaning to ask for some time but have you ever met Mega Saurus?

But I digress,,,,  when I saw egregiously I nearly choked on my weeties....I had to reach for my Funken Wagtail....big word even for a MFC forum....unfortunately the translation could come out as shockingly bad bad decision but I will settle for outstandingly....my brain hurts...

 

 

[picket fence 17,973]

12 hours ago, Jaded said:

I absolutely disagree that we are going in too tall down back. Smith perhaps will take Rohan. But we know Geelong play tall and we need to have them covered for height to allow Lever to float. 
I am not against playing Smith over Hibbo. It’s just a curious selection for me as Smith hasn’t played all year and I don’t see how he cements a backline spot a week from finals. 
Our backline is arguably the most important part of our team. We’ve been settled since Tomlinson went down. Now Hunt is down and we are going into finals with a 3 gamer in Bowey and an equally inexperienced Smith? Seems risky. 

Smith has specifically replaced Hunt, not Hibbo is my take. Has similar pace, run and carry.

[forever demons 2,317]

wondering why the teams are not up on the mfc web site ,so slack

[binman 44,530]

13 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

Disagree again.

In both the VFL and AFL games he's played this year he has never played as a run and carry half back. He rebounds somewhat from the contest, because that's how he's always played, he hits the contest and keeps momentum forward, but he is not a run and carry player who will go further up the ground like Hunt does.

Here's Hunt's heatmap from his last full game (v GC):

Here's Smith's from last week v Adelaide:

Pretty clearly those are the heat maps of two completely different roles.

 

Fair points about the heat maps.

And smith's does show he played deep and in mays role. At least in the first half.

However heat maps can be deceptive.

For one thing, they only show where a player got their possessions, not where they run to. GPS numbers would give a better idea of how much running a players does. 

Smith only had 9 possessions in the crows game, almost all in the first half and many of them when he was manning Himmelburg.

Once Himmelburg went off Smith was released and played higher up the ground, albeit got few possessions (so not evident on the heat map)

In the gc game hunt had 19 possessions. So his heat map demonstrates how he gets up the ground.

I'm not sure why you say Smith has not played the hunt role in the vfl. If you have kayo, have a look at the last vfl game.

Against Werribee Smith had 19 possessions. And if there was a heat map available it would look very much the same as the hunts one in the gc game.

But we will soon see. 

Dazzler has made the suggestion he might play on Cameron, which makes sense. He has the pace to go with him and Cameron gets up the ground a lot.

So Smith can mark Cameron AND provide overlap run and carry and push up the ground. And have the pace to get back into defence.

Edited August 19, 2021 by binman

[Pates 9,672]

2 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I’ve become increasingly sensitive to how the media portray us now that we are good. People like Eddie and Derm really struggle to acknowledge it (while their teams are poor especially), always providing excuses for the opposition and so on.

But this headline really got my goat:

Melbourne, the top team in the competition, the only team to be in the top four all year who are coming off a convincing win have “dumped” veterans (to bring in three very good players).

While Richmond, the reigning Premiers who have had an abhorrent season and will miss the finals can drop almost half their team and they are just “changes”.

Agreed CB, it makes it sound like those guys have done something wrong. But we’ve actually replaced 2 “veterans” and one young bloke for 3 very experienced players (one that you’d also consider a veteran). More accurate title would be “Three star Dees return”. 

Will be interesting to see how Viney returns, he was not in good form before his suspension so hopefully this time off will have given him a chance to reload. 

It will also be interesting to see Goody’s moves on Saturday if the dogs get the win. Sounds like we want the win and are almost treating this as a dress rehearsal, but I would have no issue with us resting anyone that might have some soreness. 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

we have “dumped” veterans (to bring in three very good players).

While Richmond, the reigning Premiers who have had an abhorrent season and will miss the finals can drop almost half their team and they are just “changes”.

So, if I’m gonna break up with someone I shouldn’t say I’m “dumping” them, I should say I’m just making a “change.” 😆 

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,788]

6 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

So, if I’m gonna break up with someone I shouldn’t say I’m “dumping” them, I should say I’m just making a “change.” 😆 

Maybe "wholesale changes"

[Little Goffy 14,750]

4 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

So, if I’m gonna break up with someone I shouldn’t say I’m “dumping” them, I should say I’m just making a “change.” 😆 

So many factors to consider. Was it for form or fitness reasons? Like for like replacement or bringing in a specific roleplayer? Are they still being retained as a depth option?

[IRW 1,388]

4 hours ago, Garbo said:

The argument to keep Melksham for his ball use into 50 only makes sense if he actually gets it. As it stands he got so little of the ball last week any difference in our efficiency as a team is just psychosomatic 

True ....but surely he's a better medi sub than VDB

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

9 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

Maybe "wholesale changes"

“You’re being managed.”

[Pates 9,672]

9 minutes ago, Little Goffy said:

So many factors to consider. Was it for form or fitness reasons? Like for like replacement or bringing in a specific roleplayer? Are they still being retained as a depth option?

Might be general soreness 🤔.

[Dido 79]

The media have been notable quiet when it comes to reporting on the Dees achievements so far this year. Is this an advantage for us as we head into the finals?

 

[Engorged Onion 10,224]

3 minutes ago, Dido said:

The media have been notable quiet when it comes to reporting on the Dees achievements so far this year. Is this an advantage for us as we head into the finals?

 

Why would it matter either way? Are you worried that the team would get ahead of themselves.

I genuinely cannot imagine the team scrolling through their phones, imbibing all positive and negative reviews, and then referencing themselves against those reviews, either getting ahead of themselves or conversely not believing in themselves.

As Goodwin once spoke about - it's all Fugazi.

[whatwhat say what 23,428]

47 minutes ago, forever demons said:

wondering why the teams are not up on the mfc web site ,so slack

eh? literally the main story for the last 15 hours

[jnrmac 20,276]

16 minutes ago, Dido said:

The media have been notable quiet when it comes to reporting on the Dees achievements so far this year. Is this an advantage for us as we head into the finals?

 

Seriously who cares about this?

 

It's almost as if some pple are seeking validation...

[binman 44,530]

43 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

So, if I’m gonna break up with someone I shouldn’t say I’m “dumping” them, I should say I’m just making a “change.” 😆 

Managed?

[radar 1,865]

17 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Seriously who cares about this?

 

It's almost as if some pple are seeking validation...

Agree - who cares

AA, minor premiers, Rising Star, Brownlow, Coleman - SFA

Max holding the Cup only thing I wanna see

[drdrake 3,203]

I think this forum shows why Smith was picked, he has the ability to play on small/mid size forwards as well as big forwards.  I think he will start on Cameron.

We don't really get much stronger than this side.

[forever demons 2,317]

27 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

eh? literally the main story for the last 15 hours

thats odd it wasnt what  i saw earlier