On 10/02/2021 at 08:30, bing181 said:

Apart from Hunt, whose two high-scoring games skewed the stats, Weidemann had the highest goals/game average last year.

A fair point. He also ranked 10th in the league for marks inside 50 per game.

But my main issue with Sam is his intensity and effort. That's to say his lack of it. 

A huge issue for us last season was our woeful pressure inside 50 and out inability to keep it trapped there. In our really bad losses (i'm thinking Port, Freo, Swawns and Dogs) the  opposition just waltzed the ball out of our defence and up the field with ease.

Sure Weed is a big (pardon the tautology) and i read about his struggles, but he had only had six tackles for the season. Six.

The most he had in a single game was 2 against the crows.

And i'm pretty sure of those six, maybe one or max two were in the last 5 games or so, when our season was on the line and you'd expect him to be at his most desperate.    

Compare that to Port's Todd Marshall, who i reckon is a pretty fair comparison:

One year younger, drafted the year after Sam,  ten fewer games, similar position, a touch taller, a touch lighter and both top 20 picks (16 to Sam's pick 9).  And he played almost the same number of games in 2020 (14 to Sam's 13). 

Todd Marshall had 35 tackles for the 2020 season. Nearly six times more than Sam. 

Marshall had the 18th most tackles inside 50 per game of any player in the AFL in 2020.

It is also worth noting that its not as if the other bigs at Port were not pulling their weight on the tackle front. Dixon had 18 (and Rozee, who to be fair is a mid size forward at 175 cm, had 16). 

To be fair to Sam 83% of his tackles were inside 50.

The problem is he only had six tackles in total

We really need Fritsch to step up in the early rounds and be a Tim Membrey like prolific 40 goal a year mid sized forward (although Membrey had a quiet 2020)

Unfortunately he'll now attract a much better defender now that BBB and Weid are out.

I was expecting Fritta to be a major beneficiary with the recruit of BBB, but that will have to wait.

Year is over in Feb, wouldn't be normal if it wasn't. So sick of our crappy luck.

Edited February 11, 20214 yr by AzzKikA

Don't forget Roswell too, the new Brent Croswell is our Roswell...

  On 11/02/2021 at 00:30, loges said:

Would expect most people are sick of looking to next year.

You'd be surprised....

The last time Petty played afl he was a forward wasn't he ?

B Brown and Weideman are big losses for us and I hate seeing players out before the season, but we have decent depth in TMac, Jackson, M Brown and Petty. Smith as a forward is a bit of an enigma IMO and Rosman is unknown.

The one silver lining of it all is that Goodwin won't be tempted to fiddle with our team balance. Surely we will go with two key forwards and Fritsch. Petracca might also spend more time forward, although that will depend on Viney and/or Brayshaw playing.

It's not great but we just have to deal with it.

Whoever the 2/3 key talls are the delivery inside 50 and the structure will have more impact on winning games.

These outs hurt but if everyone knows their role we will be fine. The ability of players out IMO impacts against the really strong sides, but if all else is in place we should be beating those around us

  On 11/02/2021 at 05:05, Pennant St Dee said:

It's not great but we just have to deal with it.

Whoever the 2/3 key talls are the delivery inside 50 and the structure will have more impact on winning games.

These outs hurt but if everyone knows their role we will be fine. The ability of players out IMO impacts against the really strong sides, but if all else is in place we should be beating those around us

In a nutshell,  it's next man up PSD as long as the proper systems & structures are in place (and that includes our stoppages/midfield systems)

So T-Mac,  LJ & either Brown,  Smith,  Rosman or Petty rotating through 2 key positions in the forward line or the wing (T-Mac, Rosman) or on the ball (LJ)

They could rotate at the start of every quarter and/or half way through each quarter

Replacing 2 stay at home forwards (Ben Brown & Weideman)

Not sure that T-Mac or LJ are ideally suited as stay at home forwards.  One likes to roam (T-Mac) whilst LJ has versatility so let him be versatile

Edited February 11, 20214 yr by Macca

  On 10/02/2021 at 10:53, monoccular said:

It is now February by  the way 

 

Sounds like Petty will be reassigned up forward. 
 

One man’s pain is another’s opportunity 

I would rather Petty down back and Joel Smith forward!!

  On 11/02/2021 at 06:08, picket fence said:

I would rather Petty down back and Joel Smith forward!!

Joel Smith is a dead set dud

  On 11/02/2021 at 07:36, Roost it far said:

Joel Smith is a dead set dud

Geees he looks like an athlete though, imagine getting paid to work out 7 days a week for 5 years!!

  On 11/02/2021 at 07:43, Cards13 said:

Geees he looks like an athlete though, imagine getting paid to work out 7 days a week for 5 years!!

Yeh great for us!!

  On 11/02/2021 at 03:08, binman said:

A fair point. He also ranked 10th in the league for marks inside 50 per game.

But my main issue with Sam is his intensity and effort. That's to say his lack of it. 

A huge issue for us last season was our woeful pressure inside 50 and out inability to keep it trapped there. In our really bad losses (i'm thinking Port, Freo, Swawns and Dogs) the  opposition just waltzed the ball out of our defence and up the field with ease.

Sure Weed is a big (pardon the tautology) and i read about his struggles, but he had only had six tackles for the season. Six.

The most he had in a single game was 2 against the crows.

And i'm pretty sure of those six, maybe one or max two were in the last 5 games or so, when our season was on the line and you'd expect him to be at his most desperate.    

Compare that to Port's Todd Marshall, who i reckon is a pretty fair comparison:

One year younger, drafted the year after Sam,  ten fewer games, similar position, a touch taller, a touch lighter and both top 20 picks (16 to Sam's pick 9).  And he played almost the same number of games in 2020 (14 to Sam's 13). 

Todd Marshall had 35 tackles for the 2020 season. Nearly six times more than Sam. 

Marshall had the 18th most tackles inside 50 per game of any player in the AFL in 2020.

It is also worth noting that its not as if the other bigs at Port were not pulling their weight on the tackle front. Dixon had 18 (and Rozee, who to be fair is a mid size forward at 175 cm, had 16). 

To be fair to Sam 83% of his tackles were inside 50.

The problem is he only had six tackles in total

With thinking like this Binman, you're in line for a seat on the Filth's board.

  On 11/02/2021 at 08:16, Queanbeyan Demon said:

With thinking like this Binman, you're in line for a seat on the Filth's board.

To help the dees out, I'll convince the pies to trade for him

  On 11/02/2021 at 08:15, Roost it far said:

Yeh great for us!!

Here is hoping he turns the corner, to be fair to him he has never really had a clean run at it. 

  On 10/02/2021 at 21:04, Webber said:

Agree. Petty looked very good up forward in 2019. Great hands, aggressive, straight kick. And then there’s Joel Smith! 

   Please !  Joel Smith Don't make me cry.  What makes you say that?

   Brain freeze........

Edited February 11, 20214 yr by nosoupforme

  On 11/02/2021 at 08:56, nosoupforme said:

   Please !  Joel Smith Don't make me cry.  What makes you say that?

   Brain freeze........

I'm buying Smith shares. He'll make it.

Really sad for Sam, he will miss a fair chunk of the season along with BBB, however it opens the door for TMac, Mitch Brown, Luke Jackson and Harrison Petty, we now have the cattle to cover injuries and get on with the season proper. No time to mope it's time to crack in and show us what you have got. BBB and Sam do what you need to do to get yourselves right for the second half of the season and the finals boys, don't feel sorry for yourselves feel sorry for the teams that have to play us.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  On 11/02/2021 at 03:08, binman said:

A fair point. He also ranked 10th in the league for marks inside 50 per game.

But my main issue with Sam is his intensity and effort. That's to say his lack of it. 

A huge issue for us last season was our woeful pressure inside 50 and out inability to keep it trapped there. In our really bad losses (i'm thinking Port, Freo, Swawns and Dogs) the  opposition just waltzed the ball out of our defence and up the field with ease.

Sure Weed is a big (pardon the tautology) and i read about his struggles, but he had only had six tackles for the season. Six.

The most he had in a single game was 2 against the crows.

And i'm pretty sure of those six, maybe one or max two were in the last 5 games or so, when our season was on the line and you'd expect him to be at his most desperate.    

Compare that to Port's Todd Marshall, who i reckon is a pretty fair comparison:

One year younger, drafted the year after Sam,  ten fewer games, similar position, a touch taller, a touch lighter and both top 20 picks (16 to Sam's pick 9).  And he played almost the same number of games in 2020 (14 to Sam's 13). 

Todd Marshall had 35 tackles for the 2020 season. Nearly six times more than Sam. 

Marshall had the 18th most tackles inside 50 per game of any player in the AFL in 2020.

It is also worth noting that its not as if the other bigs at Port were not pulling their weight on the tackle front. Dixon had 18 (and Rozee, who to be fair is a mid size forward at 175 cm, had 16). 

To be fair to Sam 83% of his tackles were inside 50.

The problem is he only had six tackles in total

Yeh, you reckon Marshall is a fair comparison because his tackle count is high for a kpp and it suits your argument. 

I think you pick and choose who you like frankly. 

All the time in the world for Oscar who is now delisted.

No time for Weideman. 

Doesn't quite add up. 

  On 11/02/2021 at 02:36, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

Not really an positive spin I can find for our first two choice KPFs missing a big chunk of preseason and the season proper.
Weideman was very impressive in 2020 and was statistically on par with his KPF peers.

McDonald said he wanted the opportunity to prove himself... well, here it is!  Hopefully, with a full preseason and a lighter frame, McDonald can be released to play a more ranging, traditional CHF role.  His tank was his best asset prior to the toe and ankle issues and the role of the hulking, inside 50, power forward didn't work for him in 2019/20.

I don't love the idea of Jackson and Fritsch being inside 50 targets, but hopefully this can bring about a change in forward 50 entries (which was hopefully being worked on anyway). 

I currently don't have Petty in my best 22 ahead of a more versatile Tomlinson, but he may be worth a look and will be interesting to see where he trains/plays for the remainder of the preseason.  

Bit harsh on Tommy but he has to perform no doubt. So does  Mitch Brown who is very honest when selected 

Think  you will find both Fritsch and Jacko will with Kossie get more of the ball this year and do much more with it with Bowey ANB Laurie Rosman Debuting and Spargo improVing our competitive assault we should get a lot more goals with team play and varied style players crumbing leading and greater skills in conversion.

Then BBB can come back and provide a spearhead of quality with Weid about mid year getting his opportunity to join a productive and improving forward line.

  On 11/02/2021 at 11:06, JimmyGadson said:

Yeh, you reckon Marshall is a fair comparison because his tackle count is high for a kpp and it suits your argument. 

I think you pick and choose who you like frankly. 

All the time in the world for Oscar who is now delisted.

No time for Weideman. 

Doesn't quite add up. 

I like players who try super hard and play with intensity. And tackle. 

No time for weed?

Again with the misrepresentation.

When did I say I had no time for him? Or even imply I had no time for him?

I've always 'had time' for sam.

I gave him credit for his goals and highlighted his marks inside 50. Have always been a fan. I'm a fan of all our players (though melksham is testing my patience)

I said I had lost faith, explained why, and supported that view with evidence. All very logical and dispassionate i would have thought.

But I sincerly hope he makes it.  I am open for my faith to be restored. He has the talent, as I have acknowledged throughout his career. Just has to get to AFL level intensity. 

I'm critical of a player and you of all people find that curious?

And on Marshall I landed on him because I was looking for a comparable player and correctly assumed he fitted the bill. 

Believe, or not believe me, I don't care but I didn't look at his tackle count unti after I selected him. Either way it proved my point.

But for fairness sake here are the number of tackles in 2020 of a random selection of some other key forwards (young and old):

Max King: 22

Ben King: 7

Josh Kennedy: 16

Luke Jackson: 8 (in 6 games). So 2 more than Sam in 7 fewer games. A kid in his first season of footy.

Tmac: 15 (in 9 games)

Dixon: 18

Sam Day: 21

Jeremy Cameron: 24

Hawkins: 40

Oscar Allen (who i should have picked because he is pretty comparable age wise etc and plays with the sort of intensity I wish Sam did. And his name is Oscar): 41

Charlie curnow: six fewer than Sam, with zero. Had a good excuse though as he didn't play a game last season. But over his career averages 2.2 per game so on that average would have had 28 odd if he had played Sam's 13 games.

Tom Lynch (tigers): 23

Tom Lynch (crows): 13 

Tex Walker: 14.

Darling: 35.

You get the point.

Maybe.

Perhaps you are ok with a key forward averaging a tackle every two games. 

Maybe in your analysis of a players you don't rate the tackle stat or don't mind that a 95 kg, 23 year old key forward doesn't throw his weight around, crunch defenders, apply pressure or trap the ball inside 50.

Call me crazy, but I do. 

Edited February 11, 20214 yr by binman

  On 11/02/2021 at 09:04, binman said:

I'm buying Smith shares. He'll make it.

No GameStoping here binny!!! 

  On 11/02/2021 at 19:16, Cards13 said:

No GameStoping here binny!!! 

Some might argue buying Smith shares is more akin to loading up ganja shares, as the reddit crew have moved on to

 

Salt on the wound? Geez it would be ironic if he has a stellar year and we have our 2 key positions players injured. 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2021/02/11/hogan-getting-better-and-better-in-first-full-pre-season-in-years