11 hours ago, joeboy said:

TMac’s inevitable departure smacks of the same supporters’ sentiments as those expressed with Jack Watts’ removal.

 

Just calling out an inaccurate statement here.

 

11 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Not sure some on here understand the haircut we will take if T Mac leaves.

IMO he should go but we will probably end up paying around $200k per year of his salary for the next two years. Anything under $200k would be a win for us.

All players took a pay cut this year due to CoVid. It’s hard to predict what will happen to salaries next year given that covid’s still around and the AFL has lost a lot of money due to lack of crowds etc.

From a football perspective, I think we would be very happy if Tom went across to Collingwood and shifted down back again.

 

 

1 minute ago, BW511 said:

From a football perspective, I think we would be very happy if Tom went across to Collingwood and shifted down back again.

 

 

Yeh easy to run off him and win  contests. Not to mention his kicking

9 hours ago, Timothy Reddan-A'Blew said:

On a serious note, Brown vs TMac?How much different was Brown's 2020 form from Tom's? Can all Brown's fall be blamed on others? Can all Tom's fall be blamed on him?

In fairness Brown had injury issues, Nth were a basket case and I believe he had some family issues.   

Just now, Demons11 said:

In fairness Brown had injury issues, Nth were a basket case and I believe he had some family issues.   

He lost a child, that's pretty serious. Would be enough to put pressure on all relationships, particularly the football one

10 hours ago, Timothy Reddan-A'Blew said:

On a serious note, Brown vs TMac?How much different was Brown's 2020 form from Tom's? Can all Brown's fall be blamed on others? Can all Tom's fall be blamed on him?

Both have had injuries this year and struggled to find rhythm. It cant have been an easy year when out of form. I don't think either are to blame, but the quesrion is "who is more likely to hit form in 2021?

I think that Brown (kicking 32, 41, 63, 61, and 64 goals in the 5 seasons before 2020) has a more consistent body of work behind him than TMac (one season above 23 goals) who although he has had periods of top flight football, it has been in patches and in different positions.

Ben had an average 2020 (injuries and personal reasons). Tmac had an average 2020 (also injuries) but also a poor 2019, so has been out of form longer.

Based on that, one could assume Brown is more likely to regain form, than TMac who has been in the wilderness for a couple of years now.

 

TMac has always been a chaos player and he gets bogged down in structures which is why he gets thrown on the wing every now and then for a bit of freedom. Unfortunately chaos and freedom isnt a great way to find form at the top level, where even if you aren't in form, you need to find a way to do the basics and play your role.

It seems Brown may have had a falling out with the coaching staff around their response in a difficult personal time (documented elsewhere).

So it also could be that for both players, a fresh start, new environment, new coach, new game plan, will reinvigorate form.

12 minutes ago, BW511 said:

He lost a child, that's pretty serious. Would be enough to put pressure on all relationships, particularly the football one

?

big thing that favours brown as a modern key forward over t mac is his height and reach - he's got a solid 2-3 inches of height, plus brown is one of those forward who marks the ball at the top of his reach

in terms of who i'd prefer as our key forward going forward, my vote definitely goes to brown

Just now, whatwhatsaywhat said:

big thing that favours brown as a modern key forward over t mac is his height and reach - he's got a solid 2-3 inches of height, plus brown is one of those forward who marks the ball at the top of his reach

in terms of who i'd prefer as our key forward going forward, my vote definitely goes to brown

You could have stopped at "plus brown is one of those forward who marks the ball"

10 hours ago, binman said:

Not in my opinion.

C'mon binman, Watts was a no hoper. Guys like that who see footy as a hobby rather than a profession are locker room cancers. He had 10 years to prove his worth here and has subsequently retired without firing a shot at Port. Good luck to him it seems he got what he wanted out of footy but the club was right to move him on if anything they probably did so too late in the piece.

21 minutes ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

big thing that favours brown as a modern key forward over t mac is his height and reach - he's got a solid 2-3 inches of height, plus brown is one of those forward who marks the ball at the top of his reach

in terms of who i'd prefer as our key forward going forward, my vote definitely goes to brown

Just want to congratulate you on the bolded phrase.  I am so sick of commentators saying 'he marks the ball at its highest point' when what they actually mean is what you wrote. 

1 hour ago, Demons11 said:

In fairness Brown had injury issues, Nth were a basket case and I believe he had some family issues.   

Brown is now a genuine dedicated family man. I think priorities have shifted. He and Weid are both straight up the ground leads. It would take some serious forward coaches for both to play together.

Tom was terrific in 2018, in fact he has been a really good servant of the footy club, was more than a capable defender and made a great switch to the fwd line and played significant part in lots of great victories. There does come a time though when things have to move on and Tom is sadly part of this. There is no spot for him down back, and his fwd craft is no good when he cannot mark or turn or run and that does not look like getting better. 

Its a no brainer that he moves on for both him and teh club, i really genuinely hope there is no bad blood as it is just the way it is. As i always say, the minute you pull on a Red and blue jumper for either 1 game or 200 games you are a demon for life and Tom will be remembered as a really good Demon.

1 hour ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

big thing that favours brown as a modern key forward over t mac is his height and reach - he's got a solid 2-3 inches of height, plus brown is one of those forward who marks the ball at the top of his reach

 

44 minutes ago, sue said:

Just want to congratulate you on the bolded phrase.  I am so sick of commentators saying 'he marks the ball at its highest point' when what they actually mean is what you wrote. 

Maybe, just maybe you could change the commentators vernacular. However, there are those amongst them who would still insist that the ball was 'chiselled' to him. ?

Sam Edmund stated on SEN that he doesn't see a trade being likely given TMac's contract. I don't see any team putting their hands up given his output last year unless we pay most of the contract and given him away for a token pick. I would continue to shop him around, but I think we should plan for TMac to remain a Demon.

Re T.Mac out and Brown in. What's Brown like when the ball's below his knees? How are his knees?

If Tmac can get his mobility back and some confidence i am still completely confident he can be a good player at AFL level for us. 

if he goes, i'd only allow that to happen if we got something worthwhile in return. 

pick 78 wouldn't cut it, would rather keep him and back him to find form

13 hours ago, Queanbeyan Demon said:

Didn't Peter Moore win a Brownlow with us? Henry Coles went around alright. 

John Dellamarta, Wayne Gordon, Charlie Pagnocolo??

3 hours ago, My name is legion said:

All players took a pay cut this year due to CoVid. It’s hard to predict what will happen to salaries next year given that covid’s still around and the AFL has lost a lot of money due to lack of crowds etc.

The paycut they took was a proportionate pay cut with a corresponding reduction in the salary cap.

If they take a paycut the Tom salary supplement may go down in dollar terms but as a percentage of the new salary cap and media revenue from the AFL it will remain the same.

1 hour ago, Fat Tony said:

Sam Edmund stated on SEN that he doesn't see a trade being likely given TMac's contract. I don't see any team putting their hands up given his output last year unless we pay most of the contract and given him away for a token pick. I would continue to shop him around, but I think we should plan for TMac to remain a Demon.

I think that's quite likely. As I posed on another thread how much are we prepared to pay to trade him.

Per year..100k, 200k 250k ?

58 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

Sam Edmund stated on SEN that he doesn't see a trade being likely given TMac's contract. I don't see any team putting their hands up given his output last year unless we pay most of the contract and given him away for a token pick. I would continue to shop him around, but I think we should plan for TMac to remain a Demon.

Any club will want the MFC to pick up 20-30% of his contract, I can't see that happening MFC paying him 150-200K a year plus getting what would be at best a third round pick for him, unless we really want him out of the club or he really wants to leave, if it is he wants to leave we should be able to say no worries but we need to re-negotiate your contract so we aren't picking up a fair whack if he moves.

2 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Any club will want the MFC to pick up 20-30% of his contract, I can't see that happening MFC paying him 150-200K a year plus getting what would be at best a third round pick for him, unless we really want him out of the club or he really wants to leave, if it is he wants to leave we should be able to say no worries but we need to re-negotiate your contract so we aren't picking up a fair whack if he moves.

Tom is 28...this is his last contract of any size

Why would he take a salary cut.There's no upside.

Conversely what club wants a disgruntled player languishing in the VFL

This ain't easy save for those who think he'll magically regain form.

(Fairytales never come true at the MFC as we all know)

16 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

The paycut they took was a proportionate pay cut with a corresponding reduction in the salary cap.

If they take a paycut the Tom salary supplement may go down in dollar terms but as a percentage of the new salary cap and media revenue from the AFL it will remain the same.

I think it’s fair to say we don’t know what the future holds for next year for sure. CoVid may still be around in a big way. The AFL leaders may well change their minds regarding salaries and salary caps depending on the whole financial situation of the AFL and the economic situation in Australia.

1 hour ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

If Tmac can get his mobility back and some confidence i am still completely confident he can be a good player at AFL level for us. 

if he goes, i'd only allow that to happen if we got something worthwhile in return. 

pick 78 wouldn't cut it, would rather keep him and back him to find form

I agree - but if he can't get the mobility and confidence back then he is no use to us.  If he is being shopped around, it might be an indication that the club don't think he can get it back.