POSTGAME: Rd 08 vs Brisbane

[DemonOX 8,791]

23 minutes ago, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

I've hardly read this thread, because I was driving back and have been busy at work today, but I do feel that one of the things Brisbane did which significantly helped their cause was to mitigate the impact of Max's marking and presence around the ground. 

I would like to know what the coach was trying to do to counter it especially sharking his taps. From where I was sitting there didn’t seem to be much change going on. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

1 hour ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Trac's season's getting ridiculous.

Willed us back into the game in the last quarter.

True, but Viney deserves plenty of credit as well.  He had 7 touches in the first 7 minutes of the last term and was everywhere.  Both he and Trac were the ones to get us going.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,223]

10 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Getting very worried about Brayshaw:

• Again played only 65% of the game. 
• He doesn't have a role to make his own in the team. 
• Don't know how many rotations he had but he seemed to be on/off the field a lot, almost as if he was a 'relief' player to give others a spell. 
• He looked frustrated at one rotation when he almost pulled his helmet off. 

These first 3 things would make it exceptionally difficult to get into the rhythm of the game, to get some touch for the ball and that 6th sense for where teammates and opponents are.

Not making excuses as he had a poor game.  But not sure he is being given the best opportunity to play to his strengths.

He cannot play anywhere other than in the middle and he is well behind Trac, Oliver and Viney with his impact in there. Needs to learn a new role in 2020 or accept low minutes or demotion if form does not improve. Full length quarters in 2021 will see his role as 4th inside mid have greater importance and minutes for him to find his rhythm.

[nosoupforme 3,085]

3 hours ago, A F said:

I'd argue our defence and team defence is way better than 2018, but our ball movement isn't as fluid forward of centre in 2020 as it was in 2018 IMO.

The combination in the middle is missing a cylinder and that is Brayshaw However l will not get into an argument as IMO he is down on form and not playing enough time in there. Throw him to the wolves at the start and hope he finds the Brownlow form of 2018.

Petrac , Clarry Brayshaw, Viney and Langdon on the wings and Harmes on the Forward line or can play a vital tagging job.

Brayshaw seems to be the bunny who finds himself spending more time on the bench. Doesn't help his confidence.

The good teams find a way to rotate their Mids and we have to find that combination  for us to move the ball forward of centre as you say AF.

[CHF 2,748]

My one word analysis of that game is 'FRUSTRATING'.

Broke even in the first quarter, lost the plot a bit in the second and third and came home well in the last quarter.

Frustrating when I can see what they are trying to do but fail on the skills and quality because of overuse.

Frustrating when we have a tap ruck that is the best in the business and we still get killed on clearances.

Frustrating when we have so many relatively easy shots on goal and cannot convert.

Frustrating when there is no logic or consistency in the umpiring decisions.

Frustrating to see us get so close to a win over the Lions when, for a majority of the game, we were just not playing well.

Frustrating....Frustrating....Frustrating

Our defence was good. it kept us in the game and gave us a sniff of victory. The structure of May, OMac, Lever and Hibberd at the heart of the zone is working well. Lockhart has surprised me as he is growing into the structure very well and I was not a fan. Jetta is a weak link at the moment and I think we will rest him next week after his couple of head knocks and only a 4 day break.

Midfield is a puzzle to me. We have the talent there on the inside in particular with Petracca, Oliver and Viney with back up from Brayshaw and Harmes. It is the outside we lacked polish. It was also frustrating that I did not see us trying to adjust to what was happening with clearances. Gawn was dropping it to players in close and I do not recall him tapping it further out as a tactic. 

Forward play was ok with the structures that they had. I would have liked to see a swap between Weideman and Jackson  a few times just to mix it up. have Jackson move to the goal square for a bit and have Wiedeman take his man further from goal. 

In all, as I said, I found it very frustrating...... Should I go on about the umps?

[dazzledavey36 55,041]

3 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

With respect to the Hannan - Fristch debacle, I absolutely blame Fristch more than Hannan on that one.

Hannan's kick was terrible however a Lions kick in from deep in the back pocket would've been kicked to a Max Gawn contest 60 mtrs out from goal and who know what would've happened. It was the best part of the ground to make a mistake/give away a free.

Instead Fritsch carried on like a "smart alec" as Barret labelled him, and was warned numerous times to give the ball back, only for him to then lie on the pill. Can't defend the indefensible there.

I don't know if Goodwin delivers good old fashioned cooks after the game but Fristch deserves one right there.

The Lever point review was frustrating as hell, but technically the goal umpire did the right thing as it was a close call. But common sense suggested it should not have been called back for such an irrelevant score of 1 point.

Good performance by the lads to keep a top 2 side goal-less in the last quarter, but ultimately these honorable losses are going to cost us finals. There will no good will from supporters or media if we drop another thriller to Port this week. Infact it will be season over as we can't go 7-2 after Port. 

Agree with this wholeheartedly.  Still filthy on Fristch for pulling that [censored] off.

I'm hoping Goodwin gave him an almighty serve. He needs to step up this weekend and repay the boys back. 

[Brownie 5,981]

3 hours ago, loges said:

Now you make a great post here. When I played and I know that was a long time ago, you were told, play in front, be first in for the ball and you will be given the benefit. Now we have a senior coach advocating no prior opportunity. Surely you have to look after the ball winner. Reduce the time to get rid of the ball maybe but to take it away is altering the fabric of the game. Coaches seem to throw up anything but reduced interchange to improve the game but all these interchanges is when the game started to go down hill.

There was a deliberate free paid against Nev for toeing the ball back towards goal and over the line. It was a one on one and the Lions player was on his hammer. I reckon he was afraid to slow down and pick it up as he'd get pinged for htb.

It's a worrying sign.

[P-man 13,366]

McStay getting two weeks for the bump on Jetta is a joke tbh. I’d be filthy if it was a Melbourne player

What exactly is McStay meant to do im that situation when Jetta puts his head down and charges into him? Jump out of the way? Even Goodwin in the presser acknowledged that players need to be better at turning their body before contact.

It really seems like the match review process and basic common sense are an ill fit.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,235]

2 hours ago, bing181 said:

If, if, if.

But back in the real world, we didn't beat Geelong. Or the Lions. Or Richmond or West Coast for that matter.  The ladder doesn't lie, and for the moment at least, we're a mid-table team who have been consistently beaten by teams in the upper part of the table.

We have a forward line built around kids and players with under 50 games. In the mids, after a few stars of the comp, we have players who half the contributors to this thread think should be dropped. We have a backline with a player who's past it, one who's a kid who may/may not make it, and another who's so criticised he has his own ongoing thread.

Top 4? Delusional.

It's not delusional at all, those games both came down to the final minute. Yes the Carlton game could've gone the other way as well but we've improved our structure and ball movement a lot since then. We are clearly thereabouts just need to start clinching these wins. I don't know if you've watched much footy this year but there aren't many good teams around. We are easily a top 8 side and one of a few pushing towards that upper bracket. You might argue that we still have a couple of things to fix before we can make the claim but to call supporters "delusional" for thinking we should be there is under selling what this team is capable of.

[P-man 13,366]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I don't know if you've watched much footy this year but there aren't many good teams around. We are easily a top 8 side and one of a few pushing towards that upper bracket.

How true this is. I’m continually struck by how bog ordinary the league is these days. Compare league leaders Port to a Hawthorn, Geelong or St Kilda in their heyday. No comparison. Top 8 is well within the reach this year for this reason alone.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

3 minutes ago, P-man said:

How true this is. I’m continually struck by how bog ordinary the league is these days. Compare league leaders Port to a Hawthorn, Geelong or St Kilda in their heyday. No comparison. Top 8 is well within the reach this year for this reason alone.

Agree.

West Coast climbed 6 spots on the ladder with one win. That only happens when teams are all relatively close to one another on points/percentage.

If we can go 3-1 over the next month and come out at 6-5, the season is very much alive. It will probably also still be alive at 5-6, depending on how we play and other results.

[DemonOX 8,791]

Even Terry Wallace said on SEN he couldn’t understand why Harmes wasn’t tagging Neale from the first quarter rather than getting Viney to run with him in the second quarter when he was up and running. 
 

WTF goes through Goodwins brain not to send our best tagger to the oops best mid player. 
 

Absolutely boggles the mind. 

[nosoupforme 3,085]

2 hours ago, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

So many mixed feelings about last night's game.

We didn't play that well for a big chunk of the game, but were still very competitive in the final wash up on the score board.

I hate 'honorable' losses, but to get so close gives me some comfort that our team and form are currently around the mark. 

Even though we really didn't deserve to win in some ways, I was absolutely spewing inside at the time, because being there at the ground, it would have been sensational to stick it up the numerous moronic Lions supporters I was surrounded by at the time.  So rank that a suposed home game for us was really more of a home game for them.

I think I also feel denied by some of the diabolical umpiring decisions in the last ten minutes.  Both the BS score review and the 50m penalty paid against Fritsch.  Although we were on the right end of a few 50m that resulted in goals (Gawn & Jones), they were both pretty clearly there, where as the argumentative "you didn't get the ball back quickly enough" type 50m are so rarely paid and combined, they both had the effect of snuffing out any chance of scoring that final goal in the dying minutes.

Conversely feeling of being cheated by the men in yellow is also somewhat ballanced by the numerous regulation shots from Weid and Bennel that should have been put away and the brain faid from Nev that handed them a goal via Charlie Cameron.

Also disapointed, because it feels like a bit of a turning point in our season.  It puts a pretty big bridge between us and keeping up with the top 8.  Conversely I also think that we are good enough on our way to beat Port on Thursday night, win the next 3 games after that and be back in the hunt, but it's a pretty big ask.

YOU HAVE TO BE IN IT TO WIN IT. Balls we have a game up our sleeve if that helps

The boys battled it out although they were disappointed after the loss l am sure they won't die wondering.  IMO we are now playing better and consistent footy an there is the upside as well.  They might get it right in the coming games and things may fall into place.

We keep the Faith.

[sue 9,107]

1 hour ago, P-man said:

McStay getting two weeks for the bump on Jetta is a joke tbh. I’d be filthy if it was a Melbourne player

What exactly is McStay meant to do im that situation when Jetta puts his head down and charges into him? Jump out of the way? Even Goodwin in the presser acknowledged that players need to be better at turning their body before contact.

It really seems like the match review process and basic common sense are an ill fit.

Complete rubbish (IMO). Look at the video and you see a player trying to bump rather than get the ball or tackle. And with his elbow raised.   I guess you’d say that every such collision is down to the victim for not running away. 

[Watts the matter 1,235]

14 minutes ago, sue said:

Complete rubbish (IMO). Look at the video and you see a player trying to bump rather than get the ball or tackle. And with his elbow raised.   I guess you’d say that every such collision is down to the victim for not running away. 

Even Goodwin has acknowledged Jetta was leaning with his head and had a responsibility to turn his body (as Mcstay also had to avoid the head)

[P-man 13,366]

26 minutes ago, sue said:

Complete rubbish (IMO). Look at the video and you see a player trying to bump rather than get the ball or tackle. And with his elbow raised.   I guess you’d say that every such collision is down to the victim for not running away. 

We are placing a ridiculous amount of responsibility on players if that action is worth a two match ban. Jetta clearly leads with his head. It’s poor technique on his part.

If you reversed the jumpers and told me hand to heart you’d be happy with a two match ban for that, then I really have no words.

[dazzledavey36 55,041]

16 minutes ago, P-man said:

We are placing a ridiculous amount of responsibility on players if that action is worth a two match ban. Jetta clearly leads with his head. It’s poor technique on his part.

If you reversed the jumpers and told me hand to heart you’d be happy with a two match ban for that, then I really have no words.

The fact Goodwin acknowledged that Jetta had a responsibility to turn his head his body speaks enough for me.

Again, so many are clouded by their red and blue blinkers on.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

The AFL's "Access All Areas" video has the behind-the-goals camera shot of the Lever score review:

The highlighted players are ours. Food for thought on what we could have done with that.

I also took another look at Hannan's kick to Fritsch:

It's blurry, but smack bang in the middle there is Viney, all on his own.

Hannan committed the 2020 MFC cardinal sin number 1: playing on and rushing his kick inside 50 without thinking.

To give Fritsch some benefit of the doubt, Bennell was behind him in the goalsquare. Maybe he was leading up into the pocket to draw a player away from the hotspot and give us a bit more space.

[Rodney (Balls) Grinter 10,842]

There is a huge difference to how you might perceive thie Jetra incident watching it in real time or slow motion. 

Watch it in slow motion and/or freeze frame it at the critical moment and it looks like McStay lines up Jetta and elects to bump.

Watch it in real time and I think it's apparent that there is just players going everywhere and McStay just braces himself for an instant at the wrong time in the wrong way, almost as a reflex action and collects Jetta's head with his braced body and for arm.

I think it's possible that McStay could have avoided Jetta, but I don't think he realized he was going to collect him head high either, so why would he try.

I think the treatment by the tribunal/match review is fairly consistent though.  Steve May got rubbed out for a week for us in his first year, when all he did was stop and brace himself and the bloke ran into him and got him head high.

Edited July 27, 2020 by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

[Dr. Gonzo 24,235]

44 minutes ago, P-man said:

We are placing a ridiculous amount of responsibility on players if that action is worth a two match ban. Jetta clearly leads with his head. It’s poor technique on his part.

If you reversed the jumpers and told me hand to heart you’d be happy with a two match ban for that, then I really have no words.

McStay elected to bump front on. Jetta is about a foot shorter than him. If he lifts his head he risks a severe shirtfront/concussion/facial injuries. It was a split second decision to keep the head down when he realised he was about to get poleaxed. Look at the Shiel hit on the north player a couple of weeks back. The same thing would've happened to Jetta had he raised his head except McStay is much bigger so the impact would have been more severe

[spirit of norm smith 16,479]

20 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

True, but Viney deserves plenty of credit as well.  He had 7 touches in the first 7 minutes of the last term and was everywhere.  Both he and Trac were the ones to get us going.

Agreed. Vineys goal lifted us.  Viney played a great game. All 4 quarters. Definitely my best player on the day for the Dees. 

[pineapple dee 2,892]

On 7/26/2020 at 8:32 PM, Diamond_Jim said:

Season probably over now. Did it ever really start for us?

Time to see if Weid can take us anywhere.

Some decent signs but so many teams have passed us by.

 

Don't really agree with this Diamond J.

There are probably 3 teams which are clearly better than us but we are markedly more competitive than last year. Cooler heads at the death and we win that game. What we didn't cope with was the pressure every Brisbane player applied to the Melbourne ball carrier as if their lives depended on it. 

Those brissie players are big boys too. That surprised me a bit.

Weid will turn the corner this year I agree. More consistency and self belief will see him blossom.

[jnrmac 20,109]

22 hours ago, sue said:

I haven't seen that Deliberate OoB free discussed.  But I disagree.  Seems to me he was trying to kick it hard a fair way to his left to allow Langdon(?) who was in front of his opponent to run onto it, but accidentally it went far too straight and OoB.   I cannot believe that any player would have such a big brain fade that hard that far from the boundary.   Unfortunately it's unlikely an ump could avoid paying the free.

 

22 hours ago, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

So many mixed feelings about last night's game.

Conversely feeling of being cheated by the men in yellow is also somewhat ballanced by the numerous regulation shots from Weid and Bennel that should have been put away and the brain faid from Nev that handed them a goal via Charlie Cameron.

100% that Nev was trying to kick the ball sideways to Langdon. There is no other possible explanation.

The maggots cost us a goal.

[Diamond_Jim 12,600]

1 hour ago, pineapple dee said:

Don't really agree with this Diamond J.

There are probably 3 teams which are clearly better than us but we are markedly more competitive than last year. Cooler heads at the death and we win that game. What we didn't cope with was the pressure every Brisbane player applied to the Melbourne ball carrier as if their lives depended on it. 

Those brissie players are big boys too. That surprised me a bit.

Weid will turn the corner this year I agree. More consistency and self belief will see him blossom.

measuring  from 2017 to now would you not agree that three teams Port, Collingwood, Brisbane St Kilda and possibly the Suns  are  now in front of us when in 2017 they were behind us.

Sure improvement is not linear but we aren't exactly in the mix.

Eagles and a full strength Richmond are way in front and the Bulldogs are at least marginally better.

We are on par with Essendon Carlton and Geelong and probably better than Hawthorn Freo and North not to mention Adelaide.

By my reckoning that puts us 11th at best.

Of course if you use 2019 as your measurement base it's hard to have anyone pass the 17th ranked team.

 

 

Edited July 28, 2020 by Diamond_Jim

[Pates 9,660]

19 hours ago, P-man said:

We are placing a ridiculous amount of responsibility on players if that action is worth a two match ban. Jetta clearly leads with his head. It’s poor technique on his part.

If you reversed the jumpers and told me hand to heart you’d be happy with a two match ban for that, then I really have no words.

I’d be comfortable with two weeks because Jetta was first to the ball and McStay was already in a bumping motion before Jetta “lead with his head”. I’m not arguing that Nev doesn’t do it, but he was already in a vulnerable position when McStay elected to bump. 

If it was a Melbourne player (ie May) I’d be glad not to get 6 weeks knowing our record with the MRO.