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olisik

The calumny of the AFL's priority pick policy

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On the couch suggesting Gold Coast should get a PP before first round this year. Also mention that St Kilda and Carlton who havn’t made finals since 2011 should also be in the conversation.

If our Pick 3 gets pushed due to perennial losers I will lose my [censored]

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What a joke.

Firstly on Gold Coast - They got picks 2, 3 and 6 last year so need to be patient. (and if any of their picks leave they just need to negotiate a return like GWS do) 

They've lost 3 games under a goal they easily could have won (Exhibit A vs us)

They've made a couple of really poor draft picks (not even referring to the pick 2 for Weller trade but the pick swaps with West Coast and the one with Brisbane this year). 

Carlton are finally improving (Exhibit B vs us) and as much as it pains me to say are on the up. 

Saints aren't that bad, (Exhibit C vs is), a classic mid table club at the moment and don't deserve it until they've been bottom 4 for another few years. 

 

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Any stats people here like to put out a comparison with our worst 9 years of late? TIA

"I don't think there would be any fair minded person who would say that nine years at the bottom isn't time to give genuine assistance" - Tony Cochrane GCS

Edited by Moonshadow

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'I will become a 6000-pound gorilla on this': Suns to ask for No.1 pick

When I saw the '6000 pound' headline the first I thought was they were making fun of Dew.

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Season isn’t even over and they are asking for a PP.  What a joke, talk about ask for hand outs rather then focus on improving from within over the rest of the season.

What they need to do is answer how a pick 1 is going to make a difference when they were gifted with the best player in the game dual Brownlow medalist and 9 first round picks upon the teams inception couldn’t. 

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33 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Any stats people here like to put out a comparison with our worst 9 years of late? TIA

"I don't think there would be any fair minded person who would say that nine years at the bottom isn't time to give genuine assistance" - Tony Cochrane GCS

Not sure any more than the basics is needed -

Melbourne wins tally 2007 to 2015 - 5, 3, 4, 8, 8, 4, 2, 4 7,

Gold Coast 2011 to 2018 - 3, 3, 8, 10, 4, 6, 6, 4

If you want you can trim it for the first couple of years of Gold Coast being a new club, and for Melbourne's final year in the period (the 7 wins) being considered part of our bold new dawn.

The grand total of our official draft assistance over the period was Sam Blease and Jack Trengove.

 

But setting the actual season results aside, does anyone really think it is a lack of draft picks that has been limiting Gold Coast's performance?

To paraphrase Tony Cochrane "I don't think there would be any fair minded person who would say that nine years at the bottom isn't time to give a genuine kick to the head of those responsible".

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35 minutes ago, olisik said:

What a joke, talk about ask for hand outs rather then focus on improving from within over the rest of the season.

You’re a Melbourne supporter and you are questioning this?

Allow me to take you back to 2009...at least they are attempting to win games.

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4 minutes ago, Beetle said:

You’re a Melbourne supporter and you are questioning this?

Allow me to take you back to 2009...at least they are attempting to win games.

We didn’t ask at the start of July right after the mid year bye...

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3 minutes ago, olisik said:

We didn’t ask at the start of July right after the mid year bye...

That club have been raped and pillaged by opposition clubs at the hands of the AFL. I believe they have every right to ask for compensation. They were set up to fail from the start compared to GWS.

Edited by Beetle
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29 minutes ago, Beetle said:

That club have been raped and pillaged by opposition clubs at the hands of the AFL. I believe they have every right to ask for compensation. They were set up to fail from the start compared to GWS.

Compared to GWS? The only difference is GWS got some under 17 kid picks to trade off. Im return GC got given the best player in the league on a silver platter.  What’s stopping GC getting a pick 2 for then trading it for another Mav Weller?  Or a pick 6, then mis managing that players concussion and trading them away for steal knives.

Edited by olisik
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10 minutes ago, olisik said:

Compared to GWS? The only difference is GWS got some under 17 kid picks to trade off. What’s stopping GC getting a pick 2 for that then trading it for another Mav Weller? 

It was Lachine Weller and he is a good player, while you wouldn't think he would be worth pick 2 when you look at the players picked that year, I would take him ahead of every other player from pick 2 onwards in the top 10 bar Jaydn Stephenson. 

GWS got 4 mini draft picks, which they traded for essentially 4 top 3 picks. This is a substantial advantage. GWS also got lucky with a better group of pre-draft players (Treloar, Shiel, Camereon amongst others). By doing this the draft lost elite talent the years while the Gold Coast was at the bottom.

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Gerard Healy with fake tan seeping in to his brain has this idea that all teams that miss finals should get a 2nd round priority pick every year until they make finals again. Which sounds interesting until you realise teams will absolutely tank in to 9th-12th stock up on picks and come out stronger.

Brisbane got a priority pick after their run of failures. Now that they've turned it around it's one more good player they don't really need as they have one of the most talented lists in the comp.

The Gold Coast already got a couple of extra state league picks and used one on Sam Collins who was in great form before injury. They've simply run out of puff as the season went on and had 1 terrible loss. No reason they can't bounce back and win a couple more games before the end of the year.

Backline: Weller, Ballard, Lukosius
Midfield: Bowes, Fiorini, Martin, Swallow, Powell, Brodie, Ainsworth
Forwards: B. King, Rankine, Day, Wright, Ah Chee

This is a team stacked with young talent, all they need to do is either keep it together or find some decent mature players (like Hibberd's and Melksham's) to replace anyone that might leave.

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2 minutes ago, Watts the matter said:

It was Lachine Weller and he is a good player, while you wouldn't think he would be worth pick 2 when you look at the players picked that year, I would take him ahead of every other player from pick 2 onwards in the top 10 bar Jaydn Stephenson. 

GWS got 4 mini draft picks, which they traded for essentially 4 top 3 picks. This is a substantial advantage. GWS also got lucky with a better group of pre-draft players (Treloar, Shiel, Camereon amongst others). By doing this the draft lost elite talent the years while the Gold Coast was at the bottom.

And us as well.

That whole second rebuild period we got second go at the talent pool after GWS and GC had their go at it.  Not to mention our previous No.1 pick being lured by the big wads of $$$$ being thrown at him by GWS with money and salery cap to burn.

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1 hour ago, olisik said:

Season isn’t even over and they are asking for a PP.  What a joke, talk about ask for hand outs rather then focus on improving from within over the rest of the season.

What they need to do is answer how a pick 1 is going to make a difference when they were gifted with the best player in the game dual Brownlow medalist and 9 first round picks upon the teams inception couldn’t. 

dude, you do realise our club was handed down the biggest sanctioning in modern afl history for tanking games?

theres so much hypocrisy in this thread. 

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41 minutes ago, Beetle said:

That club have been raped and pillaged by opposition clubs at the hands of the AFL. I believe they have every right to ask for compensation. They were set up to fail from the start compared to GWS.

The Giants got more but the Suns had Ablett, had first crack at offering experienced players huge contracts and had a decent start that they completely screwed up.

Not content to lose Dixon, O'Meara, Prestia ruin and lose Bennell etc they then couldn't turn it around quick enough to keep Lynch and May. By the way they well compensated for every single one of those players. Pick 2 for Lynch, pick 6 for May, 2 top 10 picks for O'Meara, picks for Bennell who practically never played for Freo. 

They are on coach 3 and rebuild 3 and this one will work if they've got the off field stuff sorted, they don't need more draft picks they just to keep doing what they are doing.

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I can't fathom giving St Kilda a priority pick.  Next they will be want to give them to Essendon and probably Hawthorn because they have an aging list and will miss finals this year. 

They have got to get fair dinkum.  If St Kilda get a FA pick, they really must help Hawthorn.

Edited by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

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1 minute ago, Dr.D said:

dude, you do realise our club was handed down the biggest sanctioning in modern afl history for tanking games?

theres so much hypocrisy in this thread. 

Not true. Adelaide lost draft picks for breaching the salary cap in the Tippett affair. Essendon lost draft picks for the 

Melbourne were fined for doing the exact same thing Carlton, Collingwood, Hawthorn, West Coast and probably others had done when the priority pick scheme was active. The fact the AFL's punishment was so light was reflective of how it was such a token effort.

We then didn't get a priority pick when we were clearly far worse than any of the recent bad sides. We turned Frawley in to pick 3 which was overs but the Suns got the same for Tom Lynch and there's been a heap of teams receive similar overpays. Tyrone Vickery netting the Tigers a 2nd round pick one of the greatest swindles ever. 

Carlton stunningly managed to match Melbourne's 2013 2 win season and the Blues and Suns got state league access which we didn't. The Suns are already clear of the 2 win mark. It's impossible to say they are worse than Melbourne or Carlton's low mark.

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After the gold coast had 3 wins and we had not won yet, tony was boasting how good their list is and it was not as bad as people thought, 12 weeks later his asking for a PP get [censored]

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Both Carlton and St Kilda have made the finals during the current decade so what are they complaining about. Melbourne also did it once but are now languishing in the bottom four and is a game and %age behind the Saints. Had Jayden Hunt’s shot at goal on Sunday gone the way of most of his team’s set shots, we would have been behind the Blues on the ladder as well. Therefore, we have as much right as those two teams to a priority pick - and it would correct an historical wrong as well.

#prioritypicforDees2019 😀

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11 hours ago, olisik said:

On the couch suggesting Gold Coast should get a PP before first round this year. Also mention that St Kilda and Carlton who havn’t made finals since 2011 should also be in the conversation.

If our Pick 3 gets pushed due to perennial losers I will lose my [censored]

We as a club and supporters have no right no whinge about other clubs getting priority picks. We received more than anyone about a decade ago and squandered them. The Suns clearly need one and are in their right to ask for one.

Lets stop whinging and just demand the club get better instead of the pathetic effort it’s served up this year.

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Tony Cochrane has been on the Board of the Gold Coast Suns since 2014 and Chairman since 2016. Could that be where part of the problem lies? I'm in favour of giving the Suns more support but if I were the AFL I'd be providing more back-of-house support and part of that would mean replacing the Chairman with someone who is less combative. 

I would also give the Suns one or two priority picks at the end of the first round which they can use for trade only. That would enable them to boost their stocks of experienced players. 

 

 

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I'm not a fan of the 2 wrongs make a right. We probably should have gotten more help and didn't. But it's clear the Sun's need help so they should get it. I am a big fan of priority picks between finalists and non-finalists. That would mean they have 1 and 11. This way it doesn't hurt the other teams that are struggling. 

I don't think it's possible to justify a pick for St Kilda given they've been competitive for years just not finals quality and have been hurt by injuries. Carlton is a different story. But Teague hurting their chances by getting them playing better footy.

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People have got to get over the idea that priority picks lead to team improvement.

A PP is 1 extra, potentially good player who with development, might reach that standard after a couple of years i.e it won't help the club next season and probably the season after, even if 1 player can make that difference.

The next thing people have to get over is that it costs other clubs to any real extent.  Pick 4 or 5 for us at the next draft?  What difference will that make to us.  It's not like pick 4 or 24.

If the AFL are serious about helping GC ( and I am absolutely convinced there is no future in an AFL side on the GC) they should give them salary cap relief to be able to attract experienced players who can fill the gaps while they develop their younger draft picks. 

It helps straight away, not in a couple of years, and like Hodge at Brisbane, surrounds these kids with immediate knowledge about how to play the game. 

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4 minutes ago, george_on_the_outer said:

People have got to get over the idea that priority picks lead to team improvement.

A PP is 1 extra, potentially good player who with development, might reach that standard after a couple of years i.e it won't help the club next season and probably the season after, even if 1 player can make that difference.

The next thing people have to get over is that it costs other clubs to any real extent.  Pick 4 or 5 for us at the next draft?  What difference will that make to us.  It's not like pick 4 or 24.

If the AFL are serious about helping GC ( and I am absolutely convinced there is no future in an AFL side on the GC) they should give them salary cap relief to be able to attract experienced players who can fill the gaps while they develop their younger draft picks. 

It helps straight away, not in a couple of years, and like Hodge at Brisbane, surrounds these kids with immediate knowledge about how to play the game. 

George

That is entirely too sensible an idea for the Circus called the AFL

It has worked a treat at Brisbane

 

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