Farewell Jesse Hogan

[Pates 9,658]

I’ve got all the sympathy in the world for Hoges, his past 24 months haven’t been easy but I want the club to make Freo pay up big time, should it go ahead. I would also not be against us potentially holding Jesse to his final year. Bear in mind there hasn’t been a single bit of chatter that Jesse isn’t happy with us, and if the club assessed what was being offered and decided it having Jesse for a tilt at the premiership next year then I’d say tell them to call back in a years time. 

Edited September 30, 2018 by Pates

[Dirts 429]

I have said all along weeds is our future.

Hogan has never seemed to settled.

My call

Hogans to Freo

Neil to Bris

Port give pick 9 and trade down to about 18 and give to us

We use pick 9 and third rounder to suns for May and KK 

We then chase a quality outside player

Gaff?

Shiels?

smith? 

Sure it will be left field!

[old55 23,353]

4 hours ago, olisik said:

No one cares about points unless there is academy or FS bidding in play.

if we hold pick 4, we tell them give us 9/10 or say goodbye to Rankine.

Yeah well welcome to the world Rumplestiltskin.  We just don't  operate that wat because what goes around comes around and we're fair dealers.

[beelzebub 23,313]

So it's ok to talk about a Hogan trade. Welcome to the real world everyone. Took some of you long enough.

Go Dees

[bing181 9,193]

3 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

Yeah well welcome to the world Rumplestiltskin.  We just don't  operate that wat because what goes around comes around and we're fair dealers.

As opposed to the macho posturing school of negotiation.

[beelzebub 23,313]

5 minutes ago, bing181 said:

As opposed to the macho posturing school of negotiation.

I would think because we didn't attend the Dodoro school of "pizzing everyone off" that we are/should be well placed to deal with GC etc with whatever we exchange for Jesse. 

 

[bing181 9,193]

3 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

I would think because we didn't attend the Dodoro school of "pizzing everyone off" that we are/should be well placed to deal with GC etc with whatever we exchange for Jesse. 

Seeing we want 2 of their players, yes ...

[DSP 1,488]

Just discussed on SEN. According to Tim Gossage either Hogan or his manager have personally informed Goody that he wants a trade to Freo.

 

[grazman 7,404]

10 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

Posters need to realise that the points deal to get Port's 9 and 10 is 4 AND 22 that Freo get from Brisbane for Neale.

The talk of us trading just pick 4 or even 5 for 9 +10 is fantasyland.  It's really not that hard to look up the points table.

Also 5 + 10 for Hogan values him much higher than 4 + 22 for Neale.

That's true, but is 6 & 10 fair value for Hogan?  That has to be the starting point for negotiations for  the MFC.  I don't think it's unreasonable to expect pick 5 & 6 for Hogan* (3629 points) In other words what is closest to what we paid for him in the first place (picks 3 & 13 - 3446 points) plus our development of him. If we need to we can throw in our third pick this year (ours not the one we have from Adelaide for Lever) likely pick 53 or thereabouts to even it out.

Freo may well want to offer us  6 & 10, after they deal with Port  but for me that is unders for someone like Hogan.

We could do that sort of deal for ourselves.

Picks 5 & 6 and our first round pick for 2019 (somewhere between 1,112 and 985 points) for May, KK and one of their early picks (for arguments sake let's say pick 3 - 2,234 points).  We could then either use that pick ourselves or trade pick 3 and our second round pick this year (2736 points) for pick 9 & 10 (2864) which is better value for Port than (5 & 22 - 2723 points).  It also gives them what they presumably want which is the earliest possible crack at a SA kid. We would then obviously have to use one of picks 9 or 10 ourselves for trading out next year's first pick and look at converting the other pick for players or picks if we have other irons in the fire, which we do.

So from a points calculation only ( I wouldn't be inclined to even out the trade with our third pick this year myself).

Out. Hogan, 2018 2nd pick, 2018 3rd pick, 2019 1st pick.

or Hogan and approximately 1822 current and future points+.

In, May, KK, 2018 picks 9 & 10.  

or May, KK and 2,864 current points. (or in rather simplistic terms it values Hogan as being worth May, KK and about pick 17)

 

Freo lose Neale and their first pick this year, but get Hogan and pick 23 - that seems fair to me (but I am biased).

 

*In all likelihood the draft order will be Brisbane 5 and Freo 6 after Lynch walks to Richmond.

+ assuming we finish 3rd next year as an indicator only. 

Edited September 30, 2018 by grazman
Sorry., multiple edits - I'm not a numbers person obviously.

[Moonshadow 17,675]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

So it's ok to talk about a Hogan trade. Welcome to the real world everyone. Took some of you long enough.

Go Dees

Oh no Bub, we shouldn't be talking about it because it's never going to happen and he's settled and Goody said so. Therefore CLOSE THE THREAD!!! I have serious concerns for some of you supporters...

?

Edited September 30, 2018 by Moonshadow

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,325]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

So it's ok to talk about a Hogan trade. Welcome to the real world everyone. Took some of you long enough.

Go Dees

 

10 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Oh no Bub, we shouldn't be talking about it because it's never going to happen and he's settled and Goody said so. Therefore CLOSE THE THREAD!!! I have serious concerns for some of you supporters...

?

The funny thing for me is that we still haven’t had any official confirmation, the closest thing we have had was Chook in Perth posting last night (and no disrespect intended because we all appreciate his mail but that didn’t really tell us anything that we weren’t already thinking).

Watching the pack mentality change a couple of days ago from the morning “Goody said he’s staying” to the afternoon “where there’s smoke there’s fire”.....

I would much rather read posts from people who can think for themselves, think outside the square and don’t continue to run with the company line on every bloody post they make.

Whats also funny is the posters who continue to run with the 

- Hogan’s a gun / a star.

- He had a form slump.

- It was the midfields fault

Or one of my personal favourites.... 

- Weed’s only played one good game.

When these posters were presented with constructive counter arguments and examples of where Hogan’s game was found wanting, quite often there was no response. 

And they’d have us believe we’re the ones with the problem, we’re not the real supporters. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I'm not just saying this because it looks very likely he will leave, but Hogan never really felt like a Melbourne player to me, does anyone else feel that way?

[Cards13 9,117]

1 hour ago, DSP said:

Just discussed on SEN. According to Tim Gossage either Hogan or his manager have personally informed Goody that he wants a trade to Freo.

 

Either or neither? 

[Ethan Tremblay 30,819]

Hogan is a gun and gave us hope when we had none, it will be a shame to lose him. But I’m also excited to see who/what we end up with as a result of trading him, I think we’re in for a cracking trade period just quietly. #WhatdoesETthetradewhispererknow?

Edited September 30, 2018 by Ethan Tremblay

[R.I.P. Troy 185]

8 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'm not just saying this because it looks very likely he will leave, but Hogan never really felt like a Melbourne player to me, does anyone else feel that way?

100% agree.

It never felt like he was going to become a Demons great (Neitz, Schwarz, Lyon etc ).

Did we feel unworthy of his talents? Was the go home factor always in the back of our minds? Was it his body language on field?

I'm not sure.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter now. Where as once losing Hogan would have been a massive blow to us, not so now. 

I think its speaks volumes as to how far we have come as a club and a player list, that losing a player as talented as Hogan may possibly be a positive. But that will all depend on what we get back.

GO DEES!

[Neil Crompton 5,447]

Interesting to note that this thread started in mid July when some pseudo jurno had the audacity to write that he thought Hogan would be gone at the end of the year. Our members jumped all over him - typified by this comment by our DL Administrator:

“This isn't even a rumour. It is an unfounded and uninformed opinion from an irrelevant ex-footballer.”

Did he really know something back then, or was he just shooting the breeze?

[DeeZee 7,361]

29 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'm not just saying this because it looks very likely he will leave, but Hogan never really felt like a Melbourne player to me, does anyone else feel that way?

Was never really one of the boys was he?

[Mach5 4,767]

30 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'm not just saying this because it looks very likely he will leave, but Hogan never really felt like a Melbourne player to me, does anyone else feel that way?

I think he’s an aloof character which contributes to that sentiment, but I don’t doubt his commitment. He has just had a lot of other things running through his head (understandably). He has looked distracted because he is.

[Undeeterred 3,117]

6 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

Interesting to note that this thread started in mid July when some pseudo jurno had the audacity to write that he thought Hogan would be gone at the end of the year. Our members jumped all over him - typified by this comment by our DL Administrator:

“This isn't even a rumour. It is an unfounded and uninformed opinion from an irrelevant ex-footballer.”

Did he really know something back then, or was he just shooting the breeze?

Given we've had the same discussion pretty every year, I wouldn't get too excited about whichever journalist it was and their credibility.

I could have written that article.

[Ugottobekidding 1,171]

3 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'm not just saying this because it looks very likely he will leave, but Hogan never really felt like a Melbourne player to me, does anyone else feel that way?

Fair point... one never really felt his comittment.

[Demons1858 1,742]

We are getting into premiership contention so you don't want to lose any A-grade talent unless list mgmt have a guaranteed A-grader coming back the other way. Would be ok if Sam May, Gaff, Neale, or an unknown are coming back the other way. We will stretch teams with Weid, TMac and Hoges like never before. Weid will get the 3rd best tall and will benefit as much as anyone and learn along the way.

[drdrake 3,157]

1 hour ago, DSP said:

Just discussed on SEN. According to Tim Gossage either Hogan or his manager have personally informed Goody that he wants a trade to Freo.

 

He must be gone then based on Tim's great journalistic efforts to uncover this. 

Journo's are paid to make statements to keep them employed.  If they don't make big statements and just deal with facts no one reads or listens to them.  If they are wrong no one holds them to account, they can say what they want, make stuff up would it right and get away with it, bit like our politicians. 

We have 117 pages based on Journo's hunches not facts.  Until we get some concrete comment for Hogan, his manager, Melbourne or Fremantle, he is a Melbourne player no point everyone saying we don't need him because we do what team doesn't need a 50 goal per year forward.

 

[beelzebub 23,313]

2 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I think he’s an aloof character which contributes to that sentiment, but I don’t doubt his commitment. He has just had a lot of other things running through his head (understandably). He has looked distracted because he is.

There's another possibility. And a perfectly understandable one. He never really got the chance to wholly immerse his inner self into the role. So much happening around him . Without doubt it's been hard. 

That's possibly the 'why' .

The result is, for mine , he didn't seem as much into it as some others. 

I actually think a fresh start will do him well. Good luck to the lad.

Go Dees

[FarNorthernD 5,861]

6 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

Was never really one of the boys was he?

Supposedly he is best mates with Harmes. A couple of seasons ago it would have been hard to believe that James would be more important to our future success than Jesse. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

25 minutes ago, R.I.P. Troy said:

100% agree.

It never felt like he was going to become a Demons great (Neitz, Schwarz, Lyon etc ).

Did we feel unworthy of his talents? Was the go home factor always in the back of our minds? Was it his body language on field?

I'm not sure.

 

I think it was the strong links back to Perth all the time that made me feel this way.

I don't begrudge him at all, it isn't a criticism just something I have always felt.