Farewell Jack Watts

[Dr. Gonzo 24,227]

5 hours ago, Akum said:

OK, you're perfectly welcome to bag Watts, that's your right. But when you state fiction as fact, that's another thing.

Whatever it was that Jack was disciplined for preseason, it wasn't that he was "out of shape" or "acting like a millionaire". The club stated that he wasn't doing some things right at training, and it's still vague about exactly what it was. I have my guesses just like you, but they're guesses.

And I can guarantee you that he is absolutely NOT the type of bloke who will be satisfied with ever having done enough.

I've become used to him being traded. What concerns me is that the club is pushing a narrative that all that's wrong with the team is a "lack of intensity" and they're starting to connect that with whatever Jack's done. In other words, trying to hide other problems with our lack of skill, inadequacies in our game plan, inability to counter when the other team closes us up.

But most of all in the latter part of the season there was a fear to take the game on that definitely wasn't there in the early part of the season when they were so fearless in "taking the game on" and attacking that they were prepared to persist even if it meant they conceded a few easy goals "out the back". I'd like to know where that enterprise, that fearlessness, vanished. It's as if they became scared to make mistakes, so tried to play within themselves in a number of games.

But it seems to me too easy to hint at lack of intensity and hint at Watts (and to some extent Salem who was also dropped after our really poor game against GWS) being the problem.

You don't see any correlation between players running out of steam due to youth/not preparing themselves well enough and an unwillingness to take the game on in the latter half of the year?

[Dr. Gonzo 24,227]

5 hours ago, binman said:

Indeed. I do have a bit of broken record itis on some issues. 

What happened in the Ryan Ferguson Brad Sewell scenario? I don't recall. I can't think of any examples where a player under contract does not want to leave but is forced to.

But the point remains if the club make it clear they don't value retaining him he still needs to agree to be traded. Which as you rightly say may well be in his best interests to do so.

However i maintain that he will have zero interest in going to a club in the bottom half of the ladder. Any trade would have to be mutually beneficial and if put on the table he would want to go to a top four club.  

Lol he is not going to dictate terms. Once a club makes it known to a player he's not part of future plans you'd have to be an idiot to say "fine but if you trade me I'll only go to a top 4 club". That's without even co siderig the top 4 changes year on year. We're Richmond a top 4 side last year?

[Dr. Gonzo 24,227]

4 hours ago, SFebey said:

I'm told by a friend that Jack likes to frequent Southbank area on week nights and on weekends, ie; likes a beer and social life. I think that's who Jack is, a nice guy who loves life. If his heart isn't in it for AFL by now it will never be unfortunately. A late 2nd or 3rd round pick is what we'd be looking at I think. So much talent but doesn't have the heart. I'm not sure if this is what Jones is alluding to either in regards to preparation etc. Jack just seems like a nice version of Nick Kyrgios. Talent to burn, but no desire.

Remember when there were comments that some players under previous regimes had already achieved their goals by playing senior footy? Jack seems to like the lifestyle of being an AFL player, but doesn't want to sacrifice any part of that lifestyle to be a successful player. Colin Sylvia mk2 is dead right. Time to cut our losses and make him someone else's problem.

[homsar 431]

Trade him for Stringer. 

[Master Deebater 492]

35 minutes ago, homsar said:

Trade him for Stringer. 

Also think this is worth considering. The FD will have the background goss on Stringer's "real" issues and hopefully informed enough to make the call on Jack for Jake.

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

Looking at the results of the survey I would say that nearly 70% of us want Jack to stay. Case of the noisy MINORITY I would reckon. Let's give this topic a break and let the MFC decide one way or another.

[billyblanks29 184]

I guarantee you we won't win a single premiership or final with him in the side. There I said it. 

You need 22 players fully committed.

Hard decisions need to be made. If Watts was at the Bulldogs under Bevo I don't think he would hesitate, he has the guts to make the tough calls.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,227]

1 hour ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

Looking at the results of the survey I would say that nearly 70% of us want Jack to stay. Case of the noisy MINORITY I would reckon. Let's give this topic a break and let the MFC decide one way or another.

I didn't think it would need to be pointed out, but in a discussion board related solely to potential MFC trades these are the kinds of discussions you'll find. Good luck trying to shut down these discussions.

[PaulRB 6,377]

Jones and Goodwin are critical of Jacks preparation off field because it's inadequate and it sets a poor example to other younger players. 

For example, would we want Petracca, a similar high talent player, modelling his approach to his AFL career on Jack Watts?

I'm for sending him North for the best deal we can get. 9 years is too long. 

[Earl Hood 6,086]

3 hours ago, billyblanks29 said:

I guarantee you we won't win a single premiership or final with him in the side. There I said it. 

You need 22 players fully committed.

Hard decisions need to be made. If Watts was at the Bulldogs under Bevo I don't think he would hesitate, he has the guts to make the tough calls.

Yes we need commitment but we also need talent. Players who are 6'5" are quick, have endurance and elite disposal don't come along too often. I don't see we would get a suitable trade to match what we would lose. 

[jumbo returns 6,741]

Trade him!

We can't drown him! He's a witch! He cost us the year by missing 2 goals!

It's Jack's fault the club is so impotent

F

M

D

[Dee tention 616]

Trade trade trade...

At his age and skill set he should be in our top 3 players at the club. He should be having a major influence on the result. He does not. 

Disinterested and non-proffessional.

Jeff White mkII (could of been, but could not)

Edited September 20, 2017 by Dee tention

[rpfc 28,503]

3 minutes ago, Dee tention said:

Trade trade trade...

At his age and skill set he should be in our top 3 players at the club. He should be having a major influence on the result. He does not. 

Disinterested and non-proffessional.

Jeff White mkII (could of been, but could not)

Mate, no HF/wing should ever be in your top 3 players... you'd be going nowhere.

Some of you seem to be so emotionally invested one way or the other. 

It is pretty [censored] simple - if he can be traded for something that is more helpful then great, otherwise he stays and we work with him to get the most out of him and his very handy skill set that we need more of; great vision, and superb foot skills.

[Ethan Tremblay 30,873]

I had a siesta earlier today and dreamt we signed Lever for pick 10 and Watts. 

Edited September 20, 2017 by Ethan Tremblay

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

4 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I didn't think it would need to be pointed out, but in a discussion board related solely to potential MFC trades these are the kinds of discussions you'll find. Good luck trying to shut down these discussions.

I'm not trying to shut down discussions Doc. Just pointing out the futility of it all whether Watts is traded or not. Noisy minority still trying hard. Same old posters.

[64" 97]

 Watts is Gonski bobby.

[puntkick 325]

2 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

I had a siesta earlier today and dreamt we signed Lever for pick 10 and Watts. 

Whilst you were asleep the WCE's resigned Mitchell,Petrie, and Wellingham too !

[robbiefrom13 887]

Stef Martin found it hard at Melbourne.  I saw him once with the guys at Fed Square, looking very ignored and detached.  Look at him now.  Watts seems to struggle to get into the rhythm of the job, as though on some level an outsider.  My speculation about Watts centres on this.  What is going wrong?  Jurrah was pretty much the same, with that never-ending injury.

I saw a game a few years back where Jones marked just forward of centre and looked around for options.  I posted on Demonland about it at the time.  Watts led to centre-half forward, clear in front of his man, and Jones ignored him.  Shortly afterwards, Jones kicked it to Watts, in a huge amount of space out near the boundary except that his man was wearing him like a glove, and the ball ended up over the boundary - as it was always going to.  Kick not to advantage etc.  At the time I thought, Jones doesn't really like - or understand - this guy.  And now he is chucking him under the bus (Nield's old bus, as I remember it - he certainly didn't like Watts).  My speculation: is it the intuitive, the intelligent, the non-grunt guys that we can't incorporate into our team?

Maybe we as a club think such guys can't play the game "the way it should be played"?  Is our culture a monoculture that fails to get the best out of its different guys?  Robbie Flower has always been the top of the pile for me.  I'm not here likening Watts to Flower in anything other than being not-the-standard-model.  Plenty thought someone as different as Flower was going to be useless - he was scorned by Melbourne supporters around me for his first two quarters, mostly because he didn't look like what they thought a footballer should look like.  Ok he turned out to be great from his first game, but plenty of ultimate stars of the game have taken time to come on.  Roos had it right - treat them all as individuals, with respect.  Watts is no complainer, but how do you feel supporting a club where a loyal employee said "I just wanted to be treated as a human being"?  And, this was referring to a time when one of his presumed mates was Jones?  Are there things to be learned on the other side of this straining relationship too?  

Melbourne chucking players under buses in recent years has happened too often for a club with its back to the wall, and we know with hindsight what disastrous results some of those sackings have had.  Goodness knows how morale was affected among the "survivors" each time we unwisely threw away a loyal player.  If you got no talent, clearly you have to go, I accept that.  But if you don't make the most of your talent, before the club says goodbye, what I want to see is the motivators showing some skill.  And yet, here we have, yet again, a boot up Watts' arce (just as the bus comes into view) as our deliberately-made-public approach supposedly to motivating what is a skilled, intelligent and multi-talented, committed and apparently sensitive human being...  

I remain convinced that Watts has it in him to cut the big games apart, using the skill, the speed, and the imaginative flair that we saw when he took off from behind the centre once Oscar got the ball against Collingwood.  Watch the vision again, and watch his thinking.  and on that occasion his move was honoured by his team-mate, and (slow-motion) moments later it had reduced Collingwood players to their knees, literally.   That's what he can do, at that stage of a big game - and nobody else, on either side - saw or attempted the move: Watts used brains, comprehension of the game, beyond anyone on the field.  A rare talent, albeit not yet fully harnessed to the team.  

[chook fowler 19,459]

I doubt the leadership group would have given him the very public rocket that they did if he was on the trade table.

 

[dpositive 1,665]

Hey let's trade this lazy inconsistent dude more interested in board shorts to Gol Coast after GWS win their flag fulfilling the AFL record of new franchise teams winning flags. Then GC can close our window of opportunity coz we will be one skilled player short of a team.

Lets not try and recreate the player who contributed in more score creating opportunities and has been as inconsistent as the rest of the team. Let's not try and use him and improve him and the rest of the team. Let's not show some loyalty to the players

Oh why go on you know what I mean 

[Ethan Tremblay 30,873]

6 hours ago, puntkick said:

Whilst you were asleep the WCE's resigned Mitchell,Petrie, and Wellingham too !

They did re-sign Le Cras, so anything is possible. 

[Dirts 429]

10 hours ago, PaulRB said:

Jones and Goodwin are critical of Jacks preparation off field because it's inadequate and it sets a poor example to other younger players. 

For example, would we want Petracca, a similar high talent player, modelling his approach to his AFL career on Jack Watts?

I'm for sending him North for the best deal we can get. 9 years is too long. 

Love jack w and think he has been valiant but if an offer comes in worth something good, take it.  WA is a beach state. Board shorts are big . Gaff is a Melbourne lad. 

Just a thought . Watts and pick 10 for gaff and their first rounder .

[beelzebub 23,380]

9 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

I had a siesta earlier today and dreamt we signed Lever for pick 10 and Watts. 

It among many suggestions has some plausibility.

I could see 

Out #10 Watts  3rd rnd pick

In Lever  Adel 2nd rnd pick

A bit of give and get both ways. Thats called trading.

[Dirts 429]

6 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

It among many suggestions has some plausibility.

I could see 

Out #10 Watts  3rd rnd pick

In Lever  Adel 2nd rnd pick

A bit of give and get both ways. Thats called trading.

Don't mind that either. Chase a mature outside run type. Must be a few hiding in the draft. If van berg comes back in that will certain assist our cause. 

[beelzebub 23,380]

@robbiefrom13 et al.

Ive had, possibly like yourself, a nagging feeling there's an "in"  crowd, a clique still at Melb. This would explain a lot. You wont be alone in observing Watts being ignored or "bussed"  . The Dees have a long history of 'jocks' . Where other clubs seek success Melbourne are masters of self destruction. 

Its not necessarily in the realm of fantasy that some lesser talented but better workers are just jealous of highly skilled cruisers. Its a normal human condition..

It might well prove beneficial for Watts to move on., provided we better the list in doing so.

Whilst we're on this subject of "Bussing" players i firmly believe we'll never win a Premiership with Jones as capt ( i await the incoming )