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dieter

2017 Post Mortem

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I still can't believe we have managed to screw this season up, just when you think they've put you through the worst....we beat 4 of the top 8 and the reigning premiers, all the teams around us but couldn't handle the bottom 4-6! Its unfathomable....

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For all the changes we've made over the last few years, there are still a few key things we lack:

A) At least two but preferably three A grade midfielders. Most top 8 sides have min 2. By start of 2018 season we'll have one: Oliver. Get Kelly please Mr Taylor.

B) True leadership. Crows, Swans, Hawks, Cats and now GWS have this in spades. Ours is thin and flakey 

C) A gun kpd. Omac, Tmac and Frost are not these. Maybe Lever if he comes to us.

D) The brains for players not to get sucked in to stupid hits behind play that result in suspensions. Bugg, Vince, Lewis and Hogan. I can take a misdemeanour in the contest, but not dumb hits off the ball. Grow a brain fellas.

E) Jesse Hogan to have an uninterrupted season. This kid must've killed a white dove. Deserves more success

F) Greater mental toughness and (for some players) competitiveness. Jack Watts I'm looking at you.

G) Quality list depth. A couple of injuries/suspensions in our midfield or forwardline and suddenly we've got Hannan playing chf and JKH on the ball. Seriously???

There's probably more. Happy to have this added to.

For those saying it's a blessing we didn't make finals because we'd be scarred from a Port smashing, I say bull [censored]. This was undoubtedly a chance to get the taste of finals and set us up for next year. It's not a failed year, but its certainly disappointing and hurts.

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2 hours ago, Mac7 said:

Not sure if mentioned already, Max Gawn during the week on SEN was saying most of the guys had played finals in under 18s or VFL. "so it wasnt really new to them" . 

1. No clue on what it means to play AFL.

2. Huge lack in desperation to make it, that was clear on Saturday.

3. unbelievable lack of respect for the supporters. 

Oh cool, you played finals in junior footy. Get a grip mate this is AFL!!! How about you (as a team) start to give something back to thr club and supporters that provide you with such a privileged life.

Can't believe that. That shows a clear lack of desire and hunger if true.
Newsflash Max, probably half the posters here, myself included, played finals in junior football. It was junior football! You played finals by just showing up and not getting distracted by oranges at half time and other kids having a laugh! You are a 26 year professional AFL player and you have the same level of finals experience as half the bloody people sitting in offices across the country. You should be f*cking embarrassed by your efforts and your failure, not joking about it! You got paid handsomly for 5-6 years to smoke ciggies and stuff around until you finally grew up. You've had 1 good season, and 7 shite-average ones. The comedy act in the media was tolerable last year when you were playing well, but now you've become an embarrassing clown. Time to take responsibility, work your ass off and give something back.

Edited by Lord Travis
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While I am very disappointed,  and heartbroken, this is very interesting as we were 9 points from 8th and 23 points from finishing top. This is due to the following :

Lost to Fremantle by 2 points

Lost to Hawthorn by 3 points

Lost to North Melbourne by 4 points 

Lost to North Melbourne by 14 points. 

I think back to 2013 and we would have lost all those games by 100 points. This shows how far we have improved but how much more we need to improve.  The old saying so close but so far. We need to use this disappointment all summer and all next season.  

 

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1 minute ago, Ditcha said:

While I am very disappointed,  and heartbroken, this is very interesting as we were 9 points from 8th and 23 points from finishing top. This is due to the following :

Lost to Fremantle by 2 points

Lost to Hawthorn by 3 points

Lost to North Melbourne by 4 points 

Lost to North Melbourne by 14 points. 

I think back to 2013 and we would have lost all those games by 100 points. This shows how far we have improved but how much more we need to improve.  The old saying so close but so far. We need to use this disappointment all summer and all next season. 

2013 is ancient history.  It was our abyss.  Anything would look better than 2013 so really clutching at straws using it as a base for comparison.

In 2017 when it really counted we lost to Collingwood by 16 points because the coaches and players collectively dropped the ball. 

Our opportunity to give the finals a shake, to get some experience into our youth and to give supporters something to hang on to went up in smoke because they dropped the ball. 

On Saturday we lost a lot more than a football game!

 

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4 minutes ago, Ditcha said:

While I am very disappointed,  and heartbroken, this is very interesting as we were 9 points from 8th and 23 points from finishing top. This is due to the following :

Lost to Fremantle by 2 points

Lost to Hawthorn by 3 points

Lost to North Melbourne by 4 points 

Lost to North Melbourne by 14 points. 

I think back to 2013 and we would have lost all those games by 100 points. This shows how far we have improved but how much more we need to improve.  The old saying so close but so far. We need to use this disappointment all summer and all next season.  

 

Supporters (some of them anyway) have been saying this for the last decade.

 

Its now the end of 2017 and we are still, STILL losing games we should win. And its not an abberation, it happens more often than not.

 

Its mental. Plain and simple. Call it desire. Or toughness. Whatever. We just dont have it. And its not good enough.

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The supporters just cant trust the team to turn up and win the games it "should" win. Sure you will cop an upset loss a couple of times in a season (it WILL happen) but 4-5 times? Thats unforgivable.

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4 minutes ago, Lord Travis said:

Can't believe that. That shows a clear lack of desire and hunger if true.
Newsflash Max, probably half the posters here, myself included, played finals in junior football. It was junior football! You played finals by just showing up and not getting distracted by oranges at half time and other kids having a laugh! You are a 26 year professional AFL player and you have the same level of finals experience as half the bloody people sitting in offices across the country. You should be f*cking embarrassed by your efforts and your failure, not joking about it! You got paid handsomly for 5-6 years to smoke ciggies and stuff around until you finally grew up. You've had 1 good season, and 6 shite-average ones. Time to take responsibility, wok your ass off give something back.

Yep, maybe I'm clutching at straws and hindsight is a wonderful thing but I believe the club failed in the week leading up to the game to get these guys focused.

I know the telethon on the footy show is for a great cause but watching Max hug Goldsack last Thursday night didn't sit well with me.

Regardless of what happened earlier on the year we had one single objective and we failed miserably on Saturday.

Even when the boys came out for their usual kick and snaps at goals prior to their main warm-up it didn't sit right with me, I know it's great for us the fans and our kids  but they have been kind enough all season with clinics and so forth.

Maybe I'm digging too deep for answers but how can we get it so wrong in what was a massive statement game for the club?

 

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15 minutes ago, hemingway said:

I am disappointed, sad and angry.  So much to gain and now lost.       And no guarantees for next season. Half a dozen sides that are clearly better and another half a dozen sides that are on a par with Melbourne.  Even Brisbane gave more promise at times than Melbourne. 

This is the frightening thing about our wasted season.

Are our players going to tell themselves they shoulda, woulda made finals except for [insert excuse here].

And then go out next year going through the motions, expecting it to just happen for them? Like playing North, only for a whole season?

Easy to see us dropping down through complacency.

I hope Goodwin puts a rocket through them. And the president and CEO put a rocket through the whole place.

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42 minutes ago, JV7 said:

I actually can't stay of Demonland... It gives me some form of comfort to read other people's thoughts & problems and realise your not the only one... 

I'm sitting here at work staring into the middle distance and refreshing DL. It's a coping mechanism...I guess 

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2 minutes ago, Mazer Rackham said:

This is the frightening thing about our wasted season.

Are our players going to tell themselves they shoulda, woulda made finals except for [insert excuse here].

And then go out next year going through the motions, expecting it to just happen for them? Like playing North, only for a whole season?

Easy to see us dropping down through complacency.

I hope Goodwin puts a rocket through them. And the president and CEO put a rocket through the whole place.

There needs to be anger. Not oh well we have had an improved season and we can look forward to finals next year. Look at our great young list. We need the failure of not making finals to drive this club forward. I want to see anger, desperation and a refusal to accept failure. I want to see a club from President down that will not accept near enough is good enough.

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Just now, the rolling fog said:

SEN reporting the following named in the 40-man AA squad: Hibberd, Garlett, Jetta

In further good news, Max won $50 on the horses! It seems he's used to success!

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11 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

The way we played on Saturday, I wouldn't have given us much chance. 

That settles it . Why turn up at all. 

Loser attitude.

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Obviously the overriding feeling is extreme disappointment. Just when you think Melbourne have finally found a way to deliver something back to the fans who have stuck with them through what has been one of the darkest periods in the history of the club, they go and do that and find a new way to break our hearts.

It's difficult to be rational in times like this but if I try my hardest I think this season needs to broken down into two components - 1) getting into the position where we could make finals and 2) what we did once in that position.

In relation to the first, I must say I have been impressed by our ability to stick it at with what we had to go through. I reckon I thought it was "season over" (from a finals perspective) on a number of occasions - when Gawn went down in Round 3, when we lost our back up ruckman in Round 5 (after dropping winnable games v Dockers and Tigers), when we lost to North in Round 9, when Hogan was out for an extended time, after the Sydney game when we lost Viney on top of our other injuries, etc. But we kept finding a way to win games and stay in the hunt to the point where were strong favourites to make the finals. This shows some resilience and spirit in the group and needs to be acknowledged.

But then there's the second point, having got into the position we did. Make no mistake - this was a choke of absolutely monumental proportions. Having the bottom side on the ropes at home, 5 goals ahead with valuable percentage up for grabs, we choked. Even retaining that 5 goal lead would have seen us play finals. But we let them back in and fell over the line. Then we choked again on the weekend. Playing a side with nothing to play for and with about 8 players out and we find ourselves 6 goals to 1 down at quarter time.

Some say we didn't come to play or we just expected it to happen. I cannot believe that to be the case - the players knew finals was up for grabs. For mine, it was a choke - we got nervous, froze and didn't know what to do. The signs were there - Garlett's rushed snap, Hibberd's rushed snap and skill errors - skilled players who normally do better but froze in the moment. 3 tackles in 20 minutes. Outnumbered around the ball. You can't say our players didn't care as players clearly want to play in finals. But it was symptomatic of a nervous team that lost their heads and panicked. While we recovered somewhat and were reasonable after that - we won the rest of the game by 3 goals - the damage was done in that first quarter.

And that brings up another point. What on earth is going on against bottom sides? We had a 7-5 record against the top 11 and a 5-5 record against the bottom 7. Even in the games we won against the bottom 7, it was a struggle and we were usually behind at some point. 5 goals down against Gold Coast and Pies on QB, trailing Carlton during the 3rd quarter in Round 2 and 4th quarter in Round 16 (albeit with a depleted side), and falling over the line against the Lions. Not once did we easily account for a bottom 7 side.

Can this simply be put down to attitude? That we don't show up against the lower sides? I don't think this is the only reason. It can't be - it can't possibly be that our blokes are so dumb that it's groundhog day every time we go into a match as favourites.

For mine, it's more to do with personnel. We are an effort and intensity based team - our best performances for the year have been when we were underdogs and were able to summon up an intensity and defensive work rate that overwhelmed the opposition. We were the hunters on each occasion.

But it is unrealistic to expect this every week. It's only natural that your intensity fluctuates and that against lower teams you are going to be the hunted rather than the hunter. To win these games you need to stay in the game and limit the damage when the opposition are on top (particularly early in games) and then you need your class to come to the fore. And on these two aspects we have failed miserably.

The Hawthorn, North (in Round 9) and Collingwood losses saw the opposition 5 goals up at quarter time - an absolute failure to stay in the game. If you can hold firm and go into the break say 2 goals down, you give yourself the chance to settle down and then kick away after half time. I've got no doubt if we were only 2 goals down at quarter time on the weekend we would've won that game. But if you give a lower side a big early lead, they get confidence and a sniff and then you are pushing the proverbial uphill the rest of the game.

And the second aspect is class. Class should allow you to get over an inferior opponent when you're not at your best. Perfect example is the way GWS have won games this year with lots of players and out and playing well below their best. I understand their list is stacked with quality, but I also feel we have built a side high on aggression and competitiveness but currently low on class. We make too many basic skill errors and poor decisions. In fact, we have probably been outclassed by both Brisbane and Collingwood in the last two weeks. So essentially what happens when an inferior side hunts us and matches (or betters) our intensity is that we don't have the quality to fall back on to get over the line. We come back, which shows we have resilience and competitiveness, but we make basic errors and fail to capitalise on our control of the ball, which makes it very hard to kick away from a team.

Unfortunately while there were many positives in the season, the overriding taste of the season is sour and what will be remembered is that we completely bottled it when it mattered. This team must accept that they are currently seen as bottlers, a tag no sportsman wants to be associated with. It will be up to them to summon up the mental strength required to overcome this - and the only way to do it is to perform when it counts.

 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, Ditcha said:

While I am very disappointed,  and heartbroken, this is very interesting as we were 9 points from 8th and 23 points from finishing top. This is due to the following :

Lost to Fremantle by 2 points

Lost to Hawthorn by 3 points

Lost to North Melbourne by 4 points 

Lost to North Melbourne by 14 points. 

I think back to 2013 and we would have lost all those games by 100 points. This shows how far we have improved but how much more we need to improve.  The old saying so close but so far. We need to use this disappointment all summer and all next season.  

 

Gee we have come so far...pathetic

The swans won the spoon in 1994 with 4 wins. They were 12th in 1995 and played in a grand Final in 1996.

The Bulldogs were 15th in 12 and 13, 16th in 2014 and won a flag in 2016.

Don't give this bullshite that we are improving. This is not a game of incremental improvement in ladder position. Teams leap up the ladder frequently.

We are a laughing stock of a club where it doesn't hurt when we lose. We are comfortable with mediocrity. There needs to be a major statement from our inconsequential, unsighted president, our CEO and our two Captains about what we will accept as a club.

 

As for those players that don't stand up when it counts. they can [censored] off.

 

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4 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Gee we have come so far...pathetic

The swans won the spoon in 1994 with 4 wins. They were 12th in 1995 and played in a grand Final in 1996.

The Bulldogs were 15th in 12 and 13, 16th in 2014 and won a flag in 2016.

Don't give this bullshite that we are improving. This is not a game of incremental improvement in ladder position. Teams leap up the ladder frequently.

We are a laughing stock of a club where it doesn't hurt when we lose. We are comfortable with mediocrity. There needs to be a major statement from our inconsequential, unsighted president, our CEO and our two Captains about what we will accept as a club.

 

As for those players that don't stand up when it counts. they can [censored] off.

 

How true, incremental improvement more likely takes sides closer to flag window closing and inevitable decline. 

Edited by america de cali
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6 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Gee we have come so far...pathetic

The swans won the spoon in 1994 with 4 wins. They were 12th in 1995 and played in a grand Final in 1996.

The Bulldogs were 15th in 12 and 13, 16th in 2014 and won a flag in 2016.

Don't give this bullshite that we are improving. This is not a game of incremental improvement in ladder position. Teams leap up the ladder frequently.

We are a laughing stock of a club where it doesn't hurt when we lose. We are comfortable with mediocrity. There needs to be a major statement from our inconsequential, unsighted president, our CEO and our two Captains about what we will accept as a club.

 

As for those players that don't stand up when it counts. they can [censored] off.

 

The Daniher years - case in point

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48 minutes ago, sisso said:

I still can't believe we have managed to screw this season up, just when you think they've put you through the worst....we beat 4 of the top 8 and the reigning premiers, all the teams around us but couldn't handle the bottom 4-6! Its unfathomable....

That just makes it sound more depressing 

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4 minutes ago, sisso said:

Are we going to hear from the club, coach and players or is it just 'oh well'....

I hope it's real soon and it better start with exit interviews today.

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6 minutes ago, sisso said:

Are we going to hear from the club, coach and players or is it just 'oh well'....

Why, so they can tell us they are really hurting at the moment and feel disappointed.  Then we can all jump on here and call them dumb stupid footballers, that are like a broken record when they should win games but don't.  The only ones that can change what happened this year, last year and really for the last 15 years is the playing group, stop accepting defeat, be ruthless not toothless

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6 minutes ago, sisso said:

Are we going to hear from the club, coach and players or is it just 'oh well'....

The club still waiting on other results to come through.

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2017-08-26/melbourne-to-wait-and-see-after-loss

Edited by america de cali

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2 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Why, so they can tell us they are really hurting at the moment and feel disappointed.  Then we can all jump on here and call them dumb stupid footballers, that are like a broken record when they should win games but don't.  The only ones that can change what happened this year, last year and really for the last 15 years is the playing group, stop accepting defeat, be ruthless not toothless

Well know we know "where we are after rd 23" I'd like to hear Simon Goodwin's take on it

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