The Jesse Hogan Panic Room - all contract talk here

[Lucifers Hero 39,063]

4 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Beat me to the post.

Boyd had a great game in the GF.  First one that I can recall. 

Wasn't he dropped to the VFL for a large chunk of games this year, because his form was terrible?  Played 14 AFL games this year.

Was defended by the club for his poor form, while on a huge salary.

The short memories dominate on here.

Quite right - he had poor form in the first half of the season.  Then he was suspended (for a fight with teammate Cordy) and made the senior side for round 17.  He has played well since and had really good games for the last of the 3 finals with a breakout game in the GF.  He has said the suspension was the kick up the backside he needed and hasn't looked back.

Time will tell if he is a 'one finals series wonder'.  I suspect he is on his way to an outstanding career.  Good on him. 

And I reckon Jesse will have an equally outstanding career

 

[beelzebub 23,253]

1 hour ago, Satyriconhome said:

I do find it a bit disconcerting with some of the discussion around a 21 year old, I am sure most of us can remember being 21 and especially male, not exactly the most 'intelligent' creatures.

Yes he is an AFL player, and yes he is being paid an inordinate amount of money for a 21 year old, but he is now having to consider his future/career, he must take into consideration his families wishes, especially if there is illness, but I am also sure he is getting guidance from other sources as well.

Think the modern day manager is more about getting the best deal financially for his clients, rather than footy success, my opinion, so Jesse will also have to weigh up the advice from his manager as well, and what he wants to achieve in his career

 

Saty...my stance has always been I havent been convinced he has ever committed to the Demons in the manner we might expect a player to. Its nothing more than observations I concede but the body language and demeanor dont sell me. 

He'll be 22 soon enough. Hes been in the system for near on 4 years.  He's not a noobie really . Yes he's entitled to consider his career.. We have seen this past weekend that football can be so much more than about the money, or a contract. Football is about passion. I dont see any from him. Again , just my view.

Some seem to think ( not saying you ) that to have a discussion , indeed to be suspicious , to be questioning is tantamount to being 'angry' at the lad. I really couldnt care less what he does. He's just one of a number that make up a list. Yes, he has talent, but so do others.  If anything does matter , it is that I want a cohesive , competitive team. Who make it up is really to me irrelevant.

tbh, i think the modern day manager is all about the  modern day manager !!

If Jesse decides his future IS at Melbourne , for mine that will be the first indication he has actually bought into the club and that would be good for the MFC. If he decides it's elsewhere, good luck to him , and we'll get some value in return and good for us.  Again, I'm more about US .

Now I can fully understand views that are different but mine is that a person who really wanted to be at Melbounre would have one, displayed  more passion by now, and secondly found a way to sign on to mutual benefit much sooner.  He's a WA boy with real family ties and love for his home. Who decries that.I dont. Happy for him to go home. If his old man is the crux  ( and thats no disrespect to his condition , just positioning the discussion )  then  again tbh Id have thought we wouldnt even be having any more talk about it.

Probably the most poignant post, though suspect it had other motives, was to suggest we'll know by Friday.   I think we will too.

Go Dees

Edited October 1, 2016 by beelzebub

[KLV 1,764]

8 hours ago, deanox said:

I understand you can't reveal your source but is it a different source than we've heard reported here recently? Is it a primary source or heard from someone?

Primary

[beelzebub 23,253]

3 minutes ago, demondame said:

Primary

are you suggesting an announcement. or thats the deadline for any decision ?

[TGR 1,367]

47 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Yesterday was the first time I'd seen it.

Clint, your eyes are usually better than that. Thank god you don't work in an emergency department.  Many of you patients would be waking up in the coffin. 

 

Going up against the most brutal ruckman in the league for virtually the entire (PF) game, when Roughead went down last week....and then at least halving most contests....was all heart.

 

Most of the time, it's not about licking the ice-cream.  Boyd's effort and output in the PF was massive; but simpletons often just look at goals and possies.

 

 

 

I backed JJ for the norm, but in reality, Boyd was the biggest difference on GF day.  No Boyd, no flag.  The best 10 million dollar investment of all time.  Maybe Buddy might end up being the worst?

[What 18,810]

Hogan is twice the player Boyd is.

[beelzebub 23,253]

7 minutes ago, Petraccattack said:

Hogan is twice the player Boyd is.

when Jesse stands up in a GF and plays out of his skin. You may well  have some currency with that ideal...til then 

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

While the Boyd v Hogan stuff is riveting, it does highlight how important a decent KPP is.

Hogan isn't a decent KPP, with the right support he's going to be star. Boyd highlights how important it is to keep and obtain quality talls. What did the dogs pay a mil per year over 5 years, to get him? I am sure a lot of you laughed at that price tag.... now look how they gloat.

Boyd had a great finals series, played as a ruck and HF rotation which got him in to the game. He wasn't played like Hogan would as a power KPP. Very different players. Boyd has the potential to be like what Hogan already is

The one thing the dogs have that we don't, is excellent on field senior leaders. Boyd (M), Murphy, Morris, (I think I'm forgetting 1) which were massive contributors, add guns kids like Wood, Libba, Picken, Dalhaus etc and what a great combo

My point is we are not quite there yet, but if we keep Hogan we are a lot closer then if we are if we lose him....

 

Anyway as predicted no one actually knows where this contract is at. I still expect Hogan to be a Dee for 2017 and from there who the hell bloody knows. Buckle in kids

Edited October 1, 2016 by Unleash Hell

[Satyriconhome 10,415]

6 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Saty...my stance has always been I havent been convinced he has ever committed to the Demons in the manner we might expect a player to. Its nothing more than observations I concede but the body language and demeanor dont sell me. 

He'll be 22 soon enough. Hes been in the system for near on 4 years.  He's not a noobie really . Yes he's entitled to consider his career.. We have seen this past weekend that football can be so much more than about the money, or a contract. Football is about passion. I dont see any from him. Again , just my view.

Some seem to think ( not saying you ) that to have a discussion , indeed to be suspicious , to be questioning is tantamount to being 'angry' at the lad. I really couldnt care less what he does. He's just one of a number that make up a list. Yes, he has talent, but so do others.  If anything does matter , it is that I want a cohesive , competitive team. Who make it up is really to me irrelevant.

tbh, i think the modern day manager is all about the  modern day manager !!

If Jesse decides his future IS at Melbourne , for mine that will be the first indication he has actually bought into the club and that would be good for the MFC. If he decides it's elsewhere, good luck to him , and we'll get some value in return and good for us.  Again, I'm more about US .

Now I can fully understand views that are different but mine is that a person who really wanted to be at Melbounre would have one, displayed  more passion by now, and secondly found a way to sign on to mutual benefit much sooner.  He's a WA boy with real family ties and love for his home. Who decries that.I dont. Happy for him to go home. If his old man is the crux  ( and thats no disrespect to his condition , just positioning the discussion )  then  again tbh Id have thought we wouldnt even be having any more talk about it.

Probably the most poignant post, though suspect it had other motives, was to suggest we'll know by Friday.   I think we will too.

Go Dees

Good post, Demondame seems to be convinced he is staying, so all this discussion could be mute

He has always struck me as a young guy who has been thrust into the spotlight, and not quite sure how to deal with it, on field sometimes his body language is all over the place, off field from day one he has struggled with dealing with the hype/autographs/interviews.

The coaches love his attitude, never shirks training, came back into pre season in ripping shape, so don't think his attitude is a problem

I think he thought naively that if he said he would leave contract talk till the end of the year, it would all go away, can only assume he was badly advised

My thoughts on Jesse. if he leaves, he is one player, we will have a plan to cover it

If he stays great

 

 

[John Crow Batty 8,826]

47 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Saty...my stance has always been I havent been convinced he has ever committed to the Demons in the manner we might expect a player to. Its nothing more than observations I concede but the body language and demeanor dont sell me. 

He'll be 22 soon enough. Hes been in the system for near on 4 years.  He's not a noobie really . Yes he's entitled to consider his career.. We have seen this past weekend that football can be so much more than about the money, or a contract. Football is about passion. I dont see any from him. Again , just my view.

Some seem to think ( not saying you ) that to have a discussion , indeed to be suspicious , to be questioning is tantamount to being 'angry' at the lad. I really couldnt care less what he does. He's just one of a number that make up a list. Yes, he has talent, but so do others.  If anything does matter , it is that I want a cohesive , competitive team. Who make it up is really to me irrelevant.

tbh, i think the modern day manager is all about the  modern day manager !!

If Jesse decides his future IS at Melbourne , for mine that will be the first indication he has actually bought into the club and that would be good for the MFC. If he decides it's elsewhere, good luck to him , and we'll get some value in return and good for us.  Again, I'm more about US .

Now I can fully understand views that are different but mine is that a person who really wanted to be at Melbounre would have one, displayed  more passion by now, and secondly found a way to sign on to mutual benefit much sooner.  He's a WA boy with real family ties and love for his home. Who decries that.I dont. Happy for him to go home. If his old man is the crux  ( and thats no disrespect to his condition , just positioning the discussion )  then  again tbh Id have thought we wouldnt even be having any more talk about it.

Probably the most poignant post, though suspect it had other motives, was to suggest we'll know by Friday.   I think we will too.

Go Dees

If he does sign a big deal for us will he will change his attitude, chase, tackle and improve his kicking? That I'm not convinced.

[beelzebub 23,253]

24 minutes ago, america de cali said:

If he does sign a big deal for us will he will change his attitude, chase, tackle and improve his kicking? That I'm not convinced.

Actually...I think where your mind is is everything adc. Convinced ?   Maybe just presumptive 

[binman 42,148]

2 hours ago, Redleg said:

No one said he is the messiah.

It's just the anger that has been directed at him, by so called Demon fans, when at this stage he has done nothing to deserve it.

He is contracted for another year. Has never said he is leaving. He is apparently dealing with a family crisis. Yet, is the butt of anger and derision from some, because he hasn't extended his contract in the time period they demand. FFS.

I thought we were meant to support our players, until or unless they do something that should end that support. What has he done wrong to deserve the anger of some?

As usual, if he stays and does well, those same supporters will be the ones fawning all over him.

 

Good not agree more Redleg. Not only are some posters angry with Hogan some are also personally attacking him. Beggars belief.

[Lucifers Hero 39,063]

11 hours ago, demondame said:

Very confident hogan stays, announced soon, strong source

 

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

are you suggesting an announcement. or thats the deadline for any decision ?

The lady's first post is above, bb.

[beelzebub 23,253]

8 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

 

The lady's first post is above, bb.

Cheers, my bad

Announcemen; may or may not be what folk expect.

Such a wonderful time of year for cryptics .

 

[DeeZee 7,349]

I'm putting my money on a two year extension 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

1 hour ago, TGR said:

Clint, your eyes are usually better than that. Thank god you don't work in an emergency department.  Many of you patients would be waking up in the coffin. 

 

Going up against the most brutal ruckman in the league for virtually the entire (PF) game, when Roughead went down last week....and then at least halving most contests....was all heart.

 

Most of the time, it's not about licking the ice-cream.  Boyd's effort and output in the PF was massive; but simpletons often just look at goals and possies.

 

 

 

I backed JJ for the norm, but in reality, Boyd was the biggest difference on GF day.  No Boyd, no flag.  The best 10 million dollar investment of all time.  Maybe Buddy might end up being the worst?

I stand corrected, he's played two good games and not one.

[Gator 17,261]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

when Jesse stands up in a GF and plays out of his skin. You may well  have some currency with that ideal...til then 

That's a rubbish argument. 

Flower is the best wingman I've seen, but by your logic he can't be. 

[Redleg 40,385]

26 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I stand corrected, he's played two good games and not one.

And for those that love stats.

Boyd had played 34 games before this year's finals. An average of 11 per year. 9 in his first year with GWS. 25 with the Dogs.

In none of those games was he considered to have been a star of the game.

This year he played 11 of the 22 games. Form not injury was the main factor.

He played a fair game in the ruck against Mummy and contested well, though again not starring in the PF.

His breakout game was yesterday and happened to be the GF.

He has not shown consistent good form in 3 years in the AFL.

But on the strength of one good game, some on here hail him the new Polly Farmer/Tony Lockett rolled into one.

FWIW, Jesse's stats are far more impressive and he didn't cost us $2m for the last 2 years.

Edited October 2, 2016 by Redleg

[Demon Disciple 11,820]

29 minutes ago, Redleg said:

FWIW, Jesse's stats are far more impressive and he didn't cost us $2m for the last 2 years.

He will soon

[beelzebub 23,253]

51 minutes ago, ProDee said:

That's a rubbish argument. 

Flower is the best wingman I've seen, but by your logic he can't be. 

You were directly comparing the two. What you suppose is purely speculative. Boyd HAS delivered. Hogan is all about 'might' 

Try as you may your argument is flowery at best and totally illogical more likely.

[Ted Lasso 18,914]

3 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

You were directly comparing the two. What you suppose is purely speculative. Boyd HAS delivered. Hogan is all about 'might' 

Try as you may your argument is flowery at best and totally illogical more likely.

Hogan has delivered 80 plus goals in 2 years, 2 top 10 finishes in the best and fairest, a rising star win, been Melbournes most marketable player and cost half of what Boyd has. 

Boyds played a really good finals series but he's still miles behind Hogan. 

the thing to remember is if Hogan kicked better we'd be talking about a 60-65 goal season in his second year, he's better than a heap of the champion key forwards over the last 20 years in their first 2 years. 

Kudos to Boyd for playing well in a final but if you look at the body of work rather than 1-2 games it's laughable that they're even being compared.

[Pirlo 813]

Boyd was terrific yesterday, absolutely outstanding in the big moments. That doesn't change the fact that he got 15 touches, took eight marks, and kicked 3.

I recall Hogan having 20- touches and 14 marks late in the year, and people ripping into him.

He is far and away the best young key forward in the game, whether in red and blue or purple and white, because he doesn't have a stand out deficiency.

He will lead us to a flag if circumstances allow it.

[Pirlo 813]

2 hours ago, america de cali said:

If he does sign a big deal for us will he will change his attitude, chase, tackle and improve his kicking? That I'm not convinced.

Forgive him for trying to focus on football with a sick dad on the other side of the country.

Is Hogan the one who decked a teammate on a night out a few months ago?

You people are insufferable.

[Gator 17,261]

30 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

You were directly comparing the two. What you suppose is purely speculative. Boyd HAS delivered. Hogan is all about 'might' 

Try as you may your argument is flowery at best and totally illogical more likely.

Your elevation of Boyd after a great grand final, his only great game, is very shallow thinking, bub, and a distortion of facts.

We at least know that Boyd can now compete in the ruck, but he's yet to play a decent game as a key forward. 

I'm still to be convinced that he'll be anything other than a toiler in the ruck and doubt he has the game to dominate as a forward.

He's a premiership player, so good luck to him, but try not to rewrite history.

Edited October 2, 2016 by ProDee

[Return to Glory 8,398]

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

And for those that love stats.

Boyd had played 34 games before this year's finals. An average of 11 per year. 9 in his first year with GWS. 25 with the Dogs.

In none of those games was he considered to have been a star of the game.

This year he played 11 of the 22 games. Form not injury was the main factor.

He played a fair game in the ruck against Mummy and contested well, though again not starring in the PF.

His breakout game was yesterday and happened to be the GF.

He has not shown consistent good form in 3 years in the AFL.

But on the strength of one good game, some on here hail him the new Polly Farmer/Tony Lockett rolled into one.

FWIW, Jesse's stats are far more impressive and he didn't cost us $2m for the last 2 years.

By my reckoning, Redleg, it's been a string of finals culminating in a great Grand Final performance.