Have we a team of competitors?

[CBDees 3,167]

I can't wait until we unleash Oliver, Petracca and Trengrove into our midfield mix. As if Jones, Vanders, Vince, Tyson and Brayshaw wasn't enough for them to think about!

[dee-luded 2,959]

1 hour ago, ManDee said:

That's over three and a half meters tall!

its anticipated he still has some growth left in him.

[nutbean 8,838]

You can be a competitor without being a monster or an extraction machine like a Viney.

1/ When it is you turn to go - you go

2/ Keep putting in for the full 4 quarters. To me this is the big one - Everyone "competes" but 4 quarter efforts need to be the benchmark. I don't want hear our coach say - "we played so well for 3 quarters but we started poorly/ faded out/ had a bad 30 minutes and that one quarter cost us".  

[DeeMfc 621]

12 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

I believe Jack Viney will be setting the bar long before Oliver will be.  He'll just follow in his footsteps. 

this has to be watched right to the end. Classic!!!

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

17 minutes ago, nutbean said:

You can be a competitor without being a monster or an extraction machine like a Viney.

1/ When it is you turn to go - you go

2/ Keep putting in for the full 4 quarters. To me this is the big one - Everyone "competes" but 4 quarter efforts need to be the benchmark. I don't want hear our coach say - "we played so well for 3 quarters but we started poorly/ faded out/ had a bad 30 minutes and that one quarter cost us".  

This'll be the big thing I'll be looking for this year. Consistently competitive 4 quarter efforts will make me happy, regardless of the result. If the players are trying for 100% of every game, the wins will come.

[Wormburner 674]

10 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Would surprise me.

If he didn't turn it over at least 3 times....

 

Give him a chance. From what everyone's saying he's doing everything right, he knows it's make or break.....lets get behind him.

 

[Tony Tea 2,809]

My hobby horse on my soap box.

AFL footy is all about size and grunt. Roos and the current footy department know it's a power game and have recruited competitive animals. Clarko, despite Hawthorn's style of rebound footy, also understands this, and bases its game around the likes of Lewis & Hodge crashing bodies. (Their famous "unsociable footy" is part & parcel of the physical game.)

Most every kid who enters the AFL can kick, mark, handball and generally play the game at U18 level. It's mostly the bigger bodied competitors who develop into successful AFL footballers. By successful I mean players who play well in big games and finals. Players who may have less skill than their opponents, but who through size, strength and desire, have the ability to beat their opponent every time.

It will be fascinating to see how Oliver compares with Parish. Parish has a big wrap as a pure footballer, but he may struggle to get the agate if no one can get it to him. Oliver, on the other hand, looks like the sort of player who will be difficult to stop, since his objective is to charge into the fray and get the ball. In the AFL you should always rate the Oliver type over the Parish type. The former is the guts of a footy team, the latter is the garnish.

It is also why I am less bullish on Stretch and Neal-Bullen, than some.

[Demonated 252]

14 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Oliver will be twice Viney's size in 3-4 years....!

he is going to be a Monster

great get. 

He will be a lot bigger than Viney but as for competitiveness and aggression, I doubt we have anyone on our list that has or will match Viney. He is probably the most aggressive midfielder in the league at the moment and physically hurts the opposition far more than many players much bigger than him. 

 

Viney will be our battering ram for the next 10 years, Brayshaw, Petracca, Oliver (and VDB) are also bulls but will hopefully bring their own unique skills and traits into the team. 

[Tony Tea 2,809]

1 minute ago, Demonated said:

Viney will be our battering ram for the next 10 years, Brayshaw, Petracca, Oliver (and VDB) are also bulls but will hopefully bring their own unique skills and traits into the team. 

Viney is a psycho Energiser bunny. Love him.

[Sir Why You Little 37,134]

1 minute ago, Demonated said:

He will be a lot bigger than Viney but as for competitiveness and aggression, I doubt we have anyone on our list that has or will match Viney. He is probably the most aggressive midfielder in the league at the moment and physically hurts the opposition far more than many players much bigger than him. 

 

Viney will be our battering ram for the next 10 years, Brayshaw, Petracca, Oliver (and VDB) are also bulls but will hopefully bring their own unique skills and traits into the team. 

Let's see what happens. Don't get me wrong i love Jack Viney's attitude I just look at Oliver Now, and think Wow he could be anything down the track. 

We need Generals in the middle

[nutbean 8,838]

12 minutes ago, Tony Tea said:

My hobby horse on my soap box.

AFL footy is all about size and grunt. Roos and the current footy department know it's a power game and have recruited competitive animals. Clarko, despite Hawthorn's style of rebound footy, also understands this, and bases its game around the likes of Lewis & Hodge crashing bodies. (Their famous "unsociable footy" is part & parcel of the physical game.)

Most every kid who enters the AFL can kick, mark, handball and generally play the game at U18 level. It's mostly the bigger bodied competitors who develop into successful AFL footballers. By successful I mean players who play well in big games and finals. Players who may have less skill than their opponents, but who through size, strength and desire, have the ability to beat their opponent every time.

It will be fascinating to see how Oliver compares with Parish. Parish has a big wrap as a pure footballer, but he may struggle to get the agate if no one can get it to him. Oliver, on the other hand, looks like the sort of player who will be difficult to stop, since his objective is to charge into the fray and get the ball. In the AFL you should always rate the Oliver type over the Parish type. The former is the guts of a footy team, the latter is the garnish.

It is also why I am less bullish on Stretch and Neal-Bullen, than some.

For every Mitchell and Jordan Lewis you need an Bradley Hill and Isaac Smith - the difference is that whilst Mitchell and Jordan are size and grunt and Hill and Smith are not, all 4 are competitors....

 

 

[Tony Tea 2,809]

3 minutes ago, nutbean said:

For every Mitchell and Jordan Lewis you need an Bradley Hill and Isaac Smith - the difference is that whilst Mitchell and Jordan are size and grunt and Hill and Smith are not, all 4 are competitors....

I agree with that. But it starts at the contest.

[McQueen 17,867]

Whether it's being a competitive or skilful player, not enough attention has been placed on the psychological aspect of player development in the past. This, is going to be the differentiator moving forward towards success. The club has invested heavily in the development dept and whilst I have no doubt they have strategically targeted 'harder' players who show the desire to get the ball at all costs, I believe these same players also have the capacity to be trained to become mentally tough. 

I really don't expect to see any heads drop this year when the going gets tough. This in itself will be very telling to our fortunes.

[rjay 25,093]

6 hours ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Being competitive is one thing coming to play every week is another.

 

When we suffer a loss this year the first person to blame "learning a new gameplan" needs to be banned from this site for a month.

Being competitive and being a competitor is a very different thing though 'Bombay'...being competitive is like "they had a go but weren't really good enough".

Being a competitor is when you don't like getting beaten at anything nor against anyone, our own RDB was famous for this.

I think we are building a team of real competitors. Viney for one is looking to be one of the most, if not the most competitive players in the comp, his battle with Libba this year is going to be a beauty. Hogan hates losing anything and from what I've seen of Olli at training he doesn't care who he's up against he's there to win in every contest.

[binman 43,816]

1 minute ago, McQueen said:

Whether it's being a competitive or skilful player, not enough attention has been placed on the psychological aspect of player development in the past. This, is going to be the differentiator moving forward towards success. The club has invested heavily in the development dept and whilst I have no doubt they have strategically targeted 'harder' players who show the desire to get the ball at all costs, I believe these same players also have the capacity to be trained to become mentally tough. 

I really don't expect to see any heads drop this year when the going gets tough. This in itself will be very telling to our fortunes.

I agree with your points in the the first para McQueen and hope you're right with second one.

A key psychological element winning teams have is an expectation of winning. I've been fascinated to listen to the recent interviews on Dee tv with Neal Bullen, Kent and Harmes. All talk about the expectation of playing well this season and specifically this weekend against Port. They talk about winning this game and the other NAB games as an important energy to bring into the season. This reflects the very positive messages coming from Roos and Mahoney in the last week about us being successful this year.

A far cry from the 'one week at time, focus on on getting the process right and winning will take care of itself' nonsense espoused by Neeld but also a far different tone from Roos this year to last. They are priming the players and this gives me alot of confidence. As does how positively the players are about the vibe around the club. Terrific stuff.

The other interesting thing in term of psychology at the club - and one i've mentioned before - is how clear players seem to be about the role they will play and how open the club is about these roles. For example Kent talks about how much he is looking forward to playing forward with Hogan, Frost etc. 

[jnrmac 20,189]

1 hour ago, Wormburner said:

Give him a chance. From what everyone's saying he's doing everything right, he knows it's make or break.....lets get behind him.

 

Understand your sentiment and I don't make short term judgements on players - they play for our club after all - but DT has had plenty of chances. I don't doubt his endeavour and commend him for working hard in the off season but his inability to hit targets kills us coming out of the backline.

Frawley changed his kicking style and was much more reliable in his later years at hitting targets, so it can be done. I will watch with interest and hope that he can eliminate that bad habit.

 

[P-man 13,366]

20 minutes ago, binman said:

I agree with your points in the the first para McQueen and hope you're right with second one.

A key psychological element winning teams have is an expectation of winning. I've been fascinated to listen to the recent interviews on Dee tv with Neal Bullen, Kent and Harmes. All talk about the expectation of playing well this season and specifically this weekend against Port. They talk about winning this game and the other NAB games as an important energy to bring into the season. This reflects the very positive messages coming from Roos and Mahoney in the last week about us being successful this year.

A far cry from the 'one week at time, focus on on getting the process right and winning will take care of itself' nonsense espoused by Neeld but also a far different tone from Roos this year to last. They are priming the players and this gives me alot of confidence. As does how positively the players are about the vibe around the club. Terrific stuff.

The other interesting thing in term of psychology at the club - and one i've mentioned before - is how clear players seem to be about the role they will play and how open the club is about these roles. For example Kent talks about how much he is looking forward to playing forward with Hogan, Frost etc. 

Those three latest interview are all terrific in their own right.

i especially like listening to Nibbler talk. I know some think he has a case of verbal diarrhoea but he's just very thoughtful about his responses and as a supporter I appreciate the fact he puts some thought into what he says. Was interesting to hear him single out Tommy Bugg as a positive influence on the younger players with his hardness at the contest. Bugg is one that I'm really looking forward to seeing in the red and blue  on Saturday. Fans who aren't familiar with him are going to love him I reckon. Doesn't know how to take a backward step.

Edited February 26, 2016 by P-man

[binman 43,816]

15 minutes ago, P-man said:

Those three latest interview are all terrific in their own right.

i especially like listening to Nibbler talk. I know some think he has a case of verbal diarrhoea but he's just very thoughtful about his responses and as a supporter I appreciate the fact he puts some thought into what he says. 

I agree. Really refreshing and i loved how positive they all were, particularity Harmes who seemed to be buzzing. 

I assume Neal Bullen is nibbler?

I liked his response to the question about where he wants to play: 'í'm an out and out midfielder' or words to that effect. No spin or stuff like happy to play where the coach wants me blah blah blah

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,408]

14 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

I'm a bit over this focus on competitors and competing .We'll assemble a team of competitors only to have a team devoid of skill. 

I've got Grimes as a starting wingman and am tossing up between 2 debutants (Wagner, Hunt) and Lumumba for a spot on the back flank. We might have competitors but I worry about skills.

Just give me a team of footballers who go out each week and play football. Which means attacking the ball, running hard and displaying skills. 

I like tough, physical, strong football that ensures you are always winning contests and making the other side work very hard, but I love winning more. The best teams always have a standard of competitive football required to keep a spot in the team, but they also always have players with varying skill sets which balance out the team. We won't solve all our problems by putting the cart before the horse and expecting some unachievable standard where by every player attacks the contest like Jack Viney.

You start by saying a "we'll end up having a team devoid of skill", you follow that up with "I've got Grimes as a starting wingman"

????

Players need 

- to be competitive 

- possess good to elite skills

- footy smarts

- to come to play every week

 

[McQueen 17,867]

38 minutes ago, binman said:

I agree. Really refreshing and i loved how positive they all were, particularity Harmes who seemed to be buzzing. 

I assume Neal Bullen is nibbler?

I liked his response to the question about where he wants to play: 'í'm an out and out midfielder' or words to that effect. No spin or stuff like happy to play where the coach wants me blah blah blah

Also where he said there's a real belief the boys can achieve something special this year.

I firmly believe this is strongly linked to the increased footy component in the form of match sim. Rawlings made mention of it in his interview and I reckon the boys mentality is fixated on 'training how you intend on playing'. 

Thats got to be comforting for the group.

[thesleepinggiant 160]

2 hours ago, nutbean said:

For every Mitchell and Jordan Lewis you need an Bradley Hill and Isaac Smith - the difference is that whilst Mitchell and Jordan are size and grunt and Hill and Smith are not, all 4 are competitors....

 

 

Thinking the same... anb and stretch are not extractors, they are runners and should be receiving on the outside. Very astute drafting.

Without being vindictive I'm surprised Prendergast hasnt been hung, drawn and quartered..?

[Lucifers Hero 40,364]

From most of the interviews one thing altho unstated, that comes thru loud and clear is HUNGRY!

Hungry to make the 22, hungry to hold down a spot, hungry to win games, hungry to bring MFC success...(I especially love their commitment to the latter).

Can't remember when we had hungry players let alone a hungry team!

[Wormburner 674]

2 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Understand your sentiment and I don't make short term judgements on players - they play for our club after all - but DT has had plenty of chances. I don't doubt his endeavour and commend him for working hard in the off season but his inability to hit targets kills us coming out of the backline.

Frawley changed his kicking style and was much more reliable in his later years at hitting targets, so it can be done. I will watch with interest and hope that he can eliminate that bad habit.

 

I agree, he has had a lot of chances. Although I think that playing well in the VFL and not being able to get a senior game would have hurt .

Anyways, it'll be a great step forward for our club when we don't have to cringe or worry about some of our players disposals every time they get it.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Wormburner

[dee-luded 2,959]

2 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

From most of the interviews one thing altho unstated, that comes thru loud and clear is HUNGRY!

Hungry to make the 22, hungry to hold down a spot, hungry to win games, hungry to bring MFC success...(I especially love their commitment to the latter).

Can't remember when we had hungry players let alone a hungry team!

you'd need go back to last century L'sH the 90's we had hungry sides. mostly.

[Fork 'em 6,991]

Not hungry enough DL.