Just trying to work out how many off seasons it will take to shed the list of our duds?

I'm tipping at least another 3....., that gives an idea of how many list cloggers we carry!

That timeframe will see the end of Goodwin if the club does not get a move on with its list.

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by Soidee

Bail, Mckenzie, M Jones, Terlich

If you were to ask me who on the list isn't up to it and is a "list clogger" I'd be going:

Bail

M.Jones

Mckenzie

Riley

Toumpas (always hoped for the best but think its over)

Michie

Spencer

Terlich

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by JV7

Watts, Howe, Garland......Bail, M Jones.

Lumumba.

Not sure about spud. I prefer sloppy hack.

How long is his mind boggling contract anyway?

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by Deestroy All

Let's cut the crap.

Who can't dispose of the footy by foot.

Every player must possess 3 things.

1- must be a natural competitor and love the contest

2- must be able to dispose of the footy

3- must have footy smarts

Let's be honest, how many does that now rule out?

A Tom McDonald might be the only exception with regards to no.2 because his main role is a stopper.

If we're being honest at least 6-7 who played yesterday must go.

How many would miss if applied to the Hawks? One, Chip Frawley but he comes under the Tmac exception.

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by Al's Demons

If you were to ask me who on the list isn't up to it and is a "list clogger" I'd be going:

Bail

M.Jones

Mckenzie

Riley

Toumpas (always hoped for the best but think its over)

Michie

Spencer

Terlich

Pretty clear start for the 'all due respect, but just not AFL level' group.

Only Spencer (and he's gone if we land any kind of ruckman by FA/trade) of that group I would rate better than 50/50 to be on the primary list next year, and only Toumpas might get a 're-rookie' slot of the rest.

Then there's the layer of 'just barely adequate at AFL level' who need to be kept until some kind of development can be found'.

Different people put different players in that group, usually a selection from;

Garland, Lumumba, Dunn, Grimes, Pederson, Dawes, Howe, Watts.

As we've seen, any one of them could turn around their form, and here's hoping they all do and the Demons are transformed in 2016.

BUT if the team overall is improving, they are likely to slip further out, one by one.

I think by the end of 2016 almost all of our list cloggers will either have improved or gone.

Simon Goodwin will have a whole new set of list cloggers to work with! Yaaaaaaay!

I reckon this pre-season clean will be our main clean-out, before Goodwin takes the reigns for the 2017 season, & then does his own clean at the end of 2017...

....... next season Roosy will want to start the side really getting wins happening, & a momentum going. he will want us to climb to around the 10-11ish on the ladder, on around ten wins, IMO.

so those who clearly aren't up to it, will be well shed skins.

Expendable: Dunn, Howe, Fitzpatrick, Riley, Toumpas, Garland, Watts

Not AFL standard: Bail, McKenzie, Terlich, M Jones

I'd keep Michie for depth.

Simples.

Dawes ffs!!!

Expendable: Dunn, Howe, Fitzpatrick, Riley, Toumpas, Garland, Watts

Not AFL standard: Bail, McKenzie, Terlich, M Jones

I'd keep Michie for depth.

Simples.

Howe and Dunn are vital players. Both very good players, if they were to leave - would be a BIG loss. Watts is worth sticking with. Agree with the others.

The problem with the list is the lack of superstars, not the depth players. Due to horrifically stupid cap rules we have over paid role players in the past to comply with using the minimum cap space..

This will level out with a better football department which we now have.

Terlich,M Jones, Trengove, Spencer, Fitzpatrick, Bail, McKenzie, Grimes, Toumpas. None of AFL standard. Jamar will be forced to retire. I personally think this is unfair and a mistake. However he isn't being given a chance in the seniors so his cards are marked.

Dawes ffs!!!

Succinct

It'll be a big call if Spencer and Jamar are both delisted/retired as we'd have to go out and look for a decent ruck.

It looks like it's curtains for Bail, M.Jones, Terlich and Mckenzie but I'm not sure about anyone else at the moment. Based on selections this year there's a chance Toumpas, Fitzy, Riley and Michie will all go be it through trade or delisting but that bunch is worth persisting with more than the previous 4

Terlich,M Jones, Trengove, Spencer, Fitzpatrick, Bail, McKenzie, Grimes, Toumpas. None of AFL standard. Jamar will be forced to retire. I personally think this is unfair and a mistake. However he isn't being given a chance in the seniors so his cards are marked.

Jamar may well be kept on if he's prepared to play at Casey and get the odd run when required. He could play a similar role to what Hudson has done at a few clubs unless that is we have some younger rucks to develop at Casey.

I think Gawn's development was held back by not getting enough of a run as the main man at Casey.

3 years seems very optimistic. better chance of winning tattslotto

Bail
M.Jones
McKenzie
Riley
Toumpas
Michie
Spencer
Terlich

Fitzpatrick

Keep turning the list over.

Crikey these threads are amazing - a weird mix of everyone's pet hates with a few obvious names that will go.

OK the obvious are Bail, Terlich, McKenzie. These are the only certainties but M Jones, Michie and Riley must be on short leads although both Jones and Michie have shown glimpses in the past two weeks that suggest they might be coming on.

Trade bait are Jamar, Spencer, Fitzpatrick, maybe Grimes but of course they won't all go.

Toumpas is underwhelming but I suspect they will want to keep working with him but is also trade bait.

Howe and Watts are keepers.

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by pitmaster

Trade bait are Jamar, Spencer, Fitzpatrick, maybe Grimes but of course they won't all go.

Not sure if serious? Trade bait? For pick 100?

Watts may have fallen into this category in the past but no longer. He should not be in any discussions about trading or delisting at this stage, imo.

To go:

Bail - honest trier with no skill and little football smarts.

Michie - had his best game in a long time on the weekend, but too little too late. Not good enough.

McKenzie - as with Bail, tries his heart out but far too limited. VFL dominance does not translate to AFL form for him.

Spencer - has had long enough imo. Will only work as a number one ruck (if ever), and that is now Gawn. Need the spot for another ruck prospect.

Hunt - hasn't cracked a senior game since being drafted in 2013. Wouldn't think he'd get an extension.

Jones - has had long enough to show that he isn't up to it. Can't doubt his endeavour though.

Terlich - Roos clearly doesn't like him, though I did once upon a time. Good VFL player.

Jamar - cooked and clearly no longer in favour. Will get a spot at another club I think.

Very close, but worth holding onto:

Toumpas - I still think Jimmy can do it, and I hope Roos and co can still turn him around. Too much skill to throw away yet.

Lumumba - Needs a year to adjust to the different team mates and style of play, I think. We'll see a better player next year.

Dawes - Fierce competitor but not up to it aerially. I hope we are searching for an upgrade, but I do like him as a person.

Newton - Provides depth and has shown promise. Needs to string together some senior games though.

Kennedy-Harris - has some wicked attributes but needs to work harder, as well as stay fit. Hoping to see this next year.

Petracca - dodgy knee, looks overweight, too arrogant. I'd be close to having him delisted but think they will persevere with him.

FWIW:

Dunn and Lumumba are contracted to 2017.

Trengove, Dawes, Grimes, Watts, Matt Jones, Spencer, Terlich and Newton are contracted to 2016.

Jamar, Garland, McKenzie, Howe, Fitzpatrick, Toumpas, Pedersen, Hunt, Cross, Bail, Riley, Michie, Harmes, King and White are out of contract this year.

I think this year's trading and drafting period will see the delisting of most of the players, who Demonlanders feel are not up to it. We will hopefully snare a FA mid who will add to our side and draft well.

We will then have have changed 75% of the list that we had when Roos was appointed.

It would be impossible to argue then IMO, that we don't have a better list than when he arrived.

While we will still have some players who may not be the best in the AFL, we will have some serious talent on the list.

The next step is to keep developing the younger players and teach the list a game plan that they can understand and implement. A game plan that can help us win games.

IMO our players don't understand what they are to do when they get the ball, or where they are supposed to be when they haven't got it.

I also think that the Coaches have had quite a few games where they have not been at their best.

Everyone has their own opinions on players. Although there are some that we agree on.

The ones I'd like to see go are;

Terlich

McKenzie

Hunt

Riley

Michie

Cross - Sorry mate, I like you but the last couple of games it is painfully clear you are losing your speed

Jamar - Trade bait

Toumpas - Trade bait

I would actually like to keep some that are others suggesting. These include;

Bail - Is a gut runner and we know what we get from him even though it isn't flash

MJones - See Bail

Spencer - Need a backup ruck

Fitzpatrick - Need a backup tall, can play back or forward

Pedersen - See Fitzy + pinch hit

Dawes - Can play forward and pinch hit

Edited August 17, 20159 yr by Barra17