Tipping Point Has Been Reached...

[Chook 15,012]

It's going to be hilarious on here when we beat Collingwood next week.

If we beat Collingwood next week, I’ll...

[old dee 23,742]

If we beat Collingwood next week, I’ll...

Your safe

[Nasher 33,607]

You won't get an answer.

Nasher seems to be in the 'I'm content with being average' crew of demonland.

Don't know why anyone would find it funny if we beat Collingwood. Especially with Cloke and Elliot out.

How many fucking 'rebound' games have we seen with this club? Why would anyone think that everything will be all okay if we were to beat Collingwood?

For a fella who I reckon is one of Demonland's more knowledgeable posters, you sure act like a dolt sometimes.

I'm not content with being average. I merely don't ride the roller coaster of "we'll push for finals" to "we won't win another game all year" that crops up on here from week to week.

Surely you can see that describing this week as the "tipping point" is nothing but rank hyperbole? Jeez, it wasn't even the worst we've been this year, let alone in the last 5. We knew we had a propensity for being crud when we shouldn't be. We knew that our effort and intensity are inconsistent. I don't know why we carry on after each loss as if it's something new.

And it'll all be forgotten when we win again. Until we lose again, of course...

[old dee 23,742]

For a fella who I reckon is one of Demonland's more knowledgeable posters, you sure act like a dolt sometimes.

I'm not content with being average. I merely don't ride the roller coaster of "we'll push for finals" to "we won't win another game all year" that crops up on here from week to week.

Surely you can see that describing this week as the "tipping point" is nothing but rank hyperbole? Jeez, it wasn't even the worst we've been this year, let alone in the last 5. We knew we had a propensity for being crud when we shouldn't be. We knew that our effort and intensity are inconsistent. I don't know why we carry on after each loss as if it's something new.

And it'll all be forgotten when we win again. Until we lose again, of course...

We average a win every five weeks Nasher so on that basis the problem will not arrive again for another month.

[John Crow Batty 8,860]

What are the chances of Darcy Moore upstaging Jesse Hogan on Saturday?

[old dee 23,742]

What are the chances of Darcy Moore upstaging Jesse Hogan on Saturday?

Very good I would think.

We have a habit of getting players off and firing.

Cloke and Daniher could not hit the side of a barn until they played us and Roo had a great game on one leg.

Every chance of a big one from Moore

[John Crow Batty 8,860]

Very good I would think.

We have a habit of getting players off and firing.

Cloke and Daniher could not hit the side of a barn until they played us and Roo had a great game on one leg.

Every chance of a big one from Moore

We played that McCartin spud into form too. His best game for the Saints by miles. Doubled Hogan for possessions, marks and tackles.

[Sir Why You Little 36,947]

For a fella who I reckon is one of Demonland's more knowledgeable posters, you sure act like a dolt sometimes.

I'm not content with being average. I merely don't ride the roller coaster of "we'll push for finals" to "we won't win another game all year" that crops up on here from week to week.

Surely you can see that describing this week as the "tipping point" is nothing but rank hyperbole? Jeez, it wasn't even the worst we've been this year, let alone in the last 5. We knew we had a propensity for being crud when we shouldn't be. We knew that our effort and intensity are inconsistent. I don't know why we carry on after each loss as if it's something new.

And it'll all be forgotten when we win again. Until we lose again, of course...

That of course is your opinion, not the be all and end all.

Losing to the Saints on our grass for the 12th consecutive time was actually the worst. Why because it shows there is zero leadership and stuff all pride wearing the jumper. No matter who coaches the club

Losing to Essendon was a disgrace losing to St.kilda with no system or confidence as a team means the club dos not learn

And no it won't be forgotten...

[Redleg 40,800]

It's going to be hilarious on here when we beat Collingwood next week.

It would be if we do, which I now think we won't, not only for us, but also for what it would do to the Pies' season.

[old dee 23,742]

It would be if we do, which I now think we won't, not only for us, but also for what it would do to the Pies' season.

Good to see you back up Redleg last night I thought you had tossed it all in and I was to blame.

[Gorgoroth 12,911]

Jesse White will kick a bag on us, every other f!ogging spud has, so why not this nonce.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,685]

51 years of crap

We need to recruit LEADERS who will not stand for selfish soft attitudes

Players who cannot kick mark handball or run to an AFL elite standard must go, it has now reached that point.

A Coach can only teach. It is the players who activate those teachings. What we saw yesterday is not Roos' gameplan, it was a total shambles

and we do not have the leaders to stamp it out

We have to import. Anything else is yet another Bandaid...

At the risk of asking a serious question, why do you say what we saw is not Roos' gameplan? (I'm not arguing about the quality of execution. I agree it was a shambles).

[Sir Why You Little 36,947]

At the risk of asking a serious question, why do you say what we saw is not Roos' gameplan? (I'm not arguing about the quality of execution. I agree it was a shambles).

Do you really think what we saw yesterday was planned?

The players did not execute

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,685]

Do you really think what we saw yesterday was planned?

The players did not execute

Sorry, but I'm confused. Are you saying it was not Paul Roos's gameplan because the execution was so poor it didn't resemble what he wanted the players to do? If so, I now appreciate what your opening post was saying.

[drdrake 3,157]

Do you really think what we saw yesterday was planned?

The players did not execute

I reckon what we are seeing is the game plan, when things happen over and over again it has to be pre- meditated or you would fix it. Skill errors are coach killers but allowing loose men in our forward 50m, protect space rather than manning up, allow your nan to always have a 5 m gap on you, if it was isolated you say players but this is how we play each week. Then we man up one week like we did at Geelong and we are a different team.

That is my issue, our best game in 8 years and the very next week we revert back to the Roos gameplan and we are garbage

[M C 221]

I reckon what we are seeing is the game plan, when things happen over and over again it has to be pre- meditated or you would fix it. Skill errors are coach killers but allowing loose men in our forward 50m, protect space rather than manning up, allow your nan to always have a 5 m gap on you, if it was isolated you say players but this is how we play each week. Then we man up one week like we did at Geelong and we are a different team.

That is my issue, our best game in 8 years and the very next week we revert back to the Roos gameplan and we are garbage

How we played against Geelong was an example of us executing the game plan exactly how Roos wants. That is the Roos gameplan.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Public Supporter Backlash. I like it

It is time we put the club in the spotlight...

no its time to highlight the AFL's issues in the spotlight, because they are the cause of most of this, & our cushy culture on top makes it harder for us to flourish, than others.

[Pennant St Dee 13,062]

For a fella who I reckon is one of Demonland's more knowledgeable posters, you sure act like a dolt sometimes.

I'm not content with being average. I merely don't ride the roller coaster of "we'll push for finals" to "we won't win another game all year" that crops up on here from week to week.

Surely you can see that describing this week as the "tipping point" is nothing but rank hyperbole? Jeez, it wasn't even the worst we've been this year, let alone in the last 5. We knew we had a propensity for being crud when we shouldn't be. We knew that our effort and intensity are inconsistent. I don't know why we carry on after each loss as if it's something new.

And it'll all be forgotten when we win again. Until we lose again, of course...

Don't think this is the case any more Nasher for the majority and the knowledgable suporters

We have been through so much and seen the team on to many occassions respond for 1 week only, they become content with themselves it is an ingrained culture amongst the playing group

Roosy gat a grace period and whilst we can see small improvement and the players we moved on (barring Martin) have done little to suggest we were wrong for moving them on, The players we brought in generally showed more potential and improvement in the side.

However taking this all into account teh fact that we still can't string 2 wins together is just to much to take, it is not like we haven't had opportunities to do so

• Suns & GWS Round 1 & 2
• Bulldogs & Port Round 8 & 9
• Saints & Cats Round 11 & 12
• Essendon, Brisbane & Saints Round 15, 16 & 17

The team group has been found wanting in all of the above gone missing, expected the usual suspect to do the job, no leadership. Even in those games we had the opportunity to get the two in a row. Basic mistakes made by a so called professional team leading into and during these games

• we were comfortably in the lead in two of those games and became complacent which is so common for this team
• Nobody stood up and stopped the run ons in the GWS and Port games or teh Bombers in the 3rd quarter
• nobody on the ground realised there was only 40 secs left (FMD the security were out around the ground and there had been SFA goals scored) in the Saints game at Etihad
• no leader stood up and nailed opportunities against the Bombers when we had them on the ropes and doubting themselves in the 4th
• No leader yesterday realised in the conditions it wasn't a day for run and carry with handball after handball

These are basics in leadership and even now into our third rebuild we continue to disapoint our members. I advocated a few weeks ago and will again that should we win our next game we do not sing teh song because we will have accomplished little until we put two together.

We have imporved but other sides improve quicker and that is what irks the majority of our supporters

[old dee 23,742]

Excellent comment above PSD covers more thoughts Thanks for the effort.

Pity our team is not so good.

[deeflog 679]

We played that McCartin spud into form too. His best game for the Saints by miles. Doubled Hogan for possessions, marks and tackles.

fairly sure that has something to do with having an AFL standard work rate and desire for the defensive side of the game. Areas hogan greatly lacks in

[drdrake 3,157]

How we played against Geelong was an example of us executing the game plan exactly how Roos wants. That is the Roos gameplan.

No it isn't, Geelong we went one on one, to the point at one stage we had an 8 man forward line, everytime Geelong push one back we push one forward.

Geelong was about accountability, old fashion beat your man. For some reason Roos doesn't want us playing that way, he wants men behind the footy and allows loose men in our forward half. We don't man up we zone and we don't have the skills to keep the footy off loose players. We have a rookie being smashed 3 on 1, what coach in their right mind lets this happen

[grazman 7,404]

The angst is understandable, same issues we've seen for so long. Roos has gone from hero to zero in the space of half a season because expectations were for more. More, wins, more effort, more hope that we're heading towards PremiershipNirvana only to be left constantly disappointed. Trying to be rational and logical about why we should continue to invest our emotional capital into the club is hard to do because perception is reality and the process of kudos transference means we all feel diminished by such performances and perhaps slightly soiled by the last ten years.

Rather than throw the baby out with the metaphorical bathwater though it's important to put some perspective around where we're at.*

- Regardless what we think of the game plan or the list he inherited at the Swans from Eade or the merit of the premiership win - Roos arrival at Melbourne has managed to buy the club a state of grace in terms of rebuilding that his successor would not necessarily have had from the media or supporters. Whether another coach could have achieved more is both speculative and irrelevant.

- The fact that the same issues are recurring at an unsuccessful club (old dogs, new tricks) and we point to clubs that have gone past us with successful cultures (Port and Saints -maybe not premierships, but sustained time at the top and minimal time at the bottom in the last ten years ) should not be surprising (Why aren't supporters comparing us to Essendon or Carlton?). Changing culture is both difficult and lengthy - we've started (again) to address the issue but we've still got a lot further to go regardless of how impatient we are as supporters. Did we really know what we were celebrating when Jordan McMahon kicked 'that' goal? (Anyone that thinks yelling and screaming at the players and talking tough will fix the issue, clearly hasn't a clue)

- Irregardless of whether we think Roos is the right coach or not and regardless of win loss ratios the succession plan is already in place that will if nothing else ensure continuity in terms of the familiarity and processes with the list and the work that needs to be done.

- Both our player development and our recruitment are now light years ahead of where we've come from and perhaps atm that's more perception than reality, but judging by comments on the benefit of playing first year players like Brayshaw, Hogan, Stretch, ANB, vandenBerg and Harmes compared to the whipping boys that DL consensus doesn't want to ever see in Melbourne colours again, most would concur. Hardly a surprise that when the first year players are drop off in the second half of the year - similar to last year - so does the team.

*I don't think this makes me a Pollyanna, but clearly some supporters won't want to hear anything except fire and brimstone, plague and famine.

[Sir Why You Little 36,947]

I reckon what we are seeing is the game plan, when things happen over and over again it has to be pre- meditated or you would fix it. Skill errors are coach killers but allowing loose men in our forward 50m, protect space rather than manning up, allow your nan to always have a 5 m gap on you, if it was isolated you say players but this is how we play each week. Then we man up one week like we did at Geelong and we are a different team.

That is my issue, our best game in 8 years and the very next week we revert back to the Roos gameplan and we are garbage

Sorry mate

Roos is a much better Coach than that.

How many coaches has this list killed so far ??

The coach doesn't demand a lack of skill or to hand ball to a player in a worse situation...

That's players deciding it's all too hard...

[grazman 7,404]

Sorry mate

Roos is a much better Coach than that.

How many coaches has this list killed so far ??

The coach doesn't demand a lack of skill or to hand ball to a player in a worse situation...

That's players deciding it's all too hard...

Agree, how many times do you see the younger players on the list to look up and see their team mates in the wrong positions? How many times do you see a Melbourne player spoil their own team mate by competing for the same ball or standing too close? How many times do you see them fail to block or shepherd? How many times do you see senior players torch the ball or ignore the first option? There's still a lot of work to be done.

[Sir Why You Little 36,947]

I know one thing for sure

N Jones cannot be a long term Captain

He is not strong enough mentally to do it