When does the coach start taking the blame?

[joeboy 2,946]

Discuss

[Dockett 32 1,213]

For what? Losing a practice match?

[Bendigo Demon 115]

When he is coaching a team that he totally recruited, and has had the chance to develop them. When he isn't coaching people like Colin Garland and the like, and trying to deal with their years of incompetent coaching, poor development and shot confidence.

Paul Roos is still dealing with up to 8 years of total mismanagement of recruiting and player development. Look at Geelong. where they have guys like Enright, Bartel, Johnson and the like who lead there team on and off the field. We have nobody like that, because our recruiting and development has been so inept. That's why we have to recruit people like Lumumba, to get on and off field leadership and experience into our group.

Are we going to be better than we were last year? Yes.

Will we make the finals?- Not even close.

Will we turn over our list big time again at the end of this season? Yes we will.

It's impossible on sites like this, but we need to keep our expectations realistic. A top 10 finish would be a massive improvement for us.

[Crompton's the man 635]

When the Panic Button gets pressed

[Machsy 2,858]

When the team does something where someone should be wearing the blame?

Massive overreaction to a meaningless practice match.

[SaberFang 7,141]

Seriously?

If Roos can't get this team into shape, nobody will. It's up to the players now.

If they can't execute a premiership-winning gameplan because they aren't skilled enough, or simply lack the footy smarts to execute even the most basic decisions under pressure, that's on the players, not the coach.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

When he is coaching a team that he totally recruited, and has had the chance to develop them. When he isn't coaching people like Colin Garland and the like, and trying to deal with their years of incompetent coaching, poor development and shot confidence.

Paul Roos is still dealing with up to 8 years of total mismanagement of recruiting and player development. Look at Geelong. where they have guys like Enright, Bartel, Johnson and the like who lead there team on and off the field. We have nobody like that, because our recruiting and development has been so inept. That's why we have to recruit people like Lumumba, to get on and off field leadership and experience into our group.

Are we going to be better than we were last year? Yes.

Will we make the finals?- Not even close.

Will we turn over our list big time again at the end of this season? Yes we will.

It's impossible on sites like this, but we need to keep our expectations realistic. A top 10 finish would be a massive improvement for us.

Nicely summed up BD.

If we look at who Roos has recruited since he arrived then there isn't too much to complain about. He improved us defensively as a side, something we were awful at in the previous years, and along with PJ they have stabilised the club off the field as well.

If we look at the players who are potentially holding us back then it's easy to see that they have nothing to do with Roos.

It is also not surprising that an average NAB Cup performance has us discussing something like this before the season has even started. We are the kings of the over-reaction on here.

[P-man 13,309]

Pointless to even contemplate given that even in a scenario where he was to blame, he's handing over the reigns to someone else at the end of next year.

[Guest]

Not yet. To be honest, Roosy is in a sweet situation as he won't ever really be sacked.
I think that this is now the time for strong characters. It's good to see that the club hasn't over reacted like some on here. Sure, it wasn't a great performance but the easy thing is to carry on like Beaker from the Muppet Show as Doctor Bunsen Honeydew uses one of his crackpot inventions on him but it takes some guts to actually stay cool and look at the situation rationally and stick together.
We win 7 this year and finish up with 10-11 in Roosy's last year then I would say then he would have set the place up beautifully for Simon Goodwin. He will have left a team on the verge of finals compared to a club that was seriously in danger of not paying it's bills halfway through 2013. And no that's not hysterical. I was seriously more worried about the future of our club than at any time in our history considering the contracts we were seemingly tied into and the fact that with those administrators whose contracts we were tied to were only preventing us from recruiting quality people.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Slartibartfast 16,108]

I posted this elsewhere, but it's relevant here.

Earlier in the preseason I was shouted down when I questioned Roos and his coaching tactics but I've seen very little in the practice games that leads me to believe Roos knows how to coach a team to kick goals. It's well documented that he reduced the scores against us last year and it's now better known that we kicked the lowest average score for years. From memory we never kicked 100 points last year and scored 6 goals or less 6 times. That's pathetic however you slice it. Like everyone I hoped that with the inclusion of Hogan and Garlett, the introduction of some new mids and a year under their belt we'd see a significant improvement in our scoring capacity.

My impression is that most teams are now concentrating on fast ball movement to break zoning and the press and that this started in the middle of last year. Teams such as Richmond and Carlton who had shocking first half years in 2014 improved dramatically when they started to move the ball quicker. Brisbane punched above their weight last year to the surprise of many and they relied on fast ball movement.

The most disappointing feature of our play this preseason has been the lack of any dare. We stop, look, hesitate, kick backwards and allow the opposition to zone back and make scoring difficult. So far I'd have to say that Roos has failed to teach us to kick goals even with Hogan and Garlett added to our attack.

And just for the record this is not new to Roos. He won a premiership based on stoppage work and defense despite having a forward line containing Goodes, Hall, O'Laughlin, Davis and O'Keeffe. I just wonder if he is capable of changing his mind set. I can't help but believe we are much better than we are showing.

One of the questions is "can Roos teach a team how to kick goals". I wondered from the day he was employed. I wondered if his time out of the game had left him behind. We'll find out this year.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

I posted this elsewhere, but it's relevant here.

Earlier in the preseason I was shouted down when I questioned Roos and his coaching tactics

Why would you question it after one season? We were one of the worst defensive sides of the modern era, particularly in 2013, and Roos' mandate when he first came in to the side was to rectify this. He did that, and it was for the time being at the expense of scoring. The players needed to learn to run both ways and we achieved that somewhat.

His biggest test is ahead in terms of keeping us sound defensively while also being able to score, something that may take some time, but your questioning of his tactics was unfounded and misguided.

And don't use the NAB Cup as an example. We all know Roos sees it as nothing more than a chance to experiment. We'll all know once the season gets going.

[jazza 1,323]

When the Panic Button gets pressed

Its been pressed by some supporters already,the club has opened help lines to cure all preseason shakes.

1800imscared

1800jitteryalready

1800aroundthecornerthread.

1800belikepaul.

[FarNorthernD 5,848]

I suspect it will end up similar to the Barassi 5 year plan in the early to mid 80's where the rewards of his hard work wasn't fulfilled until the Northey era.

No matter what happened on Thursday night we are a better team than last year and the year before. Goodwin and us, as supporters, will be the beneficiaries of the Roos legacy.

[mo64 5,278]

Have to agree with Bagdad Bob. I seem to think that Roos' strategy is that if we maintain possession, the opposition don't score. Unfortunately that puts a lot of pressure on the players, because a turnover will invariably lead to an opposition score. Mark Ricciuto made a point in the Bombers game, that the players need to feel good about themselves, and playing a negative game plan, doesn't lend itself to that.

The players that we have acquired in Lumumba, Garlett and Frost, or have stepped into a starting position in the case of Salem and Hogan, all lend themselves to playing a more attacking style. Yet rarely do we see players overlapping with run to break open the game, and move the ball quickly into the forward line.

I too believe that we are underachieving under Roos.

[deanox 8,945]

The one positive for me this preseason had been our wilingness to go for the fast break and score. Hopefully we can do it more as the season goes on. The worry for me was how we struggled to clamp down when the opposition got a run on. Maybe it is sourcing between attacking and defensive mindsets that is the problem?

RE Roos I suspect he had tried to salvage what he could of the list. Then over the old duds set in old ways. Dump shine kids that were too scared. Add some experience and hope that the core middle of the list can perform with this new support.

What I saw on Friday indicated that even though we have pruned hard there is still section of the list who can't do it. Maybe the skills aren't the major problem for some of them, but the mind set is. Winning games is not something they understand and further changes are needed, more than roos thought.

[hardtack 10,186]

Discuss

In (kind of) 3 words...

Surely you're takingthepiss!

[Wiseblood 24,636]

Have to agree with Bagdad Bob. I seem to think that Roos' strategy is that if we maintain possession, the opposition don't score. Unfortunately that puts a lot of pressure on the players, because a turnover will invariably lead to an opposition score. Mark Ricciuto made a point in the Bombers game, that the players need to feel good about themselves, and playing a negative game plan, doesn't lend itself to that.

The players that we have acquired in Lumumba, Garlett and Frost, or have stepped into a starting position in the case of Salem and Hogan, all lend themselves to playing a more attacking style. Yet rarely do we see players overlapping with run to break open the game, and move the ball quickly into the forward line.

I too believe that we are underachieving under Roos.

And you are basing that on a few pre-season games?

Turn it up.

[Sideshow Bob 2,165]

Opened this expecting it to be about Hird......

[jumbo returns 6,619]

He's leaving at the end of next year anyway, so it doesn't really matter....

That's IF we survive and the AFL doesn't go bust.

[titan_uranus 23,133]

Have to agree with Bagdad Bob. I seem to think that Roos' strategy is that if we maintain possession, the opposition don't score. Unfortunately that puts a lot of pressure on the players, because a turnover will invariably lead to an opposition score. Mark Ricciuto made a point in the Bombers game, that the players need to feel good about themselves, and playing a negative game plan, doesn't lend itself to that.

The players that we have acquired in Lumumba, Garlett and Frost, or have stepped into a starting position in the case of Salem and Hogan, all lend themselves to playing a more attacking style. Yet rarely do we see players overlapping with run to break open the game, and move the ball quickly into the forward line.

I too believe that we are underachieving under Roos.

Then your expectations of where we should be are grossly inflated.

To be honest, I do think it's fair to query Roos - I don't think it's healthy to just assume that everything he does must automatically be correct. But any querying of Roos has to be done in context.

It's also kind of ironic that the main criticism of Roos, at least in this thread anyway, is our lack of attack and scoring, which to a lot people has been a clear sign from us this pre-season. It's obviously not working out for us 100% of the time, but the intent has been there, certainly more than I saw during the second half of last year.

[Demonsone 1,736]

Your kidding aren't you!

A complete change both on & of the field

Around 18 players turned over( correct me if the number is wrong)

Stopped the humiliating & embarrassing 100 pt loses

Build a strong foundation of new culture & development

All this in the 1st yr of coaching

Yeah let's starting blaming the coach!

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,603]

I'm beginning to hate his game plan.

Can someone tell me the benefits of slow inside 50 forward entries? It just gives the opposition a chance to flood our defensive 50.

It's also the most boring brand of footy I've seen from Melbourne since I first started watching them in 1990.

I'd just be kicking to Garlett one on one as fast as possible and as many times as possible.

I will give him a lot of credit though for his recruiting strategy and recruits from other clubs over the last 2 years.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Bring-Back-Powell

[Whispering_Jack 28,118]

I find myself agreeing with Bagdad Bob on this with one caveat and that is that eight days ago in the first half against the Bulldogs we were actually playing with more than our usual flair (albeit that our opponent was severely undermanned). It was exactly what many of us had been clamouring for from about halfway through last year. By then, we had demonstrated that we were able to play more defensively and on a few occasions this was translated into stirring victories such as the Crows in Adelaide and Essendon when Christian Salem scored that last gasp goal to win what should have been an unwindable game. It's worth watching the piece of play that set up the Salem goal because to me, it seemed to go against the grain of every move the team usually makes under Roos' coaching. As I said above, I expected more of it later in 2014 but we regressed and lost a couple of games that we could have won (Brisbane for one) had we taken the opposition on instead of gone completely defensive to save it.

The pre season has produced a mixed bag and I'm still puzzled as to what happened after half time last week and again this week. We seem to have gone back to the style of game that wasn't working in the latter half of last year even though we look far better equipped in terms of our personnel.

A great deal will depend on how Roos directs the team to play when the season opens in a fortnight's time. I can't complain about our recruits who can and do play attacking footy and I like Hogan and Watts up forward. A bit more run with the inclusion of JKH and Kent opens up the possibilities but we need to stop over possessing the football and start having a dip more often.

[Moonshadow 16,572]

Blame the coach for our situation, hey?

Sooooooo, tell me again how many seasons Roos has been coaching us?

Yeah, nah....

[Wiseblood 24,636]

I'm beginning to hate his game plan.

Can someone tell me the benefits of slow inside 50 forward entries? It just gives the opposition a chance to flood our defensive 50.

It's also the most boring brand of footy I've seen from Melbourne since I first started watching then in 1990.

I'd just be kicking to Garlett one on one as fast as possible and as many times as possible.

I will give him a lot of credit though for his recruiting strategy and recruits from other clubs over the last 2 years.

Are you sure about that? Think hard about this.