Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[Whispering_Jack 29,317]

Thanks.

So in summary is it right to say:

1. Any negotiated settlement between the AFL and Essendon can be overruled by WADA who can impose their own penalties including penalties on the Club and its non playing employees (which is what I read the post I initially responded to to say)
2. The ACC have powers to prosecute Essendon and its employees (and obviously Danks et al).
3. ASADA can ban the players and has little if any choice but to impose bans if they are found to have taken banned drugs.

If point three is correct, what will they do in the situation where the drugs given to players was not uniform and there are no records of which drugs were given to which people. It would be evil if Trenners got rubbed out because he was the only person to identifiably taken a banned drug and the Bomber players can't.

Point 1 - the charges brought by the AFL relate to governance issues so I'm not sure that WADA would override any outcome in the currect discussions. More likely, they would act if not satisfied with the way the ASADA final report is dealt with.However, WADA would be looking closely at the final outcome of the negotiations to determine if Essendon agreed to a charge which might come within their jurisdiction.

Point 2 - correct although technically, the prosecution is done by other bodies.

Point 3 - ASADA will issue its final report and then it will be up to the AFL to deal with any infraction notices raised as a result. WADA has the right to appeal if it considers any outcome to be incorrect and not in accordance with its code. As mentioned above, the standard of proof is not the same as in the criminal courts and circumstantial evidence can often be sufficient to sustain a charge.

[Sir Why You Little 36,725]

That Fat controllers paying our wages at the moment be careful what you wish for.

The MFC situation has nothing to do with the Essendrug case at all. Why even bring it up?

Yes we are being paid by the AFL.

What am i wishing for anyway??

I have always believed Vlad sold the Broadcasting Rights for too much.

For this very reason. Compromise.

It costs a lot to broadcast each game...a lot.

[stinga81 210]

Its compelling listening/viewing of whats been happening at AFL House the last two days, you have two of the biggest ego's going head to head. I wouldn't be surprised if its still going at 10pm tonight.

[jackaub 1,402]

So The AFL gives out a range of penalties today and the deal is done so everything goes back to normal, Essendon are trying to recover minus key personnel and draft picks. Paul Little pays the bill but needs to resign. Say six moths pass.

ASADA then contact the Essendon players with absolute proof that illegal substances were administered and they are charged.

What happens then? Another round of investigations and sanctions?

You cannot interchange illegal activities and Governance issues like they appear to be trying to do.

Edited August 27, 2013 by jackaub

[Redleg 40,326]

Rumour from local barista, that is coffee maker not lawyer, that the AFL will give final offer at 3.00PM today and Essendon and individuals, have until 5.00PM to accept, or offer is off the table and a hearing will scheduled.

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

Afl.com is spreading a rumour from the bloke making coffee for the 4 who are charged.rumour is at 3 charges and punishments brought forward and they then have two hours to decide. If not the deal is off and the courts await. Yep this is from the coffee man.

[Gorgoroth 12,748]

So The Afl gives out a range of penalties today and the deal is done so everything goes back to normal, Essendon are trying to recover minus key personnel and draft picks. Paul Little pays the bill but needs to resign. Say six moths pass.

ASADA then contact the Essendon players with absolute proof that Illegal substances were administered and they are charged.

What happens then?.

We get to dance on their graves twice!

[Whispering_Jack 29,317]

So The AFL gives out a range of penalties today and the deal is done so everything goes back to normal, Essendon are trying to recover minus key personnel and draft picks. Paul Little pays the bill but needs to resign. Say six moths pass.

ASADA then contact the Essendon players with absolute proof that illegal substances were administered and they are charged.

What happens then? Another round of investigations and sanctions?

You cannot interchange illegal activities and Governance issues like they appear to be trying to do.

The problem as I understand it is that, for the good of the game and its image, the AFL wanted Essendon out of the finals so an interim report was issued.

In an ideal world (oxymoron) they should have waited till the report was final (i.e. after the Danks interview) so that all of the issues, drug use, governance etc. could have been dealt with as one. It was reported that the legal bill all round for this currently stands at $4m. Imagine what it's going to be like if this goes on, and on and on ...

[mjt 640]

The problem as I understand it is that, for the good of the game and its image, the AFL wanted Essendon out of the finals so an interim report was issued.

In an ideal world (oxymoron) they should have waited till the report was final (i.e. after the Danks interview) so that all of the issues, drug use, governance etc. could have been dealt with as one. It was reported that the legal bill all round for this currently stands at $4m. Imagine what it's going to be like if this goes on, and on and on ...

Paul little wipes his back side with 4 million, the Bombers will take them on they have grunt, this would be killing WYL.

[DemonFrog 1,347]

We'll start with this though I , in all honesty , and not through bias , am amazed the length of suspension touted for Hird is only 12 months.. A player would under normal circumstances get 2. He has no remorse, indeed contests the guilt. I'd ban him for life and that's commensurate with bans in various codes for the most heinous of actions. This , given he's been prepared to toy god-like with lives can be nothing less than that.

Reid ought to be seriously looked at by his professional peers for his actions in not stopping what he knew to be going on ( even if not specifically ) calls into question his allegiance to his oath

Maybe a life ban will happen when he get the other pending charges.

But I agree 1 year would be a complete JOKE.

Sure a year ban is for those that joke about tanking.

[Slartibartfast 16,937]

Point 1 - the charges brought by the AFL relate to governance issues so I'm not sure that WADA would override any outcome in the currect discussions. More likely, they would act if not satisfied with the way the ASADA final report is dealt with.However, WADA would be looking closely at the final outcome of the negotiations to determine if Essendon agreed to a charge which might come within their jurisdiction.

Point 2 - correct although technically, the prosecution is done by other bodies.

Point 3 - ASADA will issue its final report and then it will be up to the AFL to deal with any infraction notices raised as a result. WADA has the right to appeal if it considers any outcome to be incorrect and not in accordance with its code. As mentioned above, the standard of proof is not the same as in the criminal courts and circumstantial evidence can often be sufficient to sustain a charge.

Thanks for the clarification. So in reality the penalties now dealing with failures of Governance are additional to anything coming from WADA/ASADA.

[Slartibartfast 16,937]

I'm surprised, that you are surprised, that I am surprised. Does that surprise you?

PS. Hope you are well, we haven't spoken for a while.

All good Redleg, sick of the footy but we all are. I'm also sick of the Essendon situation and the election campaign.

Let's hope all are sorted in a week or so.

By the way, your response didn't surprise me!

[Sir Why You Little 36,725]

Paul little wipes his back side with 4 million, the Bombers will take them on they have grunt, this would be killing WYL.

No. I will be seething if the Bummers are let off easy.

But that can't happen because Dank is yet to speak....This is up there with Breaking Bad.

[beelzebub 23,239]

Rumour from local barista, that is coffee maker not lawyer, that the AFL will give final offer at 3.00PM today and Essendon and individuals, have until 5.00PM to accept, or offer is off the table and a hearing will scheduled.

who's he bean listening to ??

[DemonFrog 1,347]

who's he bean listening to ??

Coffee the legal Drug LOL

[beelzebub 23,239]

Thanks for the clarification. So in reality the penalties now dealing with failures of Governance are additional to anything coming from WADA/ASADA.

yep...this is the prelude . This just Vlad reminding little Jimmy who runs this game. Main event comes later

[PJ_12345 1,098]

"I signed that consent form. My understanding after it being given through Bruce Reid and the club that I was receiving AOD. (I believed) that it was legal at the time and that's what I was told I was being given."

Jobe Watson

Still find it amazing that one player has admitted to having taken a banned substance yet only the club and the amigos have been charged.

Maybe I'm being too impatient... but I've still got the feeling the players are going to get let off.

The Storm played a the remainder of their season for no points after their salary cap breach, the AFL should take a page out of the NRL's book and make the EFC play for no points next year than suspending the players - and whilst they're at it, Watson should take a page out of Michael Johnson's and give back his Brownlow.

It's a tough stance but at the end of the day he won it during a year where, even he has admitted, he had taken a banned substance.

Edited August 27, 2013 by PJ_12345

[DemonWA 3,888]

Not Essendon related but does anyone know what energy/supplement drink Ahmed Saad supposedly drank to return the positive test?

[beelzebub 23,239]

"I signed that consent form. My understanding after it being given through Bruce Reid and the club that I was receiving AOD. (I believed) that it was legal at the time and that's what I was told I was being given."

Jobe Watson

Still find it amazing that one player has admitted to having taken a banned substance yet only the club and the amigos have been charged.

Maybe I'm being too impatient... but I've still got the feeling the players are going to get let off.

The Storm played a the remainder of their season for no points after their salary cap breach, the AFL should take a page out of the NRL's book and make the EFC play for no points next year than suspending the players - and whilst they're at it, Watson should take a page out of Michael Johnson's and give back his Brownlow.

It's a tough stance but at the end of the day he won it during a year where, even he has admitted, he had taken a banned substance.

The AFL are dealing with the 4 amigos/club for governance and AFL issues. WADA/ASADA will deal with players and club for use of banned substances' issues.

[Jara 1,153]

Could somebody enlighten me?

How did ASADA (and consequently everybody else) first find out about Bombers' drug regime? Anybody know who was the whistleblower?

Cheers

[daisycutter 29,427]

Coffee the legal Drug LOL

unless you are into archery or shooting - lol

[DemonWA 3,888]

Could somebody enlighten me?

How did ASADA (and consequently everybody else) first find out about Bombers' drug regime? Anybody know who was the whistleblower?

Cheers

ACC had been investigating the importation of banned substances for months in the lead up. I believe Customs noted a huge increase over the last couple of years. They knew essendon were implicated. The ACC told Vlad who then leaked it to Essendon thus the investigation being launched the day before the ACC press conference

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Could somebody enlighten me?

How did ASADA (and consequently everybody else) first find out about Bombers' drug regime? Anybody know who was the whistleblower?

Cheers

The Australian Crime Commission (ACC) was from what I can gather the first on the case.

They probably had a number of flags but all you would have to do is just follow the Dank trail from NSW. He is the Dr Ferrari of the NRL/AFL world.

[Jara 1,153]

Thanks DemonsWA

Still a bit of a mystery, though

I wonder how Customs knew that Bombers were implicated

Oh and an edited thanks to you too, PJ. I suppose Dank was the key, and maybe before him that 'Doctor Death'

[beelzebub 23,239]

I think it was Danks they were watching