Foundation Heroes

[dee-luded 2,959]

I am a Foundation Hero and remain proud of my contribution and would, if called upon, contribute again.

The basic premise of the OP is flawed and underlines why the club is in such desperate straits at the present time.

There is little doubt that the Stynes/McLardy boards must bear a measure of responsibility for the mess but it is wrong to suggest they promised us a rose garden, nor did they ever give undertakings about the success of the football team or the ongoing financial viability of the fiscal and on field train wreck they took over in 2008.

At that time the Board went to its supporters and appealed to business people, professionals and rank and file supporters for funding to help get us in the black so that we could compete with the stronger clubs in terms of facilities and amenities available for the football department to sustain improvement and betterment in that fundamental core area of its functions.

Those to who the club appealed are well aware that even the application of the most sophisticated and elaborate business models does not necessarily guarantee success and this is particularly the case with sporting models where success on the field can be so elusive and dependent on a diverse range of factors.

Further, it's a complete and utter fallacy to claim that the elimination of debt was the "the single achievement of the Stynes/McLardy Board".

That Board also established better and closer relations with the MCC and AFL, strengthened our relationship with the Casey which is a long term venture aimed at expanding our supporter base. What they have failed to do so far is bring success on the field and in fact, we have gone backwards in this area in the past two - three years.

However, I don't believe for one second that our current plight is due alone to any one factor be it the current board, Cameron Schwab, Garry Lyon, Mark Neeld or, for that matter, the playing group and some of the suggestions I've read here are disingenuous to say the least.

The cancer at the club began long before Stynes took over in 2008 although reading this and many other threads you would hardly know it. Some of the worst "culprits" in causing the situation were brought into the club by previous boards. Neale Daniher was kept on as coach for far too long. Bailey was a poor choice as coach. The records of Craig Cameron and Barry Prendergast as recruiters speak for themselves.

Cameron Schwab did not get sacked because he was "no good or because of tanking". He took the fall because the team's performance in the opening rounds of the season was abysmal and, as the CEO, he had to accept responsibility.

The team we now have is the result of a decade of second and third rate coaching, recruiting, list management and player development and financial decay. You heard it this week from Cale Morton how he was amazed at how much harder and how more intense the Eagles train compared to us. That comment reflects not only on the current coach but on previous coaches Daniher and Bailey who set poor standards during their tenures.

Then there are the negative and destructive elements around the club who had the current board in their sights from day one. I have no problem with critics (but prefer them to be constructive). The termites were boring away at the Stynes board and everything it did from the start and undermining its foundations (note that word).

When times get tough, people at most clubs close ranks. Countries at war have national unity governments.

But when our club was under fire during the tanking investigation, we had a former president at the forefront condemning us for tanking, we had disgruntled former employees coming forward and giving their jaundiced versions of what happened. Mark Neeld was undermined in the same way in his first weeks. So called supporters went to the media with stories calculated to undermine the club, falsely describing Cameron Schwab as looking "ashen faced", others telling convoluted tales about what the coach's moves during games like the Swans game at Manuka so that they could be blown out of all proportion. Others just praised Caroline Wilson urging her to keep up the good job when what she was doing was sniping at and undermining our club.

I find that reprehensible. When Caroline Wilson bags Brayshaw the whole of the North community gets behind him. The Carlton people close ranks around their club when Libba called the club for tanking and even Libba himself was forced to recant under pressure. We have supporters who like to open the wound and let it fester but are nowhere to be seen at an AGM where they can get the message across to the membership and the board.

Ultimately, if we want to see the club succeed, we are all responsible and therefore, if we're able to give then I consider it a duty to do so and I'm not concerned about those on board, particularly with the changes that will undeniably come following the recent interventions.

As one great philosopher said, "Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards."

Too much of what's going on around the club and too much talk among the supporters is all about negativity and looking backwards. We need to take on board the mistakes of the past and then look forward and act together to rebuild our foundations. That's what being a Foundation Hero means to me.

totally Jack...

IMO the MCG appeal causes too much political desperation of aspirants with over inflated opinions of themselves... This, IMO, is one of the bigger causes of our demise over the generations.

... the sooner we can move our Offices & Board,,, Away from the 'G', & its attractiveness of self centred, motivated types, who want the plum roles within the home of sport, the sooner the MelbourneFC, will become a Footy Club again....

run this organisation as a Footy Club again...... & bring the Dees supporters, back into the fold.

.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

I am a Foundation Hero and remain proud of my contribution and would, if called upon, contribute again.

The basic premise of the OP is flawed and underlines why the club is in such desperate straits at the present time.

There is little doubt that the Stynes/McLardy boards must bear a measure of responsibility for the mess but it is wrong to suggest they promised us a rose garden, nor did they ever give undertakings about the success of the football team or the ongoing financial viability of the fiscal and on field train wreck they took over in 2008.

At that time the Board went to its supporters and appealed to business people, professionals and rank and file supporters for funding to help get us in the black so that we could compete with the stronger clubs in terms of facilities and amenities available for the football department to sustain improvement and betterment in that fundamental core area of its functions.

Those to who the club appealed are well aware that even the application of the most sophisticated and elaborate business models does not necessarily guarantee success and this is particularly the case with sporting models where success on the field can be so elusive and dependent on a diverse range of factors.

Further, it's a complete and utter fallacy to claim that the elimination of debt was the "the single achievement of the Stynes/McLardy Board".

That Board also established better and closer relations with the MCC and AFL, strengthened our relationship with the Casey which is a long term venture aimed at expanding our supporter base. What they have failed to do so far is bring success on the field and in fact, we have gone backwards in this area in the past two - three years.

However, I don't believe for one second that our current plight is due alone to any one factor be it the current board, Cameron Schwab, Garry Lyon, Mark Neeld or, for that matter, the playing group and some of the suggestions I've read here are disingenuous to say the least.

The cancer at the club began long before Stynes took over in 2008 although reading this and many other threads you would hardly know it. Some of the worst "culprits" in causing the situation were brought into the club by previous boards. Neale Daniher was kept on as coach for far too long. Bailey was a poor choice as coach. The records of Craig Cameron and Barry Prendergast as recruiters speak for themselves.

Cameron Schwab did not get sacked because he was "no good or because of tanking". He took the fall because the team's performance in the opening rounds of the season was abysmal and, as the CEO, he had to accept responsibility.

The team we now have is the result of a decade of second and third rate coaching, recruiting, list management and player development and financial decay. You heard it this week from Cale Morton how he was amazed at how much harder and how more intense the Eagles train compared to us. That comment reflects not only on the current coach but on previous coaches Daniher and Bailey who set poor standards during their tenures.

Then there are the negative and destructive elements around the club who had the current board in their sights from day one. I have no problem with critics (but prefer them to be constructive). The termites were boring away at the Stynes board and everything it did from the start and undermining its foundations (note that word). When times get tough, people at most clubs close ranks. Countries at war have national unity governments.

But when our club was under fire during the tanking investigation, we had a former president at the forefront condemning us for tanking, we had disgruntled former employees coming forward and giving their jaundiced versions of what happened. Mark Neeld was undermined in the same way in his first weeks. So called supporters went to the media with stories calculated to undermine the club, falsely describing Cameron Schwab as looking "ashen faced", others telling convoluted tales about what the coach's moves during games like the Swans game at Manuka so that they could be blown out of all proportion. Others just praised Caroline Wilson urging her to keep up the good job when what she was doing was sniping at and undermining our club.

I find that reprehensible. When Caroline Wilson bags Brayshaw the whole of the North community gets behind him. The Carlton people close ranks around their club when Libba called the club for tanking and even Libba himself was forced to recant under pressure. We have supporters who like to open the wound and let it fester but are nowhere to be seen at an AGM where they can get the message across to the membership and the board.

Ultimately, if we want to see the club succeed, we are all responsible and therefore, if we're able to give then I consider it a duty to do so and I'm not concerned about those on board, particularly with the changes that will undeniably come following the recent interventions.

As one great philosopher said, "Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards."

Too much of what's going on around the club and too much talk among the supporters is all about negativity and looking backwards. We need to take on board the mistakes of the past and then look forward and act together to rebuild our foundations. That's what being a Foundation Hero means to me.

WJ, as usual, a very eloquent post from you.

I acknowledge that much of what you said is true. I gave to this Club, because I live red and blue. I know that sounds cliche and I do not want to be trite about this. I grew up in the northern suburbs, in a working class family, surrounded by Collingwood and Essendon supporters. My 4 older brothers barracked for Collingwood. I was anything but the stereotypical Melbourne supporter, so often portrayed and lampooned in the media. I followed my late father, who, having been born and bred in Sydney and somewhat of a renegade himself, refused to bow to the pressure of his peers and chose to support the team that carried the name of his adopted city and home. I still have fond memories of him somehow cadging a couple of tickets for the 1964 Grand Final. That epic day ensured that I would remain a Demon for life.

As I suspect you did, I witnessed the quick demise of a dynasty from 1965 onwards. I lived through the excruciating '70's and the lean early to mid 80's, but the embers of my passion, like many of us, were re-kindled by the inspiration of Swooper Northey, the deeds of a young Irishman and a list of players who were by no means over endowed with talent, but played for each other, the jumper, their coach and the MFC. These blokes brought pride back to the club, despite the fact that they had to ply their trade with less than satisfactory facilities. To be a Demons supporter means you understand tragedy and irony. A modicum of masochism doesn't go astray either. But we push on. I have sat in the Southern Stand, the old Olympic stand, which, for all of its ugliness, by the time it was demolished, gave me such fond memories. I felt the spirt of Norm Smith, Ron Barassi, Hassa Mann, Bluey Adams, Johnny Townsend, Froggy Crompton, Brian Dixon, Wrecker Leahy, Ray Groom, John Lord; the list goes on. I have sat in the old smokers stand as well and the new members. Of course, while we might yearn for better days, we can't live in the past. But over all those days and contrary to the urban myth, I have learned that our supporters come from all walks of life and are as passionate about their footy club as any other.

And so it is with the Foundation Heroes. We come from all walks of life, but bonded by a desire to see our beloved footy club pull itself out of the mire of mediocrity. Some could afford to pay more than others, but the motivation to give had the same value and currency. On that first night in Kensington, we were provided with a plan; a vision for the future. We believed again and felt a sense of unity and confidence that had been missing for so long. While we accepted that the path forward would not be a short one and was likely to have twists and turns, if not detours, we believed we indeed were going forward. While we give freely, we also entrust those to whom we give our money. As such, the beneficiaries have a fiduciary responsibility to keep safe that trust.

Your observations regarding personal vendattas aimed at the current administration, targetted leaks, public criticism by former officer bearers/players and general destructive critiques of the club have veracity. However, in my view, we, faced with doing business in an increasingly more competitive and cut throat environment, have never been lower. While I agree, any changes which are made need to be carefully planned and implemented, to save even further destabilisation, in my view change is needed and the change must be extensive, or we risk our very existence.

Like you, I will give to this footy club again. My conscience (heart) would not let me do otherwise. However, neither you, nor I can guarantee that our confrere's will turn up and give in the same numbers as previously. The most important lesson in any business is that you look after your existing clients, as it is cheaper than trying to attract new ones. That is just marketing 101.

Go you Demons!!!!

[Slartibartfast 17,635]

Well the good news is that the generosity of the members and FH who helped in the past seems to continue and their goodwill not diminished. My only comment on that front is many have said they would contribute again given the assurances of good financial management. That, of course, is what we were promised last time.

Further, it's a complete and utter fallacy to claim that the elimination of debt was the "the single achievement of the Stynes/McLardy Board".

That Board also established better and closer relations with the MCC and AFL, strengthened our relationship with the Casey which is a long term venture aimed at expanding our supporter base. What they have failed to do so far is bring success on the field and in fact, we have gone backwards in this area in the past two - three years.

Whilst my intention was to gauge the mood of those who so generously gave in the past WJ has extended the scope of the discussion. His claims of achievement whilst modest are also misguided IMO.

Our relationship with the AFL must be at an all time low. Despite the receipt of several priority draft picks, generous hand outs and better stadium deals, all provided by the AFL we find ourselves the runt of the competition and a concern to all. Even Eddie want to help us with an additional salary cap. The AFL have been forced to put in an administrator to fix us because we were unable to do that ourselves. Not only that but we've been found guilty of bringing the AFL into disrepute and everyone other than a few believed we tanked. We also threatened to take the AFL to court and probably caused them significant legal costs. Add to that we, in their eyes at least, were not fully open about our dealings with Danks and I'm sure we'd be the first club they'd send a Christmas card to. We don't have a relationship with the AFL at the moment beyond doing what they say.

Our relationship with Casey is awful. They hate us because we pull our good players at finals time and we hate them because they don't do anything we ask - Fevola is a terrific example. Add to the fact we've got a 20 years agreement with a club that habitually doesn't pay its bills and looks to us for financial assistance and you can imagine what a jolly time the two Boards have when they get together. And whilst the intention was to establish a presence in the area and expand our membership there is no evidence of that happening.

That leaves the MCC. The relationship may be better but as Jack Little would say "all I can say is WOW".

In retrospect the premise of my comment about wiping out debt is probably wrong anyway as we appear headed to significant seven figure losses over the next couple of years. Perhaps the single achievement of this Board is a better relationship with the MCC.

And then of course there are the "faceless men", those evil doers who have undermined the club. Of course what is never stated is they need oxygen to undermine the club and this Board has provided so much. The reality is the faceless men seem to have been right all along and their efforts to replace Schwab well based. As Jackson said, the club was dysfunctional with up to four people from the FD reporting to Schwab. Even more damning was his comment that "it's not a hard fix, it's just not a quick fix". It's hard to imagine a more damning comment.

The bottom line is our product is football. It's the Boards job to govern a Club that can produce good football and see us financially secure. On both counts this Board is a complete failure with arguably no redeeming attributes.

[deanox 9,989]

That's a disappointing post BB. You are so despondent and so bitter and see the worst case scenario in everything you have mentioned. Earlier today another poster suggested than in reality issues probably sit somewhere between the two extremes, a view you should consider.

It is emotionally hard following the club right now but stick at it. Unless you are going to put up your hand you need to trust in the leaders we have elected, or at worst trust in the leadership of Peter Jackson.

As a club we'll pull through this but if we fracture we will fall. If you want to see the good times again you need to support the club in whatever ways you can in the bad times.

Edited May 30, 2013 by deanox

[Fitz Fitzpatrick 886]

I am a Foundation Hero and remain proud of my contribution and would, if called upon, contribute again.

The basic premise of the OP is flawed and underlines why the club is in such desperate straits at the present time.

There is little doubt that the Stynes/McLardy boards must bear a measure of responsibility for the mess but it is wrong to suggest they promised us a rose garden, nor did they ever give undertakings about the success of the football team or the ongoing financial viability of the fiscal and on field train wreck they took over in 2008.

At that time the Board went to its supporters and appealed to business people, professionals and rank and file supporters for funding to help get us in the black so that we could compete with the stronger clubs in terms of facilities and amenities available for the football department to sustain improvement and betterment in that fundamental core area of its functions.

Those to who the club appealed are well aware that even the application of the most sophisticated and elaborate business models does not necessarily guarantee success and this is particularly the case with sporting models where success on the field can be so elusive and dependent on a diverse range of factors.

Further, it's a complete and utter fallacy to claim that the elimination of debt was the "the single achievement of the Stynes/McLardy Board".

That Board also established better and closer relations with the MCC and AFL, strengthened our relationship with the Casey which is a long term venture aimed at expanding our supporter base. What they have failed to do so far is bring success on the field and in fact, we have gone backwards in this area in the past two - three years.

However, I don't believe for one second that our current plight is due alone to any one factor be it the current board, Cameron Schwab, Garry Lyon, Mark Neeld or, for that matter, the playing group and some of the suggestions I've read here are disingenuous to say the least.

The cancer at the club began long before Stynes took over in 2008 although reading this and many other threads you would hardly know it. Some of the worst "culprits" in causing the situation were brought into the club by previous boards. Neale Daniher was kept on as coach for far too long. Bailey was a poor choice as coach. The records of Craig Cameron and Barry Prendergast as recruiters speak for themselves.

Cameron Schwab did not get sacked because he was "no good or because of tanking". He took the fall because the team's performance in the opening rounds of the season was abysmal and, as the CEO, he had to accept responsibility.

The team we now have is the result of a decade of second and third rate coaching, recruiting, list management and player development and financial decay. You heard it this week from Cale Morton how he was amazed at how much harder and how more intense the Eagles train compared to us. That comment reflects not only on the current coach but on previous coaches Daniher and Bailey who set poor standards during their tenures.

Then there are the negative and destructive elements around the club who had the current board in their sights from day one. I have no problem with critics (but prefer them to be constructive). The termites were boring away at the Stynes board and everything it did from the start and undermining its foundations (note that word). When times get tough, people at most clubs close ranks. Countries at war have national unity governments.

But when our club was under fire during the tanking investigation, we had a former president at the forefront condemning us for tanking, we had disgruntled former employees coming forward and giving their jaundiced versions of what happened. Mark Neeld was undermined in the same way in his first weeks. So called supporters went to the media with stories calculated to undermine the club, falsely describing Cameron Schwab as looking "ashen faced", others telling convoluted tales about what the coach's moves during games like the Swans game at Manuka so that they could be blown out of all proportion. Others just praised Caroline Wilson urging her to keep up the good job when what she was doing was sniping at and undermining our club.

I find that reprehensible. When Caroline Wilson bags Brayshaw the whole of the North community gets behind him. The Carlton people close ranks around their club when Libba called the club for tanking and even Libba himself was forced to recant under pressure. We have supporters who like to open the wound and let it fester but are nowhere to be seen at an AGM where they can get the message across to the membership and the board.

Ultimately, if we want to see the club succeed, we are all responsible and therefore, if we're able to give then I consider it a duty to do so and I'm not concerned about those on board, particularly with the changes that will undeniably come following the recent interventions.

As one great philosopher said, "Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards."

Too much of what's going on around the club and too much talk among the supporters is all about negativity and looking backwards. We need to take on board the mistakes of the past and then look forward and act together to rebuild our foundations. That's what being a Foundation Hero means to me.

This is why i feel MFC will never achieve lofty heights and will continue to just keep its head above water. your post illustrates exactly my thoughts that a club can only be as strong as its core of supporters/members. as a whole im afrais to say, MFCs membership/supporter base is very weak and fractured. this hasnt happened overnight but it is what it is and will take generations to change, if ever. every club has its own personality. As you say, Nths members rallied around brayshaw. (one of hundreds of examples). Our clubs "personality" just isnt like that. a supporter base is a living breathing beast. ours has severe personality flaws. individually we all want whats best for the club but as a whole we are a weak and divided club. MFC will find it impossible to move forward as every time it hits a rough patch the members will struggle to deal with it properly. i cant ever seeing this changing. its taken a process of decades or longer to be created. We are what we are.

[Redleg 41,497]

Well the good news is that the generosity of the members and FH who helped in the past seems to continue and their goodwill not diminished. My only comment on that front is many have said they would contribute again given the assurances of good financial management. That, of course, is what we were promised last time.

Whilst my intention was to gauge the mood of those who so generously gave in the past WJ has extended the scope of the discussion. His claims of achievement whilst modest are also misguided IMO.

Our relationship with the AFL must be at an all time low. Despite the receipt of several priority draft picks, generous hand outs and better stadium deals, all provided by the AFL we find ourselves the runt of the competition and a concern to all. Even Eddie want to help us with an additional salary cap. The AFL have been forced to put in an administrator to fix us because we were unable to do that ourselves. Not only that but we've been found guilty of bringing the AFL into disrepute and everyone other than a few believed we tanked. We also threatened to take the AFL to court and probably caused them significant legal costs. Add to that we, in their eyes at least, were not fully open about our dealings with Danks and I'm sure we'd be the first club they'd send a Christmas card to. We don't have a relationship with the AFL at the moment beyond doing what they say.

Our relationship with Casey is awful. They hate us because we pull our good players at finals time and we hate them because they don't do anything we ask - Fevola is a terrific example. Add to the fact we've got a 20 years agreement with a club that habitually doesn't pay its bills and looks to us for financial assistance and you can imagine what a jolly time the two Boards have when they get together. And whilst the intention was to establish a presence in the area and expand our membership there is no evidence of that happening.

That leaves the MCC. The relationship may be better but as Jack Little would say "all I can say is WOW".

In retrospect the premise of my comment about wiping out debt is probably wrong anyway as we appear headed to significant seven figure losses over the next couple of years. Perhaps the single achievement of this Board is a better relationship with the MCC.

And then of course there are the "faceless men", those evil doers who have undermined the club. Of course what is never stated is they need oxygen to undermine the club and this Board has provided so much. The reality is the faceless men seem to have been right all along and their efforts to replace Schwab well based. As Jackson said, the club was dysfunctional with up to four people from the FD reporting to Schwab. Even more damning was his comment that "it's not a hard fix, it's just not a quick fix". It's hard to imagine a more damning comment.

The bottom line is our product is football. It's the Boards job to govern a Club that can produce good football and see us financially secure. On both counts this Board is a complete failure with arguably no redeeming attributes.

BB, could you refresh my memory on the several priority draft picks you mentioned we got. I can recall the T$ one and I am not sure if Sylivia was one, but can't recall any others.

Also, don't the generous handouts go to several clubs, including the Visy mob and aren't they to do with some sort of equalization, because of poor fixtures generously handed out by the AFL.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Redleg

[Slartibartfast 17,635]

BB, could you refresh my memory on the several priority draft picks you mentioned we got. I can recall the T$ one and I am not sure if Sylivia was one, but can't recall any others.

Also, don't the generous handouts go to several clubs, including the Visy mob and aren't they to do with some sort of equalization, because of poor fixtures generously handed out by the AFL.

Blease was a PP in 2008 ND. That allowed us the first two in 2009.

Yes, the handouts go to several clubs but we receive the third highest amount and of course we will be a significant recipient when the new compensation arrangements that are being discussed are finalized. The terrible fixture we got this year which has seen us with only our first home game against a Melbourne based team this weekend is evidence of the regard the AFL hold us.

I absolutely agree that the compensation we receive from the AFL is justified but that doesn't change the fact that it's been squandered. How much has the termination of Schwab, Neeld (to come) and bringing the AFL into disrepute cost? IMO with reasonable management all of that could have been avoided. And lets not talk about the opportunity cost of our performances under this FD.

The mind boggles.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Baghdad Bob

[Redleg 41,497]

Blease was a PP in 2008 ND. That allowed us the first two in 2009.

Yes, the handouts go to several clubs but we receive the third highest amount and of course we will be a significant recipient when the new compensation arrangements that are being discussed are finalized. The terrible fixture we got this year which has seen us with only our first home game against a Melbourne based team this weekend is evidence of the regard the AFL hold us.

I absolutely agree that the compensation we receive from the AFL is justified but that doesn't change the fact that it's been squandered. How much has the termination of Schwab, Neeld (to come) and bringing the AFL into disrepute cost? IMO with reasonable management all of that could have been avoided. And lets not talk about the opportunity cost of our performances under this FD.

The mind boggles.

To be fair and do an analysis of the PP's we have had, Sylvia is still with us and is a fair player, Blease is not a failure yet and if he can get his engine up, could be good and T$ is the second highest paid player in the AFL and was pinched from us by the lure of an astronomical amount of AFL funded money and a disgusting new AFL rule. . I don't think anyone could argue we have stuffed up our PP's.

As for the rest of our drafting, it has been abysmal and you know how angry I am with BP.

[IvanBartul13 2,564]

To be fair and do an analysis of the PP's we have had, Sylvia is still with us and is a fair player, Blease is not a failure yet and if he can get his engine up, could be good and T$ is the second highest paid player in the AFL and was pinched from us by the lure of an astronomical amount of AFL funded money and a disgusting new AFL rule. . I don't think anyone could argue we have stuffed up our PP's.

As for the rest of our drafting, it has been abysmal and you know how angry I am with BP.

Important to remember we've parlayed the Scully PP into Hogan, Barry, one of Chris Dawes' appendages and perhaps the passage of Viney to the second round. At this point, relative to other decisons, that is bordering on Genius.

Edited May 30, 2013 by goodoil

[Slartibartfast 17,635]

That's a disappointing post BB. You are so despondent and so bitter and see the worst case scenario in everything you have mentioned.

Deanox I see what I see. I am angry because we've again failed to take our chance but I'm not without hope.

IMO the players aren't as bad as the FD are making them look. A new coach, some hope, one or two imports and we're ok. But we need to attract a Board and CEO who regularly make good decisions.

This Board and our previous CEO made terrible decisions regularly. I don't think we'll improve until that changes and thankfully we are now so low that the AFL has stepped in to save us from ourselves.

That's very good and cause for optimism, in the longer term, for me at least.

[Whispering_Jack 30,682]

... as Jack Little would say "all I can say is WOW"...

How sad.

[Redleg 41,497]

Important to remember we've parlayed the Scully PP into Hogan, Barry, one of Chris Dawes' appendages and perhaps the passage of Viney to the second round. At this point, relative to other decisons, that is bordering on Genius.

I understand that, but I was referring to the actual players we got as PP's. It has been suggested in the media that because we stuffed up our PP's we shouldn't get more. I was demonstrating that we actually haven't.

[Redleg 41,497]

IMO the players aren't as bad as the FD are making them look. A new coach, some hope, one or two imports and we're ok.

That's very good and cause for optimism, in the longer term, for me at least.

Agree. Perhaps that should read 4-5 imports.

[IvanBartul13 2,564]

I understand that, but I was referring to the actual players we got as PP's. It has been suggested in the media that because we stuffed up our PP's we shouldn't get more. I was demonstrating that we actually haven't.

...I was actually supporting not countering what you said.

Edited May 30, 2013 by goodoil

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Deanox I see what I see. I am angry because we've again failed to take our chance but I'm not without hope.

IMO the players aren't as bad as the FD are making them look. A new coach, some hope, one or two imports and we're ok. But we need to attract a Board and CEO who regularly make good decisions.

This Board and our previous CEO made terrible decisions regularly. I don't think we'll improve until that changes and thankfully we are now so low that the AFL has stepped in to save us from ourselves.

That's very good and cause for optimism, in the longer term, for me at least.

The Board have indeed made some ordinary decisions, but so did the board before that and the board before that, at least as we look down the barrel of a seven figure loss, we aren't carrying Gardiners $5m deficit with us as well.

[Tricky 341]

I am a Foundation Hero and remain proud of my contribution and would, if called upon, contribute again.

The basic premise of the OP is flawed and underlines why the club is in such desperate straits at the present time.

There is little doubt that the Stynes/McLardy boards must bear a measure of responsibility for the mess but it is wrong to suggest they promised us a rose garden, nor did they ever give undertakings about the success of the football team or the ongoing financial viability of the fiscal and on field train wreck they took over in 2008.

At that time the Board went to its supporters and appealed to business people, professionals and rank and file supporters for funding to help get us in the black so that we could compete with the stronger clubs in terms of facilities and amenities available for the football department to sustain improvement and betterment in that fundamental core area of its functions.

Those to who the club appealed are well aware that even the application of the most sophisticated and elaborate business models does not necessarily guarantee success and this is particularly the case with sporting models where success on the field can be so elusive and dependent on a diverse range of factors.

Further, it's a complete and utter fallacy to claim that the elimination of debt was the "the single achievement of the Stynes/McLardy Board".

That Board also established better and closer relations with the MCC and AFL, strengthened our relationship with the Casey which is a long term venture aimed at expanding our supporter base. What they have failed to do so far is bring success on the field and in fact, we have gone backwards in this area in the past two - three years.

However, I don't believe for one second that our current plight is due alone to any one factor be it the current board, Cameron Schwab, Garry Lyon, Mark Neeld or, for that matter, the playing group and some of the suggestions I've read here are disingenuous to say the least.

The cancer at the club began long before Stynes took over in 2008 although reading this and many other threads you would hardly know it. Some of the worst "culprits" in causing the situation were brought into the club by previous boards. Neale Daniher was kept on as coach for far too long. Bailey was a poor choice as coach. The records of Craig Cameron and Barry Prendergast as recruiters speak for themselves.

Cameron Schwab did not get sacked because he was "no good or because of tanking". He took the fall because the team's performance in the opening rounds of the season was abysmal and, as the CEO, he had to accept responsibility.

The team we now have is the result of a decade of second and third rate coaching, recruiting, list management and player development and financial decay. You heard it this week from Cale Morton how he was amazed at how much harder and how more intense the Eagles train compared to us. That comment reflects not only on the current coach but on previous coaches Daniher and Bailey who set poor standards during their tenures.

Then there are the negative and destructive elements around the club who had the current board in their sights from day one. I have no problem with critics (but prefer them to be constructive). The termites were boring away at the Stynes board and everything it did from the start and undermining its foundations (note that word). When times get tough, people at most clubs close ranks. Countries at war have national unity governments.

But when our club was under fire during the tanking investigation, we had a former president at the forefront condemning us for tanking, we had disgruntled former employees coming forward and giving their jaundiced versions of what happened. Mark Neeld was undermined in the same way in his first weeks. So called supporters went to the media with stories calculated to undermine the club, falsely describing Cameron Schwab as looking "ashen faced", others telling convoluted tales about what the coach's moves during games like the Swans game at Manuka so that they could be blown out of all proportion. Others just praised Caroline Wilson urging her to keep up the good job when what she was doing was sniping at and undermining our club.

I find that reprehensible. When Caroline Wilson bags Brayshaw the whole of the North community gets behind him. The Carlton people close ranks around their club when Libba called the club for tanking and even Libba himself was forced to recant under pressure. We have supporters who like to open the wound and let it fester but are nowhere to be seen at an AGM where they can get the message across to the membership and the board.

Ultimately, if we want to see the club succeed, we are all responsible and therefore, if we're able to give then I consider it a duty to do so and I'm not concerned about those on board, particularly with the changes that will undeniably come following the recent interventions.

As one great philosopher said, "Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards."

Too much of what's going on around the club and too much talk among the supporters is all about negativity and looking backwards. We need to take on board the mistakes of the past and then look forward and act together to rebuild our foundations. That's what being a Foundation Hero means to me.

Bravo

[Adam The God 30,427]

This is why i feel MFC will never achieve lofty heights and will continue to just keep its head above water. your post illustrates exactly my thoughts that a club can only be as strong as its core of supporters/members. as a whole im afrais to say, MFCs membership/supporter base is very weak and fractured. this hasnt happened overnight but it is what it is and will take generations to change, if ever. every club has its own personality. As you say, Nths members rallied around brayshaw. (one of hundreds of examples). Our clubs "personality" just isnt like that. a supporter base is a living breathing beast. ours has severe personality flaws. individually we all want whats best for the club but as a whole we are a weak and divided club. MFC will find it impossible to move forward as every time it hits a rough patch the members will struggle to deal with it properly. i cant ever seeing this changing. its taken a process of decades or longer to be created. We are what we are.

Mark Neeld everybody. Welcome to the party.

To be frank, I think it's a pretty weak sentiment to proffer too. "It is what it is"? We must be inclusive of all types and handle our business and footy club in a way that is courteous to all involved. That way we don't leave ourselves open to potential fracturing and those with vendettas. Case in point, the way Bailey's sacking was handled.

It is not blind trust, but hope that fills me with the confidence to believe PJ will start us off on the right path.

[What 18,810]

god bless Whispering Jack and the other foundation heroes

When the MFC is back in business, and playing finals I will personally seek out WJ and other foundation heroes and thank them in person

[Barney Rubble 1,576]

I personally think that us run of the mill supporters owe a lot to the Foundation Heroes.

If it wasn't for their generosity, we wouldn't be in existence as an MFC team.

We would be completely run by the AFL like GWS, what a sad indictment that would be on a club that started this great game.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Chippy

[rpfc 28,781]

BB - you were angling for someone to push this 'oh-so-noble' thread into your well-worn feelings on the current board and it's issues.

Bravo. WJ took the bait and you caught him. Although he is far to eloquent to be gutted once caught.

Just let it be - I tire of these conversations. McLardy will go at the end of the season I am sure of it. The board will remain with a couple of changes because we cannot afford to just spurn and burn impressive people willing to put in for the club.

The AFL has parachuted in someone to provide some 'best practice' and we all hope that we can attract a coach of high standing to galvanise supporters, appease sponsors, and provide confidence to the players.

That is where we are at right now - the AFL is holding our hand.

But it does mean that the MFC will soon be unquestionably AFL-approved and on a track that head office endorses.

Let's move on?

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

The fact is we need the AFL's protection for now.

Undoubtedly the media launched an agenda at us but unfortunately they were right and every move we made seem to make things worse. The great thing about footy though is win games and people quickly change their tune.

But for now AFL protection helps us win the public relations battle. The sports media are a blood lusting lot, you only need to look at Caroline Wilson's attack on Eddie McGuire today to see the lengths they'll go to for a spill of blood. Do a 100 good things and one bad and you are out the door according to her, she must be some saint.

[Redleg 41,497]

...I was actually supporting not countering what you said.

Sorry I misunderstood. Then I agree with your support.

[Redleg 41,497]

BB I am saddened to admit this, but I now accept that this Board, like many others before it, made some terrible decisions. I agree with you that PJ is the lifeline and clearly the conduit to help via the AFL.

If we play our cards right from here and limit mistakes, we can recover pretty quickly IMO, with the help of the AFL.

[Pates 9,660]

Some of the feelings on here have been very well said, especially WJ's. I haven't read OP but I would assume that the point was to ask whether the FH who have given so generously to get us out of debt will be as willing now that we've got ourselves back in that hole we took so long to crawl out of.

I'm not a FH but I donate to the fund around $100 every year, and I will do so again this year. Not because I support the board but because I support the club and will do what I can to see it succeed again.

Turning away IMO does nothing for the club, it will only serves to make the issue about yourself and not the bigger picture. Stupid and irrational as this sounds, I would rather support a disfunctional and failing club, then turn my back them. And that is not a shot at those who can't take it anymore, I'm 26 there are those that have been through more and can't handle it.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

There's some very well written stuff on this thread. Well done in particular to Whispering Jack, Baghdad Bob and I'va Worn Smith.

Intelligent and beyond the superficial, angst-driven knee-jerk criticisms on some other threads.