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Six and his Camera travelled down the highway in the hope that it might be open session. Alas not, until the back gate was opened for Gawny, Gus and a few others to head over to one of the other ovals for some special training. I took the opportunity to meander on in for a closer look but was swiftly told to stop taking pictures, go figure. So, I headed back out behind the fence a took a few more. Enjoy ==> https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-h9VFff/i-MLzjBHb/A A few more from Thursday = >https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-h9VFff/i-KdGnrDT/A

I thought I’d add that David Hussey told me many months ago that he asked Alex & Jack Viney to talk to the VIC cricket squad mid last year and he told me that Alex spoke so exceptionally well that he could never recall a more impressive young sportsman address a group. He told me went straight up to Alex and told him how impressed he was and that he has an outstanding career in sport leadership, management awaiting if he so chooses.

Further update as the club returns to preseason training without Clayton Oliver who remains on medical leave with the club saying that "our primary focus is Clayton’s overall wellbeing." The club also advises: "Clayton has been working extremely closely with his personal medical team, and with the support of key club staff, in order to manage these challenges." Clayton Oliver taking extended personal leave, misses preseason with Melbourne We all wish Clarry all the best for a speedy return but we can say that, according to Irene on The Mighty Demons Facebook Page, he has been running with a mate at the Tan. When she bumped into him yesterday, he “looked fit and in good spirits”. She said “hello” and “Go Dees” and he was very friendly and we echo her thoughts ~ “Fingers crossed he can get back on track and be the player we all love! ❤️💙”

It’s got absolutely nothing to do with its proximity to mine. I’ve done the six-hour round trip on public transport numerous times and would be happy to *continue doing so if it was a good ground FOR SPECTATORS, but it’s not. There’s seating for only 300 people, and that’s in the sole stand which is reserved for players’ families and friends. So effectively, zero seating. There’s no protection from the gale force winds. There’s not a nearby train station. There’s no shops and/or pubs, eateries nearby. And the biggest problem is that spectators can’t get close enough to watch training. Therefore, for spectators… it sucks. *that said, I’ll continue to make the trek there for our W matches, especially since the girls hate playing there and would sooner play at Ikon. Having a decent crowd makes it less sh!ttty for them.

Things are never as good as they seem and (despite what many on Demonland will portray) things are never as bad as they seem. It doesn’t take much to impact your chances coming in to finals as we’ve seen in 23 and sometimes taking a step back or injury to a key player nets you a piece or two in the jigsaw or exposes a player to greater responsibility which after a while creates what came only a few seasons ago That is why it’s a fascinating game

This is good, and i think well over due - ie the club coming out and putting Clarry 'on extended leave to deal with his ongoing health issues'. Without getting into the specifics of his issues and what is happening for Clarry the absolute right approach by the club is taking a health focused approach - for Clarry, the team and fans. Making it clear he is on extended leave takes some of the pressure off, allows fans to recalibrate and come to terms with the likelihood we won't see him in the team for a while. But perhaps even more importantly it means the rest of the team can focus on their own preparation without some of the fugazi. Easy to forget i reckon how stressful and unhelpful this has all been on his teammates, particularly those who have been long term mates such as tracc and Salo. Personally i'm approaching the situation like Clarry had an ACL last season. He's out, he's not coming anytime soon and it's not clear how long it will be before he does come back. I'm sending positive vibes Clarry's way and wish him nothing but the best.

Salo looks in ripping nick. A fit and firing Salem will be a huge fillip.

Because it provides a narrative for Footballing journalists to discuss and fill content Nothing else FFS they closed the Cats window more times in the last decade than the Montague St bridge

I really believe that we're set up well for the next 5 or 6 years So we're not falling off the perch if we don't win this years flag First of all, you have to get into contention, then, on the law of averages, you can't expect to win every time you're in contention So we've been in contention 3 times now unless we want to count 2018 as well I'll take 1 in 3 any day of the week as there are usually 4 or 5 teams that can win it most seasons And I don't believe in a cut-off 5 year window either although the 5 year plan makes sense (the 5 year plan that keeps getting revamped) So 6 more years of contending can deliver us 2 more flags (if we're being realistic) I'll take that in a heartbeat as for a long time I couldn't see us winning 1 flag anytime soon And we're going to need a good dose of luck as well (you always do in order to win big e.g. 2021 we had a virtual injury free season) The Cats won it all in 2011 and were then in contention at least 8 times in the next 11 years until they won again. And for the most part, they had very good teams and good coaching all the way through Flags are hard to win And if you get a run of injuries to key personnel at the wrong time of the year, your hopes can be dashed So you go again and look ahead

We were an Angus Brayshaw away from a flag imo. If he didn’t get KO’d, then Laurie wouldn’t have played nearly 4 quarters (plus Gus is way better for our structures than BL). Wed have rolled the Giants, and I dare say the Lions vs Pies PF would’ve been an epic, with either team absolutely out on their feet the week after. Thanks again Maynard.

Best list we have seen for decades, multiple A grade players. 2022 should've been a premiership, given the mega start we had. 2023 was unforgivable for throwing away the flag. Injuries to Petty and Melk are weak excuses. Maysie was spot on, we missed a golden chance. Goody, Taylor and Lamb developed a super list that worked well in the 2021 hub, but couldn't perform or behave in the real AFL environment. Four home final losses in a row despite i50 domination, there are problems beyond a couple of injuries. IMO if we don't get our [censored] together on 2024, it's a long time until we will be able to compete again. Can you imagine how it might look if we slip to bottom 8, with no home base, a bunch of aging stars, a coach under the pump for performance on and off field, and the AFLs attention returning to their darling big 4??? We got comfortable believing the hype that the Club has returned to the powerhouse we were 60 years ago Fortunes can change very quickly

Another side we can think about to model our future on is the Hawks. They won their first flag in 2008 with a relatively young side, not too dissimilar to our 2021 side. It then took them another 5 years to win their second flag and they then went on to win 3 straight. They actually had 9 players play in both 2008 and 2013 - Guerra, Birchall, Hodge, Lewis, Mitchell, Franklin, Rioli, Roughhead and Sewell. I definitely hope we don't have to wait 3 more years, but I'm definitely not panicking about the window closing yet.

yeah, they really went overboard. 7 photos.

Don’t expect the rest of us to be as narrow minded as yourself and others. Theres a difference between being disappointed and being angry when there are things beyond your control which have massive impacts and don’t even think of going down the Grundy line with regard to matters within our control as it would have had zero impact on our forward structure in those finals. The supporters you accuse of not being angry enough are the same supporters you accused of accepting mediocrity when they brought to yours and others attention numerous times what was happening with the development of the team. They told you a lot of luck in terms of everything going right is needed to win flags and we had that in 2021. What occurred in the proceeding 2 seasons is to do with human nature, luck and learnings. Yes that word everyone hates Learnings, we started 2022 like a house on fire and fell into a decline, but let’s be honest what were to expect having gone in as reigning premiers for the first time in 57 years. But you want us to be angry that they couldn’t foresee that and that they couldn’t foresee the Petty, Fritsch and Melksham injuries. But then again that’s me making excuses and accepting mediocrity as opposed to being a realist

No, it doesn't please me. But excuses clearly please you Chose Tmac over Schache and Grundy in the last final, poor coaching. We've dominated i50s and long bombed for the last four years without decent conversion, poor coaching A midfield whose kicking couldn't hit the ocean from the beach MFC won't be a top club for long. Max, Maysie, BBB, Tmac, Melk approaching retirement. Hibb retired. Petty a strong chance to return to SA. Oliver's future in limbo Without another flag soon we will struggle to keep relevant 2024 is a must win season

Yes, on top of the injuries that just capped it off for us. I forgot to mention this... The flow on effect of that incident meant we couldn't use Trac as much forward as we needed to.

But we haven’t… and mentioning it every five minutes isn’t going to change that. Premierships are bloody hard to win, yet clearly you and many others saw it as a given that we’d win at least three on the trot. Taking things like this for granted is a surefire way to set yourself up for disappointment. And no, I’m not saying we should hope for anything less than another Flag, but surely we don’t need to eternally dwell on the years that’ve elapsed.

In all honesty we may be a couple of years older but we have recruited on face value better than we have since 2019. If the recruits click and fire for us eg. inside the F50 we are better placed than the past 2 years. Our core group are still in their peak years, in my estimation we have 2-3 years in our window left. I just want us to find composure inside our 50 delivery wise and a killer's ruthlessness when the chances arrive to kill teams off.

May & Lever are game-changers So are Viney & Gawn. Fritsch when fully fit. And how about Kozzie? Rivers, McVee, Sparrow, Petty, JVR, Salem, Langdon and Gus are all capable of stellar games in the future We've finally got a good list of players and you can only find 2 players? It's not 2012/13 DJ Injuries to most of our forwards last season cost the club a flag There is no other standout reason For years, we've seen 1 excuse after another (umpires, our drafting, the board, the coaching etc etc) Now, a legitimate reason for not winning the flag last year is put forward and people want to blame the coach? Or just spit the dummy with their constant whining? We didn't win, get over it and go again We've got the list and we've got the coaching. I've never seen the club in better shape and I go back as far as you do

I think 22 was forgivable, last year we let ourselves down massively in the finals........and before anyone says we only just lost those games.......please think first.........Collingwood pantsed us in the first quarter and a half and then we gagged in front of goals like a 12 year old trying to ask their first crush out on a date but just can't.........Carlton.......FME....we should of beaten them by 6-8 goals in a canter but played undisciplined, scared to lose football............injuries didn't lose us the either of those games.

No. 2022 was crueled by injuries and we did not allow for recuperation and recovery during the season. 2023 was crueled by losing Petty and Melksham (who surely would have been worth 1-2 goals) and the illegal hit on Angus that affected our options in the first week of the finals. Maysie was right - we are as good as them. Let's hope that better injury management and greater fortune with the timing of injuries will enhance our prospects for this year.

Suggest we move on from season 2023. It's just flogging a dead horse. Just one point I'd like to make. Stevie May was wrong. We were not the best team last season and, in my opinion, did not let a flag slip. We finished 4th and went out in straight sets for a reason. We huffed and puffed through most of the year. We were hard work to watch. Pies were the best team. finished top at the end of H&A, played daring attacking footy, won lots of close games and got the job done in September. They rode their luck for sure but they made their luck. I hate them with a passion but they deserved their flag. If injuries don't cruel us again we'll be in it up to our necks in 24. Go Dees

Thanks for your work, gives us a lot better insight than anything the club has / will post

I could probably name at least 10 clubs where their window has remained open a lot longer than 5 years (over a 60 year stretch) The Hawks from '71 through to '91 for starters. The Pies from '64 through to '81 (played in 7 GF's) There are numerous other examples How about the Demons from '54 to '64? All that mainly on the back of savvy recruiting So do the 5 year window types think that we're going to stop recruiting talent? Why would we do that? And free agency will eventually become much bigger than it is now so why wouldn't Taylor be all over that area of recruiting? There's no reason why our list can't get better. Somehow, after finishing in the top four, 3 years in a row, we ended up with picks 6 & 13 in the draft. That's better than a bottom club could usually hope for And smart trading to snare McAdam & Billings. Fullarton could surprise as well Jason Taylor comes across as being hungry for more talent. The man is the linchpin in my view. The best recruiter in the business Geelong's window remained open for 16 years and they are still thereabouts. Built on the back of another great recruiter, Stephen Wells

Completely agree with everything Macca has written in this thread. Yes, we lost in the last two years. But people seem to forget that there are 17 other teams on the competition and some of them have pretty good lists too - in fact, most commentators see Brisbane as having the best list, and how many cups have they won with it? There is so much luck and fate involved - just ask Stephen Milne (for those who remember 2010). With a good stable board and good recruiting we can stay in contention for many years. And i firmly believe that this is our year (although very distressed by this mornings news that Clarry is not back!).

Don’t mention the war

Photos on the MFC website about training starting the shot of Gus walking in , he looks relaxed and confident hope he has a stellar year

SWYL You are clearly not reading the tea leaves. We all acknowledge our FOUR Finals losses ( Straight sets) in a row. It is fact but as you should read more D/L ers have analysed snd came to the conclusion that injury and bad luck plus horrible forward connection and inaccuracy over those games has cruelled us. Whst are we doing about it? Well we have recruited specifically to remedy this forward line weakness via trade and draft selections plus retain our best forwards and hit that our oldest pair may have one last injury free year to turn the clock back. We now await the pre season start of 2024 and the proof in the pudding is serious from today at Casey to the last Dat in September!

On a cheerful note on this otherwise gloomy morning. Any folk walking their dogs around a cyclone fence at a distant suburban ground this morning?

I no longer believe in premiership windows opening and closing. Obviously there are instances where a club is a long way off a premiership, such as North and the Eagles, however most other teams can put themselves into the window with some savvy trading and quality drafting. With the introduction of free agency and the power the players now have, it is the easiest it has been since the introduction of the structured trading and draft system to top up with quality talent. The key area that list managers are earning their keep now is managing the salary cap, which if done well can prolong a side's window for many years. Realistically the two players from our best 22 in their twilight are May and Gawn, who I think both have 2 years of high quality footy left but may slow down after that. Therefore, our biggest need over the next two years is to either develop or trade in a quality ruckman and a quality full back. I'm sure the club have Dan Turner, Jed Adams, Will Verrall and Kyah Farris-White as potential options depending on development, however if we get to the end of 2025 and they haven't come on then we may pivot and go hunting ready to go players. I think the time when our window will absolutely be shut is when Petracca, Salem, Viney, Lever etc all hit around 32/33. I'll back Tim Lamb and Co to plan well for that though, as their track record is outstanding but I would expect we will start to miss finals around then and will need a mini rebuild. If managed well we hopefully never hit the rock bottom times like we did in 2008-2012 though....

Like all top clubs, good lists with multiple A graders...we don't play in a vacuum, it's a tough comp & you need your share of luck. Injuries to Petty, BBB, Tommy Mac & Melk...Fritsch not at 100% & JVR rubbed out for our last final. I think that's a little more than weak excuses. ...but please yourself.

Not as a given. We have the Talent, but not the same drive we had in ‘21 We should have won both years, but we were beaten on our home deck 4 times

True. After two years of getting a gazillion inside 50's yet scoring enough goals is an indictment. One is entitled to expect one's highly-paid, highly-skilled experts to derive strategies and bed them in over that time frame.

Free agency? We can play that game too. Is that the next Jason Taylor episode? Gawn & May fair enough but we'll find another ruckman as we've had a rich history in the rucking position May? That's a toughie but maybe Petty after a couple of years up forward. He's still only 24 Petracca has got another 5 productive years as has Oliver. Same for Gus and watch out for Sparrow to take it a level up. Rivers continues to improve. Salem will find his mojo Lever is 27 ... there's another 5 years of good footy from him coming up Windsor & Tholstrup? Both could be stars. JVR as well but he's got to get on the lead Plus of course, our ongoing stellar recruiting through the draft and through trades We're in great shape for the future. Past 5 or 6 years, who knows? But no point getting worried about 2029 just yet, rjay! The Swans, Pies & Cats are constantly thereabouts or in contention We can do the same!

Shh… you’re making too much sense for the media and the negative nancies on Demonland In all seriousness we have had mitigating circumstances the past two seasons - particularly 2023 - that have meant we haven’t been able to perform at anywhere near our best, particularly come finals time Clearly there are some coaching, gameplan and personnel weaknesses that have exacerbated this, but more than anything it has been bad luck with injuries that has crueled us And I reckon new recruits, fire in the belly and a bit of good luck will take us a long way in 2024

We have certainly wasted the last 2 years

Exactly The replacement forward line stood up manfully and tried their utmost But if our forward line looked like this do we lose either of the finals? HF Petracca*/Kozzie** Petty Fritsch F Melksham JVR/Brown Chandler *Petracca not able to play forward due to the loss of Brayshaw **Kozzie not able to have stints on the ball as he was needed in the forward line Dark italics - not available So not only did we not have key personnel up forward but we lost all balance and flexibility (up forward) Despite all that we went down narrowly in both finals The above forward line would have helped us win the '23 flag, without such a forward line we had very little chance (of winning 3 finals)

Two things that consistently occur on this forum. 1. The list is overrated - it's a good list, a really good list...but there are gaps in it as there are in all teams. It's a tough competition and we are in contention. The list is not that unassailable, you need things to go your way - luck. 2. The coach is underrated - he's a very good coach. When we won the flag it was the assistants that got us there, Yze, Williams etc...when we lose finals it's all Goodwin, he can't coach, to set in his ways, no plan B. Goodwin can coach, he's proven it.

Thanks Civ I can understand people being disappointed with the 2 losses in the finals but reality bites and bites hard You cannot win without talent and if the majority of your forward line is where that talent is missing, how do you win? (3 finals) Do people think we could have won 3 finals with Upper Gully's front 6? The replacement forward line was not a patch on our best forward line, it's as simple as that. That's why we lost So to get so close in both finals says a lot about our will to win and never say die attitude - we tried our guts out but came up short

Thankyou. I truly don’t think Demon Supporters en masse are angry enough about the last 2 years. We certainly should be

...but you've got to have the star power 'Macca' Oliver is now an unknown. Trac is a star but closing in on 30. Max of course but nearer the end. May same as Max. Geelong hung around and finally got a flag but their star power came from free agency with Danger and Cameron added to what they already had in Selwood and Hawkins. Luck ran with them in 2022. The Swans have been hanging around but haven't pulled off a flag in a long time. The Pies finally got one after a pretty big & courageous shake up. Looks like we will be cashed up at the end of this season...will we be able to lure a Danger or Cameron type to the club? Will one of our kids be the next superstar? I think this year is our big chance, after that there are a lot of unknowns.

...they'll change that rule next season.

I thought 2023 was a cert for us. In fact I'd have been prepared to put my lefty on it. Sadly a lot of [censored] ( injury ) happened and we bombed out. Albeit by a bugger all margin. If it's not this year - it might be a very long wait .... again!

Then I hope they are going to open up Casey for some sessions. ...it's the least they can do.

Came down to injuries in the end, just a kick in it, to win the cup everything has to roll your way.

I reckon he could. Sestan has some real x factor about him and like Mcvee, who is another Taylor special, his point of different is his foot skills. But like Mcvee needs an AFL tank and body - which he looks like he is working on. Sestan has the ability to kick those across the body on the 45 kicks that players like Daniel, Miers, Guthrie, Crisp and Nick Daicos are so good at hitting. With all teams employing zones and and all team defence having players with that skill has become increasingly important to cut through congestion and find free players.