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What is a loser mentality though mate? Some of us are merely saying we need a bit of perspective. It's fine to vent our frustration, but you're implying here we're not contenders because we've lost two games by a total of 11 points, yet we sit in the top 4 with a very healthy percentage that also happens to currently be the best percentage. I'll pop this in here as well. ---- It's all well and good to be frustrated. I thought we were pathetic today, but I find it easier to look at the bigger picture and history is an important reminder in AFL footy (and anything really). We're top 4, with a softer draw coming up in the second half of the year, with less 8 point games than our other top 4 opposition. Many parts of our game are in good shape (our turnover game), and others (stoppages) need some work. The stoppages issue IMV has much scope for improvement when we start to throw our better mids through the contest more often. So that's personnel. The history side of it is more telling. Many supporters seem to have this expectation that having won 2021, we'd be winning flags over and over in the same way. We've had to change the way we're playing because the competition adapted to our intercept game in 2021. But no team in the modern era has gone through seasons like our 2021 season repeatedly. They've all had ups and downs. Let's look at the Hawthorn threepeat team as a prime example. 2013 was their 2021. They won 19 games and aside from their qualifying final win over Sydney, won their prelim and GF by a combined 4 goals. Their finals series that season was nothing like the dominance of ours in 2021. And maybe this, plus the fact they'd fallen after their 08 flag, kept them hungry going into 2014. But still, 2014 saw them finish second on 17 wins. To Round 10, they were 6 and 3 (there was a bye at Round 9). Those three losses were to Sydney (who finished above them in 1st), Geelong (who finished one place below them in 3rd) and 5th placed Port. Plus, they fell over the line to Essendon (who finished 7th) by 4 points in Round 2, and some of their wins were big wins to the likes of the new and young Suns, eventual wooden spooners St Kilda and struggling Brisbane who finished in the bottom 4. If that was our start, we'd have been saying all the same things. Oh, we can't beat the sides around us, our competitors, but we have no trouble beating up the lowly sides. We're flattrack bullies etc. Their 2014 finals campaign was better than their 2013 finals series, winning two finals easily, but winning their prelim against Oort on the MCG by 3 points. Again, nowhere near as good as our 2021 finals series. Moving on to 2015, and this time, they finished 3rd on 16 wins. They went the first 10 rounds 6-4. To Round 10, they lost to Essendon (who would finish 4th bottom), Port (who would finish 9th), GWS (who finished 11th) and one of their main competitors Sydney (who finished 4th, one place below Hawthorn that year). Meanwhile, they beat Geelong (who would miss the 8 that year), us (who were very ordinary in our second year under Roos - we finished 13th), 16th placed Suns and 14th placed St Kilda. Again, a season to Round 10, nothing to write home about. And their finals campaign in 2015 saw them lose their qualifying final and having to go the long way to win it. Why did I bother with all this? Well, perspective is a funny thing. And it's funny how quickly we forget things. We've forgotten how powerful our 2021 finals campaign was, and expecting us to replicate that is folly. As for it's all over by Round 10 or 11, well, history shows us that is simply not the case and that if you're in the hunt for the top 4 and injury-free come the last few rounds, that's the goal. Not being the clear premiership standout by Round 10, because we know how that goes, don't we Melbourne fans (*cough* 2022 *cough*).

I didn't watch the game today so I'm not going to to really talk in depth about it from an analysis perspective. What's the go? Why with the list that we have, why are putting in performances like this. Are we simply overrated? Because I'm starting to believe so and have felt this since after the Essendon game. For me here are some factors that we haven't been able to fix since last year. Selections Goody showing once again how incredible stale we are in this department. Continuing to gift games to the likes of McDonald, ANB, Sparrow, who add nothing to the team. Salem completely bypassing the VFL and not being made to earn his spot. We have guys like Laurie, Schache, Howes, Dunstan, Turner who are putting in consistent good form at VFL and yet Goody is still way too stubborn to reward their form. Sticking with the same usuals who have been ordinary since last year. Here i was thinking it was all going to change this year and nope. McVee and JVF have looked tired for the past few weeks and yet they look vulnerable out there. Forward Line What on earth is going on with this. We've had all summer to find what out best forward set up was going to be and it's an absolute shambles as we speak. How the coaching staff can sit there and think that Tom McDonald is actually worth investing time into is beyond me. Honestly, the sunken titanic moves better then Tmac. Guys like Schache and Joel Smith are actually performing at VFL level and would add far better mobility and ground level ability. Give them both a good 4 week stretch of games and let them settle into the team. We have 4 smalls in there who are all out of form. I'm so perplexed what ANB adds to our teams. You put the smallest amount of pressure on him and he just turns to water and fumbles like crazy. Even our forward 50 entries is a shambles. We're purely focus on just bombing in there and hoping for the best. We knew this was a massive defiencie last year but again we've done nothing to rectify this. The only forward worth holding his head up is Bayley Fritsch. The rest have been incredibly disappointing. Midfield and Gawn/Grundy combo Death, Taxes and another game beaten in the clearences. I think people actually overrate our midfield. It's Gawn, Petracca, Oliver then daylight. I'm only going off stats, but It looks like no one stood up and in the absence of Oliver. Once again it's disappointing. Our depth is very thin as well, the likes of Jordon, Sparrow, Harmes are genuine battlers who won't really improve us to the next level. Adding genuine midfield talent in the off season is the biggest need right now. Utilise the draft and trade period as best as we can. The Grundy and Gawn combo? I haven't seen any evidence to suggest it's working unfortunately. I was hesitant with the Grundy trade and still am. Both of them just look cooked. I was expecting the Grundy of old this year but just haven't seen it. Even with these two in the side it's actually bizarre how bad we are around stoppages and clearences. Coaching and Development We've had the same coaching staff since the end of 2020. There's been no new coaching assistant that's come in and added a fresh new voice for over 3 years now. Are the players simply getting stale with our current coaching set up? Do we need a fresh new voice at the end of the year? When Yze and Choco came on board you could tell they looked really rejuvenated and energised in 2021. Since then our game plan and method just looks stale and bland. Feel like even Goody is not as innovative as he once was. There seems to be zero plan B when teams get a run on, there's no willing to try and be creative with our players whether that's trying something with positional changes etc. Speaking of positional changes, all summer we heard about the Pickett midfield move. After his round 1 performance I thought this was finally the move that would add a completely new dynamic to a midfield set up. Now it's completely non existent... was he used in there today?? Why has Goody gone away from this? The other thing also is why have we gone away from our traditional 3 tall defence? Lever is CLEARLY struggling with being the 2nd defender which then has a domino effect on Steven May's form. We built our premiership defence purely on having the 3 tall defenders which means Lever plays his preferred role as a sweeping 3rd tall who is able to cut up and intercept. We have seen his form dropped significantly since Petty went forward. It's time to start we start putting games into Daniel Turner if Petty is the preferred forward moving forward. He's got the talent and ability just needs experience now. Hibberd or McVee can make way. General Summary Imo these are some of the contributing factors of our poor form. I think there is more to add but right now we're stuck in a rut and some of players are bereft of confidence. Am I confident we can turn it around. Yes and no, we play the poor teams again layer this and I feel all this will do is put a band aid over the cracks. I've seen nothing to suggest that we've made any gradual improvement since last year and I don't know I have thr faith that he can turn it around this year. It'll take a monumental shift in attitude change from the players and coaching staff.

Oh dear! we lose two games against good teams by a kick and the reaction of gloom and doom by some of our regular contributors including Joe Boy is so predictable. Win, we are the best. Lose. we are rabble and all is lost this year. Honestly, what mindset do they have? 7-4 and a great percentage and they complain. What do you think Geelong supporters are feeling right now? Do you think they have thrown in the towel? Sensible non Geelong supporters would never write them off as premiers 2023, me included. We will still give this flag a shake.

Dear Demonlanders, Valé Frank Vearing - 21.11.1943 - 25.05.2023 Post made in respect to a M.F.C player, to his family, friends and former teammates. Melbourne Football Club: 1965-1966. Played as a rover, wore #26. Games: 11 Goals: 5. Two x Melbourne Football Club Reserves Best and Fairest 1965 and 1966. Career highlights and stats - http://demonwiki.org/Frank+Vearing Best game was a 15 disposal, 5 marks, 3 goals 1 behind effort in a 30 point loss, during a round 4 1966 MCG match against South Melbourne - https://afltables.com/afl/stats/games/1966/111619660514.html Started and finished his career with Epping before a leg injury ended his career. One may even argue another great career highlight was turning down an invitation from Collingwood. Personally, Frank was a nice, kind, humble man and thank him as one of the people to influence me to barrack for the Demons. Best memory with Frank, when I was a kid watching the 2000 qualifying final against Carlton. Despite all of my family writing them off at half time, Frank calmly said, "We'll come back." The rest is history as we all know. Lastly, I'm so happy he got to see the Dees win a flag before he left us. As far as I am aware, the M.F.C has been contacted in regards to his passing. Valé Frank Vearing, may you rest in peace.

Nibbler was good. Sparrow made a huge difference to our midfield defensive run and had great aerial efforts. McDonald actually competed well for a fair bit and got stuck deep forward dragging a key Freo tall out of play at times. I’m not at all convinced Schache would’ve been better than Tom, it’s Schache! Dunstan’s injured. Laurie isn’t consistent at VFL, how does that deserve a promotion. Howes isn’t ready, he should be, but he’s not, really inconsistent contests and drifts though games. Turner, maybe, but Hibbo was fantastic today. Disco’s close but he’s hardly smashed the door down. The only selection issue today was Harmes for JJ and JJ hardly impressed when subbed on. I suspect one was going to be sub no matter. There’s no evidence JVR is significantly tiring, he covered plenty of ground today. Same goes for McVee who was very solid defensively and didn’t get turned around by Freddy at any stage.

If you were sitting anywhere within a 100 metre radius of me yesterday you would have no doubt how passionate, frustrated and disappointed I was. My throat is ruined. On a related point, I have not generally been critical of dees fans not showing up. But yesterday was pathetic. 29k on a perfect Saturday arvo for footy. And I'm positive it would have made a difference if there was more vocal passionate dees at the ground. For one thing we might have actually won a God damn holding the ball free. So anyone who is on board the dees are rubbish train who could have gone yesterday (i dont mean those who cant, live interstate, have mobility issues, had a funeral, were getting married, have covid etc etc) but chose not to - you are part of the problem not the solution. Buy a mirror.

Imagine having a list more talented than anything we are likely to see for another 20 years and not being frustrated when they underperform.

As Im calming down after the game a few things stand out. It was a tough, hard fought contest against a good team hitting their straps now. It’s not a crime to lose to a likely finalist on a winning streak, but it’s still a game we should have won. 1./ Basic errors in tight games kill you. spargo spoils fritsch mark at 30 metres, harmes does the same to Jvr. Both players also miss sitters from 30 during the game. Grundy running in to goal unpressured from 35 misses. Errors will always happen but we made way too many. 2./ simple but true… bad kicking costs you in tight games . They kicked straight we didn’t. Picket 2x OOF to go with his 2 goals but there was many culprits. Not just bad kicking at goal either, our kicking all over the ground was riddled with poor choices. Trac def a culprit. 3./ Lever is way down on form. Got to good places to impose himself but dropped marks he would normally take including the one that led to the sealer. 4./ An intangible. It felt, at the ground, we just didn’t have a lot of spark. They are consistently tough and we should all appreciate that. But there just doesn’t seem to be much excitement between them or anyone to light that fuse. 5./ We’re a good to very good side in 23. Top 4-6. But we’re no longer a great one. BBB and Tmac are pretty much done now and they were both a big part of our flag year. Sadly I think We may have to adjust to the truth of where we actually sit in 23.

I never said we aren’t contenders. I said that in our current form we aren’t contenders and that things need to change if we are to win. In fact in the same post that you quoted I said that we deserve to be a successful club! Your history lesson is a good one. What it shows is that those teams improved dramatically in order to then go on to win the flag. They didn’t just repeat their mediocre form all season and then somehow had a flag fall in their lap. But apparently to suggest that we need to improve in key areas in order to win is being negative and hysterical, not pragmatic or realistic. I love this club, but I’m not blind to its faults. We are seeing our own history from last season repeat itself. We seem to have not improved in the areas that hurt us last season either. To bury your head in the sand and say oh we only lost our last two games by 11 points, is to paper over the cracks in a very convenient way to the narrative that we all so desperately want to believe, which is that things will get better and we will win the flag in 2023. I hope more than anything that you’re right, but without change I can’t see it happening.

Posters can posters what they want as long as it doesn’t breach any site policies or standards. We have the full spectrum of posters on DL from the overly optimistic to the overly pessimistic. Most are worth reading and have valid perspectives. There are a couple that only bob up after a loss. Always with the I told you so’s. I just ignore them. We’ll beat Carlton next Friday because they’re woeful, but the pies will give us a touch up. They’ll put 30-50 points on us based on current form. That’ll be 8-5 at the bye. Middle of the road mediocrity. That’s a bottom of the 8 trajectory which is in all honesty is our level because we’re playing like a bottom of the 8 team and have been for a while. I don’t know where the spark or inspiration is coming from to elevate us again.

This is such a [censored] take. I’m sorry but nobody here wants to see us lose. You only needed to be here post flag to see how invested and happy everyone was. I hate this notion that you shouldn’t vent or be upset post loss. Nothing is ever as good or as bad as it seems, but ffs if supporters want to be upset and have a crack, who cares? As long as nobody is being personal or nasty or rude, why can’t supporters be reactionary? Why can you make big calls post win but not post loss? And why are Melbourne supporters so scared to call out issues? It’s like you’re not a real fan if you aren’t happy with every single thing the club does. Anyone who pays their membership and has sat through two decades of rubbish served prior to 2021, has every right to be as upset as they want post game, so long as they continue to support the club in both good times and bad. And by the way, nobody at Demonland is forcing anyone to read anything. If people don’t like to read posts after a loss, why come online then? Venting about others venting is equally as ridiculous.

I really only want to see three things selection-wise: Another tall defender alongside May and Lever. Our insistence of going with May and Lever on their own, stretching HIbberd, is not working. It's not a good strategy made even worse by seeing Lever's AA form in the first few weeks fall apart since we moved Petty. I don't care whether that's Tomlinson, Turner or someone else. A change to the two tall forwards. The JVR-TMac combo doesn't work. If JVR's tired, he should be rested. Either way, TMac isn't good enough. I don't know what the FD are waiting to see in Brown but he was averaging 4 goals a game at AFL level before his injury and perhaps we should try putting him back in. He can hardly do worse than what we're seeing. A rebalancing of our smalls. We have too many small defenders who are low possession getters. We have too many small forwards who are low possession getters. Too much is left to too few. We need to increase the number of midfielders in the side who can rotate through the middle at the expense of one of the smalls. I fear this will mean Chandler or McVee will be dropped, which saddens me because I like both of them and like the freshness they bring to the side, but something has to change.

Way, way, way longer than you’re suggesting here. We are 23-12 since the flag (ie we win twice as often as we lose). We’ve been in the top 4 for all bar, what, one round in that time? As upset as you are, this isn’t where we are heading for a long time yet.

And if Port kicked straight we get belted last week. Even if we had have fallen over the line due to kicking straight it wouldn't change much. Falling over the line against a middle of the road (at best) interstate team on your home deck - I feel were just making up the numbers this year. It's not about the results it's about how we're playing.

Removal of a 3rd tall defender, practically reducing Lever's output to zero Kozzie Pickett dominates R1 playing higher up the ground, and now is getting no midfield minutes Unwillingness to play BBB after kicking 9 goals in his first three games prior to injury Persistence with highly limited role players Reluctance/unwillingness to draft balanced or outside mids to compliment our current group, issue then magnified by lack of creativity with midfield rotations Trent Rivers attending a total of 0 centre bounce attendances over the past 4 weeks We have too many forwards that aren't actually forwards (ANB, Harmes, Sparrow) Using players like Jordon as sub doesn't make sense, either needs to be in the 22 or not in the side at all Reluctance to play Harmes in the one & only role where he's been a good player - a tagger I'm sure there's a further thousand points I'll get to at some point

He had a couple of shocking clangers, he had a couple of regulation mistakes that will happen when you have 18 touches and only 1 mark (ie very little uncontested kick mark). He had 9 tackles and some quality disposals and fought hard to halve a heap of contests. He definitely was not the problem.

Freo are playing finals this year. They had a 15 win season last year and were 20 points away from playing Sydney in a prelim. Now they’re on a 4 game winning streak. I don’t get the under rating of Fremantle.

Here's the thing though. It's all well and good to be frustrated. I thought we were pathetic today, but I find it easier to look at the bigger picture and history is an important reminder in AFL footy (and anything really). We're top 4, with a softer draw coming up in the second half of the year, with less 8 point games than our other top 4 competitors. Many parts of our game are in good shape (our turnover game, our scoring sources), and others (stoppages) need some work. The stoppages issue IMV has much scope for improvement when we start to throw our better mids through the contest more often, plus I'm sure we'll have some tactical tweaks too. So that's personnel and tactics that you don't necessarily want to show in the first ten rounds. The history side of it however is more telling. Many supporters seem to have this expectation that having won 2021, we'd be winning flags over and over in the same way. We've had to change the way we're playing because the competition adapted to our intercept game in 2021. But no team in the modern era has gone through seasons like our 2021 season repeatedly. They've all had ups and downs. It's very similar for Richmond's 4 year period, but let's look at the Hawthorn threepeat team as a prime example. 2013 was their 2021. They won 19 games and aside from their strong qualifying final win over Sydney, won their prelim and GF by a combined 4 goals. Their finals series that season was nothing like the dominance of ours in 2021. And maybe this, plus the fact they'd fallen after their 2008 flag, kept them hungry going into 2014. But still, 2014 saw them finish second on 17 wins. To Round 10, they were 6 and 3 (there was a bye at Round 9). Those three losses were to Sydney (who finished above them in 1st), Geelong (who finished one place below them in 3rd) and 5th placed Port. Plus, they fell over the line to Essendon (who finished 7th) by 4 points in Round 2, and some of their wins were big wins over the likes of the new and young Suns, eventual wooden spooners St Kilda and struggling Brisbane who finished in the bottom 4. If that was our start, we'd have been saying all the same things. Oh, we can't beat the sides around us, our competitors, but we have no trouble beating up the lowly sides. We're flattrack bullies etc etc. Their 2014 finals campaign was better than their 2013 finals series, winning two finals easily, but only won their prelim against Port on the MCG by 3 points. Again, nowhere near as good as our 2021 finals series. Moving on to 2015, and this time, they finished 3rd on 16 wins. They went the first 10 rounds 6-4. To Round 10, they lost to Essendon (who would finish 4th bottom), Port (who would finish 9th), GWS (who finished 11th) and one of their main competitors Sydney (who finished 4th, one place below Hawthorn that year). Meanwhile, they beat Geelong (who would miss the 8 that year), us (who were very ordinary in our second year under Roos - we finished 13th), the 16th placed Suns and the 14th placed St Kilda. Again, a season to Round 10, nothing to write home about. And their finals campaign in 2015 saw them lose their qualifying final and having to go the long way to win it. Why did I bother with all this? Well, perspective is a funny thing. And it's bizarre how quickly we forget things. We've forgotten how powerful and abnormal our 2021 finals campaign was. Expecting us to replicate that was always folly. As for it's all over by Round 10 or 11, well, history shows us that is simply not the case and that if you're in the hunt for the top 4 and injury-free come the last few rounds, that's the goal. Just because we're not the clear premiership standout by Round 10, doesn't mean we won't win it, because we know how that one goes, don't we Melbourne fans (*cough* 10-0 in 2022 *cough*).

Love this thread - DD starts off by stating they didn’t watch the game today and then goes on to write a thesis on what is not working. I love Demonland.

This season has caused a relapse. May be I will opt for deep sleep therapy and have a little holiday in Chelmsford.

If you don’t want knee jerk, don’t log on here after a loss. Plain and simple. It’s an emotional game. Besides which there’s some truth behind all the fists being smashed on the table. The same applies in reverse after a win. Two things: 1. The Darcy injury will hurt for a few weeks but Freo should play finals this year. Whether or not that makes them a ‘good team’ depends on your definition but I don’t see them regressing back to early season form. The narrative that we lost to a bog ordinary side simply isn’t true. 2. We have the talent on the park to be a contender THIS year. Obviously talent alone doesn’t get you there but it’s a major factor. The season is not shot. Far from it.

Well, i think we will finish top 4 and will go on to win the flag.

After taking my 7yo in the train to the ‘G’ today and revelling in his joy at watching the Dees live for the first time, circumstantially on the anniversary of my fathers death 7yo ago of MND, I reflected on the circle of life. oh and death and as we pulled into the south Geelong station at 7pm, hearing the crowd silence (yes hearing it) as GWS got another goal from about 800m away. I considered the fact that the AFL are reaching a version of the utopian vision of any team can win on any given day, bar 1-3 sides. What I know it means for ‘us’ is that 4 losses b 11 rounds in over the course of a 23 round season and the method of our other wins, hasn’t papered over deficiencies per se. It speaks of how close the competition is and really (inc Collingwood) there are no standouts. TL/DR We’re in it up to our eyeballs even though it doesn’t feel this way, as the disparity between the best and worst of the competition has contracted significantly. and it’s a good thing - but really stressful, if you want to smack teams weekly.

It’s not Griffiths, as we have had a good injury run and we have won most last quarters so far and are still running at the end of games. It is skill, speed, game plan, attitude and ineffective clearances and a non settled forward line.

Everything is so painfully laboured. Moving the ball seems like such hard work. Our handballs cause the receiver the break stride. No flow or fluency at all. No connection. I suggest the team head off to Bali during the bye and blow off some steam (I'm half serious). Find some joy because at the moment we're playing joyless footy.

Our pre season games were blistering and had such a great attacking style, which we haven't seen much of in the past few weeks. Some of this is likely down to the disruptions caused by injury, but very disappointing regardless to have returned to the 2022 style...

What happened to the corridor footy we saw pre season?? We rarely switch play, and barely even look to see if it's on. The only thing we have changed about our F50 entries is it is not deep pocket every time. We still bomb it and teams run it out with ease and very little pressure. We are stale and have not fired a shot against decent opposition other than Gold Coast which is looking like a very good win up there. Our skills have deteriorated, a lot of sloppy, lazy football the past few weeks in particular. We are classic downhill skiers and have been that way for 18 months.

The 8 touch game and the 9 touch game today and some of his 1 tackle efforts. ANB plays the toughest position on the ground and does his job week to week. His output with the pill depends on how he has it delivered and who he can pass to. When both of those things line up he excels. Sparrow’s crazily undervalued by Melbourne supporters who just look at disposal numbers. He’s a role player but also a very good one.

I understand both points of view and also realise that little more than a straight kick in both of the last two games and the atmosphere around here would be markedly different. We desperately want to achieve the success of Richmond, Geelong, and Hawthorn and not fade away like St Kilda and the Bulldogs. Gawn is 31 and has just had the worst run of form in probably five years and other key players have shown concerning signs this season. Our once in a generation midfield, is inexplicably being beaten and we are once again resorting to the same McDonald/Brown/Smith dilemma. Goodwin is clearly a coach who prefers to prepare a team for long term success - and it seems to me he feels any deviation from the plan is a sign of weakness and panic. It's as though he believes that in time the poor form will self correct. As others have noted, it's a strength and weakness and I'm a little in both camps. I like that Goodwin keeps losses in proportion and has faith in the team and the system that delivered our first premiership in 57 years. But I also feel frustrated and sense that the team is stagnating, becoming complacent, and even bored. I know others bemoan the loss of Petty from the backline, but in some ways it's the most exciting structural change Goodwin has made in a long time and I hope we persist with it for a while longer. In short, I understand the frustration and I hope Goodwin does to learn to become more dynamic as a coach and also as a list manager. Keep in mind, however, it's round 11 and we're 4th with a great percentage. St Kilda and Bulldog supporters would also be livid that they spoilt the chance to climb into the top 4 after unexpected losses of their own. Geelong, the reigning premiers, also dropped one unexpectedly and are a game out of it.

Some of the worst non calls from the umpires were right below me on the members wing. Noone call tell me the pies or tigers would have not got some of those frees in front of their home crowd going bannnas - hell, they would get them when we are the home team. I might have scared some kids too. Also told myself to pull my head in.

I agree. Some critical posts about him but to me he has some poise and composure which the team sorely lacks at the moment. And there was one instance where he turned side on to the contest, won the ball and kick passed 15 meters or so to a teammate. So some saying he's soft is off the mark as well. Plenty of problems at the moment but Salem isn't one of them.

I think that if people start looking at the team like a mid-table team pushing into the contention equation, rather than already being in contention, then the record and performance aligns more with expectation, and it makes it easier to handle. I think it's clear now that atm we are probably at the top end of the 5th-10th ranked group of teams, which puts us into contention for top 4 but an outside chance for the flag relative to genuine top 4 contenders (Brisbane and Collingwood). Thinks can turn very quickly though and 7 losses generally nets you top 4 but this year could be anywhere from 4th to 9th. We are on track for 8 losses. Suggest we persist with JVR, McVee, get Laurie, Turner into the side, blood Woewoden. Improve our draft hand. And maybe lure some free agents. Worried that persisting with the likes of McDonald, ANB, Harmes will cost us in the long term. We've pushed Jordon out the door. And for what? ANB's turnovers. Then start preparing for 2024 and 2025 flag push. Because it's not happening this year. People have to let 2021 go and move on.

I watched GC last night get throughly destroyed by the umpires. They still won. Yes the umpires were putrid, absolutely terrible. Welcome to every game in 2023.

Would rather they just take the tackle for a ball up/htb risk or punt it to the boundary for deliberate and worsen the angle. Dump snapping it to 30-40m out directly in front in a panic and hoping we'll have a player there, is costing us massively. Just want to get my 1 knee jerk post-loss reaction post for the year out of the way. This drives me up the wall. Along with Healys grumpy commentary.

Yes at times as high as HB. Joel played mostly stay-at-home and BB obviously the roaming relief down the line. Both played their roles well. Joel held his positioning and presented well with good timing on the lead on a few occasions. Maybe didn't do enough for AFL call up but things can also improve your own performance at AFL level as you're sometimes getting more service... although maybe not that clean with us at present! BB was involved in quite a bit and played his role (assiming that's what was asked) very well. Melksham also had a solid game without setting the world on fire. It should be noted that their opportunities were limited with much of the delivery coming in dirty under pressure. My view after watching this match was that we couldn't do any worse with BBB & Joel in for JVR (managed/rested) and Macca (out). I also think Melk is in better form than Chandler / Spargo at this point and we would probably see at least a goal or two extra scored with him in the team coming off the bench or as sub. Obviously not a long term option but couldn't play much worse than the aforementioned. Both added nothing yesterday.

I watched the Full game yesterday v Freo. Lots of areas for improvement. 1. Goalkicking. It’s absolutely the one area of most teams that is crucial to winning. Dees missed 7-8 shots from 30 metres out. 2. Kicks to inside 50. Bombs and kicks to packs of 5-6 players. Cox and Pearce were able to outmark or easily defend. No leads or forward smarts from Tmcd or JVR. Ultimately Mids need to lower their eyes. Fritsch is the smart one who works to space. Look for him more. 3. overhandballing. Yes chain of 5-6 handballs usually leads to trouble and turnovers. It looks predictable as players telegraph the next habdpass and it gets shut down. Turnover. 4. Clearances and stoppages. We have inside mid bulls but are now losing clearances weekly. Huge area needing focus. 5. Get Lever back as a 3rd interception defender. We had May and Petty and Lever was able to defend and cover. Dees walking into others plans to make him accountable. With Petty out, Turner or Tomlinson needs to play. more to come …

It’s actually a good read when posters stick to just analysing a loss with facts or valid reasons for a poor performance. The two things that are just plain wrong are: 1. The posters that only come here after a form slump/loss and give us their usual negative bulldust. Nowhere to be seen when the team is going well. 2. The name calling of players after a loss. Such as the Brayshaw overweight plodder comments from last week. That is simply not on imo.

He really stepped up to the plate yesterday. Credit where it is due.

Everything you posted, I said to my son at the game. I added, our disposal was terrible, 66% cannot win a a game, we showed no aggression, especially at LJ and more so when Darcy went off, allowing LJ to follow up and win the game for them, they didn’t miss, we too often did, we never short passed going into forward 50 and our forward line has a kid, a cooked player, an injured/lacking confidence one and too many small forwards who had no impact and we lacked awareness, spoiling team mates and costing a few certain goals. Our GF team would have killed our side yesterday. Clarry and Petty out cost us beyond belief.

Richmond also, when they won their 3 flags, in those flag winning seasons they were around 7-4 by round 11, in 1 of those seasons (2019) they lost 3 games in a row by some convincing margins. Lost to North by 37, lost to Geelong by 67 and lost to Adelaide by 33. They went on to win the flag convincingly. By round 11, Geelong last year were also 7-4 and went on to win the flag convincingly. Some demonlanders hit the panic button wayyy too early. Plenty of games to go.

Mate, it's bizarre you're getting on here and writing a book (like I usually do) without having watched the game.

There is also this weird notion here that because we aren’t the laughing stock we once were, we have no right to be annoyed about a loss. After all, we once would lose by 10 goals and finish bottom 4, so we should just be grateful every day that we are not that bad anymore. It’s such a loser mentality. We deserve to be a successful club and we deserve to be contenders. To be happy with anything less than that, is to be happy with mediocrity, which with our current list, is not where we should be.

That is the most inaccurate post I have ever read on DL. Probably a dozen clangers. Turned it over continually.

Our biggest issues are run, skills, speed and selfishness. Our defenders do no run the ball out nor attempt to hit corridor kicks. Langdon is always ready and waiting, the ball doesn’t get to him. Our mids don’t work in cohesion to receive uncontested kicks, leading in and out of zone gaps. All over the ground we are slow in transition and too defensive. Our wings drop back too far and leave their man for 45 switches. May goal keeps. The rucks drop deep out of every forward. stoppage and we never lock the ball in. Particularly up forward we have big issues with selfishness in terms of not blocking, not staying down, not passing to open team mates and in the case of Fritsch not chasing. We don’t smother. And of course our forwards don’t lead because our mids don’t kick to leads. A vicious circle. These aren’t coaching or personnel problems that can be solved over night and not with VFL players coming in. They are problems that have come from emphasising a way of playing that won a flag in 2021 and not adapting the list. Petty, Oliver and better goal kicking and I suspect we win with todays effort pretty comfortably. But we aren’t some super team that can just romp to victory. We have a lot of flawed players, including our stars.

I appreciate the thread from Bobby but I find the people who sit back and wait to attack the people who show frustration on here quite obnoxious. It's like they're secretly hoping for us to lose so DL goes into meltdown and they can gaslight posters who actually care about the game and this club, making themselves look really high and mighty in the process. It's frankly pathetic, we might care and say things we don't 100% mean in the moment but we aren't stupid and idiotic maniacs and you aren't better than us.

Freo have got their game in shape since that loss. Do you watch the games at all or just look at the results and post trash?!

It's great to be positive but freo are not a good side. They lost to norf at home. What will actually happen when we play a good side is a real concern.

their lawyers will turn that into a week's suspension for petracca

I'm starting to think for the first time that we're overrated. Our bottom 6 have reverted to type after Goody managed to get a tune out of them in 21. ANB and Harmes were dreadful today. Chandler anonymous. Spargs no impact. Our ball movement is as stodgy as and we have no forwards. I don't think our problems are an easy fix either. Top 4 is looking a stretch.

Maybe we should try using our best key forward for once? The team balance has been off since Petty was used as a forward which weakened the backline and prevented Ben Brown coming back in. Also, clearances are trash and we can’t win a scrap or the ball when it hits the ground. Voss and Goodwin in a Loser Leaves Town match. Carlton by 22.