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A big thank you to all those who contributed to Demonland during the past season and also to everyone who posts here and even to those who visit but don't post. We value your contributions and ongoing support - especially to Nasher who keeps us going on the technichal side, our moderators whose task is often thankless - especially so when we go through a season such as the last few we've experienced. Particular thanks to our regular contributors, Whispering Jack, George on The Outer, The Oracle, JVM and KC from Casey. With the exception of KC they've often had to report on games and subjects that have been difficult to write about in 2013 but I reckon the coming ones will be more uplifting and exciting stories than those gone by in recent times. As always, we're hoping for a bigger and better season in 2014 and are always looking out for new contributors who have something to say about the mighty Demons. If you want to contribute an article feel free to contact me via PM. Cheers & thanks again.

Recruiting thru the Neeld era was generally very positive - Clark, Dawes and Viney in the 2nd round.The whole Pedersen, Rodan, Byrnes, Gillies angst is overblown.

God I hate that term, every time someone puts it out there we get another failure.

I have been a big fan of Joel's since his first game with us. Yes, his disposal was occasionally tragic but you would never see any half hearted, head ducking one time efforts that we see from other players still on our list. He gave nothing less than his all at every contest and as a supporter you cannot ask for anymore. Good luck in your future endeavours Joel

Your both drunk, go to bed.

Same [censored] Barrett that said Watts will leave the Dees, Rodney Eade to coach us and the list goes on ... Don't listen to him.

I turned up at Gosch's Paddock bright and early this morning and nobody was there? I think 2014 must start tomorrow or the day after.

90% of good kicking is actually having a good option to kick to

all this fuss about Tom Boyd, imagine if Jesse Hogan was still in the draft He would be consensus pick 1 by a mile

Is it just me or does Tommy Franklin ( AKA Salty Rain) bear a striking resemblance to Jack?

We must mark this club hard from now on. We are the backbone of the supporters of this club. I read Dland before i read the club website. I am still pumped that PJ signed Mr. Roos We members deserve the best from this old and proud club. It will rise and we are the beginning of making sure it does. Our list is not good enough. It can be in time. Those who wish to leave can leave. We will build a list of September players if the members expect it. Average performances must be unacceptable. What i am saying is take off the red and blue glasses. We must be hard on this club. Roos must do at least 3 years. If he walks that could be the end. But he is not going to...We must demand that the whole club toughens up. To win the 13th we have to beat similar pressure that we witnessed yesterday. 120 minutes of sustained pressure. Weekly.

And why do 1000's of single and available Asian women keep on wanting to chat to me via Demonland? Or your more mature fatties? Just wondering.

Everyone seems to be assuming from Barrett's message that Sylvia won't be there because it's his choice and his alone. But what if Roos and Melbourne have taken the view that he's not worth the price? Personally, I reckon we would get more value out of a 30/31 year old Chappie than Colin but, in any event, like WYL, I won't be losing any sleep over his departure if that turns out to be the case despite his improved form in the latter half of 2013. When all is said and done, he is a product of the pampered culture that prevailed in the latter half of the Daniher years and the Bailey and Neeld periods. He had to be disciplined often over the journey. Perhaps it's a good thing, after ten years, for Colin to take his life membership and try himself out elsewhere and for the club to take the morsel of compensation that's doled out and for both to move on.

I get a little rush of enthusiasm whenever people mention Adam Simpson as the successor coach. Huge respect for such a low-key player and leader who achieved consistent excellence for an entire decade. A few year's experience coaching the midfield, particularly stoppages at Hawthorn hasn't hurt his credibility, either. On a side note. interesting how many of Hawthorn's coaching panel are in some way connected to Melbourne, historically; Clarkson, Fagan, Ratten, Yze and Bruce have all been Demons at some point.

And you dont think Richmond just might of, sort of, kind of and actually did do that as part of the intensive 24/7 hypercare delinquent program they have had for Martin in the past 3 to 4 years?

I'm not worried about the "pensioner" thing myself. List management is constantly evolving and, now that free agency has taken hold and is better understood, clubs are poised for a much different recruiting landscape that prevailed even two years ago. We've already shed eight players with delistings and retirements and I can see some more to come in the month ahead. I expect the total turnover of our list to number around 12 which means we should be able to include a mix of different players of varying ages coming from different places. The list under Roos will be vastly different to what we had at the end of the Bailey reign just two years ago.

Cut it out with the abuse please folks.

Let's face it - one our many deficiencies is lack of experience and a Chapman will help us even the keel a bit while our younger players develop and also help them. As long as the cost isn't too great I'm happy to add Chapman and Cross to the list - it will improve us overnight (although we'll cop lots of criticism from the naysayers and the usual suspects in the media).

Can I just say one quick thing. Not having a go at anyone, but I have bit my lip a fair few times when the whole 'GWS has failed' thing comes up. I live in the Western suburbs of Sydney and have since 1989. I have been through hell and back supporting not only my club, but the great game in general. Was teased and constantly hammered in the 90's, but I lived with it. I have played football for 2 clubs in Sydney, one in the early SFL days and still currently play for a Division 1 Sydney AFL club. Since the AFL jumped on the GWS thing, we have had 4 of our main grounds completely redone and in tip top condition with all new surface, lighting and irrigation systems. We have a full structured and solid competition, with not only a website that is constantly updated with scores, but now we are also getting live stats taken down as well. The kids at school now have Aus Kick available (prior to that PE teachers didn't even know the game to teach it). My friends 8 year old daughter came home the other day and told us she wants to play AFL. This would have been unheard of prior to the AFL's move in Western Sydney. I'm not having a go, but just try to think about all the little things that go on, before you all write off the GWS idea. There is a lot more to the community than just a team, they visit the schools, they spread the game and I couldn't be more proud of the great game in the city I live in. I will also be attending the game next week at Skoda Stadium with a whole bunch of friends who have recently gotten into the game. For as long as I remember it would just be my old man and myself at the Swans games cheering on the Demons all by ourselves. This has all changed since the AFL took interest into Western Sydney. It has truly made a huge difference and we constantly get new players to our club that have come over from Soccer and League. Those numbers increase every year.

If he had any ticker, he'd have taken the competition by the scruff of the neck and done something about success years ago.

first time post guys so go easy i think it is a must to trade pick 2 for adams and gws's compo pick to draft freeman and then use pick 20 on dunstan if he slides

We can't afford Dustin Martin but we can afford Shaw? Come on Dees, get the priorities straight.

If he had any of that, he'd be a good footballer.

You may think that but you're quite wrong. It was the view of the AFL that we shouldn't get a PP. Vlad has overseen such a powerful and successful competition that the AFL have had a chance to support basket case clubs who in normal circumstances would now be in the hands of the receivers. You can snipe at the little issues all you like but the reality is he's been exceptionally successful in growing the brand and he's saved our club.

Perhaps Roos signing isn't a great thing for Sylvia at the MFC.

He's playing AFL footy you [censored], and doing it pretty well. I'm sure you've dreamed of that at some stage in your life. It's not very pathetic at all.

If it was for a good trade, I'd be more relaxed. It's the likely lack of proper compensation that concerns me.

The guy isn't too sharp, but this is a bloody shallow and obtuse appraisal.Martin's biggest problem is ambition. He has no ambition outside of football. He always said he felt like he was born to be an AFL player, and that's what he does, and the spare time he has away from doing that is just that, spare time. Idle hands are the devil's tools, and Martin doesn't have the intelligence or the inclination to use his time outside footy to better his own life. He doesn't need a "babysitter" to stop him from sticking a fork in the toaster or eating snails. He needs people in his life to give him the sort of guidance he has obviously never got from his home life, and direct him towards constructive pastimes, and help teach him what he should want out of life. It must be difficult having role models like his father.

I think there might be a few people pulling your leg there...

Fyfe is a W.A. boy?

I beg to differ dee man, Sellar was out of contract and Pedersen has two more years. IMO that is 75% of the reason he is still on our list. I have said this before but when his highlights reel was one game for North I was worried.

He was a commentator last year? he can speak fine, very highly regarded by both Ross Lyon and Paul Roos, been involved at successful clubs, already knows paul roos game plan/ how to implement the bloods culture, there is a pretty strong argument for him to at least be considered as an assistant.

Agreed. Without wanting to be too harsh on players who go in to battle for us, this guy is the avatar of our ladder position.

Actually, So Long Ling is #57 on the menu of my favourite restaurant.

The pleasure's all ours. Thank you.

And I want a toilet made out of solid gold but it's just not in the cards now is it? Rumours people, rumours. Dustin Martin to re-sign because no one wants to give up anything to get him. That is the only rumour I have heard outside of this site. Auf wiedersehn.

Fyfe is an absolute jet, totally untouchable right now.

recruit bennell again, if thats is the 1st priority, as he's a beautiful kick. No, the 1st priority is that a player can play. Then that they have the requisit desire & attitude to improve & a likelihood to become the best they can be. followed by the courage to engage & to take the game on. when the basic needs are all there, then look for the best skilled. and after all the criteria, we need a balance of types as well. BUT lets just forget the peter pans.

Had a chat with my old man after the gf today. He has predicted, and I am not kidding, that Buddy Franklin will become a Dee. He has apparently heard Roos on a number of occasions talk about how good Buddy would be in the midfield and thinks that Roos has already got him stitched up. Could you imagine? God bless the old fella

They provide good hard leads into space for each other, and the kicker knows where to put the ball. The hawks are better kicks because they work harder for each other.

To me Heater doesn't have a "culture" problem. He has a "Buckley" problem. As Does Dale Thomas, Chris Dawes, Wellingham. Players never used to actively try to leave collingwood. Im quite happy to have Heater at our club. We don't have a decent running half back. This guy is one of the best in the business in this position.

Watched him play about 5 of the 11 games, improved every time I saw him. Spoke to him a couple of times as well. He developed, ie picked up the game, quicker than they thought, that he went from coming over to Melbourne during holidays and spending the rest of the time in AFLNZ league, to coming over permanently and playing in the development league. Because of rugby background, he can tackle, has prodigious leap on him, his kicking is getting better and better, played most of the games in defence, watched one incident where opposition isolate him one and one, made three repeat efforts and killed the ball I have him as a real smokey, expect to see him in Casey firsts next year. As for skinny, asked him, fitness staff said he could play at around 90kg, he is still very young, saw his Dad once, of Maori descent, a seriously built guy.

Say what? From what I saw of Tynan, he was build like a brick outhouse. Don't think being skinny was his problem.

Hogan is the only player on the list i wouldn't trade under any circumstances, so my comments on Howe are made from that perspective. Some say he lacks defensive pressure, I agree, and it's because he's an instinctive player with flair and hasn't been coached to include that type of pressure in his game. It's purely a mindset. It's silly to think he won't evolve. Howe is the best mark I've ever seen. I've seen Vanders and Knights - individually and toe to toe, amazing really, I've seen Modra, Barker, Snake Baker's grand final exploits, Jezza, Jumping Jack Hawkins, our own Robbie, Russell Robertson, etc, but none hold a candle to Howe. But unlike some I don't consider him a one trick pony. He has top level endurance, pace, usually good footskills, and at 190cm he's a brilliant size for a utility. At 23 with just 56 games under his belt he's one of the last players a club bereft of talent should trade. Especially when he's finally going to have an 'A' grade coach to improve his game. It just doesn't make sense to move such a player on when you can't be sure how good he'll become. Here's a novel approach. As well as trying to quickly inject a bit of midfield talent through trading some early picks how about we start developing our own talent.

Why go for 2 B grade mids instead of one A grade - very short sighted prefer Aish.

I have never posted a rumour based post as I have no connections to the club or players but I was told of one today that really excited me. Tom Rockliff has agreed to terms with the MFC and will wear the red and blue next season and beyond. I heard he and his girlfriend have become home sick(she is from benalla), and Tom is sick of the off field crap going on up there. My source is my mates sisters best friend is the girlfriend Don't shoot the messenger, but I thought I would put it out there for all demonlanders to know

Jack's loss of pace is a mystery. A lot have suggested he's had an undisclosed osteitis pubis, which is a furphy. The answer is that his foot fracture early season really killed the top 30% of his running mojo. The foot is the 'springboard' from which speed comes, and it would have been playing catch-up all season. He was noticeably quicker in his last 4 or 5 games, and with a full preseason, JT will come back with a bounce. His best is yet to come, and I reckon he, Viney and Toumpas will complement each other beautifully. In respect to Toumpas, he's obviously not at the level of Ollie Wines in respect to his physical maturity, but as he does mature, both his physical capacity and his confidence will grow. His disposal quality, evasive skills and decision making remind me most of Sam Mitchell in his early days as anybody in the AFL, and I'm as confident about his future elite status as about Jesse Hogan.