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On twitter @melbournefc: Neeld: We thought that under 5 goals on the road was a positive. No, not it is not, a 5 goal loss to a top of the table interstate team, maybe. A 5 goal loss to a team as bad as us who kicked poorly at goal and had over 100 possessions more is pathetic. PATHETIC!!!

we lost by 25 goals 3 weeks ago. If Sylvia had kicked a goal at 3:40 in Q4 there would have been 13 points in it. We scored 3 goals less than the opposition without our only 2 key forwards. Unless you have a brain tumour that is an obvious improvement.

Wah wah wah get your chins up you babies No matter how stupid you are you can (hopefully) count, we have matched our opponent for 7 of the last 12 quarters. These are obviously small joys but clearly we have improved since the start of the year. 3 weeks ago we lost by 148, today by 28. Obviously some of you are so pathetic that this rate of improvement is not enough for you. Today at 3:40 into the last qtr, a shot on goal from Sylvia would have reduced the margin to 13 points, he just missed. We matched them for goals in the 1st,2nd and 4th quarters, only losing by the 3 extra goals we conceded in the third. Obviously they kept fighting for most of the game unlike lying down they did for large periods of the first 3 rounds. This was an interstate game without Clark or Dawes, I think it is fair to say those 2 are worth the 3 goals we lost by. Clearly the likes of Jones, McDonald, Trengove and Grimes were well below their best today. We KNOW they are better than that. We have Viney, Toumpas and Hogan to come into the side over the next few... and I don't know wtf is wrong with some people but Byrnes and Rodan were OK today. Just because you hate losing doesn't give you the right to blatently lie in order to slag off Neeld. We are coming from a long way back, these needs to occur gradually, you can't just expect to improve 1000% from week to the next. Stop your bloody whingeing FCS.

Only 10 tackles. What a pathetic effort.

Folks, there's been a fair bit of unnecessary bickering on this thread tonight. Any more will result in immediate bans being put into effect. Thanks.

For God's sake get off Watt's back. He kicked two goals when moved forward with crap supply. He backed back to take a mark and did, early and got clobbered. He is the only bloke in the side, besides Davey, who can actually pass it to a team mate. We are incapable of passing the ball by foot or hand and this makes at least 5 years I have been banging on about it. When we turn it over the overlap is usually a goal. We also have no midfield. We zone and leave opposition players free and it is killing us.

We did not pick Wines. We picked Jimmy. Now, we can spend the next 12 months focusing on every Wines possession,like a mantra for morons, or we can get behind the kid that we picked. Personally, I think Jimmy will develop into a star of the competition. One thing for sure is that I'm not writing him off week 5.

Neeld comes out and says that he doesn't believe in miracles and that fans should not expect it. Hinkley sees it differently.

I love how some people are saying we've improved the last two weeks. Reality check, the quality of our opponent has declined. Back to the thrashing reality next week against Carlton. If we lose by less than 10 goals I'll find a hat and eat it.

For a slight change of tone, I would like to say I was thrilled with one piece of play from Watts today that didn't result in anything much. He actually crashed a pack. Didn't hold the mark, but he also didn't hold back or flinch. He came in full tilt and hurled himself into the pack and damn near had the mark. I've never seen him try it before and it's something I would love to see from him more in the future.

I still question why Neeld felt the need to scrap everything that came before him and start his planning from scratch, taking us into a sub re-building phase and stripping us of any attacking flare that had given us the ability to compete on occasions with the big boys. Without doubt, we were a better, more competitive team under Bailey, which just goes to show how bad things have become. Rather than build on the positive elements that clearly existed within the group, we've gone backwards at a rate of knots. The complete opposite of what Ken Hinkley has been able to manufacture at Port, and what Sanderson did with the Crows last year. I'm a glass half full man, but I can't see him being able to turn things around.

all of a sudden this place is the Brent Moloney fan club, when last year you couldn't open a thread without somebody knifing him hey guess what, we have turned over well over 30 players in the last 3-4 years, a couple of them might actually do OK for other clubs some of you are so peahearted and intent on finding fault in the club it is absurd

We say we dont show effort yet you want to take the leadership off the guy who had 10 tackles. He was given our best player on the AFL site. Giles you are an A Grade tool.

Good on Davey for having a go when Tapscott got roughed up

Our chance to kill a coach other than are own today. And to be equal ninths on the ladder And to play the Suns for a place in the eight next week. Out by percentage. Oh footy is a strange game at times.

Would love to see Jack Watts play that hit up CHF role today.

From what I've read and heard I think Toumpas puts too much pressure on himself, he needs to understand, that other than the small few on here that believe he should be leading the brownlow already, the rest of us just want to see him play some good footy this year and develop and find his feet to become a A grade mid for us.

Enjoy!

How did that work out for Jack Nicholson?

I went along to the game tonight but missed the first 10 minutes. Casey is normally windy but tonight is was ridiculous. At one point I had to move because my eyes were watering into the wind! I was really impressed with the coach - I think it is Rohan Welsh. Clear instructions that were concise and to the point. It was a tough night for good footy. 4-5 goal wind for most of the night. Dunn was outstanding. He played loose across half back, which I know is the easiest position in footy, but his reading of the play followed by his kicking was superb. If Watts does not play well, Dunn comes straight back in. Strauss. Played a very good game. Had a little bit of run-and-carry through the middle and delivered well most times. He appeared quicker than I remembered him. Taggert. I really like this kid. Strong over the ball, showed some gut running and kicked well. Was very smart at times using the ball into the wind. Kicked three (I think) Fitzpatrick.Great game. Proved a handful for Williamstown every time he was near the ball. Ran all night, flew for every mark and his pace was amazing. Seemed to have iron hands a bit - the ball bounced off them when he had a clear chance at marking. An impressive game considering the wind made it a shocking night for tall players. Hogan. Didn't see him get it too much. Toumpas. He got to a lot of contests but didn't seem to impact many of them. However, in the last quarter he was superb. His kicking to position against the wind was really good and he got in an under in defence when needed. Dawes. Not a great game. When he kicked for goal I am sure he did not kick through the ball well, and it seemed he was holding back on a full effort. I doubt he will play for the Dees against Carlton. His positioning and defensive efforts were good at times. Davis. He gets to a lot of contests and plays hard when he needs to. Kent. I was not sure of his number until the game was almost over so I am unsure how he went. Dunn, Strauss and Fitzpatrick played worthily enough to be considered for game against Carlton. Taggert maybe.

Not to toot my own horn here but merely raise the frustration I have with Neeld's thought process, here is a comment I made in the Casey thread. Rodan was good last weekend for Casey. It was his first game back in the VFL and Casey won by 100 points. We'd beaten GWS that weekend.. He comes back straight in after 1 good game, and he is back to some pretty useless football. A junk time goal was really all that saved his stat line and playing in a fairly hustle and bustle part of the ground 11 disposals is simply not good enough. Mark. Other clubs have players dominating VFL week in and week out and not get a game and yet we continue to congratulate mediocrity. He'll be dropped next week and the cycle will continue... It's not how professional sport should work and for the first time in 18 months, I find myself asking is this it. The zones horrific, I've never seen more players run through a corridor unmarked than against Melbourne in my whole life. I'll never give up on Melbourne, but I have no qualms on giving up on the staff within and 5 weeks in theres nothing to tell me otherwise.

Watch us make Hampson look like Buddy franklin next weekend.

Why? The culture is about accepting responsibility for your own actions, be you player, coach, waterboy. The players are accountable, just as the coach is. You are unable to do anything except simplistic, mindless blaming of the coach simply because the game is too confusing for you. You are incapable of seeing the many different things that go together to make the whole, so you look for the 'magic bullet' approach of simply lumping the blame at the feet of the coach. You are willing to absolve the players of any blame, which is strange. That's why you cannot deal in specifics, but rather the motherhood statements and then falling back on the very broad measure of the win-loss column.

Tom McDonald? Are you serious? If you are looking at people to blame for us playing badly I would be looking straight at Rodan and Pedersen myself. Both not AFL standard. Basically playing with 2 players down.

Losing today really hurts our top 4 chances

I'm really looking forward to seeing Nathan Jones, Matt Jones, Jack Trengove, Rohan Bail, Jordie McKenzie, Dean Terlich and Jack Grimes all in the same team. All of them are hard running, good tackling mids who will try all day no matter what happens.

It's funny how last season many of the anti-Neeld brigade said we should've landed Sanderson. No mention of Hinkley at all. Port's 5-0 thus far this season. And now it's Hinkley. No mention of Sanderson. At all. Talk about blowing in the breeze.

Rubbish, anti-Neeld biased comment. Compare Port's list, then compare ours. Hinkley actually had something to work with, and it's not so much of a 'miracle' to turn around a list with talent like theirs.

Thanks for the reports people I like freedom of speech and all that but seriously there should be some sort of policy on cretins who hijak threads with garbage If a post annoys every single person that reads it, its author should be dealt with

I have been reading a lot about the Demons lately - as most of us probably are - and have been trying to formulate my own unbiased opinion about which way the club is headed: up or down. Personally I think we are headed up - and have come a long way - it's just that we started from so far down, to the rest of the world we still look disorganised, uncontrolled, demotivated and below standard... But in the back of my head I recall an interview with Woosha about the rise of the West Coast in 2011. (For some background information, West Coast's end of season positions since 2006 have been 1st, 3rd, 15th, 11th, 16th, 4th, 5th.) I cannot remember where I saw the interview, and if anyone can find it that would be great, but I think it was probably during On The Couch or something similar because I recall hearing the question as well as the answer (why can't reporters be mic'd at press conferences???)... The question went along the lines of: "For the last three years you have been pretty terrible - last year you even won the wooden spoon. Now you are in the top four. What have you done different? What changes have you made?" The answer: "Nothing. We have been working on this training plan and gameplan for a few years, and the players have finally caught up with how we want them to play." I think this is exactly where the Demons are at. 12 goals in one quarter is an accomplishment - even considering the opposition. In our 150+ year history, this surely isn't the first new team we have played against. A lot of people seem to be sick of the rebuild of the rebuild of the rebuild. I concur. But not for the same reasons.I don't see this as a rebuild at all. Quite simply, its a build. Build our club; build our momentum; build our supporter base; build our profitability; build our professionalism; build our player list. But build it right. Stuff the media - it's their job to whinge and whine - but be nice to them, they cant help it, they are like politicians - all about "What's in it for me?" The attitude you get from selfish people that have no concept of bonding teamwork. And stuff the critics. They are probably all Collingwood supporters anyway and who wants to listen to them? I have been supporting the Demons for as long as I can remember. My father is English and supports Liverpool and my mother can recognise the Demons Guernsey and knows if we are doing well or not, so not so sure how I got this passionate for them - but the one thing that being a Demons supporter has absolutely taught me is loyalty. Whether we win 1 game in a year, or every game in a year, I will still wear my Demons guernseys/shirts/jumpers/sweaters at every opportunity and I will always look forward to the next match. I do hope that the Demons win a premiership* - hell, I hope they win them all - but just like I wouldn't kick my kids out for underperforming, I will never turn my back on the Demons because I believe that, just like Neeld, Craigy and the entire club keeps saying, the players are doing what is required of them and just like Woosha said, at some point everything will fall into place, and the Demons will return to the top of the ladder where they will see the success we are all waiting for. * I would prefer the Demons premiership winning run to wait until I can afford annual trips down from Brisbane to the MCG with my family of five... but understand if they aren't willing to wait that long.

There does not seem to be that much at all considered with Moloney. Aside from Jones he would walk into our midfield. He is another player who was ostracised and jettisoned in a poor manner. He made a few people in the coaches box look repeatedly stupid....if that was not happening already

Moloney has made a career out of smashing rubbish sides. Awful flat track bully. Rarely plays well against strong sides. Bailey set up blocks which enabled Moloney to win centre clearances in tanden with Jamar, but which were easily countered by better organised on-ball oppositions. Neeld demanded Moloney win his own footy, and Moloney showed he was not up to the task.

The big mistakes that hurt more than the rest... Byrnes kicking into mark... Brisbane Goal! McDonald dropped mark... Brisbane Goal! The umpire paying ridiculous holding ball against Tierlich in goalsquare... Brisbane Goal! Oh yes... Bail not hitting up Davey in goalsquare in last qtr... cost us a certain Goal!

every time a commentator makes an anti-melbourne comment you can bet a demonlander will make a thread as if it was their idea

I've taken this from one of my other posts. It is relevant here... I'm still trying to wrap my mind around this friggin list Neeld and co have put together. Did anyone watch Pedersen today? Actually did anyone know that he was out there? Well he was. Played like a bloody donkey like has most of his career. Great drafting skills ... Moloney B&F 2011, Neeld didn't play him 2012, so he leaves for the lions 2013, don't blame him. I'm sick of this rubbish. The positive to the loss today is that it puts more pressure on Neeld, hopefully the club will react this week and finally get rid of him.

He rarely has a bag scored on him and even today he was one of our better defenders

Great goal from Watts. I still hate everyone.

My iPad is a good chance to be embedded in my TV shortly.

Watts backs back with courage for a mark. Good to see

Bickering BEFORE the match has started. Anyone would think we were nervous about this one..

There has been doubting toumpas' around for about 2000 years

Looking forward to watching Big Maxy again!

I've just put on another $20.00 via sportsbet. Go figure, I lost $200.00 on us last week and we won!! FMD

Come on I just want the game to start!.....3.15pm.. geez what a time for a game of footy.

Thanks for the Casey reports, it is a nice bit of background to know that we seem to have at least a bit of current depth and potential coming through. Get the impression that plenty of the Casey-listed players have good solid football attitudes, too. As for the Toumpas talk.. hmm... Toumpas' long term role is likely to require that he maintain super-high fitness levels, providing the handball-receives and entries into 50, the continuous movement around and through packs that loses a tagger, and the body strength to go when it is his turn, particularly for the run-down tackle. Right now, he's had one preseason. This is a distinct factor for the role he is set to play. If things go well, he'll become a fully-rounded midfielder, and as such, priceless. As for how much we can pin on his first season or two just ask... Lenny Hayes, Nick Dal Santo, Scott Pendlebury, Brent Stanton, Brett Deledio, Travis Boak, Corey Enright, Bryce Gibbs... you get the picture.

How is that trolling? Some do expect the world of him already. After game 1 he thought he le the whole Greek community down FFS. Then you read he comes off down on himself cos he hasn't impacted as much as he would like too. Putting too much pressure on yourself can be very counter productive.

if we roll them today he wont be flying under the radar anymore thats for sure Will also be a massive pressure release for Neeld and the boys GO DEMONS

LOL This is hilarious. "and then for no reason at all the guy just hit me" you have said this a few times in your short life haven't you

Toumpas impressed, not so much his game - though he has silky skills - but the way he got pummelled three times in the last quarter, he was hurt, but got up, got into it and continued to put himself in the firing line. The kid will be a gem mark my words.

I look at players such as Garlett who did nothing much year one. We seem to expect 18yo to walk in and change the team while playing in a team that lost its first 3 by 100 plus. I think many here are heavily scarred by the Jack Watts experience and now are not prepared to wait for anyone. Remember what a great first year Rhys Palmer had? Rising star....where is he now???? People on here need to recognise every individual is different and takes their own time. The comments about Todd Viney are out of line given he knew Wines in depth and still went for Toumpas as most people agreed with. Get some perspective and take a chill pill. For what it's worth if you have been to training you would see Toumpas offers more from his shortened preseason than many others we have down there already.