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Knew we were stuffed when Jamar was subbed out at quarter time. Prior to that, we were simply smashing them in the contested possessions and clearances. Strauss was only intended to play the last quarter - had to play three. I expect Grimes will be out next week - he is a trooper. Hope Bennell is not out for the rest of the season. As to fitness - anyone who knows ANYTHING about AFL fitness knows you can't turn an unfit list into a super fit list in one pre-season. This doesn't reveal the incompetence of Misson or Craig - rather it reveals the absolutely drop dead ignorance of the posters posting that mindless droll.

Jaded your lack of understanding of the game is unbelievable. We lost Jamar early, then Bennell, then carried Strauss and Couch in their first games at this level for the year. We got killed on the spread because we had nothing left. We made skill errors because the simple options dried up because of lack of run.We refuse to man up because we had nothing left. You want bring to Gysberts in who is renowned for having no tank to improve our spread? Replace Bennell (small forward) and Petterd (lead up forward) with him, they dont even play the same role. Were we perfect today no but get a grip.

Fitness in this context = AFL standard or better. However, it seems when Misson took over the reigns at the MFC, we were less than AFL standard. Notwithstanding that I spoke to John Quinn (Head of Sports Science at GWS) recently at a corporate function and that he confirmed the following view in spades, I'll provide another account for stating this view. I injured my hip flexor earlier this year. A mate referred me to a leading sports physio in Sydney to treat it (he also does the physio for several rugby clubs in Sydney), but takes fee paying individuals as well (ie, me). I asked him whether he knew Dave Misson. He said 'of course, everyone in the industry does'. I then asked him whether he's any good. His response - 'yep, he's one of the best. I don't actually know him very well, but he's got an enormous reputation.' I then asked, 'how long before he gets the Dees up to elite AFL fitness?' His response: 'Probably about 3 pre-seasons - and, that said, he won't even try to rebuild the senior players. It's too late for them - he'll just try to tweak them. Whereas for the younger players, he'll invest the time - BUT it will take a lot of time and patience too. There are no miracles in this space - it's all hard work, and I understand they were a fair way off the pace - so, for them, it'll take even longer. First of all, they need to catch up to the other clubs - all of which put enormous energy into this area as well - but, to then surpass them - well, that's not easy because they also have elite regimes and elite athletes, and they're all going like a bull at a gate on this stuff. So it's not easy at all. I'm confident you'll be happy with the results in a FEW years from now though'. My take out - most lay people don't get this area - it's simply too scientific. They simply want instant results, and, if those results are not there instantly, the supporters get frustrated. BUT I strongly suspect the physio's analysis above is correct. 100% correct. This stuff takes time. And the new regime hasn't had the requisite time just yet. To suggest otherwise is plainly stupid. But then again, the dominant majority at the time also thought Galileo was wrong.

Flower Power. I just added the goal kickers and best players to the post above from the end of the game. Gysberts was probably in Casey's best to half time but was quiet in the third quartermand did a couple of good things in the last. Same goes for Morton although he was the better of the two. Spencer played a great game in the ruck and given the Russian's injury today, he should be back at Melbourne next week. Jack Fitzpatrick played well in patches - he could have kicked four today. One of his misses was a brain fade when he marked 15 metres out, tried to play on and messed upmhis shot for goal. Jake Spencer had 45 hit outs and kicked the winning goal. Brent Moloney had 20 touches, 12 clearances and four tackles. Other stats: Morton 27, Panozza & Gysberts 26. Michael Evans had 19 disposals and two goals in limited game time in his first outing for the year after a back injury. Mitch Gent played the first half in the development league game and was called up late to play in the seniors at Windy Hill. He finished the game with 19 disposals and kicked two vital goals in the final quarter. The Scorpions defence was strong all day. Troy Davis worked hard down back and took some telling marks, Nev Jetta had 19 disposals, Brayden Salton had 24 touches and Michael Riseley did an important job on a tough opponent. With the injury situation at Melbourne it's amazing that the Scorpions keep coming up every week. On top of that they have three of their own best players out with injury - Matthews, Lees and Nicholls - and yet they keep coming up every week with new players who adapt well to the game at this level. Fortunately, they have a bye next week to charge the batteries and regenerate.

"Analysis" of the players and the staff doesn't get much lower than this.

What is there to say. You've done a lot of work there, Captain Obvious.

Today has made it clearer to me that we are definitely on the right track, I know were sick of it hearing it, but its gonna take time. This new regime is a couple reset from the Bailey era and us supporters just have to cop that, bring on 2013...

I would prefer our culture not be so corrosive to talent. Sewell, Enright, Chapman - yes they are a sort term solution but we need help to fix a culture of ease and laziness and they will help. More kids isn't the answer, the answer is setting standards and meeting them and getting games upon meeting them.

Good call. My own favourite was in the last quarter when 50 was paid for interference after a mark, but the umpire hadn't paid a mark!! I feared for my health at that point. I think the umpiring this year has been terrible and not just at Melbourne games. The AFL need to do something, the umpiring is a total farce.

Really happy for him. He's put his head down and worked really hard to become a good player, which you can only respect.

Guys... Had Russian stayed on..Bennel as well we would have won.Simple. We couldnt stay fresh or maintain our thrust forward . A brave effort. Some of you lot..fair dinkum bunch of whingers !!! Its getting better ffs.

One player I thought would have been handy today was Sellar. Once the Russian went down and Martin went into the ruck we looked seriously undersized in the forward line.

For all those that haven't seen 'ology ...... Bluey is just a [censored] stirrer that pokes others with stereotypical negative supporter stuff. If you know this it's actually pretty funny. What's even funnier is when other posters come on and agree with him!! They're the stupid ones.

A famous victory for Casey who go to top of the ladder. Casey Scorpions 2.2.14 5.5.35 6.8.44 11.11.77 Bendigo Gold 3.2.20 6.5.41 11.7.73 11.8.74 Goals Casey Scorpions Evans Fitzpatrick Gent Williams 2 Morton Page Spencer Bendigo Gold Little 3 Hunter 2 Dalgleish Lee Merrett Thompson Slattery Winderlich Best Casey Scorpions Spencer Salton Riseley Davis Jetta Moloney Bendigo Gold Slattery Lee Little Williams Hunter Winderlich

I don't think that's what Stuie's saying KingDingAling. That Moloney is out of form, or no longer able to cut it with the new regime (which is clearly what we need), doesn't mean it's acceptable to brutalise the guy. We're not Syria here. Moloney has been a great, loyal clubman for us for many, many years. That IMO is to be respected when comments are made about him.

I think this thread has degenerated into people using it to slag off a great (albeit out of form) servant of our club, and should now be closed. I'm ashamed to support the same team as some of you snipers on here who take joy in eating their own.

Has copped a lot of unfair criticism - fantastic set shot to win the game after the siren. Richmond... Shows the real danger of selling home games.

Today's performance gives me some hope. We were undermanned, suffered injuries and played a reasonable side with a superstar forward. I thought we actually looked like an AFL side today. Sure the skill errors were still there but our tackling and desire for a contest were great.

I have two things, closely related, to say about that game. 1. Sam Blease was hit square on the top of the head while bending to pick up the ball and not only did the umpire not blow his whistle (despite a number of soft high contact frees to Fremantle), but the commentary team on 7 didn't even mention it in passing. Shocking. 2. The umpiring today was truly a disgrace. Not just the questionable calls they made, but the many blatant frees they failed to pay as well. Obviously the Blease non-call noted above stood out for me, but there were many others, such as the one-handed toss to a teammate on the boundary in full view of the ump, which are worthy of note. I think the single biggest improvement the AFl could make to the game is to introduce a proper professional body to govern umpiring, including penalties for poor or clearly one-sided performances.

You are kidding me. Is this a Bluey-esque joke? What do you think fitness is? (He says, with popcorn in hand)

Nah fatigue would have no impact on a guy in his first senior game back after brutally breaking his leg last year meaning losing all fitness he would have built up in his short career especially with our rotations down due to injuries. How was his disposal in the first 3 quarters?

Dont like your view of getting rid of Neeld. WE'VE GOT THIS!

There were definitely some good signs today, we worked hard, spread a bit better, moved the ball well. Losing Jamar and Bennell ruined us, especially Jamar which threw our structures out and destroyed Martin. However, there were still far too many skill errors which hurt us with turnovers. Jack Grimes turned the ball over about 6 times by foot. His kicking is simply deplorable (and before people jump down my throat, at least 3 of those turnovers occurred before he hurt his ankle). His effort, strength, marking and leadership aren't questionable, but his kicking is as bad as any player on our list. I'm sick of players kicking backwards and sideways seemingly simply because a player is free, rather than because it helps us move forward or set up a play. Tom McDonald gave up two goals because he didn't kick precisely when going backwards/sideways. The last goal of the game also was conceded because Grimes didn't kick with precision when going sideways. It's infuriating. We also spent too long with players behind the ball which didn't help us score, and Jones was taken out of the game by Crowley which hampered our clearance work. Pleasing to an extent, but still lots of work to do.

Spot on b59. Sometimes i just have to shake my head at some footy fan's (and professional commentators for that matter) refusal to recognise the impact of injuries - either in a match or across a season - to a team's fortunes. It seems to be ingrained into footy culture - old school culture at least - not to blame injuries, but in my opinion it is by far the biggest factor in football, at least when teams are roughly level. Look at every winner of the flag in the last 30 years - they have one thing in common: a great run with injuires and sufficient depth to cover the inevitable problems. And not just the number of injuries but who they are too. GF winners generally don't lose too many of their key players. In this match we lost Jamar early and Martin was clearly stuffed. And because of injury Sellar was not there to give him a chop out (and made sure Garland ghad to play up back, robbing us of a forward option). Grimes was injured and off for some time and when he came back on couldn't offer the usual run. Bennel was off and robbed us of rotations. Add not having Clark - who provided our forward structure and created our shape - and Watts out (who in a short time has become super important down back interms of our set up - just look at how we struggled with both kick ins and back half clearances) added to our difficulties. Of course a Collingwood say, who has the depth to cover injuries, or Wet Coke for that matter will manage them better than a time light on for talent like the dees. But if Collingwood lose Cloke and WC Cox those clubs premierships hopes are shot - depth or no depth. To not acknowledge the impact of injuries is,to my mind, just plain silly and reflects a really simplistic, naive view of footy.

Depressed more than usual today. We started well, we were unlucky with injuries, but there's just such a massive sense of resignation being a Dees supporter these days. I know the effort was there today, so not mad at the boys, they had a crack, just the usual weekly heavy heart.

I am sure if Sanderson was coaching us we would have won today.

Great post Dee Landing. Just the sort of ordinary response from supporters we need right now - particularly given that your 'analysis' seems to be based entirely on irrational emotional responses, rather than clearly reasoned evidence based thinking. Neeld, Misson, Craig, Rawlings, Brown and a few others have brought a professionalism to this club that it's not ever seen before. That, to me at least, is clear. Doesn't mean they can transform the joint (and the list) in one season though. To suggest otherwise would be naive in the extreme. I feel very confident they will though. All the signs are there IMO. I think you will see a very different team in 2013. It will be a Mark Neeld moulded team. And I reckon it will perform pretty well.

We always get killed on the spread. When we lost Bennell why didn't they rotate Petterd through the centre to ease the pressure on the midfield rotations? He has played there before. Why not push Rivers back in the last when it was obvious the backline was under siege? It's never ideal losing players early in the game, but it doesn't lead players to give away dumb 50meter penalties, or not manning up in the goal square. And our spread would be aided enormously by someone like Gysberts who can win the ball inside. As it is our best runners like Howe, Blease and Bail can't win their own ball so their spread doesn't help us because we struggle to win the contested ball. Besides we are currently playing lots of imperfect players in an effort to expose them to game time. Blease loses his man in just about every contest. Bennell can't get a touch. Tappy is too man conscious and not ball conscious enough. Developing Gysberts sure as hell does more for us long term than persisting with Bate for example. Why is it no ok to expect more from this team? Why do I not understand anything about the game because I am not pleased with players constantly turning it over? Running to the wrong spaces? Not manning up? FFS I get that being optimistic is all we have left, but I doubt Neeld was happy to get destroyed in the last quarter, and we shouldn't be either. P.S.- being a condescending [censored] doesn't make your point anymore valid.

Suck it up princess No good coach's in 50 years I believe Daniher would have something to say about that. Our facilities have been reported to be pretty good unless you have been down there lately maybe you could give some in depth knowledge into that instead of spewing up rhetoric you have probably heard from Greg Denhim. I could go on but like trying to explain the holding the ball rules to my wife THERE IS NO POINT!

Good effort by Stef he is showing he is a genuine forward/2nd ruck. Jamar was smashing them in the clearances in the 1st. Just ran out of legs and the hard pre season is taking it's toll but I believe we will see more injuries next year until ultimate fitness is reached by the group. There will be casualties along the way but we will get to an a grade fitness.

Too easily pleased. Yes we ran out of legs, but we also make dumb decisions with the footy (or have a dumb coach!), we can't hit targets and we refuse to man up. Once again we got ripped apart on the run. They broke away and spread while we sat and watched. And for as long as our midfield fails to compete I will keep asking where the [censored] is Gysberts? Why are Bennell and Petterd getting a game ahead of him? And how can you justify playing Bate in the middle when we are already lacking run? We weren't unlucky to lose. We got smashed for about 30% of the game.

Damn, I watched the wrong game.

Difficult game to analyse, apart from the last quarter I thought we fought all the time and the last quarter CAN be put down to lack of legs from our injury toll. There were plenty of positives to take from the day but unfortunately it will be overshadowed by the fact we lay down, every other quarter we able to find goals at the right time to step the flow but no one could do that and then once the game was done we went back to what know and that's playing stupid, unskilled footy. F$ me we're getting some bad luck though. And 13000 for the crowd, seriously some Melbourne fans need a kick up the backside, Jimmy worked so hard to get this club out of debt and they can't even bother to turn up for a match just because it's at Etihad.

Sometimes you're unlucky. Freo probably would have run over us anyway, but losing a couple of players made it pretty much impossible to stop them. We were running on the spot at the end. Showed some good signs, but unfortunately we : - Lacked spread - Lacked Clark up forward (especially when Martin had to ruck). Definitely getting better, though.

No. They had a dip just ran out of legs. They do show a bit today, week by week it's coming together. It's far to easy to just knock them.

Six goals before quarter time. That's usually a day's work for Melbourne! Leading every stat except for free kicks.

I loved their response...all rose as one and literally turfed the bastard in the air and on his arse.I DARE the AFL to fine them for that !!.. Hes a cheap thug Judd.. thats all..

I agree Macca.......It's so easy to pick out players good points and their faults.....If Jose did the same assessment of any other of our players.....The results would be very similar......Therefore 25 of our players would be put on the market to see what we could get for them.......As I have said before It sickens me the bagging that our players get from so called supporters.....BTW I liked your old avitar better.....

Was good to see the North players fly the flag, and instantly react and send Judd flying. They are clearly a team with great respect, and caring for one another and look at the results they are now getting. That's what our boys have to strive to build with each other!

And I couldnt care less, I'm here to talk footy, not listen to you cry me a river. Its not my fault that Neeld has came in and made Moloney pay attention to the defensive part of his game - and now he can't buy a kick. Its not my fault Neeld has came in and wants cleaner disposal going inside the 50 and now Brent isnt getting first use of Jamars taps and has to work harder for a kick!

I thought exactly the same thing. The Swisse Vitamin King's commenting about a predecent set in 1931, was soft and embarrassing and insults the TV audience

sniper!! happy to get people when they are in vulnerable positions should he get weeks...yes will he get weeks....no hate the bloke

Actually watching that now with the sound I have to say that the behaviour of the 7 commentators was only slightly less disgraceful. Their inane giggling at Judds actions really backs up the thoughts of the man in the street that this bloke is treated defferently to the rest by the media mugs.

Expect this statement from Andrew DubmItriou: "The incident was clearly seen by the adjudicating umpire who quite rightly awarded player Judd a free kick for a cowardly and unprovoked attack by Kangaroos players. There is nothing in the video to suggest that Judd was doing anything untoward, but was merely attempting to assist an opponent to his feet. The MRP will however closely scrutinise the actions of several Kangaroos players for their attack on Judd."

He has a history of gutless sniper acts. How he won his second brownlow beggars belief, insufficient force!!! A protected species. The pressure points incident was not only gutless but openly admitted and clearly intentional, this act is no different. He has intentionally set out to hurt a helpless opponent. It's a shame such a great footballer also happens to be a cheap, gutless sniper.

So good to see them getting thumped tonight , couldn't happen to a nicer club

This is getting ridiculous. So the reining B&F winner, experienced, big bodied, good leader, still relatively young, should be let go of because he has been badly out of form this year? And us anonymous hacks somehow know better than the FD! And I thought only Tigers supporters ate their own!

No. Your username says it all.

Moloney has always had 'quiet' games where he is completely taken out of the game. It is because smart coaches realise that he can only play on his right side; right foot kick - usually bombed up in the air into the forward line indiscriminately, right hand pass and he only has vision to the right hand side of the ground. Because of his bullish style, his junior coached probably never coached him out of it. Now, it seems that most teams overplay his right side and he can't get the ball and when he does get the ball, his opponents don't let him do anything with it! This is not something that can be easily changed or taught at his age.

Rivers kicked 4 against GWS and that's just about it as far as forward highlights go (unless you are including some shocking set shots) Garland has been more of success in the forward line this year. Time for Riv to go back again. And this year Green has been NO dimentional at AFL level. But, of course, he stars at VFL level.