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I haven't been paying to much attention to the endless comments being made by the many football "experts" out there at the moment, many of who are lining up to put the boots into the easy target. David King was the latest to have a crack, probably the biggest crack so far, suggesting the board should come out and sack Neeld now and admit they made a massive mistake. A load of misguided, uninformed tripe like a lot of the stuff being said. One thing he did say caught my attention though. He likened Neeld to being a square peg being pushed into a round hole. He of course made out that this was the whole problem. Neeld didn't match our club in some way and therefore shouldn't be here. I actually think this is why he is at this club. We need someone like him to come in and force his way into our club, and change the shape of the hole until it is the shape it needs to be - fully professional, resilient and ready to match it with the rest of the AFL. Neeld signed up others like Misson and Craig who could help do this from a fitness and discipline area. The square peg is needed, and time needs to be given for the square peg to mould the hole into the right shape.

This morning on SEN they were talking about our trumpeter. I was half asleep so I missed it but according to Demonology he has been suspended for being to long on the ground then being rude to an AFL official. He has been suspended for 2 home games meaning he will miss the pies game. God I hope this is true.

Actually its not the same team, Jurrah has played 3/4 of a game, Steph Martin 1 game, Col Sylvia 4 games, there's no Tom Scully, Petterd has barely played and is badly out of form, Tapscott ditto, Gysberts also...... Also Gawn played in a couple of wins as well.Thats 7 players that figured in most of those wins, and in fact most of those players were in great form whilst this year have barely played... Don't get too excited, Plus technically two wins were against a first year Gold Coast, which is 6 and a half wins as I don't think Gold Coast counts, one was against Port Adelaide who were barely a team last year (they couldn't beat Gold Coast) in Darwin (which makes the game bizarre every year), another against Brisbane (where we fell over the line), and wins against Adelaide and Freo in Melbourne in which both opposition teams didn't show up. Thats 2 and a half honourable wins, while on the other side of the ledger there was a flogging from West Coast, Carlton, Geelong (186), Hawthorn (sound familiar) and bad losses to Richmond and Port Adelaide (remember the team that was barely a team?). It was a terrible year, we could still do better this year (although it is unlikely). But if we are going to hang our hats on last year as a retrospective success then we are in real trouble. And, for the record of the teams we beat last year we have faced 2 (one of whom we also lost to last year). Sydney was a draw so we have done far worse there, but really we didn't even win that game. Maybe assess this year once we have played some of the teams we beat?

If we are serious get Matt Rendell to oversee the draft, He would be a excellent assett, how many might there be 6 changes or more ? go dees

You will find that you have not had any/many replies to this because you have broken many of the cardinal rules of this board. Your piece 1. Thoroughly researched 2. Logical in approach 3. A well thought out and expressed opinion 4. Lack of negativity 5. Non-emotive 6. Not derogatory, demeaning, condescending to anybody Please don't let the lack of feedback stop you putting up more posts like this, I for one thought it was a pleasant change and it highlights one the many issues people tend to overlook 'in the heat of the moment' This will bump it up to the top of the board so hopefully you will get more replies, but be careful what you wish for

I get it, the MFC is playing horribly, nothing has gone right this year.... But Mike coming out of retirement to take his chance to slag us off in media print as well? The AFL media circus is seriously crazy at the moment, and rather than putting something out there that requires thought.... it's the cheap attacks that are akin to laying the boot into a person when they are prone on the ground that get me. Even the article today that Jolly wrote,... he was happy to slag off Melbourne when he was there, lets drag up the corpse of the past and lay the boot in that one too. PLEASE GET A WIN SOON BOYS!!!! I just am so sick of the shite journalism rehashing the same things over and over

One thing I've noticed recently is how many of our young players (whom lots of us often heap crap on) simply haven't been out on the park enough in their early years. Lots of them have spent significant amounts of time injured. I think this is highly relevant in the development/recruitment debate. Are our players not developing because they simply aren't getting any games? For example: Rohan Bail - 23 years, 25 games Sam Blease - 22 years, 2 games Lucas Cook - 20 years, 0 games Max Gawn - 20 years, 4 games Jack Grimes - 23 years, 39 games Jordy Gysberts - 21 years, 18 games Liam Jurrah - 23 years, 36 games James Strauss - 21 years, 11 games I know some of them are very young, but if a few had 50 games under their belts, I think their development would be much greater. For example, I'm amazed that Jurrah has only played 36 games, it seems much more than that. A few of the above are real cornerstones of our future, and they just aren't getting any game time. Even some of our older blokes seem not to have played all that many games relative to their time in the system (Sylvia - debuted 2004, 125 games, 17 per year; Rivers - debuted 2003, 136 games, 17 per year; Moloney - debuted 2003, 136 games, 17 per year; Jamar - debuted 2003, 117 games, 15 per year). Be interesting to see how the average games per year stacks up against other sides, but it seems odd that none of our leaders average more than about 75% of available games. Is that normal?

Thank christ Sheahan decided to weigh in on this topic. I was concerned there wasn't enough inane and uninsightful media coverage.

RobbieF you are entitled to your view on Jolly. I liked him from the time I saw him doing some ruck training at Sandy with White and mentor (at the time) Stynes. I was frustrated by his inability to grasp the opportunities he was given with both hands. That's probably why I am sympathetic to Daniher's alleged indifference. I suggest to you that Daniher thought Jolly had immense natural gifts but wasn't prepared (at the time) to do whaever it takes. Remember, Daniher battled a series of serious knee problems to etch out a handful of games over a decade of pain... He may have thought Jolly was a bit soft. At this point in time, I still rate the N Daniher contribution to football ahead of DJ's and I found his article lacked class.

If Morton gets dropped but Moloney doesn't, I'll be right Royally farked off.

Is this the same David King who came out before the season and spoke about how he loved what he was seeing at Melbourne? This bloke has 0 idea. He spoke about how coaches need to praise players , how coaches need to be hard on players, how bailey has been too soft and how neeld has been too hard. If you listen to the material than comes out of his mouth you soon stop listening to the material that comes out of his mouth.

Well, now that almost every football expert in the land (including the doyen Mike Sheahan) has declared Melbourne an on field basket case it's time for the Demons to consider preparing an application to the AFL for a priority selection at this year's national draft. Some of you might think that the rules only cater for a priority pick if your club has had two consecutive poor years in a row but I believe there have been some recent changes. "Under the new system, which will come into effect this year, a more complicated formula will be used, which takes into account premiership points, percentage, finals appearances and injury rates for a club over several seasons. The new formula will make it more unlikely a club will be granted a priority pick after just one poor season, or that a pick will be given before the first round of a draft." But, if experts such as Sheahan, King, Roos and just about everybody else whose had a say on the club are to be accepted and their views respected, then the Demons constitute a special case because it's likely that the formula will reveal consistent poor performances over six seasons, a low number of premiership points and percentage this season and poor results with no finals appearances since 2006. Sure, an extra priority pick won't, of itself, be the club's saviour but the experts have spoken and if they're right and the trend continues, the AFL will have to give Melbourne a priority pick.

Ah, music to my ears. This "they won 8 games last year, now look at them" line is just so superficial and lazy. If people took the time to really look at those "wins", there was only really one worth writing home about, Essendon. And even then, we got them in their bad patch. Not saying we're any better, but we were seriously bad last year - which is why the whole FD has been sacked/changed/moved on.

If they can make it a life time ban then I'm all in favour.

The bugler is emblematic of our club being about everything but football. I'd be happy never to see or hear from him again.

I have never had time for Mike Sheahan. a so called melbourne supporter who epitomisies what i dislike about the media. Just when the media beat up on mark neeld and the MFC is firing up, Sheahan has to write a "special exclusive" and turn the blow torch up higher on the Dees. What ever happened to supporting teh club you supposedly follow, Mike? When his article comes out tomorrow club supporters need to demonstrate to the footy world that we ar enot going to be swayed by this nonsence. This pressure from teh media is putting the clubs future at dire risk. I can only hope that the board and FD are strong enough to ignore this media bull**** and stay the course. I am gob smacked that people can not see what Mark is trying to do here! This is ALL about the players , not the coach and , hahahaha, not the board. lol. what a ridiculous preposition that is. The players are not AFL standard. Fullstop. Mark wants an AFL standard team and is getting crucified by the media and, im very sad to see , some MFC supporters as well. MFC is not an AFL standard team at the moment. We've brought in a guy to change things and it has become very clear why MFC has never been a successful club. Everyone is bleating about the 'tough love'. To those supporters getting sucked in by the media - Harden the **** up!!. Stay the course and broaden your vision.

I just hope we do the right amount of psychological profiling if we do go for him.

Person A hires person B. Person A therefore takes responsibility for actions conducted by person B on their behalf. What's there to explain?

Couch. WTF. Has been BOG in nearly every game but can't get a go ahead of Sellar, Davis, Nicholson, and Bennell, all of which should be in the queue behind him DESPITE the speed factor. Are we really in that much good form that we have the luxury of leaving out good players purely because we might be a bit too much "same speed"? Are we really any quicker without him? This has got to the point of ridiculous, this kid should be playing, and I'd really like someone from MFC to come out and tell us why not, and not the usual BS about how he's "on the cusp". Play Couch FFS. Have we really got anything to lose?!

Sorry ... you want to shop yourself out in the club's hour of need you open yourself up to scorn.

This is a [censored] thread. Moloney won our B&F. He maybe out of form but he does not deserve this ridicule. The problems go deeper than 1 player.

I don't mind that we dropped the underperforming players, but FFS could those 'ins' be any less inspiring? We've spent years list managing to end up with so many average players. Depressing.

That is one uninspiring list of INs. All it needed was Bate to round it out. Couch, Cook, Taggert, Martin, Petterd...all overlooked. Meh, bring on the slaughter!

I'd be disappointed to see Morton dropped. He wasn't good last week, but neither were about 18 other blokes. He was okay in a few matches before last weekend and I think he deserves another crack.

I cant think of a more fascinating game in recent times. I honestly believe that sections of the media will not accept anything less than a death from exhaustion on the field sunday evening...

Oracle You make a good point for later comparison with the early Clarkson days, or maybe even years, and similar things were being said of Thompson even as late as the early rounds of the first year of their current dominance. I guess neither were regularly flogged nearly so badly as we have been, but anyone who calls Neeld a disastrous appointment, at this stage, should cool it and thing about the re-emergence of Hawthorn and Geelong in the first decade of this millennium. Sure the Cats had some pretty good cheap F/S picks, and didn't bottom out entirely, and the Hawks only briefly, but go back to 2006 when we were the best performed Victorian team and you will find those two were really struggling. They rose very quickly after that. The wheel turns. In perpetual hope - monoccular

Positive: There's only 14 games of this torture left.

worthless thread - take it to the Locker Room Farce and I'll delete your posts there as required

Criticism is fine but where is the intelligent criticism? The depth of analysis? Both oxymoronic terms when it comes to the Herald Sun. It is a sad indictment on the quality of football journalism in this country that Mike Sheahan was for decades considered the doyen of it.

No offence, but this type of post is rubbing me up the wrong way lateley. You might be correct, but there are plenty of ways to skin a cat, and surely there are less drastic or less painful ways to establish the fact that AFL players need to give 100% regardless of talent. Neeld will get the right results eventually, but do we need such a painful transition period, would there have been no other way to get from A-B?!

Was just down at training and I'd say by the match simulation Morton, Davey & Sylvia are out. Green and Moloney were with the blue team - looked like the 1sts. Training was with real intensity. Hard and contested. Interested to see the Line Development coaches over-seeing with Neeld, Rawlings etc right in there with the players coaching intently. Rawlings' intensity impresses me.

Agree wholeheartedly with other posters who state that compo picks don't come into the equation for a priority pick. I will be fuming if anyone at the AFL even hints at our need for a priority pick not being valid because we get picks 3/4 and 12 on top of our usual picks! Those were given to us for Scully, a number 1 pick who isn't on our list anymore! They are irrelevant! Regarding our chances, if we finish with 1 to 3 wins and a percentage around 50-60%, after several years of poor finishes, I think the AFL will have to seriously consider a priority pick after the first round. Edit: spelling

As bad as this season has been so far, I still can't see us finishing below both of the franchise sides. We are in a dark hole atm, but we are also in the middle of our horror run of 7 of last season's top-8 opposition. After the break, there will be a dim light at the end of the long tunnel, and I predict our confidence will lift along with our performances. GWS will struggle to win another game. GC should beat GWS at home. We have two home games against the franchise, and another in neutral-ish Canberra. We won't finish last. So .. 2, 3, 12, 24 (Viney) or 3, 4, 12, 25 (Viney) .. for us (Yes, I believe we will be able to bluff or deal GC and GWS into handing us Viney as a second rounder.)

Article in todays Age stating Rendell is being sort after by a couple of clubs, with Craig's history with him and Craig stating last year the Crows team was the best he had coached I hope we are in the frame if true. http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/rendell-sought-after-by-clubs-20120523-1z5ix.html

I dont want to start a new thread, so I'll put it here to start. Above all else to do with the draft, and I mean everything, and i'll go so far as to say I could not give a rats tossbag about what picks we end up with, so long as we appoint a full time, expirienced, successful, determined and proven recruiter. I know we have Todd Viney in there, but we need the best of the best. Like it or not we will surely have some reasonable picks this year (with or without any priority pick) and we need the right person to pick the best players for Melbourne Football Club. Matt Rendell is available (according to Age article). We have to get to the bottom of the Misfud thing - but he has runs on the board, will be determined to do well and has icked some beauties in his time. The article also talks about his "ballsiest decision ever" which was to pick Dangerfield over Ebert in the draft. He chose who he thought was the better player not the one that lived in SA with a family name synonomous with SA football. Maybe he would be a good person to have in the team to work out how to deal with the Jack Viney position? Maybe his presence may stop other clubs 'over bidding' for him with dummy bids? All I want is to be able to have complete confidence that we have the BEST person in charge of picking the players who really may be the last chance we have of getting this club out of the sh*t. Please MFC, bring in someone, I dont care who, but someone who lives and breathes recruiting. Its too important to ignore and have (with the greaqest respect to Todd) a part timer in Viney in there.

are melbourne playing bad?

Over the past 5 seasons we have turned over many players, coaching staff, Medical staff, a board, new Admin staff but one thing still remains the Bugler, it is time to place the entire blame of our poor performing club onto this constant, the Bugler is our problem not our players or game play.

Ox is just like the rest of us sick of people laying the boots in while we are down, well done Ox doing your bit to get behind the club. All take note

Jones is by far the most improved so far under the neeld style because jones has always been a hard worker and love's a challenge. We need 25 more like this.

The list and performances to date have been cruelled by the inability of Gysberts (back/ankle/jaw), Blease (broken leg), Tapscott (hip), and Strauss (broken leg) to string games together. I still rate all of these players, but they just haven't had a run at it. Young players need consistency of games to develop and they just haven't had that opportunity. Not one of these players has eked out 20 games. Compare that with Jack Redden, Rockliff, Melksham and Bastinac who have all played over 40. Not surprisingly some supporters will start doubting the capabilities of the Melbourne boys, but I reckon each one of them can be regular best 22 players. It will make an enormous difference if they can fulfill their potential. Some may call it bad management, but I really do think it's just been bad luck. Not all of our plight is down to bad luck, but we have had our fair share.

I'm not talking about replacing Moloney and Sylvia with kids, I'm talking about replacing them with Couch (who is no kid - make no mistake, he was recruited because he has a man's body) and Bate. I know it sounds a bit crazy - me from 2011 is currently wetting himself with laughter at the notion of replacing Sylvia with Bate, but I just want players who compete. I agree that it's not going to affect the result as ultimately you're replacing them with inferior players, but at least you get players who will put in the effort required and do the work required. It's just about setting the standard more than anything.

Please no more bugler.

i am a neeld fan ( so far ) BUT all the angst & cheap vitriol replying to this post is infantile & pure high school.. DH HAS every right to vent his spleen & frustration whether it gets seen by DMc or not is irrelevant.!! its human nature..its like listening to your spouse go off half cocked.& then have make up sex.. for crying out loud any supp; has the right to vent. & should do so.. ( that's what this forum is for !! ) taking it too seriously & taking it as a court statement says more about the vicious responders than the poster.!! hiding behind a comp. screen to throw pathetic insults is less than-----ordinary. whether u agree or not that's the point; letting off a bit of steam is the least any long time suffering supp. should do. considering supporters r totally ignored anyway...supporters r a commodity to be used by the club suits and thrown a bone occasionally. & dished up the standard, boring & repetitive cliche's.ie; short term pain long term g??? ( should be honest -short term pain long term pain ) in it for the long h??? stick f?? bunker down. we need the continued support of the s?????????; ... this has been a continual state of affairs....for too long ( read the parting comment from G SZONDY in 2003 )on demonwicki.. 10 years on & the same issues & points fester... it may not be one particular suits fault BUT it is a factioned club with an L & R power play.. AGAIN BUT, the CEO & THE PRES. r in control & have to take full responsibility...of their decisions or lack thereof.. unification starts at the top. MELB. SUPPORTERS r too polite & politically correct.to the club.when efforts r pathetic on field. rich .supporters .spit at the coach going off the ground & leave bags of manure on doorstep & tear up memb.cards. ess. supporters get up in arms & scream abuse & force change and get results.. carlt. coll have similar records..& get change & demand results but melb.r simply too polite & respectful over & over again..& take it up the kyber then told to suck it up & support.. well its about time supporters frustrations r heard. & let it all hang out with good & bad discourse.. blind faith is ridiculous..

I like it. In: Bugler Out: Sylvia Also agree with your point about it being one of those quirks in world sport that makes the goings on more interesting. Hope he comes back after his two-week ban champing at his mouthpiece.

I think there are two trumpeters, so as long as our second bloke comes on through the interchange we should be right v Pies. The incident with the AFL official (a ferocious looking lady) happened right in front of me and my son. We had a giggle at the time because this woman had really played up her ire (in that stage-manager style) over the fact that the coin had been tossed and regulation 326b, regarding tempo of theme songs, had clearly been breached. Mr Trumpeter looked embarrassed, after all, he had landed the gig and he had started on cue. I think I heard him say to the lady official "Where were you when Meatloaf outstayed his wecome!" before trudging off.

bang

It is refreshing to hear someone wear his heart on his sleeve and stand up for the Club and show enough courage to bag someone who he works with at SEN. It was interesting that he admitted that he had spoken to many people at the Club from the Board down and all were committed to Neeld and his future plan. He has always said in the past that he did not have close relationships at the Club. I will always remember after last year's "186" he said that he hated where the Club was and it affecting his life so much that he was fighting with Karen (wife). I think it was not long after this or during that period that he ended up having fisty cuffs with someone at SEN. I loved David as a player and the way he stood up for his team mates against those thugs. He is now standing up for the Club he loves. Like we all should be doing.

Its almost like these guys have become football shock jocks...spout the most extreme views in order to provoke an emotional response in order to gain/maintain media and public attention

I have never been so positive about the future as I am now because I am seeing something occur at the club that I have never seen before ... the complete gutting of our marshmallow soft underbelly and a serious attempt to transform us into what we must become if we are ever to seriously challenge for a flag - a formidable, fighting unit that plays tough, defensive footy. It's high stakes poker time and Mark Neeld, with the board and the co-captains behind him, has gone all-in. Bravo!

Most disappointing for me is the continuing run of bad luck when it comes to the health of our players. We lost Sylvia to a random pre-season injury again. Jurrah plays one game and goes for at least a month with an ankle. Jetta is out for a sustained period with an ankle injury. Gys breaks his jaw (and Viney). And if the on-field incidents aren't enough, Williams has encephalitis and nearly dies. Add to this Evans with a bad back, Gawn's knee and Strauss' ongoing leg problems. These are the guys who would normally be stepping up and showing something, but they've hardly been on the park since they got to the club due to the constant bloody injuries.