POSTGAME: Rd 16 vs GWS

[defuture15 856]

66 points

 

The cumulative points we have beaten by over our 6 losses!

The biggest 2 losses being 27 and 15 points

Being in control for the majority of these games

Running out of time to get it right

[binman 39,291]

1 hour ago, DistrACTION Jackson said:

In a positive note I do need to give a shout out to McVee and Bowey. Along with Salem they are the smartest players in our side and the most skilled. We need the ball in these three guys hands as much as possible and potentially need one to play a bit further up the ground to give us some better looks going inside 50.

Great post.

Didn't mcvees ball handling skills really stand out. Classy player.

[58er 5,690]

1 hour ago, Mel Bourne said:

I’m struggling to see how his occasional shirking of hard-ball-gets, poor positioning at contests and ridiculously-selfish leaps for glory translate as “doing his job”. I see it more as him doing the bare minimum. His tackle count is the most impressive stat out of all of those, and yes, it does indicate effort. But stats are deceiving. How many of those tackles have stuck? How many have resulted in a free kick? 
 

The problems do indeed lie elsewhere (and yesterday, practically everywhere) but his form is definitely one of the ingredients in the current soup of mediocrity we’ve been dishing up of late. 

At long last a microscopic look at Kossie's underperforming  and approach to the team. Partly I also blame the Coaches( Goody and Stafford ) for not getting any apparent improvement since early in the season. 

Not any on the ball or cameos at half back to get him " started" and no team play limitations like his ridiculous marking attempts that are virtually all "unrealistic attempts". 

Sad  that since his contract extension the fizz has gone out of his team play and our results have been ordinary as well. 

We can't afford our equal best goal kicker to fade off in firm and contribution to our efforts . 

[Willmoy1947 3,828]

29 minutes ago, binman said:

Yep, they have more skilled players. And like highly skilled players do, they take their chances

Nor sure i agree, but that is a completely valid question about our game plan.

But one thing we can say with certainty, given the overwhelming evidence, is it doesn't hold up in wet conditions.

On the conditions, I'm glad we only had one injury. The ground was giving way and shifting all over the ground. Perfect conditions for knee injuries.

Our blokes looked as though they were slipping more.

[deva5610 970]

3 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

 

The fatigue argument just doesn't fly. You can't be winning almost every stat line against opponents but losing games and putting that down to mainly fatigue. A fatigued side is not dominating stat lines. 

Came here to say exactly this.

Fatigue can't be to blame for 5.15 when we're at +67 Disposals, +27 i50s, +10 Hitouts, +20 Clearances, +44 Contested possessions, etc, etc. It's madness to suggest it is. If we were fatigued, we'd be getting smashed all over the place, but we aren't.

It's skills, gameplan, coaching or players. Perhaps even a bit of all 4.

I'm bitterly disappointed with the loss but it's hard to say the players didn't gave it their all when looking at the stats. It's a shame but it really is a problem that should be fixable, the million dollar question is can they do it in time?

Edited July 3, 2023 by deva5610

[binman 39,291]

6 minutes ago, Willmoy1947 said:

Our blokes looked as though they were slipping more.

Another theme in the wet.

[Mel Bourne 3,929]

22 minutes ago, Fromgotowoewodin said:

No hard ball gets? 19 possessions yesterday 9 contested, 10 uncontested. 5 tackles, behind only Viney for us.

How many have stuck? The ones that get counted. 
 

How many have resulted in free kicks? Could probably look that up somewhere but I dunno. 2 frees for yesterday. 
 

1.2 yesterday, only player with more scores was Trac with 0.4. Kozzie had 1 assist and 6 score involvements. 

By “stuck”, I mean how many of those have been wrapping players up in tight contests resulting in a ball-up? Yes, those are certainly not without their importance, but those kinds of tackles are just the basic requirements of the game. I’m not overly moved by this statistic when compared to his others. 
 

His game yesterday was a slight improvement on his recent form, but 1.2 is nothing worth getting excited about from a key small forward, who we all got terribly excited about his signing for four more years. 
 

Look, I really want him to do well. Love the kid when he’s on. And they hype from the footy media has definitely been a hinderance when it comes to how we view him as a player. But you can’t deny that he is in a slump, and one many of us here have noticed. I still back him, but he needs to find something better than what he’s currently giving us. Maybe some of that will be solved by giving him space in our otherwise stupidly-congested forward 50. 

[WalkingCivilWar 34,244]

1 hour ago, Jaded No More said:

According to @WalkingCivilWar it wasn’t sounding good yesterday. I guess we will know more today or tomorrow. 

Fritta is in surgery right now. It’s bad, as was suspected yesterday. He won’t be right to play for some time. Pauline is dealing with some other serious personal issues atm so I’m not gonna ask her any more about him except to tell her everyone is hoping the best for him. If she does tell me anything I’d love to come on here and share but I really don’t want to log on because I can’t handle the vitriol and spite that’s flying around. I don’t expect ppl to change nor can I put 100 ppl on ignore so for my own mental well-being best I give DL a miss for a bit.

 Like everyone else, I wish it was better news about Fritta, especially for Pauline since she’s got so much on her plate, but it’s not good news, it’s bad. 

[beelzebub 22,631]

1 minute ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Fritta is in surgery right now. It’s bad, as was suspected yesterday. He won’t be right to play for some time. Pauline is dealing with some other serious personal issues atm so I’m not gonna ask her any more about him except to tell her everyone is hoping the best for him. If she does tell me anything I’d love to come on here and share but I really don’t want to log on because I can’t handle the vitriol and spite that’s flying around. I don’t expect ppl to change nor can I put 100 ppl on ignore so for my own mental well-being best I give DL a miss for a bit.

 Like everyone else, I wish it was better news about Fritta, especially for Pauline since she’s got so much on her plate, but it’s not good news, it’s bad. 

Thanks for your report.

Shame about the lad. 

All the best to all.

 

[Redleg 38,227]

5 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Fritta is in surgery right now. It’s bad, as was suspected yesterday. He won’t be right to play for some time. Pauline is dealing with some other serious personal issues atm so I’m not gonna ask her any more about him except to tell her everyone is hoping the best for him. If she does tell me anything I’d love to come on here and share but I really don’t want to log on because I can’t handle the vitriol and spite that’s flying around. I don’t expect ppl to change nor can I put 100 ppl on ignore so for my own mental well-being best I give DL a miss for a bit.

 Like everyone else, I wish it was better news about Fritta, especially for Pauline since she’s got so much on her plate, but it’s not good news, it’s bad. 

Thanks for the info.

Please send best wishes to Pauline and pass on to Fritta that all DL looks forward to his eventual return and good luck with his rehab.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Redleg

[Jaded No More 59,545]

7 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Fritta is in surgery right now. It’s bad, as was suspected yesterday. He won’t be right to play for some time. Pauline is dealing with some other serious personal issues atm so I’m not gonna ask her any more about him except to tell her everyone is hoping the best for him. If she does tell me anything I’d love to come on here and share but I really don’t want to log on because I can’t handle the vitriol and spite that’s flying around. I don’t expect ppl to change nor can I put 100 ppl on ignore so for my own mental well-being best I give DL a miss for a bit.

 Like everyone else, I wish it was better news about Fritta, especially for Pauline since she’s got so much on her plate, but it’s not good news, it’s bad. 

Appreciate your update. I am fearing he won't play again this year and have resigned myself to that fact, along with our chances of winning a flag slipping away.

I just hope it is not an injury that will impact him long term, because he is so important to us. Fingers crossed it's something he can get right and come back cherry ripe in 2024. 

Please pass on all the good healing vibes from every Melbourne supporter. I think he is one player that is universally regarded as one of our very very best and most important! 

As for the vitriol, I think it's only as bad as you take it. There is as much good analysis mixed in with obvious and understandable frustration, as there is out and out rubbish. I am sure the players are feeling very frustrated, and so it is only fair that supporters feel the same.
I can count on one hand the spiteful comments I've seen here post match to be honest. Most of it is people trying to make sense of the recent poor form, especially forward of centre. As far as footy forums go, this has to be one of the best ones for analytical discussion vs pure [censored] ratio. I don't know that you'd ever log on to a Carlton or Richmond supporter forum! 

Edited July 3, 2023 by Jaded No More

[jules7 722]

10 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Fritta is in surgery right now. It’s bad, as was suspected yesterday. He won’t be right to play for some time. Pauline is dealing with some other serious personal issues atm so I’m not gonna ask her any more about him except to tell her everyone is hoping the best for him. If she does tell me anything I’d love to come on here and share but I really don’t want to log on because I can’t handle the vitriol and spite that’s flying around. I don’t expect ppl to change nor can I put 100 ppl on ignore so for my own mental well-being best I give DL a miss for a bit.

 Like everyone else, I wish it was better news about Fritta, especially for Pauline since she’s got so much on her plate, but it’s not good news, it’s bad. 

Thanks for your report, sounds like the Fritta family need all our love and support, please pass on our best wishes to Pauline and a full recovery for Bailey.  

[Fromgotowoewodin 1,103]

12 minutes ago, Mel Bourne said:

By “stuck”, I mean how many of those have been wrapping players up in tight contests resulting in a ball-up? Yes, those are certainly not without their importance, but those kinds of tackles are just the basic requirements of the game. I’m not overly moved by this statistic when compared to his others. 
 

His game yesterday was a slight improvement on his recent form, but 1.2 is nothing worth getting excited about from a key small forward, who we all got terribly excited about his signing for four more years. 
 

Look, I really want him to do well. Love the kid when he’s on. And they hype from the footy media has definitely been a hinderance when it comes to how we view him as a player. But you can’t deny that he is in a slump, and one many of us here have noticed. I still back him, but he needs to find something better than what he’s currently giving us. Maybe some of that will be solved by giving him space in our otherwise stupidly-congested forward 50. 

Getting a kick is a basic requirement of the game, yet those that get more are more highly rated than those who get less. Similar with i50 tackles, he’s 2nd in the comp at a basic requirement of his job, and in the top ~5% at other basic requirements. Makes him pretty good.

He isn’t in a slump, the team is. Every time he gets the ball there’s 29 other bodies inside 50, clear it out and you’d be amazed at what he can do.

Stupidly congested forward 50? That we can agree on..

[Soidee 1,496]

This team work their butt off for no reward.  Goodwin slowly seeing season fall off a cliff, much like last year.  
 

Our transition to kicking goals is seriously flawed, we more often than not kick it to the opposition backmen, as flippant as this is, I suggest a visit to Spec Savers for the whole damn football department.  Obviously training is not working, must have different dimensions for goal posts, also are they colour blind …kick to a red and blue jumper.  
 

ok I have made light of this, but seriously it ain’t funny anymore, we are been mocked by everyone regarding our skills.  No amount of hard work will win games without skills to back it up.

[adonski 9,353]

1 minute ago, Soidee said:

No amount of hard work will win games without skills to back it up.

We will see come selection time whether they're ready to acknowledge that yet......

[rjay 24,130]

8 minutes ago, adonski said:

We will see come selection time whether they're ready to acknowledge that yet......

Selection is not going to fix it.

We can't select what we don't have.

We have a list problem and we're trying to manufacture a game plan around it.

[WalkingCivilWar 34,244]

1 hour ago, Jaded No More said:

Appreciate your update. I am fearing he won't play again this year and have resigned myself to that fact, along with our chances of winning a flag slipping away.

I just hope it is not an injury that will impact him long term, because he is so important to us. Fingers crossed it's something he can get right and come back cherry ripe in 2024. 

Please pass on all the good healing vibes from every Melbourne supporter. I think he is one player that is universally regarded as one of our very very best and most important! 

As for the vitriol, I think it's only as bad as you take it. There is as much good analysis mixed in with obvious and understandable frustration, as there is out and out rubbish. I am sure the players are feeling very frustrated, and so it is only fair that supporters feel the same.
I can count on one hand the spiteful comments I've seen here post match to be honest. Most of it is people trying to make sense of the recent poor form, especially forward of centre. As far as footy forums go, this has to be one of the best ones for analytical discussion vs pure [censored] ratio. I don't know that you'd ever log on to a Carlton or Richmond supporter forum! 

Just got off the phone with Pauline. I passed on all the best wishes from everyone on DL and she sincerely appreciates having everyone’s support. She’ll pass on the good wishes to Bayley. 
Bayley didn’t have surgery this morning. He’s having it tomorrow morning. He needs to have a plate inserted. He tried to avoid the media at training this morning but to no avail. He spoke briefly to them but I don’t know to what extent.

The feeling is that it’s not season-ending, even if the media decide to say otherwise. So that’s a positive. 

[sydneydee 662]

Our boring game plan is killing the enjoyment of watching footy. Such a wasted opportunity. Grundy looks like a waste of cap space at this stage of the season. 

[ucanchoose 1,806]

Maybe the forwards leading to the ball instead of behind their opponents would work better

[ex52k2 231]

The problem isnt about connection between mids and forwards, get kingy in and he will throw dozens of stats at you

Its all bum fluf. Our one problem is we cant hit a target 7.5 metres wide often enough. We are getting plenty of shots on goal, plenty. Alot of them set shots from good angles. Our scores show if we can hit that 7.5 mt target we will win most games. They are prof. footballers who canr kick. Thank god they arnt surgeons, dead everywhere.

[rpfc 27,663]

4 hours ago, binman said:

Fatigue is a moot point I reckon. 

And to he honest so is the connection and forward issues palaver.

Though it didn't help having three super talls in Brown, Grundy and gawn in such horrendous conditions. Or losing our best kick for goal early for that matter.

We didn't lose because of fatigue or game plan, structure, set up,  etc etc.

We lost that game away with our woeful kicking for goals. Again.

It really is a simple as that.

We dominated that game, and should have won it easliy.

We smashed them in every key stat, including shots for goal.

Twenty shots at goal in those conditions is fine. Particularly when the opposition could only manage 12.

The expected score of 77 -43 tells the tale.

A five goal win turned into a loss because we miss shots on goal we should make. 

Bottom line, we have too many poor kicks. Wet weather exacerbates that huge issue.

The winning goal by kelly was the perfect example of how good technique stands up under pressure and in terrible conditions.

And our ball handling skills are also a big worry, again exacerbated by wet weather. Even tracc fumbles way too often. 

 

But, again, 77 points from 73 I50s is not good. 45 is just awful but 77 is still revealing a poor connection forward.

[beelzebub 22,631]

27 minutes ago, ex52k2 said:

The problem isnt about connection between mids and forwards, get kingy in and he will throw dozens of stats at you

Its all bum fluf. Our one problem is we cant hit a target 7.5 metres wide often enough. We are getting plenty of shots on goal, plenty. Alot of them set shots from good angles. Our scores show if we can hit that 7.5 mt target we will win most games. They are prof. footballers who canr kick. Thank god they arnt surgeons, dead everywhere.

Only 7.5 dead in front...

Our style often has us trying to thread a needle at worst....or kick through a doorway at best.

We dont play clever in the front 50...we make it hard....all by ourselves.

[chook fowler 18,488]

56 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Just got off the phone with Pauline. I passed on all the best wishes from everyone on DL and she sincerely appreciates having everyone’s support. She’ll pass on the good wishes to Bayley. 
Bayley didn’t have surgery this morning. He’s having it tomorrow morning. He needs to have a plate inserted. He tried to avoid the media at training this morning but to no avail. He spoke briefly to them but I don’t know to what extent.

The feeling is that it’s not season-ending, even if the media decide to say otherwise. So that’s a positive. 

hope it's not the dreaded LisFranc.

[rpfc 27,663]

9 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Only 7.5 dead in front...

Our style often has us trying to thread a needle at worst....or kick through a doorway at best.

We dont play clever in the front 50...we make it hard....all by ourselves.

So this is the meat of the issue; we are not getting deep central entries. Our misses are as much a ‘red herring’ as loading is. We don’t get good looks so of course our accuracy is low. 

We need to address why we don’t get good entries. 77 expected score from 73 Inside 50s is not good.

[Jaded No More 59,545]

19 minutes ago, chook fowler said:

hope it's not the dreaded LisFranc.

That would 1000% be season ending. So it doesn’t sound like it. Fingers crossed it’s nothing of that nature.