Any chance we can leave this thread for rumours?

4 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

No no. 

I'm glad you're not in charge. 

All you've done is outlined exactly what the Demonland one-eyed supporter would do. 

Bw too afraid to make decisions based on on fear of future outcomes. 

It's ridiculous you say 'there's no guarantees you can't move up the order' the draft hand we'd get for a trade like Petty but completely brush over the fact that there's also no guarantee he'll get his body right for a full year? Or there's no guarantee that his form will continue in an upward trajectory... 

Does anyone notice this? Lol. 

Nah. Because we love Melbourne players and Melbourne payers only and all else is riskkkkkk so shut upppp. 

Here's the thing, Jimmy, and this'll be my last one on this, as we're going around in circles, some maybe of the view that many Melbourne players are great, but you're of the opposite view that all Melbourne players are ordinary or expendable.

It's fine to be a contrarian and it's why some enjoy your posting, but you've gone off the deep end and this is a perfectly good example. Contrarian for contrarian sake. You don't trade out Petty when we've got no alternative and it's the one zone of the ground that we struggled for continuity and games all year.

As many have now pointed out to you, if we were talking about Oliver or one of our mids, then you'd have a better case for improving a zone of our game by trading out and getting a player or two that would balance us up more.

But your proposition of trading out Petty does not improve the forwardline. Just because Collingwood won a flag with Mihocek, does not mean that's the blueprint.

8 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

No no. 

I'm glad you're not in charge. 

All you've done is outline exactly what the Demonland one-eyed supporter would do. 

Be too afraid to make decisions based on on fear of future outcomes. 

It's ridiculous you say 'there's no guarantees you can't move up the order' with the draft hand we'd get for a trade like Petty but completely brush over the fact that there's also no guarantee he'll get his body right for a full year? Or there's no guarantee that his form will continue in an upward trajectory... Or any other list management risk?! 

Does anyone notice this? Lol. 

Nah. Because we love Melbourne players and Melbourne payers only and all else is riskkkkkk so shut upppp. 

I'll back JT to bring in talent with the draft picks. He has the runs on the board and will continue to deliver.

A key ingredient in building a strong competive list is retaining the talent.

Looking to the future at all costs is no way to build a list. You seem like you are happy to go for the early picks but you'd trade the player we get in 5 years for more early picks.

Retaining talent is easier and more benefitial than brining in new talent.

2 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

 

 

All of your responses are exactly what I'd expect. You can't SEE how losing Petty would result in a net positive over time. 

But that's the game. What kind of a club do you want to be? All in on chips now to try and nab another flag next year? 

Or increase your chances (depending on how we replace Petty, but most definitely with high end talent) for future years? And what does that look like? 

Look. When I read posters' responses to these types of scenarios, it's alwayyssss the same. 

Think about Frawley leaving.. The vast majority wanted him to stay. Precisely for the same reason. Nobody could see what the future would be like. It's the exact same scenario. Nobody knows what Petty's replacement could be. Nobody knows what we could do with the hand of picks we'd receive. Only those in charge. 

Given our track record with picks and trades, why is there not the same confidence that  we'd make the right call. 

If we had one or two down years in order to gain another 5-7 up, would supporters be upset? 

You have to take a chance. You have to be forward thinking. 

All I can say is thank god emotional supporters don't run list management. We'd hold everybody until they're cooked with nfi of what to do about the future due to fear of 'getting it wrong'. 

Lord. 

Difference was when Frawley left we weren’t risking anything we were basically bottom of the ladder and the only way was up. Granted it worked out as we got hogan and then may for hogan. 

Petty still has 2 more years on his contract, why rush into a trade when we have no obvious replacement we can always revisit next year once things become clearer and maybe we have a trade target.

Even picks 10 and 20 even if possible aren’t the most alluring picks we could do better next year or the year after if petty stays fit and counties to improve.

18 minutes ago, Mickey said:

Given they've just traded out 25, they either need to trade something else in or we give back to get that.

Don't think either we or Collingwood will be particularly pleased with them, though.

Yeh agree, would be very [censored] off about that

57 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Appreciate your post. 

But to be clear, it's not that I *want to trade Petty. 

But if we're being offered pick 10, 20 and McAdam, I think it's most definitely worth considering given what we could turn that into over the next few years. 

That's all. 

I'm just not in the 'keep Petty at all costs' camp. I think that's silly. 

How are you going to structure the forward line without Petty?  We'll get McAdam anyway so he's not part of the Petty deal really so it's 10 and 20 for Petty.  What is the likelihood that we'll get a player who is structurally significant as Petty with one of those picks and how long will they take to mature into someone meaningful?

Petty is a pretty valuable player.  He can play both back and forward and he's very competent now but is not at his peak being only 23.  I'd guess if you put him on the open market he'd attract something higher than 10, in fact I reckon NM may use pick 3 on him and one of their future end of first rounders.

I'm just not sure you're thinking it through but I do agree that we need to be nimble in our thinking and I think we've got a history of doing that.

4 hours ago, Demon Dynasty said:

That makes sense from an overs POV

Pick 3 > 2,234

Picks 6 & 11 (plus steak knives) > 3,080

However North would most likely have specific targets in mind with 2 & 3 already.

Also, from what i've read on here and from some scribes, 11 doesn't seem all that attractive in this draft yes?

apologies to RPFC in advance

Apology accepted.

 

See people - is that hard? Just apologise to me for your constant indiscretions and we are fine.

I doubt the veracity of this, but have been told we might make a move for GWS first pick & Nick Heyne’s salary, then Petty to move for one of Adelaide’s key forwards (Fogarty/Thilthorpe) plus McAdam.

Would give us more ammo for pick 1, or a suite of early picks if not.

The other positive being that Heyne could temporarily fill a Petty-sized hole in our defense.

Edited October 11, 20231 yr by Mach5

20 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

But your proposition of trading out Petty does not improve the forwardline. Just because Collingwood won a flag with Mihocek, does not mean that's the blueprint.

This perfectly sheds light on why it's impossible to talk any sense with you. 

You make [censored] up. 

You've literally made up that "my" proposal (which I never proposed) that trading out Petty would improve our forwardline. 

It's honestly like trying to reason with a teenager. 

Maybe go back and read what I actually said, then come back and reason. If that's at all possible. 

Try your hardest not to make things up. 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I doubt the veracity of this, but have been told we might make a move for GWS first pick & Nick Heyne’s salary, then Petty to move for one of Adelaide’s key forwards (Fogarty/Thilthorpe) plus McAdam.

Would give us more ammo for pick 1, or a suite of early picks if not.

The other positive being that Heyne could temporarily fill a Petty-sized hole in our defense.

I'd probably do that deal.

6 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I doubt the veracity of this, but have been told we might make a move for GWS first pick & Nick Heyne’s salary, then Petty to move for one of Adelaide’s key forwards (Fogarty/Thilthorpe) plus McAdam.

Would give us more ammo for pick 1, or a suite of early picks if not.

The other positive being that Heyne could temporarily fill a Petty-sized hole in our defense.

Problem with that is, presumably the move was Petty fwd next year?? Haynes not a like for like replacement in that sense 

10 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I doubt the veracity of this, but have been told we might make a move for GWS first pick & Nick Heyne’s salary, then Petty to move for one of Adelaide’s key forwards (Fogarty/Thilthorpe) plus McAdam.

Would give us more ammo for pick 1, or a suite of early picks if not.

The other positive being that Heyne could temporarily fill a Petty-sized hole in our defense.

Pick 7 and Hayne's crazy money for 27

Petty and 35 for 10, 20, Thilthorpe and McAdam (may be too much from Adelaide but Petty is contracted)

F1 and 20 for GC's 11

Leaves us with 6, 7, 10 and 11

 

Edited October 11, 20231 yr by Mickey

9 minutes ago, Slartibartfast said:

How are you going to structure the forward line without Petty?  We'll get McAdam anyway so he's not part of the Petty deal really so it's 10 and 20 for Petty.  What is the likelihood that we'll get a player who is structurally significant as Petty with one of those picks and how long will they take to mature into someone meaningful?

Petty is a pretty valuable player.  He can play both back and forward and he's very competent now but is not at his peak being only 23.  I'd guess if you put him on the open market he'd attract something higher than 10, in fact I reckon NM may use pick 3 on him and one of their future end of first rounders.

I'm just not sure you're thinking it through but I do agree that we need to be nimble in our thinking and I think we've got a history of doing that.

Isn't it funny that I mentioned taking on the Haynes contract with the bonus pick (as a possibility of covering Petty if the trade actually eventuated) and then a few posts later Mach comes through with something he may have heard. 

Did you read my post? 

Is there anyone aware that I may not have alllll of the machinations given I'm not in list management?! But that possibilities would be there that we can't see. So why even comment?!? 

Man. 

This place is crazy, honestly. We were so close to making a Grand Final. Without Petty. What's going on here?! 

8 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I doubt the veracity of this, but have been told we might make a move for GWS first pick & Nick Heyne’s salary, then Petty to move for one of Adelaide’s key forwards (Fogarty/Thilthorpe) plus McAdam.

Would give us more ammo for pick 1, or a suite of early picks if not.

The other positive being that Heyne could temporarily fill a Petty-sized hole in our defense.

Wow..

Interesting if true.

Just now, adonski said:

Problem with that is, presumably the move was Petty fwd next year?? Haynes not a like for like replacement in that sense 

No, but one of Adelaide’s forwards in return would be.

Not sure what we’d have to give up to GWS to get such a deal over the line, but the AFL seem to have ticked off salary dumps of this nature with Geelong/Bowes last year. They closes the contract extension loophole after last years episode, but I think Heyne only has 1 very expensive year left.

It would also give us a salary cap hole to fill next year in free agency.

I think we all (including Jimmy) like Petty and know how good he is, but let's not pretend he's Wayne Carey...yet. He's played one outstanding forward game, a handful of good ones and another handful of 'meh'. 

Movement of players and picks is becoming much more common in the AFL - with each passing year I find I handle this period better if I treat it with some distant ambivalence, or at most, excited interest. The whole 'club = iconic player' fable is dying a slow death. Fans are way more loyal and invested than players. We're at the point where 3-club players are pretty common. In 20 years we'll be like the NBA. 

You need to acknowledge that over the journey we will lose some good players and in some cases, those players will go on to be champions. We've benefited from the other side of that more than a few times, especially with our current list.

I'm firmly in the camp that believes Petty has a very bright future, IF he can sort out his body and injuries. As I recall, even as a youngster at Casey he was injured an awful lot.

In any event, your thoughts on Petty, his replacement or draft pick X all involve varying degrees of projection. That makes any outcome here exciting if you approach it with optimism, as opposed to calling for Lamb and Goodwin's resignations

4 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Wow..

Interesting if true.

Thanks Elon

2 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Isn't it funny that I mentioned taking on the Haynes contract with the bonus pick (as a possibility of covering Petty if the trade actually eventuated) and then a few posts later Mach comes through with something he may have heard. 

Did you read my post? 

Is there anyone aware that I may not have alllll of the machinations given I'm not in list management?! But that possibilities would be there that we can't see. So why even comment?!? 

Man. 

This place is crazy, honestly. We were so close to making a Grand Final. Without Petty. What's going on here?! 

I don’t think you’re the only one to find GWS pick appealing in conjunction with a salary dump. I myself had that thought as many others would have. And connecting the dots with Petty isn’t a long bow either.

If there’s any truth to it, then obviously our footy dept thought so too.

Not sure what you’re saying here? You can predict the future (of rumours)?

or that someone at the club read your post too?

Or that it’s a complete fabrication (likely) but also unoriginal?

Those advocating a radical change of direction may be right after the notoriety of “the double” (straight set finals exits). But be careful not to throw out the ‘baby’ with the bathwater. 

 

Edited October 11, 20231 yr by Tarax Club

Twomey’s reported offer from North for pick 1, although rejected, makes it seem much more achievable for us (if North didn’t consider that outright insulting).

Surely North are making this offer as a pisstake:

 

Edited October 11, 20231 yr by Jibroni

11 minutes ago, Mickey said:

Pick 7 and Hayne's crazy money for 27

Petty and 35 for 10, 20, Thilthorpe and McAdam

F1 and 20 for GC's 11

Leaves us with 6, 7, 10 and 11

 

Also pick 14.

Just now, Jibroni said:

Surely North are taking the [censored]:

 

Hey West Coast, here's 4 Toyota Corollas we are willing to swap for your Ferrari.

11 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Wow..

Interesting if true.

 

6 minutes ago, binman said:

Thanks Elon

Thutch a bitchth @binman

4 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

Twomey’s reported offer from North for pick 1, although rejected, makes it seem much more achievable for us (if North didn’t consider that outright insulting).

Edit: Posts since showed the offer. Jeez that's a low ball offer. Let's hope clubs all gang up on the Roos and ensure they remain at the bottom of the ladder for eternity.

Edited October 11, 20231 yr by Lord Travis