16 hours ago, mo64 said:

Getting Gunston makes perfect sense, but it makes no sense re-signing Melksham if that was the case.

 

That thought occurred to me this morning but I see you have already raised it.

22 hours ago, Grand New Flag said:

Hi All,

We are currently courting a contracted and uncontracted player both "A Grade" Key Forwards. 

The uncontracted player is Jack Gunston. We are well and truly in the race despite some contrary media reports suggesting a move to Brisbane or retained by Hawthorn. I have been told we are odds on!  (that's better than 50% chance snowflakes not a certainty).

The contracted player has also been responsive with quiet discussions since July. I have no idea of the chance of success. If I say who it is this has the real chance of wrecking the good work our recruiters are doing and would undermine the chances of success. 

Snowflakes, please refrain from abusing me...........I quite enjoy your D-Grade dibble, it's just super boring reading for the rest of DL.  If you don't want to hear what I have to say BLOCK ME.

Does this key forward play for a Victorian team or interstate? seeing as there is 100 odd key forwards running around in the AFL it's not much to go on. 

I heard some discussion about Brisbane’s father/son prospects for this year. Ashcroft is likely to be bid on by North and the Lions will match the bid to get him. In addition, they also have another potential f/son in Jaspa Fletcher. What does Brisbane need in terms of draft points to secure both players? 

4 hours ago, Lucifers Hero said:

 

They are also likely to get Oliver Henry in this year's trade.

And, they have last year's draftees to come in.  All midfielders except Toby Conway (ruckman) who they took with their first pick.

Bruhn, Henry, Conway and their second 2021 draftee, Mitch Kevitt, are all locals.  Geelong's age profile will drop very quickly when these guys replace the likes of Stanley, Blicvas, Selwood, Dangerfield, Smith, Duncan etc. 

It has amused me that so many on DL have ridiculed their age profile.  Scott has shown this year it is about managing players not so much their age. 

Geelong's list is set to be very stable for a long time.  I don't think they have an interstate player of note so no 'go home' factor or 'wasted' player development.  On the other hand they benefit from locals returning to Geelong. 

I hate to say it but they aren't going to slide down the ladder any time soon.

Geelong have huge advantages over the rest of the competition that rarely if ever seem to get mentioned in the media:

- Can pay players and soft cap coaches etc. 10-20% unders, as property so much cheaper around Geelong, this equates to 1.3 - 2.6M in salary cap advantage. Equates to a Cameron, Dangerfield and Hawkins extra on your list!

- Geelong, Bellarine, Colac area like a football factory, and get go home factor, beach/country lifestyle in their favour.

- Govt throws cash at them. So have great facilities and cash to burn!

- Massive home ground advantage and also get to play at each of MCG and Marvel 3-4 times a year. So away disadvantage is reduced!

Edited September 17, 20222 yr by D4Life
Extra point

Why not go for both Gunston & McKay? After all, Brown’s productivity has dropped below acceptable of late and we haven’t managed to get T.Mac on the field. Both getting older, slowing down and injured. They might be on their last legs next year. 

I expect we may hear some news re Gunston this coming week as he has been linked to Brisbane in the media and their season is now over. 

35 minutes ago, alpha33 said:

I heard some discussion about Brisbane’s father/son prospects for this year. Ashcroft is likely to be bid on by North and the Lions will match the bid to get him. In addition, they also have another potential f/son in Jaspa Fletcher. What does Brisbane need in terms of draft points to secure both players? 

See discussion on page 61 of this thread.

4 hours ago, Mickey said:

You'd have to think that Selwood, Danger and Duncan would consider retirement if they win it this year. Maybe Smith as well.

Thouy, Stanley and maybe Menegola (if he plays) as well!  

22 minutes ago, Pink Freud said:

Why not go for both Gunston & McKay? After all, Brown’s productivity has dropped below acceptable of late and we haven’t managed to get T.Mac on the field. Both getting older, slowing down and injured. They might be on their last legs next year. 

How do we fit Grundy, Gunston and McKay under our salary cap? We might have allocated some cap space for Jackson, but who knows whether that was used for Gus.

If we think that Brown and T Mac are on their last legs next year, why bring on more aging players like Grundy and Gunston, who have both had long term injuries in the past 2 years.

I'd go all in for McKay, take a fly on Gunston as an UFA, and get a cheap Meek as part of Jackson deal.

9 minutes ago, mo64 said:

How do we fit Grundy, Gunston and McKay under our salary cap? We might have allocated some cap space for Jackson, but who knows whether that was used for Gus.

If we think that Brown and T Mac are on their last legs next year, why bring on more aging players like Grundy and Gunston, who have both had long term injuries in the past 2 years.

I'd go all in for McKay, take a fly on Gunston as an UFA, and get a cheap Meek as part of Jackson deal.

The same way Tigers will fit Taranto and Hopper and others in.

We won’t get McKay, so that won’t be a problem anyway. Would love Tom DeKoning and could then bypass Grundy, but that seems a done deal.

I am sure we are looking at another key forward besides Gunston.

With Grundy coming in I don't see how we can land a big fish key forward. We simply don't have the cap space to chase the big ones like the Kings, Naughtons or McKay's. We have to also factor in that Kozzie and May are out of contract next year and we will probably need to offer them $600k + each to keep them. 

As GNF alluded that we are in discussion with a "contracted A grade key forward" I just don't see how we get it done unless they are happy to take unders to come to us. 

2 minutes ago, Caligula's cohort said:

With Grundy coming in I don't see how we can land a big fish key forward. We simply don't have the cap space to chase the big ones like the Kings, Naughtons or McKay's. We have to also factor in that Kozzie and May are out of contract next year and we will probably need to offer them $600k + each to keep them. 

As GNF alluded that we are in discussion with a "contracted A grade key forward" I just don't see how we get it done unless they are happy to take unders to come to us. 

Seriously, people declaring what our cap space is, is ridiculous , when they haven’t  got a clue as to the actual figures.

15 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Seriously, people declaring what our cap space is, is ridiculous , when they haven’t  got a clue as to the actual figures.

And quite a few of our most expensive players are on long terms deals, so I would imagine we have the flexibility to negotiate inside those contracts as long as we honour the entirety of the value.

There is an almost infinite amount of possibilities to what we could be doing.

37 minutes ago, Redleg said:

The same way Tigers will fit Taranto and Hopper and others in.

We won’t get McKay, so that won’t be a problem anyway. Would love Tom DeKoning and could then bypass Grundy, but that seems a done deal.

I am sure we are looking at another key forward besides Gunston.

Why are people so enamoured with dekoning ? He was fully fit and playing seconds with Carlton crying out for a ruck. Silvagni was chosen second ruck ahead of him. He’s now 23, sure he may improve but on his body of work over his first five years you could say he won’t be a star but MIGHT eek out a decent career. If he improves a fair bit. And that’s a big ‘might’. 

Edited September 17, 20222 yr by Bay Riffin

24 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Seriously, people declaring what our cap space is, is ridiculous , when they haven’t  got a clue as to the actual figures.

It must be relatively tight though given our list and the Petracca and Oliver contracts. 

Was going to say how do people know what we have left in the cap?

23 minutes ago, layzie said:

Was going to say how do people know what we have left in the cap?

They just assume, but if you are questioning our cap space... What about those of Geelong, Richmond, Carlton? YOY they seem.to chase top tier talent to bring to their already loaded lists... I wonder if they have huge cap space but we don't? 🤷🏻‍♂️

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

Seriously, people declaring what our cap space is, is ridiculous , when they haven’t  got a clue as to the actual figures.

It's just common sense really... We tried to get Cerra last year but couldn't offer him the money Carlton did and we couldn't keep Jackson here compared to the money the Western Australian teams are offering and with Grundy coming in on a supposedly $700k deal. Where exactly do you think we are going to find the money for an A grade forward? when we already have Oliver and Petracca on $900k+ and all of Gawn, Lever, May, Brayshaw, Salem and Viney on $600k+ not to mention Langdon, Tomlinson, Fritsch and Harmes commanding $500k+ and add into that Kozzie will want a hefty sum next contract due to being one of the best small forwards in the game. It's really not that hard to work out that our cap will be tight. 

1 minute ago, Caligula's cohort said:

It's just common sense really... We tried to get Cerra last year but couldn't offer him the money Carlton did and we couldn't keep Jackson here compared to the money the Western Australian teams are offering and with Grundy coming in on a supposedly $700k deal. Where exactly do you think we are going to find the money for an A grade forward? when we already have Oliver and Petracca on $900k+ and all of Gawn, Lever, May, Brayshaw, Salem and Viney on $600k+ not to mention Langdon, Tomlinson, Fritsch and Harmes commanding $500k+ and add into that Kozzie will want a hefty sum next contract due to being one of the best small forwards in the game. It's really not that hard to work out that our cap will be tight. 

Jackson wasn’t ever about money. He stopped negotiating with us, which tells you he wasn’t trying to drive up his price.

1 hour ago, Caligula's cohort said:

It's just common sense really... We tried to get Cerra last year but couldn't offer him the money Carlton did and we couldn't keep Jackson here compared to the money the Western Australian teams are offering and with Grundy coming in on a supposedly $700k deal. Where exactly do you think we are going to find the money for an A grade forward? when we already have Oliver and Petracca on $900k+ and all of Gawn, Lever, May, Brayshaw, Salem and Viney on $600k+ not to mention Langdon, Tomlinson, Fritsch and Harmes commanding $500k+ and add into that Kozzie will want a hefty sum next contract due to being one of the best small forwards in the game. It's really not that hard to work out that our cap will be tight. 

But we have no idea how any of these contracts are structured Front or Back ended….

It would be fantastic to land an A Grade Forward right now 

Edited September 17, 20222 yr by Sir Why You Little

6 minutes ago, Caligula's cohort said:

It's just common sense really... We tried to get Cerra last year but couldn't offer him the money Carlton did and we couldn't keep Jackson here compared to the money the Western Australian teams are offering and with Grundy coming in on a supposedly $700k deal. Where exactly do you think we are going to find the money for an A grade forward? when we already have Oliver and Petracca on $900k+ and all of Gawn, Lever, May, Brayshaw, Salem and Viney on $600k+ not to mention Langdon, Tomlinson, Fritsch and Harmes commanding $500k+ and add into that Kozzie will want a hefty sum next contract due to being one of the best small forwards in the game. It's really not that hard to work out that our cap will be tight. 

Cerra would've been wearing red and blue if we had the draft capital to get the deal done. Had nothing to do with salary.

22 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Jackson wasn’t ever about money. He stopped negotiating with us, which tells you he wasn’t trying to drive up his price.

Jackson's salary will go to Grundy now. So you think we have another $750k+ lying around? highly doubtful. 

1 hour ago, Fat Tony said:

It must be relatively tight though given our list and the Petracca and Oliver contracts. 

Why must it?

Every side has their better players who are on good contracts. There are so many variables and actual amounts we know nothing about.

That's why I never refer to salary cap space, because I wouldn't have a clue what our numbers are from year to year, but I know that Tim Lamb would.

39 minutes ago, Caligula's cohort said:

It's just common sense really... We tried to get Cerra last year but couldn't offer him the money Carlton did and we couldn't keep Jackson here compared to the money the Western Australian teams are offering and with Grundy coming in on a supposedly $700k deal. Where exactly do you think we are going to find the money for an A grade forward? when we already have Oliver and Petracca on $900k+ and all of Gawn, Lever, May, Brayshaw, Salem and Viney on $600k+ not to mention Langdon, Tomlinson, Fritsch and Harmes commanding $500k+ and add into that Kozzie will want a hefty sum next contract due to being one of the best small forwards in the game. It's really not that hard to work out that our cap will be tight. 

I think with respect you are factually wrong in a lot of this post.

We had Cerra, but couldn't do a trade better than Carlton's pick 5. So obviously we could fit him into the our cap at the time.

We were offering Jacko a pretty good contract as reported, but  he wants to go home. He is not leaving just for money. If he was, we would have probably retired Melk and Hibbo which would have left an extra amount in the pot. A poster on here said he had personal reasons as well and I accept that is probably true. We know he loved the players and the club.

All clubs have name players on varying amounts of money and we are not alone in that regard.

Why are we bringing in Grundy, maybe Gunston and are chasing another key forward,  as well as keeping Hibbo and Melk, if we have no salary cap room then?

Edited September 17, 20222 yr by Redleg