POSTGAME: Rd 12 vs Sydney

[loges 6,767]

What stood out to me was the poor decision making which was then exacerbated by the following poor disposal especially missed handballs. Was a particularly frustrating game to watch.

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,291]

6 minutes ago, loges said:

What stood out to me was the poor decision making which was then exacerbated by the following poor disposal especially missed handballs. Was a particularly frustrating game to watch.

You mean Sparrow

[DeeZee 7,361]

Our disposal into our forward line isn’t is definitely not that of a premiership side.

[loges 6,767]

I must say I find it somewhat amusing when players come back into the side after a long layoff and struggle then some posters want them immediately booted back out of the team. It's a big step up and some players need a week or two to get back into the pace of the game 

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,291]

Turning point was sparrow’s missed handball to Oliver. Hit that and Oliver was running inside 50 and goaling 

[loges 6,767]

3 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

You mean Sparrow

And plenty of others 

[Lord Nev 13,512]

2 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

Our disposal into our forward line isn’t is definitely not that of a premiership side.

For sure, but there's a real chicken and egg thing going on there.

The forwards are barely moving to make leads or create space so it makes it hard to deliver well - but maybe they're not working as hard on that because so many kicks just get bombed to a pack 35 out?

[Kent 2,905]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

The tackle issue is legitimate, but I'm less concerned about the scoring shots one.

They outscored us by 7 shots, which is the result of the second quarter (they kicked 5.4 to our 2.0). And that in turn was in no small part due to Petty being off getting his shoulder fixed.

In the third quarter, for example, the favour was returned, but we kicked 1.5 to their 0.2. We should have turned our third quarter dominance into 4.2 or better, and then the fourth quarter could/would have looked a lot different (going back to your earlier post on how we approach fourth quarter leads and how we play).

been saying it for years our accuracy will kill us in tight games even in soft games we miss many gettables

[loges 6,767]

It can't be ignored that our drop off in pressure rating from no1 to no18 is affecting our performance.

[DemonWA 3,928]

24 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

Turning point was sparrow’s missed handball to Oliver. Hit that and Oliver was running inside 50 and goaling 

I thought the handball was OK. Oliver slowed down and made it worse than it was imo

[DeeSpencer 25,398]

Some of the defensive mistakes last night were baffling.

3rd quarter, Petty comes up to spoil Heeney on the wing. Aggressive move and the right call. Heeney takes a strong mark, good for him. Swans then chip it around, and Tomlinson's guarding the next kick 15m away from Petty! Swans bomb it deep and suddenly Bowey's playing full back defending one on one!

Last quarter, game still in the balance, a goal the difference I think, Swans going slow play on the members wing. JJ gets caught forward too much (a common occurence). Gus rushes up from the backline. Salem follows his man up. Swans bomb long to CHF and we're short a defender.

May will certainly help a lot of that, but really we had enough experience last night to be more organised and it looked like players were unsure whether to be up or dropping back. 

And I think a lot of it stems from a lack of confidence in the midfield covering off their opponents. For which the main culprits were definitely Oliver and Petracca. If those guys aren't running and doing the defensive work then we need to roll more numbers through the midfield and find guys who will. Focus on quality rather than quantity of minutes for the 2 big guns.

[3183 Dee 2,841]

1 hour ago, Lucifers Hero said:

For 10 games this year we've played to shut down the game in the last quarter:  Defend the lead, bank the 4 pts and move on.  We became very good at it.

So good that we have forgotten how to play the last quarter to win the game:  In the last 2 weeks we've 1.5 vs opp 8.3 in the final quarter.  Accuracy aside, opps have had nearly double our scoring shots.  With some allowance for absentees last week, overall that score line is more than tiredness, 'loading' or whatever.  It is system ie how to win when down and ball movement when down and lack of effort.

Its fine to train to for Sept but not if it means we surrender the last quarter of critical games.

We forgot to play 'tempo' football, slow the game down a bit and get some composure before attacking.  Instead we rushed and went all out attack.  Then the fumbles came, even by some of our best:  Oliver, Lever, Jackson, Langdon etc looked like they were trying too hard to win.   The more mistakes we made the harder we tried. 

When the turnovers went Sydney's way we were badly out of position to defend and our small backs were caught out i50 with no support. 

The only person to stay calm was Gawn. 

I agree with this - ultimately, we gave that win to Sydney. 
 

We did, actually, have some great passages of play, where we cut Sydney up, but ultimately these were too few and far between. Players were very fumbly with the ball (while the Swans were clean) and, at the end, were trying to win the game themselves - a regression to seasons past.

It’s no coincidence that we looked better when we lowered the eyes in the 3Q and locked the ball in F50, but then reverted to those frustrating dump kicks to packs, where the ball was largely marked by the McCartins. (Can I just say here, that for someone whose had well documented issues with concussion, Paddy McCartin at least twice whacked a Melbourne player across the head in the aftermath of a marking contest).

Much as I want to believe @binman loading theory (it does make sense to follow the same recipe for success), I think the team has looked off for a few weeks now: almost as though the weight of expectation is heavy on them.

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,291]

What does Jake Lever offer the side at present? Bloke is so far off his form of last year it isn’t funny. Not on his pat malone 

[titan_uranus 24,963]

1 hour ago, Webber said:

Wow. All the evidence is to the contrary. Not saying it won’t happen, but at the moment this couldn’t be further from the observed reality. 

I actually agree that we're not that far off our form.

The question isn't the gap, it's how we go about closing it.

Remember, we led last night for 83 out of 106 minutes, and were leading with 5 minutes to go. We have issues, no doubt, but we're not that far off where we need to be.

My query is how we go about fixing the issues. We've done it before, when it comes to mid-forward connection and midfield defensive two-way running. It's time to see us do it again.

7 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

What does Jake Lever offer the side at present? Bloke is so far off his form of last year it isn’t funny. Not on his pat malone 

Given you've correctly identified Lever isn't the only player who is below his 2021 form, why the outlandish "what does he offer the side" comment?

Last night we had no May, a rusty Tomlinson and an injured Petty. We turned it over repeatedly and gave Sydney acres of space. And despite everything on here, Lever wasn't even that bad! His rushed decision-making and poor kicking was no good, but his defensive work was nowhere near the top of the list of problems for us, especially given the context.

I'm far more concerned about our inability to hit the scoreboard, the severe drop off in form of B Brown, Jackson, Sparrow and Spargo, and the slump Petracca's currently in.

[loges 6,767]

15 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

What does Jake Lever offer the side at present? Bloke is so far off his form of last year it isn’t funny. Not on his pat malone 

Maybe a bit harsh, he actually killed plenty of marking contests 

[Lucifers Hero 39,414]

2 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

The tackle issue is legitimate, but I'm less concerned about the scoring shots one.

1)They outscored us by 7 shots, which is the result of the second quarter (they kicked 5.4 to our 2.0). And that in turn was in no small part due to Petty being off getting his shoulder fixed.

In the third quarter, for example, the favour was returned, but we kicked 1.5 to their 0.2. 2)We should have turned our third quarter dominance into 4.2 or better, and then the fourth quarter could/would have looked a lot different (going back to your earlier post on how we approach fourth quarter leads and how we play).

1) It wasn't just the 7 shot difference that the scoreboard flattered us.  It was they kicked 10.13.  If they kicked a bit straighter we would have been out of the game by 3/4 time. 

2) But we didn't and it left us with a fourth quarter job to do: to play attacking football (rather than defend a lead).  We didn't get the job done. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by Lucifers Hero

[Deeoldfart 8,005]

7 hours ago, bing181 said:

Not sure that Salem should have been played. Or Langdon. Salem was rusty as all hell, not sure how many times he turned the ball over, yet alone being beaten by his man. Langdon seemed to be not quite his usual run-all-day self. Which is understandable, but we paid for it. Wonder if both of them were being fast-tracked back knowing that they weren't quite ready - but knowing also that they'd get more out of an AFL game than one at Casey.

Add into that Thomlinson, and to a lesser extent Mitch Brown, both of whom have hardly played any AFL footy for a year or so - and it showed. Neither had the pace of the game. Add that to Salem and Langdon and ... a step too far perhaps.

 

Lingers had massive padding on his ribs, but still didn’t shirk a contest.  Not his best game, but still left many of his teammates in his wake.  Love him, he brings so much to our team.

[cookieboc 775]

were we a bit desperate at the selection table?

[1964_2 2,357]

The media has trained supporters very well, to over-react to poor weeks, form slumps and the like (&vice versa) 

Relax people, we are a game clear on top, and the club has form setting us up to be peaking in September not June. 

Or alternatively keep up with the wrist-cutting, end of the world type commentary:- if nothing else, it is certainly entertaining. 
 

[david_neitz_is_my_dad 4,083]

5 minutes ago, cookieboc said:

were we a bit desperate at the selection table?

OUT: T.Rivers (Omitted), J.Melksham (Omitted), S.May (Injured), L.Dunstan (Medi-Sub), S.Weideman (Omitted)

Out of the guys ommitted maybe Rivers could have stayed but the others nah

 

[BDA 22,696]

The last 2 weeks have reminded me of something I’d kinda forgot about

I hate losing. Really puts a downer on the weekend

[Guest]

1 hour ago, DeeZee said:

Our disposal into our forward line isn’t is definitely not that of a premiership side.

… nor our indecisiveness. 🙃🙂

Or maybe it is. Nah, it’s not. 
But then again…

Edited June 5, 2022 by WalkingCivilWar

[Maldonboy38 6,390]

OK, I have an evening, brekkie and lunch behind me during which I was able to reflect and ponder our 12 point loss to the Swans. And now I sit to read the torrent of opinion, hyperbole and ranting otherwise known as the Demonland postgame thread. I think many of us (including myself last night) need to take valium, take rectal valium, medicinal cannabis, non-medicinal cannabis or some such other, and calm the &*$# down.

We played poorly and have 3 main areas to fix - 1) decision making with ball in hand 2)basic skills under pressure but  most importantly 3) forward 50 cohesion. 

We are coming towards the bye and it appears we have a few tired, sore players.

The sky hasn't fallen.

And please, for the love of everything Melbourne supporters consider sacred STOP BLAMING THE UMPIRES!!!! Yes, they make lots of mistakes every week but we rarely lose games because of them. Yes, there were some howlers last night but they are not against us, they didn't plan for the Swans to win, and no we don't always get the wort of it.

We lost by playing poorly and the Swans played well.

[1964_2 2,357]

3 minutes ago, Maldonboy38 said:

OK, I have an evening, brekkie and lunch behind me during which I was able to reflect and ponder our 12 point loss to the Swans. And now I sit to read the torrent of opinion, hyperbole and ranting otherwise known as the Demonland postgame thread. I think many of us (including myself last night) need to take valium, take rectal valium, medicinal cannabis, non-medicinal cannabis or some such other, and calm the &*$# down.

We played poorly and have 3 main areas to fix - 1) decision making with ball in hand 2)basic skills under pressure but  most importantly 3) forward 50 cohesion. 

We are coming towards the bye and it appears we have a few tired, sore players.

The sky hasn't fallen.

And please, for the love of everything Melbourne supporters consider sacred STOP BLAMING THE UMPIRES!!!! Yes, they make lots of mistakes every week but we rarely lose games because of them. Yes, there were some howlers last night but they are not against us, they didn't plan for the Swans to win, and no we don't always get the wort of it.

We lost by playing poorly and the Swans played well.

A nice summary.

Swans played their absolute best, we played not even close to our best, yet we only lost by 12 points. 

Who wins a final between the 2 teams, with the assumption that we set ourselves for Sept not June :- Dees by 40 points.

[Willmoy1947 4,077]

Three soft marks/goals and another for an unexpected goal gift by maggot no2, which he was duly thanked for, and we would have won by at least three goals ..