Angus Brayshaw

[NeveroddoreveN 1,034]

27 minutes ago, DeeZone said:

You maybe correct N but Gus is our best option at present, I am sure that JT will be looking for a suitable alternative, that is probably why we went so hard for Smith last year. With a good pre season maybe De Classe could fill this role? Or maybe Tomlinson will go back there now that Harrison Petty has stepped up in the backline.

Trent Rivers or even Jackson maybe real possibilities looking forward at the wing position too.

Brayshaw would be on decent coin somewhere around 500-600k, per year.  Langdon we actually got for around 450K.

Would consider trading for someone like Cerra, who would cost similar $$$ but add lot more polish and grunt to our team.

i find it a bit of a conundrum with Harmes/Viney/Brayshaw and their lack of adaptability to play other positions, they all get paid really well but can't seem to nail down alternate positions to play.

 

[whatwhat say what 22,732]

1 minute ago, NeveroddoreveN said:

Trent Rivers or even Jackson maybe real possibilities looking forward at the wing position too.

Brayshaw would be on decent coin somewhere around 500-600k, per year.  Langdon we actually got for around 450K.

Would consider trading for someone like Cerra, who would cost similar $$$ but add lot more polish and grunt to our team.

i find it a bit of a conundrum with Harmes/Viney/Brayshaw and their lack of adaptability to play other positions, they all get paid really well but can't seem to nail down alternate positions to play.

 

reports have it that cerra is being offered upwards of $3m for four years

while i personally don't think our salary cap is under pressure - we've shown the ability to balance the books that seems to have eluded the likes of the filth, for instance - i somehow doubt we can go close to offering what he's being offered to stay at freo or to go to carlton

 

[NeveroddoreveN 1,034]

3 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

reports have it that cerra is being offered upwards of $3m for four years

while i personally don't think our salary cap is under pressure - we've shown the ability to balance the books that seems to have eluded the likes of the filth, for instance - i somehow doubt we can go close to offering what he's being offered to stay at freo or to go to carlton

 

I think we could create the space required for player like that at @$750k per year.

Tmac was on similar $$$ to this and although he has had a great season should be nowhere near worth 750k.....say he gets negotiated down to around 500K....We then have another 250k to spend on someone like this.

If Brayshaw wanted to go play with his brother, we have some sort of currency.

Fwiw i think if we were to pick up player like Cerra, we would pay less than what Carlton would to secure him, as we would be much more desirable club to look at.

By the sound of it all Cerra will be playing with a Vic team next season.  Would we be interested in him?  Yeah i think we would at least ask the question!

[Cranky Franky 2,049]

20 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Anyone from this century? About as relevant as saying John Nicholls would still be a good ruckman at 189cm these days.

Gus is actually pretty quick once he builds pace too. I don’t know if the concussions played a role or if it’s a physical thing but he gets completely burnt off the mark.

 

Just can't admit you're wrong can you ?

You made a statement that a player who finished 3rd in the Brownlow, playing as a mid is too slow to play as a mid. Its just a demonstrably incorrect statement and you are probably the only poster to believe that.

[bringbackthebiff 654]

On 8/16/2021 at 8:37 PM, Marty said:

Delidio and Ball were reviewing the game and said completely ignore the stat sheet. Brayshaw was good. Did what a defensive winger is supposed to do. That roll is the worst in the Game. Work your [censored] off for no reward. But the hardest position to play on the ground. He only moved into the centre at the end to give Oliver and Trac a rest.

It’s a shame my old footy coach didn’t understand the role I was playing. He dropped me after i regularly got limited stats 

[Axis of Bob 11,784]

1 hour ago, Wunders said:

I commented on this at the time and can't prove anything, but i 100% (money back guarantee :P) sure that that the sprint time recorded was an error. Either the tester recorded someone else's score in his place or he was allowed to start a meter back and had built up a bit of velocity when he crossed the start line and timing started (this then leads to a much quicker 20m time as it's the first few steps that are the slow point).

Gary Rohan and Lewis jetta who were both drafted as an explosive and quick player had best 20m sprint times of 2.93 and 2.95 and they are much much faster than Brayshaw. I just want people to stop looking at a number and using it as a fact when blind freddie can see that it's an error (it's like someone swapped jayden hunts sprint time around with Brayshaw and now everyone thinks hunts slow - anyone can see that Hunts fast, but if i pull out a stat saying Hunts sprint time is 3.3 seconds over 20m it doesn't make me right).

Two points:

1- The tests were done at different times (Brayshaw missed end of year testing with injury, IIRC). Brayshaw's was done preseason.

2- The 20m test only tests the speed from a standing start in a straight line over 20m. That's it. Gary Rohan and Lewis Jetta, two long striding speedsters, are quick but that doesn't make them necessarily markedly quicker from a standing start (which nearly never happens in AFL). They are quick over 20+ metres, where they are near top speed already and can maintain that to burn opponents off. This is where you see Jetta striding down the wing, putting the ball under his arm and taking running bounces. That isn't tested in a 20m sprint.

Brayshaw's test could theoretically be slightly out given that it wasn't at the official combine, but he's not slow in a straight line from a standing start. He's very powerful and his ability to burst from stoppage in 2018 was one of the key reasons we were so good at scoring from them. His lateral quickness is not as good as his straight line (so he doesn't defend stoppages as well), but he isn't the slug that he's being made out to be. The 20m test doesn't test overall speed, it tests the ability to accelerate from a standing start.

[Axis of Bob 11,784]

21 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Anyone from this century? About as relevant as saying John Nicholls would still be a good ruckman at 189cm these days.

Matt Priddis, Sam Mitchell and Tom Mitchell have won Brownlows in the last decade. There's a place for a slow centreman still, but you have to be really, really, really good. 

To your point, Brayshaw is a completely different type of player though. Brayshaw is far more powerful and much quicker off the mark, however he is nowhere near as agile, which is the most important part of being that type of centre square midfielder.

Edited August 20, 2021 by Axis of Bob

[Wunders 397]

2 hours ago, Axis of Bob said:

Two points:

1- The tests were done at different times (Brayshaw missed end of year testing with injury, IIRC). Brayshaw's was done preseason. Hence, if there was an error it likely arose here - many easy ways to make the error especially with sport science graduates doing the measuring out (some are truly hopeless - mainly the result of the teachers being crap at uni).

2- The 20m test only tests the speed from a standing start in a straight line over 20m. That's it. Gary Rohan and Lewis Jetta, two long striding speedsters, are quick but that doesn't make them necessarily markedly quicker from a standing start (which nearly never happens in AFL). They are quick over 20+ metres, where they are near top speed already and can maintain that to burn opponents off. This is where you see Jetta striding down the wing, putting the ball under his arm and taking running bounces. That isn't tested in a 20m sprint. I worked as the fitness conditioning coach at the Eastern Ranges for 4 years whilst completing my Honours and PhD in Sport Science (focusing on the validity of GPS/accelerometry monitoring in team sports). I don't have any real insight into Angus as he wasn't at the Eastern Ranges, but i have a good 'feel' for data and what a fitness testing number looks like in relation to real life/matches. Hence, why i think that number is laughable. If i had to guess, i would say that he  could achieve a 2.98s 20m sprint time and i wonder if the last number was incorrectly scribbled down and someone read it as a 0 instead of an 8 or a 9.

Brayshaw's test could theoretically be slightly out given that it wasn't at the official combine, but he's not slow in a straight line from a standing start. He's very powerful and his ability to burst from stoppage in 2018 was one of the key reasons we were so good at scoring from them. His lateral quickness is not as good as his straight line (so he doesn't defend stoppages as well), but he isn't the slug that he's being made out to be. The 20m test doesn't test overall speed, it tests the ability to accelerate from a standing start. Agree on the test being slightly out (.1 of a second my guess). No player drafted to the AFL is slow (they will almost all, including big forwards be so much faster than the majority of the population) and the 'slowest' players would burn us off :). Relatively compared to other AFL players who would score at or below 3 seconds (Christian Petracca = 3.00s, Daniel Rioli 2.89s, etc.) i think we can see that he is not in the same explosive/top speed category as what his 20m sprint time suggests.

Good points, bold my thoughts :). Sorry everyone for blabbing on about a past test that means nothing now.

[Axis of Bob 11,784]

2 hours ago, Wunders said:

Good points, bold my thoughts :). Sorry everyone for blabbing on about a past test that means nothing now.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with all of that. 

[Engorged Onion 10,215]

3 hours ago, Wunders said:

Good points, bold my thoughts :). Sorry everyone for blabbing on about a past test that means nothing now.

Great work @Wunders and also kudos on giving context as to why you know what you know. More sports science if you know stuff, less vague punditry on here please 😘

Edited August 20, 2021 by Engorged Onion

[DeeSpencer 25,643]

On 8/20/2021 at 1:32 PM, Axis of Bob said:

Matt Priddis, Sam Mitchell and Tom Mitchell have won Brownlows in the last decade. There's a place for a slow centreman still, but you have to be really, really, really good. 

To your point, Brayshaw is a completely different type of player though. Brayshaw is far more powerful and much quicker off the mark, however he is nowhere near as agile, which is the most important part of being that type of centre square midfielder.

Maybe 'slow of the mark' was the wrong phrase, that's for correcting me. But he definitely takes an eternity to change direction. Priddis and Mitchell promptly retired when the game had gone passed them, allowing the Eagles to put Yeo and Gaff on ball for more burst. Richmond changed the game by injection smaller, faster mids who weren't so worried about winning the ball in to the centre. Tom Mitchell can really move side to side as well, mostly because that's all he does! Agility in order to pressure really is the vital component to most AFL players these days. 

[DeeSpencer 25,643]

On 8/20/2021 at 12:24 PM, Cranky Franky said:

Just can't admit you're wrong can you ?

You made a statement that a player who finished 3rd in the Brownlow, playing as a mid is too slow to play as a mid. Its just a demonstrably incorrect statement and you are probably the only poster to believe that.

Harmes and JJ have been available to play on the wing most of the year yet the coach prefers Gus, even tho Gus has cleaner hands and better ball winning than those guys. Why? Because he agrees with me. I might be wrong saying it's speed off the mark, I meant more lateral speed, but I stick by that. No matter where he plays you see Gus struggle to change direction, where as in a straight line he can run with most opponents. 

Instead of people yearning for a player that probably won't ever come back we should commend Goodwin and Gus for finding a role that at times works against his game but also maximises a lot of how he plays.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

He stood up when it mattered tonight.

[dazzledavey36 54,794]

 

[Lucifers Hero 39,715]

On the other hand, Pert went on record yesterday of being very confident that Brayshaw is staying.

Lewis probably knows that but is just fleshing out a story Ralph put out on Fox a bit earlier.

Media people feeding each other's media.

Edited April 7, 2022 by Lucifers Hero

[chook fowler 19,458]

Love the role he is playing at the moment- also JJ has been critical in allowing this to happen. I can see it being a permanent thing.

[dazzledavey36 54,794]

3 minutes ago, chook fowler said:

Love the role he is playing at the moment- also JJ has been critical in allowing this to happen. I can see it being a permanent thing.

JJ has really surprised me with how good he's playing the wing role.

His work rate and defensive ability is elite imo.

It's no wonder Adem Yze rates JJ extremely highly.

[deegirl 1,577]

38 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

 

Possibly a silly question - other than Jon Ralph reporting it, has anyone heard anything genuine about Brayshaw thinking he should be playing in the midfield? The media keep reviving this line (feel like it’s been floating around since at least 2020) but is it anywhere near correct? 

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

i also seem to recall that Brayshaw brushed off talks of leaving in one of the Gus n Gawn podcasts. His demeanor and body language suggests he is not going anywhere. I also think the demand to get more midfield minutes surely is not true - it is so against the team ethos that was central to our success that makes it very unbelievable.

I suspect he is probably after a longer term deal than what is being offered. Maybe a 4 or 5 year one.

[dazzledavey36 54,794]

25 minutes ago, deegirl said:

Possibly a silly question - other than Jon Ralph reporting it, has anyone heard anything genuine about Brayshaw thinking he should be playing in the midfield? The media keep reviving this line (feel like it’s been floating around since at least 2020) but is it anywhere near correct? 

I think there has been little snippets here and there, but if I take Brayshaw on face value he seems to enjoy playing a variety of roles.

Behind closed doors might be a completely different story.

[rpfc 28,359]

25 minutes ago, deegirl said:

Possibly a silly question - other than Jon Ralph reporting it, has anyone heard anything genuine about Brayshaw thinking he should be playing in the midfield? The media keep reviving this line (feel like it’s been floating around since at least 2020) but is it anywhere near correct? 

It is the subtext in every second Gus & Gawny podcast - he would be a top 2 mid at other teams but is behind CP5, Oliver and Viney at the Dees. 

It is not just his role but also his pay - we won’t pay him like other teams because of the role he is playing, and also because Jackson and Oliver must be kept over the next two years as they come out of contract.

I hope he stays but we are going to lose a best 18 player IMO - pick your poison.

I am just going to enjoy the year and I suggest you nervous nellies do the same.

[sisso 2,580]

We all love Gus and he'll always be a Demons legend....but if he helps us to back to back flags this season then really wants to move on its something we will just have to accept as the realities of modern footy

[Sydee 4,408]

Angus epitomises the team first attitude that has turned this club into a premiership outfit 

There is nothing I'm seeing that suggests he has the slightest interest in seeking other opportunities particularly if they are motivated by self interest - that would seem to be very out of character

He has a great rapport with his captain and his team mates - he will get paid well because he deserves to. Despite the media dribble that he would prefer to be playing midfield minutes the playing group, coaches and supporters all value his contribution just the same as if he was racking up 30 possessions in the middle. 

The penny has dropped for this group - it isn't about personal glory - "team first" is the mantra, if you are part of the team (including those on the list not able to crack into the 1's) your are an integral part of whatever success comes

This "team first" mantra will be tested in the next year or two when rivals will try to poach players. This group should want to keep the band together - there is great chemistry and culture which is not easily replicated - Yes players need to be paid well and I'm sure they will but team success and the chance of creating a period of sustained success is worth so much more than a few extra dollars or personal glory imho  

[mo64 5,874]

Sorry to break it to you Gus, but your best football has been as a defensive wingman or as a defender.

As an inside mid, the media keep using his 3rd in the Brownlow as his yardstick, but Gus finished 6th in the BnF, and in the subsequent 2 seasons he finished 8th. He's never been an A grade inside mid, that warrants a club throwing big bucks at him. It's similar to the Blues getting Zac Williams as a FA and paying him ridiculous money on the premise that he would be a midfielder. 

[rpfc 28,359]

1 hour ago, mo64 said:

Sorry to break it to you Gus, but your best football has been as a defensive wingman or as a defender.

As an inside mid, the media keep using his 3rd in the Brownlow as his yardstick, but Gus finished 6th in the BnF, and in the subsequent 2 seasons he finished 8th. He's never been an A grade inside mid, that warrants a club throwing big bucks at him. It's similar to the Blues getting Zac Williams as a FA and paying him ridiculous money on the premise that he would be a midfielder. 

That’s selling Angus short - unlike Williams, Angus has actually excelled as a mid. 

I don’t get the need to clip someone you also intend to keep? But whatever, I hope we can manage the cap and keep that core group together.