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Gun target - Key Forward recruit?


tallstuey

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We continue to strengthen our back line, mature our midfield, add to our outside run and often lead the competition with inside 50's.

But year after year after year our mids look up and see no viable or winning forward option.

Weids "might" develop some consistency one day and while I love Tom, if his body fails him (as is now common), we are left with an enormous forward void. (Not a lot of TALL emerging options from the VFL either)

Many successful teams now have a twin tower approach......Lynch / Reiwoldt.......Darling /Kennedy.

Why oh why do I never see the Dees in the hunt for a gun forward? Am I obtuse? (feel free to feedback with a meaningful explanation that makes good football sense....or criticism if deemed appropriate)

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I doubt there'll be any movement on this front until next year. Apart from Daniher, Bruce and Jenkins, unfortunately just isnt  much available atm. Of the others remaining Mason Wood is an interesting one, could be good but is super inconsistent and doesnt exactly form a formidable duo with McDonald imo. 

If Cameron dosent re-sign at the Giants next year then I'm sure there'll be a bonanza involving every vic club to land him, likewise with Ben King. I think the club is still in the mind of hoping Weideman comes good this year and will also be interesting to see how they see Petty developing next year as either part of the forward or back groups. The club should at least wait another year and see if that 2nd tall spot is still an absolute must fill with better talent when at least there are seemingly better players to look at in 2020.

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13 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Petty showed something in the games he played. I wouldn't mind seeing a TMac/Petty combo with Weid as backup unless he demands selection through performance.

I really like Petty and hope we persevere with him up forwards. He’s also quite mobile for his 197cm and could play the Gunston type role whilst crashing some packs.

Edited by Ethan Tremblay
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Good discussion point but the problem is the system.  While the likes of Lynch are able to get to the clubs that have had the most recent success that is the option they will choose vs teams who haven't seen success in decades like the Aints, Doggies (1 in 62 years) and ourselves.  And to a lessor extent Norf (96) and Carltank (95).

As Kingy suggested and which i've been calling for for years, FAs should not be allowed to get to a club thats finished top 5/6 or so (previous two seasons) or win a premiership in say the last five.

We can talk all we like about the possibility of getting a genuine gun tall forward.  Cameron is up next season,  aint gonna happen unless the clubs force the AFL to change FA to assist the lessor lights.

If Cameron doesn't re-sign at GWS i g'tee he will end up at a top liner in 2021.  Nothing more certain.

System is flawed until/unless the clubs speak up.

Bottom dwellers unite and take over!

Edited by Rusty Nails
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I think we have the makings of a dangerous forward line without having that 'gun' key forward.

I think Tom Mac and a good summer from the Weid will hold us in good stead in terms of taller targets.  Fritsch and/or Petty can be mobile third tall options, and then you have Melksham who is not only capable of hitting the scoreboard but also using the ball superbly when he has it front of the centre line.  If we can pull off a coup and sign Jamie Elliott as well, then we have the potential for a forward line that is diverse and choc full of scoring power.

I still think we need that crafty small forward type to complement the above.  Elliott is that in some ways, but I think a genuine crumber who isn't flying for marks but is feasting when the ball hits the deck is a gap we need to fill.

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Petty. Will be interesting to see where they use him. Lewis Taylor from Brisbane might be okay as small crumber but have to beware of some serious brain farts.

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33 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

Good discussion point but the problem is the system.  While the likes of Lynch are able to get to the clubs that have had the most recent success that is the option they will choose vs teams who haven't seen success in decades like the Aints, Doggies (1 in 62 years) and ourselves.  And to a lessor extent Norf (96) and Carltank (95).

As Kingy suggested and which i've been calling for for years, FAs should not be allowed to get to a club thats finished top 5/6 or so (previous two seasons) or win a premiership in say the last five.

We can talk all we like about the possibility of getting a genuine gun tall forward.  Cameron is up next season,  aint gonna happen unless the clubs force the AFL to change FA to assist the lessor lights.

If Cameron doesn't re-sign at GWS i g'tee he will end up at a top liner in 2021.  Nothing more certain.

System is flawed until/unless the clubs speak up.

Bottom dwellers unite and take over!

Your suggestion makes sense and it will slow the movement of uncontracted stars from lower teams and also lead to a more even competition, while still allowing player movement.

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Josh Jenkins.

The bloke just kicks goals.

If he plays 20 games next year, he kicks 40 goals, pure and simple. Can Weideman, Petty, O Mac or whoever we plonked down forward in the train wreck of 2019 snag 40 in a year?

Adelaide are more than willing to pay a fair bit of his salary.

He has a bad reputation because he’s outspoken in the media, and kicks a lot of goals from the goal square.

But id take him as I have no faith in Weed due to injury and consistency.

Edited by Bring-Back-Powell
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If we can't land a gun, I'm not convinced we should recruit stop gaps. Just build your system around what you have. Richmond and Collingwood have shown the way in this respect.

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5 minutes ago, A F said:

If we can't land a gun, I'm not convinced we should recruit stop gaps. Just build your system around what you have. Richmond and Collingwood have shown the way in this respect.

Exactly. Tiges did it in 2017 without two ‘key forwards’, Lynch this year was just the cherry on top. 

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Do we have any faith that with a pre-season with the club under his belt, Jay Lockhart could be groomed for the small forward role?

He’s shown some genuine glimpses of the exact kinda thing we need. This year would have been a whirlwind for him. A chance to steady and train properly with his teammates this summer could do wonders. 

Fingers crossed, anyway. 

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25 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Your suggestion makes sense and it will slow the movement of uncontracted stars from lower teams and also lead to a more even competition, while still allowing player movement.

Another good reason Mr Leg.  Can't really see it happening unless the out of favour Vic clubs speak up.  They would also need some support from within the AFL and/or a large player or two before the AFL (post Gil) bothered to take them (us)  and this issue seriously and act.

Meanwhile the guns will continue to gravitate towards the top echelon clubs as the divide between the haves and have nots grows ever larger each season.

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38 minutes ago, AaronDaveyChipsAndGravey said:

Exactly. Tiges did it in 2017 without two ‘key forwards’, Lynch this year was just the cherry on top. 

The Tigers had a more lethal defence in 2017 with Rance at the top of his game.  Missing this year but then became even more potent up forward with Lynch in.

Imagine no Lynch during the period Reiwoldt was out. 

Lynch as the equal No.1 twin also means the opp were unable to double team Jack like they did quite often in 2018.  Lynch in while Jack was out also enables the Tigers the luxury of maintaining their structures up forward with smalls still able to feed off the spills etc.

A much harder lock down up forward with the twins, more potent up forward, offsetting the loss of Rance as they were able to score more regularly while still having a very good defence. 

No Lynch while Reiwoldt was out, a loss or two extra and they probably miss top four and all likelihood of another flag.

Edited by Rusty Nails
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22 minutes ago, Mel Bourne said:

Do we have any faith that with a pre-season with the club under his belt, Jay Lockhart could be groomed for the small forward role?

He’s shown some genuine glimpses of the exact kinda thing we need. This year would have been a whirlwind for him. A chance to steady and train properly with his teammates this summer could do wonders. 

Fingers crossed, anyway. 

I thought Casey watchers were saying he played in defense at Casey, not sure. I thought he was being groomed as the Nev replacement, but his form meant he had to be picked in the seniors. Even without Nev in the snrs he didn't play that role, so no idea now.

He looks the goods doesn't he. I hope they pick a role and train him up over preseason for it and stick with it. Could be anything.

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Unfortunately as much as the club has tried, we seem to have some kind of curse when it comes to key forwards.

Hogan is the only gun key forward we've recruited in a couple of decades (Wow, yep, I think we have to go back as far as Schwartz and Neitz!) and we all know how things are going for him now.

But it is not like we haven't tried.

This century we've invested first round picks in - Weideman, Hogan, Cook, Watts, Bate, Dunn, Smith and Molan as prospective key forwards, as well as grabbing Mitch Clarke, Chris Dawes and Ben Holland in trades.

And after all that, I still have a strange kind of faith in the Weideman/McDonald combination. Maybe I just think we are simply too cursed to keep investing more in trying to get a gun?

Because I think we all know, if we did throw the money out for a Boyd-style deal, the player we got would definitely be laid out by gastro the night before the Grand Final.

 

 

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23 minutes ago, FireInTheBelly said:

I thought Casey watchers were saying he played in defense at Casey, not sure. I thought he was being groomed as the Nev replacement, but his form meant he had to be picked in the seniors. Even without Nev in the snrs he didn't play that role, so no idea now.

He looks the goods doesn't he. I hope they pick a role and train him up over preseason for it and stick with it. Could be anything.

Yeah, I have nary a clue what the club has in mind for him. But those glimpses I referred to were in his games against the Bombers and Dockers, where he was playing (well) in our inside 50. And his first kick/goal for the Dees against Geelong was a very impressive start! 

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When did the MFC last have a Gun Forward?

Neitz and Lyon were good, but just below Gun Status

Jakovich should have been, but his entire career was hampered by a back injury

Always been a problem. Never had a forward kick 100 goals. It used to irritate me when i was at school 40 years ago. Still does....

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We have the key forwards. Fritsch and Tmac for starters. We just need a better forward system and a clued up mid field and a couple of pacy small forwards. Oh.....and players that can lock the ball in and maintain pressure.

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Without dominant key forwards, we need to have KPF's who are able to bring the ball to ground pretty much all the time to allow our smaller player's (hopefully the likes of Fritsch, Trac, Lockhart, Harmes, (Weightman if drafted) to crumb the pack.

The only problem is that we have almost all players' compete for the ball in the air while not enough stay down, allowing opposition numbers to waltz the ball out of the back-line.

Goody needs to drill this into the forward groups heads to have one compete in the air and the rest ready to mop up any balls that hit the deck.

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