"If you can't kick, you don't play"

[Glenn Molloy 494]

It took less than 6 weeks for the St Kilda caretaker coach (and now permanent coach) to publicly proclaim that his team's inability to hit targets and nail goals from directly in front was an absolute killer.  I wonder why our own coach hasn't said the same thing.  To be fair to Goody, he regularly mentioned "basic fundamentals" during press conferences but I'm so sick of watching Melbourne players miss goals, miss handballs and miss kicks.  The success of Hawthorn and West Coast in recent years has been based on many things but in particular their exceptional kicking skills.  Interesting that Ratten has identified it straight away...let's hope our recruiters are thinking the same way instead of recruiting contested bulls who butcher the footy.  I will watch our drafting and trade targets with interest!

[Rod Grinter Riot Squad 5,654]

Not to worry, will be about 6 months until you see a missed kick or goal by us again 

[Ethan Tremblay 30,970]

Why does everything have to be stated publicly these days? I’m sure the coaches are well aware of the issue and it is something that will be rectified (or attempted to be). 

[Lord Nev 13,512]

14 minutes ago, Glenn Molloy said:

It took less than 6 weeks for the St Kilda caretaker coach (and now permanent coach) to publicly proclaim that his team's inability to hit targets and nail goals from directly in front was an absolute killer.  I wonder why our own coach hasn't said the same thing.

"Goodwin said poor kicking efficiency "killed" the Dees, who were unable to convert strong work around the ball into a winning score"

Source

Not that it actually makes any difference whatsoever.

[Hellish Inferno 992]

Simple minds need simple messages...?

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

Our backline recruiting has focused on good ball users - apart from Frosty. A healthy Jake Lever can kick well and is a great handballer, May, Oscar, Hibberd (at least in the past), Jetta, Salem all good kicks.

Mids and forwards not as much although you need ball winners and good athletes in those spots. It's worth questioning the chase of Langdon because he's not a great kick but there's so few good kicking outside runners that I'm not sure it matters, better to get someone than no one.

Goal kicking seemed to be a strength of ours in recent years until all of a sudden it wasn't. 

It's not a strength but if we get back to being able to win the ball, run both ways and create some space with our handballs I think our kicking will take a huge leap forward. The trick of Hawthorn and West Coast is how well they work to get guys clear and easy options to kick to. That's our real deficiency.

[Diamond_Jim 12,628]

5 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

The trick of Hawthorn and West Coast is how well they work to get guys clear and easy options to kick to. That's our real deficiency.

so true

we are so often kicking under pressure to a tight contest.

If you think about it you only need at most 50% of the team to be good kicks and then the odds favour the lesser kicks giving it to those who can.

I believe it's called a gameplan

[beelzebub 23,383]

47 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Our backline recruiting has focused on good ball users - apart from Frosty. A healthy Jake Lever can kick well and is a great handballer, May, Oscar, Hibberd (at least in the past), Jetta, Salem all good kicks.

Mids and forwards not as much although you need ball winners and good athletes in those spots. It's worth questioning the chase of Langdon because he's not a great kick but there's so few good kicking outside runners that I'm not sure it matters, better to get someone than no one.

Goal kicking seemed to be a strength of ours in recent years until all of a sudden it wasn't. 

It's not a strength but if we get back to being able to win the ball, run both ways and create some space with our handballs I think our kicking will take a huge leap forward. The trick of Hawthorn and West Coast is how well they work to get guys clear and easy options to kick to. That's our real deficiency.

Now if we can just add the requirement "FIT" to our recruiting...we might get somewhere

[Hellish Inferno 992]

Can run all day, neat skills and good footy brain that understands how to implement a game plan and adapt where required.

We have many players that have some of these qualities, but sadly lacking in others...

[Wiseblood 24,637]

5 hours ago, Glenn Molloy said:

It took less than 6 weeks for the St Kilda caretaker coach (and now permanent coach) to publicly proclaim that his team's inability to hit targets and nail goals from directly in front was an absolute killer.  I wonder why our own coach hasn't said the same thing.  

Firstly, he can talk about it all he wants.  It won't change their skill level.  What happens on the track and then on gameday is what counts.  Let's see if talking about it has any impact.

Secondly, Goodwin has mentioned it before as someone quoted above.

[beelzebub 23,383]

9 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

Firstly, he can talk about it all he wants.  It won't change their skill level.  What happens on the track and then on gameday is what counts.  Let's see if talking about it has any impact.

Secondly, Goodwin has mentioned it before as someone quoted above.

Goidwin mentions many things...talks a lot...and we play Fugaziball

I rate Ratten above Goodwin.

Going to be an interesting  year...or 6 months

[Wiseblood 24,637]

5 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Goidwin mentions many things...talks a lot...and we play Fugaziball

 

How is 'Goidwin' mentioning things any different to Ratten doing it?

[beelzebub 23,383]

4 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

How is 'Goidwin' mentioning things any different to Ratten doing it?

Im referring  to Goody's penchant  for diarrhetic nonsense at pressers. 

Pay attention  and youll find Ratten a lot less Fugazi in his dealings.

We'll  just differ...no need to change now

 

[Deecisive 1,709]

2 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Our backline recruiting has focused on good ball users - apart from Frosty. A healthy Jake Lever can kick well and is a great handballer, May, Oscar, Hibberd (at least in the past), Jetta, Salem all good kicks.

Mids and forwards not as much although you need ball winners and good athletes in those spots. It's worth questioning the chase of Langdon because he's not a great kick but there's so few good kicking outside runners that I'm not sure it matters, better to get someone than no one.

Goal kicking seemed to be a strength of ours in recent years until all of a sudden it wasn't. 

It's not a strength but if we get back to being able to win the ball, run both ways and create some space with our handballs I think our kicking will take a huge leap forward. The trick of Hawthorn and West Coast is how well they work to get guys clear and easy options to kick to. That's our real deficiency.

I am not sure i really agree with the idea our backline is full of good ball users. I was worried every time lever got the ball as his kicking to team mates was far from good, a lot of turnovers at critical times. Oscar... has to get the ball first before he can kick it. Hibberd's disposal this year has been woeful, far from the player he was last year. And Salem, again another who seemed to turn the ball over far more frequently this year.  May did not give us the drive we expected from the backline. But other than that (Jetta) was pretty good when fit.

[Fork 'em 6,991]

Agree Deecisive.

Butchers mostly including Salem.
May is a pretty good kick I thought, see how he goes with a proper pre-season.

 

[Moonshadow 17,677]

7 hours ago, Glenn Molloy said:

It took less than 6 weeks for the St Kilda caretaker coach (and now permanent coach) to publicly proclaim that his team's inability to hit targets and nail goals from directly in front was an absolute killer.  I wonder why our own coach hasn't said the same thing.  To be fair to Goody, he regularly mentioned "basic fundamentals" during press conferences but I'm so sick of watching Melbourne players miss goals, miss handballs and miss kicks.  The success of Hawthorn and West Coast in recent years has been based on many things but in particular their exceptional kicking skills.  Interesting that Ratten has identified it straight away...let's hope our recruiters are thinking the same way instead of recruiting contested bulls who butcher the footy.  I will watch our drafting and trade targets with interest!

He did.

[Sir Why You Little 37,134]

56 minutes ago, Deecisive said:

I am not sure i really agree with the idea our backline is full of good ball users. I was worried every time lever got the ball as his kicking to team mates was far from good, a lot of turnovers at critical times. Oscar... has to get the ball first before he can kick it. Hibberd's disposal this year has been woeful, far from the player he was last year. And Salem, again another who seemed to turn the ball over far more frequently this year.  May did not give us the drive we expected from the backline. But other than that (Jetta) was pretty good when fit.

Not fit enough. Kicking under that little extra pressure

Fitness was always the major issue this year. I say that includes attitude as well, it seemed on field there was acceptance that we were under done  

Effort was there, but it was nowhere near high enough

 

[Wrecker45 3,378]

We are not drafting players who are worse kicks than other teams.

Game plan, lack of fitness due to interrupted pre-season and poor player development are resulting in our kicking problem.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

There has been a clear lack of focus on skills and simple fundamentals under Goodwin.

It’s all been about grunt work and running which can work in short periods but isn’t a sustainable way of winning.

[Guest]

@Deespencer touched on it.   Kicking is a lot easier when you have targets that have worked into space that are confidently demanding the footy. 

I'm not saying that our skills weren't woeful,  but to focus primarily on our kicking would be to oversimplify our general shittness which was complex, deep and varied. 

There is also the psychology behind it.  Our loss of mojo leaked into all facets of our game. 

[Fork 'em 6,991]

2 hours ago, Stretch Johnson said:

@Deespencer touched on it.   Kicking is a lot easier when you have targets that have worked into space that are confidently demanding the footy. 

I'm not saying that our skills weren't woeful,  but to focus primarily on our kicking would be to oversimplify our general shittness which was complex, deep and varied. 

There is also the psychology behind it.  Our loss of mojo leaked into all facets of our game. 

 
If you're working hard into space and your teammates are continually butchering the delivery it makes it tough to keep running with confidence that they'll actually reward your effort with a decent disposal.

Double edged sword.

Edited September 7, 2019 by Fork 'em

[Deemania since 56 6,718]

7 hours ago, Stretch Johnson said:

@Deespencer touched on it.   Kicking is a lot easier when you have targets that have worked into space that are confidently demanding the footy. 

Run to space, be it frontal, sideways or backward. Anticipate to create. Drop the Jones/Viney/Clarry 'bomb' syndrome.

[faultydet 7,619]

17 hours ago, Rod Grinter Riot Squad said:

Not to worry, will be about 6 months until you see a missed kick or goal by us again 

Up until last season, our record of not missing a target in finals was exceptional.

[DemonOX 8,801]

We wouldn’t have a team if that were the case. 

[dpositive 1,698]

 

12 hours ago, Stretch Johnson said:

@Deespencer touched on it.   Kicking is a lot easier when you have targets that have worked into space that are confidently demanding the footy. 

I'm not saying that our skills weren't woeful,  but to focus primarily on our kicking would be to oversimplify our general shittness which was complex, deep and varied. 

There is also the psychology behind it.  Our loss of mojo leaked into all facets of our game. 

 

4 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Run to space, be it frontal, sideways or backward. Anticipate to create. Drop the Jones/Viney/Clarry 'bomb' syndrome.

Not just working into space but making space.

wWhen you handball to another shepherd them to allow them to balance and improve their delivery..

Unless you are included in the offensive phase. Reduce space on your opponents. Back up teamates by being aware of the phase of the game .

If teammate has space recognise that and tighten up the opposition if a rebound or umpire decision occurs.