On 09/05/2018 at 03:25, Diamond_Jim said:

Will Casey be the scenes of a repeat of the "Mother's Day Massacre"

Cannot off the top of my head remember the teams in that infamous day but IIRC one of them was Geelong.

 

it seems that the Mothers Day massacre was between Richmond and Collingwood.

From an article in 2016:

"This weekend’s AFL Mother’s Day round marks the 25^th anniversary of one of the biggest upset wins in Richmond’s league football history.

On Mother’s Day, 1991, the Tigers took on reigning premier Collingwood at the MCG.

Richmond was struggling in 13^th place on the ladder (in the then 15-team competition), having won just one game and lost five (with one bye) of its six games.

Collingwood, on the other hand, was sixth going into the game, having won three, lost two and drawn one (with one bye).

The Magpies, with 17 of the 20 members of their 1990 premiership side, were red-hot favorites to beat the young Tigers, who were coached by Club great Kevin Bartlett.

But with spearhead, Jeff Hogg, in scintillating form, Richmond smashed the Pies by 57 points in a performance dubbed the “Mother’s Day Massacre”."

http://www.richmondfc.com.au/news/2016-05-05/flashback-to-a-memorable-mothers-day-for-tigers

 

  On 09/05/2018 at 01:53, daisycutter said:

why not play him as a fwd (replacing anb) on limited time (70%). depending on how he goes maybe a short stint on-ball.

vfl a waste, just as easy to injure yourself there, plus he might kill someone at that level

and box hill will probably target him for some rough treatment (not that he couldn't handle it but still a big risk). always some nuff nuff trying to make a name for himself.

 

Im not sure hed know how to play that fwd role..

Be like a caged animal

  On 09/05/2018 at 03:51, buck_nekkid said:

This is terrible logic.  What about the time Jakovich kicked 13?  Bring him back, too!

the fact that he has had poor form recently has to be the main consideration, not an aside.  We should gift games to no one, ever.  Jeffy back in when he has earned it.

You think it is terrible logic to "consider" someone who kicked 5 goals earlier this year, at the ground we are playing at and also 5 goals the last time we played the team we are playing.

By your logic if Oliver has two bad games we drop him and don't bring him back until he earns it in the twos.

 

With Viney stupidly playing in the VFL here is the 1 change

IN: SALEM OUT: HUNT

B: JETTA, O.MCDONALD, J.LEWIS

HB: HIBBERD, LEVER, SALEM

C : TYSON, OLIVER, VINCE

HF: PETRACCA, HOGAN, SPARGO

F: MELKSHAM, T.MCDONALD, FRITSCH

FOLL: GAWN, BRAYSHAW, JONES

IC: HANNAN, HARMES, NEAL-BULLEN, WEIDEMAN

EMERG: HUNT

  On 09/05/2018 at 06:07, Redleg said:

You think it is terrible logic to "consider" someone who kicked 5 goals earlier this year, at the ground we are playing at and also 5 goals the last time we played the team we are playing.

By your logic if Oliver has two bad games we drop him and don't bring him back until he earns it in the twos.

No, that would not be my logic.  Past performance at the ground means what, exactly?  Kicking 5 against the suns (who had a different coach, different players and a different system) means what? These two things would be very low on my list of considerations in selecting the team. 

Can he play a role?  Will he play that role?  Is he in form?  Does he deserve to be there more than the alternates? 

He was dropped.  If he has done what he needs to do, then consider him.  To consider him because he did something in the past or done something at some geographic location really is flawed thinking.  The sort of stuff I would expect of Mark Neeld, not Goodwin.

Are people dead set about questioning Viney's return through the VFL ?

A) He has not playe any form of game since round 21 last year. Tmac was different he'd done a preseason & atleast played 1 JLT and AFLX.

B) The intensity of VFL level can not be even be compared to AFL, litreally different games. Yeah Viney will be going all out but the pace & intensity is nowhere near on the same level as AFL.

C) They can manage he's game time, he can play controlled minutes. Maybe 60% ? If he were to play AFL you can't carry a midfielder or any player on that game time.

D) Why rush him ? We are playing good footy atm & have the likes of Brayshaw fillling Vineys absence well. We rushed  last year and look what happened. Give him controlled game time in the VFL & have him back for Carlton, if he came straight back in & reinjured it I bet these same people calling for him to be in would calling for Misson's head.

Viney confirmed playing VFL.  Probably the right move, hasn't played in forever.

 

In -     Salem

Out - Hunt or ANB

  On 09/05/2018 at 06:07, Redleg said:

You think it is terrible logic to "consider" someone who kicked 5 goals earlier this year, at the ground we are playing at and also 5 goals the last time we played the team we are playing.

By your logic if Oliver has two bad games we drop him and don't bring him back until he earns it in the twos.

Jeffy's  form has been bad for a while, his last 4 games of last year were bad and he's had 1 good game this year. That's 1 good game in about the past 8.

I definitely don't want Hunt dropped.  

  On 09/05/2018 at 07:12, loges said:

Jeffy's  form has been bad for a while, his last 4 games of last year were bad and he's had 1 good game this year. That's 1 good game in about the past 8.

It’s a shame because Jeff has some leg speed, can kick accurately for goal from set shots and from impossible angles on the run, abilities we need more of. He brings some X factor. I think the way we have executed our game plan for much of this year has not helped his cause. He is a small and fast and plays best when he has some space to work his opponent over but this year he has usually had 30 other players in the forward line with him when the ball is coming in. The games against Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond I cant remember us getting an intercept in the back half and unloading the ball into a near vacant forward 50, that scenario hasn’t happened for us much at all this season. 

  On 09/05/2018 at 07:40, Earl Hood said:

It’s a shame because Jeff has some leg speed, can kick accurately for goal from set shots and from impossible angles on the run, abilities we need more of. He brings some X factor. I think the way we have executed our game plan for much of this year has not helped his cause. He is a small and fast and plays best when he has some space to work his opponent over but this year he has usually had 30 other players in the forward line with him when the ball is coming in. The games against Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond I cant remember us getting an intercept in the back half and unloading the ball into a near vacant forward 50, that scenario hasn’t happened for us much at all this season. 

Look, he could come in, and with the improved form of the team, play quite well but IMO it's a risk.

I think we should accept the decision of the footy dept. I’m sure they’re as keen to see him play as anyone but he is needed in peak condition for the second half of the season and we can beat this mob without him.

ANB won't be dropped. We are with Richmond the best forward pressure team in the league. he is untidy with ball but he is a big reason for that. If Garlett comes in it will be for Hannan. if Salem plays it will be for Hunt or Vince rested. 

No one really pressed for selection at the last VFL game bar Pedersen and he is not in the mix.

Equally everyone was a contributor against the Saints .. mind you watching the replay the winning margin should have been closer to 18 points even after you deduct the easy ones we missed.

I thought Hunt provided a lot of drive but his disposal was often just a kick forward up in the air... not sure if that is entirely his fault in that there was a lack of targets. He could be the one to go if they don't want to rest Vince.

In the outside mid thread we discussed the role of Hunt and similar players. With the press it is really hard for that style of player. May need to reinvent himself a little if he is to continue in the best 22.

Happy they are being cautious with Viney. Finally learning from our previous mistakes. 

  On 09/05/2018 at 10:52, Jaded said:

Happy they are being cautious with Viney. Finally learning from our previous mistakes. 

True Jaded.  Fingers extra crossed that he hasn't lost a yard of pace like Jack Trengove did.  (Different injury but hes been out so long and feet are a real biiatchh)

Edited May 9, 20186 yr by Petraccattack

  On 09/05/2018 at 06:45, Petraccattack said:

Viney confirmed playing VFL.  Probably the right move, hasn't played in forever.

 

In -     Salem

Out - Hunt or ANB

Hunt?

 

  On 09/05/2018 at 07:21, ProDee said:

I definitely don't want Hunt dropped.  

Seconded. 

  On 09/05/2018 at 07:40, Earl Hood said:

It’s a shame because Jeff has some leg speed, can kick accurately for goal from set shots and from impossible angles on the run, abilities we need more of. He brings some X factor. I think the way we have executed our game plan for much of this year has not helped his cause. He is a small and fast and plays best when he has some space to work his opponent over but this year he has usually had 30 other players in the forward line with him when the ball is coming in. The games against Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond I cant remember us getting an intercept in the back half and unloading the ball into a near vacant forward 50, that scenario hasn’t happened for us much at all this season. 

There was a moment early in the Richmond game where Jeff had a clear path to goal inside 50, Melksham called him through a put on a shepherd and Jeff just had to run on to the ball, gather and goal. He fumbled the gather under perceived pressure of a defender who was still 10m away and stuffed up a clear scoring chance. That was just one moment but it was a clear one after many fumbles and poor efforts not bodying the ball under only medium pressure. I don't expect him to be like a big body mid over a loose ball but he has to play at Casey for long enough to prove he'll reliable gather the ball under pressure to get back in the team.

  On 09/05/2018 at 10:24, Diamond_Jim said:

I thought Hunt provided a lot of drive but his disposal was often just a kick forward up in the air... not sure if that is entirely his fault in that there was a lack of targets. 

Hunt had 11 kicks.  Eight hit their target.  Two that missed were "up and unders", but neither resulted in turnovers.  One was a good pass with 30 seconds to go to Tyson on the boundary line (wing), but Tyson's opponent maneuvered himself ahead of him to spoil it over the line.  Hunt's kicking last round was good all things considered.

I like Hunt's speed, courage and urgency.  He's not immune from being dropped, as we've already seen, but I hope he gets the opportunity to regain some form, because I thought his game against St Kilda was heading in the right direction.

  On 09/05/2018 at 11:35, Stretch Johnson said:

Seconded. 

Thirded. The reality is he has exactly what we lack. Speed,

Watching him on Sunday i suspect he was given three messages. Keep taking the game on, don't be afraid to take some risks and lower the eyes and take some 20-30m meter options.

A really important element of our optimal 22.

Edited May 9, 20186 yr by binman

  On 09/05/2018 at 06:38, JV7 said:

Are people dead set about questioning Viney's return through the VFL ?

A) He has not playe any form of game since round 21 last year. Tmac was different he'd done a preseason & atleast played 1 JLT and AFLX.

B) The intensity of VFL level can not be even be compared to AFL, litreally different games. Yeah Viney will be going all out but the pace & intensity is nowhere near on the same level as AFL.

C) They can manage he's game time, he can play controlled minutes. Maybe 60% ? If he were to play AFL you can't carry a midfielder or any player on that game time.

D) Why rush him ? We are playing good footy atm & have the likes of Brayshaw fillling Vineys absence well. We rushed  last year and look what happened. Give him controlled game time in the VFL & have him back for Carlton, if he came straight back in & reinjured it I bet these same people calling for him to be in would calling for Misson's head.

Fabulous reasoning, however the game is against Whorethorn, Viney will be out to prove he should be in the ones, he just won't be able to tone it down. We run the real risk of him being suspended because I see him going in too hard at that level and other players seeing the chance to take out a threat.

  On 09/05/2018 at 11:35, Stretch Johnson said:

Seconded. 

Thirded.

  On 06/05/2018 at 13:22, don't make me angry said:

After ever win I read at least 1 poster say the same thing, it is just garbage we played well today against a desperate side, I read the same thing last week, if we play like today we will lose, it makes my blood boil every time I read it.

@DeeSpencer makes don't make me angry angry. Skuit smiles.