POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 5

[sue 9,096]

What's happened to the in-the-back rule? A couple of times yesterday there were blatant 2 hands in the back pushes in 1 on 1 marking contests with no free paid, both ways.  The most obvious was when Watt's dropped a chest mark. It was almost as if he did not get the free because he was being punished for dropping the mark.

Edited April 25, 2017 by sue

[Young Blood 2,585]

5 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Yep only criticism I'd make is we need to use the angles more instead of going directly backwards. Collingwood 2010/11 were expert at this, used triangulated handball from stoppages to cut through the opposition 

Richmond did a good job of this last night. They always had a player on the corridor side. Even when the ball was hanballed or taped forward their mids were looking to get the ball back to the corridor side even if it meant going diagonally backwards to a runner. I think this was Melbourne's game plan as well to link up with runners through the middle but Richmond executed it better down the stretch and if one team muffed it (mostly Melbourne) then Richmond capitalised with players already in position to complete the play.

On a side note loving how much more positivity there is today. I had non MFC supporters telling me for most of last nights game and against Geelong that Melbourne are playing a lot like the Bulldogs ie. at a very high standard of football. Just need to bring it for four quarters.

[ProperDee 1,698]

Hibberd, to come in for his first game in a couple of years and play like that, absolutely highlights how bad our defence truly is. To those wearing a MFC jumper, THAT is how a genuine defender plays in today's game (Apologies to Jayden Hunt).

Tom McDonald, you are not a FB's rear end. Footy is not a difficult game. When the opposition is streaming forward with the ball you man up on your opponent and try to stop him getting the ball. That is hard to do from 10 metres away.  One could be forgiven for thinking that Tom should have learned that by now.

Dom Tyson is probably (alongside the aforementioned TMac) the most overrated footballer on our list.  I read somewhere that he was described as "an elite midfielder". Perhaps it was his mum? Can't mark overhead, poor kick, lacks some intestinal fortitude and slow. 

Its sad to see the criticism of Nate Jones. The poor bastard has carried the whole team on his shoulders for about 5 years and is a legend.

Bernie Vince seems like a kid playing in a scratch game at the local park and James Harmes - never been sold on him and still not - has tickets on himself that he has not earned.   On a final note, has anybody else noticed that Jesse Hogan's body language is still "off"? That worries me.

[beelzebub 23,313]

3 hours ago, Webber said:

TMac has seriously improved both his decision making and disposal this year. He's much quicker in assessing risky options and shifting to handball instead of kicking, selling a dummy, and avoiding being smothered. He backs himself to mark, halves contests he shouldn't have any right to, and frankly has become a mountain down back. That he is one of the first five players picked each week, and for good reason, will continue to evade the whingers on here who can't see past their historical bias. The boy is a gun. 

Fwiw i thought he had a pretty good game. Helped muchly by Hibberds presence ( as i anticipated )

Couple of stuff ups..but few.

Seems to have 'clicked'

[Demonsone 2,036]

Injuries aside .. would love to know how Reivoldt had so much space ... We're was Tom Mac? Our defending was poor & too many easy goals 

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

18 minutes ago, Hogan2014 said:

Injuries aside .. would love to know how Reivoldt had so much space ... We're was Tom Mac? Our defending was poor & too many easy goals 

Tmac went to impact the contest and let him free. The rule is that if you are going to impact the contest and outnumber it you need to win it. He didn't impact it which left Riewoldt free on 3 occasions. Rance does this too, but 99% of the time his impact to the contest wins it for Richmond. 

[Old Bear 388]

Game was lost by selection committee

Watts as a part time ruck-man has been great for his development

How long before he cops a season ending injury time to keep him fwd

Pederson and Frost to Ruck

 

[Hellish Inferno 992]

Watching the highlights again it got me thinking how Richmond were very good at tapping the ball to advantage, particularly in the forward 50. Resulted in a number of goals because it gave our boys no chance to tackle them and it was done fairly cleanly (they must have been training for this) so it generally put a free player in space a chance for a shot at goal.

Whereas we seemed to take possession many times and get tackled under pressure, therefore causing a turnover or ball up. Harmes the biggest culprit, couldn't get a clean ball all night

[sisso 2,580]

I'm not a fan of our style of footy at the moment, could be due to lack of personnel but it's indirect, ugly stacks on style footy circa Swans of 2005. We have hundreds of possessions that seemingly end up no where and for a monster amount of inside 50s we aren't getting many shots on goal. We certainly can't score "easy" goals either. Fremantle had this problem in their strong era they would dominate the game but only be 2-3 goals up leaving the door ajar for the "inevitable" comeback.

 

Have we recruited too many inside mids when the game has moved on? The best teams (GWS, Adelaide, Geelong) play a clean attacking style that we seem miles away from.

 

You can see our players are absolutely stuffed from playing this grinding style: we aren't the Bulldogs and we don't have their same type of midfielders! I think the story would be a bit different with Max Gawn in there directing operations as we could spread harder from the contest but our setup is so reliant on him it's hard to see where the next win is coming from...

[Dr. Gonzo 24,187]

1 hour ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Tmac went to impact the contest and let him free. The rule is that if you are going to impact the contest and outnumber it you need to win it. He didn't impact it which left Riewoldt free on 3 occasions. Rance does this too, but 99% of the time his impact to the contest wins it for Richmond. 

I didn't have as much issue with that as I did with the two occassions Riewoldt contested against TMac and Frost kept his feet and kicked easy goals out the back. Players get out on their own sometimes when you play zone defense, that's understandable. But losing a 2:1 contest and conceding a goal twice is unforgivable.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,777]

Our season went off the rails the minute the Carlton doctor provided a fraudulent medical report to the MRP.

[Go the Biff 3,414]

6 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Just finished watching the replay. With 3:50 left on the clock we were 6 points down. 

Viney Jones Jetta Petracca Spencer Smith were all injured throughout the game and all played under duress yet Richmond won the game with just under 3 minutes to go. Richmond had 22 fit players playing last night. Realistically we only had 17 fit men playing. Now i see why they are the great pretenders. Wait till we have Gawn, Lewis, Kent, Brayshaw, Vandenberg all fit and firing!

A warrior effort from all our boys who just kept at it right at the end.

Its still hurts but im super proud.

 

Are you the same Dazzler that spayed shite all over BF last night ? Very different tune

[dazzledavey36 54,282]

11 minutes ago, Go the Biff said:

Are you the same Dazzler that spayed shite all over BF last night ? Very different tune

What are you on about?

[71 Molloy 266]

Good to see Richmond's search for alternate goal kickers in 2016 starting to pay dividends.....

Jack 6, all other singles........

[Go the Biff 3,414]

10 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

What are you on about?

There's a demondavey on BigFooty who put in a heap of uncharacteristically irate, over the top negative posts after the game. For some reason I've always thought you & he were one & the same and you'd had a big day on the tinnies yesterday

[Vineytime 847]

2 hours ago, sisso said:

I'm not a fan of our style of footy at the moment, could be due to lack of personnel but it's indirect, ugly stacks on style footy circa Swans of 2005. We have hundreds of possessions that seemingly end up no where and for a monster amount of inside 50s we aren't getting many shots on goal. We certainly can't score "easy" goals either. Fremantle had this problem in their strong era they would dominate the game but only be 2-3 goals up leaving the door ajar for the "inevitable" comeback.

 

Have we recruited too many inside mids when the game has moved on? The best teams (GWS, Adelaide, Geelong) play a clean attacking style that we seem miles away from.

 

You can see our players are absolutely stuffed from playing this grinding style: we aren't the Bulldogs and we don't have their same type of midfielders! I think the story would be a bit different with Max Gawn in there directing operations as we could spread harder from the contest but our setup is so reliant on him it's hard to see where the next win is coming from...

Finals football is won at the contest, being hard at the footy for 4 quarters, that is why we play this brand, it stands up when it counts. 

[dazzledavey36 54,282]

6 minutes ago, Go the Biff said:

There's a demondavey on BigFooty who put in a heap of uncharacteristically irate, over the top negative posts after the game. For some reason I've always thought you & he were one & the same and you'd had a big day on the tinnies yesterday

No mate..

[Vineytime 847]

5 hours ago, ProperDee said:

Hibberd, to come in for his first game in a couple of years and play like that, absolutely highlights how bad our defence truly is. To those wearing a MFC jumper, THAT is how a genuine defender plays in today's game (Apologies to Jayden Hunt).

Tom McDonald, you are not a FB's rear end. Footy is not a difficult game. When the opposition is streaming forward with the ball you man up on your opponent and try to stop him getting the ball. That is hard to do from 10 metres away.  One could be forgiven for thinking that Tom should have learned that by now.

Dom Tyson is probably (alongside the aforementioned TMac) the most overrated footballer on our list.  I read somewhere that he was described as "an elite midfielder". Perhaps it was his mum? Can't mark overhead, poor kick, lacks some intestinal fortitude and slow. 

Its sad to see the criticism of Nate Jones. The poor bastard has carried the whole team on his shoulders for about 5 years and is a legend.

Bernie Vince seems like a kid playing in a scratch game at the local park and James Harmes - never been sold on him and still not - has tickets on himself that he has not earned.   On a final note, has anybody else noticed that Jesse Hogan's body language is still "off"? That worries me.

Thought Jesse was really poor Monday night, played for frees to much and his body language was terrible, needs to smarten up, quickly.....

[Goodvibes 3,596]

10 hours ago, DeeZee said:

I don't think Garry Lyon was far wrong when he said the injury to Gawn and the suspensions to Lewis and Hogan probably cost us a place in the finals.

We're talking about the finals they play in September right? Seriously we're 2 - 3 with a solid percentage. It's been a frustrating and disappointing three weeks but all hope is not lost. We've got to find some ways to scrape wins over the next two months and then come home like a freight train. Forget the wins and the losses thus far. We've got a list that when fit can compete with anyone. Don't be distracted by the short term misfortune. I think we have the hardest midfield in the comp. We've waited a long time to have the class and excitement of Hunt and Hibberd in our back half. Hogan will get better and better. Jeffy is up and about. Watts is a serious footballer these days. There's a piece or two of the jigsaw still being sorted but we're close. I'm certainly not writing off finals.

[titan_uranus 24,974]

13 minutes ago, Goodvibes said:

We're talking about the finals they play in September right? Seriously we're 2 - 3 with a solid percentage. It's been a frustrating and disappointing three weeks but all hope is not lost. We've got to find some ways to scrape wins over the next two months and then come home like a freight train. Forget the wins and the losses thus far. We've got a list that when fit can compete with anyone. Don't be distracted by the short term misfortune. I think we have the hardest midfield in the comp. We've waited a long time to have the class and excitement of Hunt and Hibberd in our back half. Hogan will get better and better. Jeffy is up and about. Watts is a serious footballer these days. There's a piece or two of the jigsaw still being sorted but we're close. I'm certainly not writing off finals.

We've lost to three teams who have suffered two losses combined through the first five weeks.

We've led in the fourth quarter of every game and have the lowest average losing margin of all clubs to have lost a game (14.7).

We've won 12 quarters (fifth best in the league, the only club not currently in the top eight on the ladder to be in the top eight in that measurement).

We've led Geelong and Richmond, both undefeated, in the fourth quarter despite being one/two/three down injury-wise during those games.

We've done all this with Viney playing his worst five game stretch in a long time, with Lewis missing three games, with Gawn missing 2.5 games, with Hogan missing two games, with Vince missing a game (and otherwise not being that good anyway), with Watts having to ruck more than he should, with a long injury list generally and having been forced to use 31 players (equal second most in the league).

None of this means we're going to make the finals or even challenge for them, but IMO talk of the season being over, or of a lack of improvement, or of Goodwin struggling, is nothing more than classic MFCSS.

[Young Blood 2,585]

Terrific post!

Shows how far we have come!

Of course i would rather be winning these games but boy we have been playing some great football.

I think Goodwin really summed it up well when he said in the post match that the great teams find a way to win. We are young and we are now competing in games at the highest level. The next stage will be maturing to the point where we can win close games or sustain a lead in the final quarter

Edited April 25, 2017 by mongrel

[praha 11,236]

3 hours ago, sisso said:

I'm not a fan of our style of footy at the moment, could be due to lack of personnel but it's indirect, ugly stacks on style footy circa Swans of 2005. We have hundreds of possessions that seemingly end up no where and for a monster amount of inside 50s we aren't getting many shots on goal. We certainly can't score "easy" goals either. Fremantle had this problem in their strong era they would dominate the game but only be 2-3 goals up leaving the door ajar for the "inevitable" comeback.

 

Have we recruited too many inside mids when the game has moved on? The best teams (GWS, Adelaide, Geelong) play a clean attacking style that we seem miles away from.

 

You can see our players are absolutely stuffed from playing this grinding style: we aren't the Bulldogs and we don't have their same type of midfielders! I think the story would be a bit different with Max Gawn in there directing operations as we could spread harder from the contest but our setup is so reliant on him it's hard to see where the next win is coming from...

Fremantle went 3 goals within a flag.

[jnrmac 20,055]

6 hours ago, sue said:

What's happened to the in-the-back rule? A couple of times yesterday there were blatant 2 hands in the back pushes in 1 on 1 marking contests with no free paid, both ways.  The most obvious was when Watt's dropped a chest mark. It was almost as if he did not get the free because he was being punished for dropping the mark.

this infuriates me. Particularly when a player is running and kicks the ball - the oppo player lunges and pushes in the back only to see the ball go out on the full or turned over. Rarely is a free paid.

Also three times last night I counted  Richmond player encroach the mark from the side and not one free paid. Another AFL rule that has gone by the wayside.  

[binman 42,672]

Gutted to lose. Though less so than against Freo, a game we should never have lost.

On the positive side our effort was fantastic. Spencer barely played in the second quarter and im not sure exactly when Smith was injured but i found out on the radio at half time. So we were down 2 key players for almost 3/4s of the game and others were carrying injuries. We were spent in the last quarter.

Watts was amazing and i reckon his intensity and leadership this season has vindicated Goodwin's approach to managing him. Watts response has been impressive and i respect him for at, as no doubt his team mates do. 

We were also dead unlucky with the weather i reckon. The rain in the first quarter favored the tigers in so far we didn't put the score on the board we would have if it was dry and they played wet weather footy better. But it belted down just minutes after the game finished. If it was raining like that in the last the Tigers would have struggled to make up the gap

I leave the negative side for another time.

[McQueen 17,864]

Spencil out for 6 to 7 weeks.

Article on the club website.

Edited April 25, 2017 by McQueen
This may have been posted earlier.