What do we do about the shirkers?

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

 

[dieter 3,325]

I would never call anyone a shirker until I knew what it was like to be in the 'shirker's' position. Have you ever played AFL footy?

[Lucifers Hero 40,578]

20 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

DeeS...you may get away with calling Watts and Garlett shirkers but you lose all cred saying Jordan Lewis is afraid of contact.!

And, lets move this to the post match thread or else it will default into a Watts bashing thread!

Edited April 2, 2017 by Lucifer's Hero

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

Just now, Lucifer's Hero said:

DeeS...you may get away with calling Watts and Garlett shirkers but you lose all cred saying Jordan Lewis is afraid of contact.!

And, lets move this to the game day thread or else it will default into a Watts bashing thread!

Lewis goes to ground as soon there's a ball to be won on the deck. Happened 3 or 4 times today. It's gutless.

Very similar to the moment Clarko surely knew it was over for Jordie at the Hawks.

 

[Bang Bang Bang 5,851]

Demonland has jumped the shark. 

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

5 minutes ago, dieter said:

I would never call anyone a shirker until I knew what it was like to be in the 'shirker's' position. Have you ever played AFL footy?

Yep mate. Played 300 games. Me and Neita the only one for the MFC.

FFS. It's a footy forum.

We criticize players for their kicking, their handballs, their speed, their tackles, missing goals. I wouldn't be capable of any of that. But 19 (or 18, I gave Milkshake a pardon today) players put their body on the line at all times today. Watts - chest marks. Garlett - ground balls. Lewis - ground balls under pressure. All prioritised their bodies over the team today. All good players. What do we do about it?

[picket fence 18,078]

32 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

 

Harsh and unwarranted! PF

[davo 209]

11 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Yep mate. Played 300 games. Me and Neita the only one for the MFC.

FFS. It's a footy forum.

We criticize players for their kicking, their handballs, their speed, their tackles, missing goals. I wouldn't be capable of any of that. But 19 (or 18, I gave Milkshake a pardon today) players put their body on the line at all times today. Watts - chest marks. Garlett - ground balls. Lewis - ground balls under pressure. All prioritised their bodies over the team today. All good players. What do we do about it?

Boring?Some 'supporters' are just never satisfied 

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

8 minutes ago, davo said:

Boring?Some 'supporters' are just never satisfied 

Hard to be satisfied with the grand total of 0 flags I've seen. No finals for a decade +.

This thread isn't about the short term. The short term answer to my question is very simple - keep playing Garlett, Watts and Lewis as they are all good players. I want to know what others think about the long term standards when the coach has stated repeatedly he wants to play a contested brand of footy.

[dazzledavey36 55,995]

Usually enjoy reading your work DS but this is pretty poor post.

We got the win mate, enjoy it for 24 hours and move on to next week.

[Cards13 9,117]

22 minutes ago, picket fence said:

Harsh and unwarranted! PF

Fark you know you've gone to far @DeeSpencer !!!

[Skuit 10,031]

I've noticed that Garlett is hitting the drop with some serious speed this season. A handful of times last week and this he was just a fraction off from collecting the ball in the clear. Maybe what you consider skipping over the ball is just the pace he's running the packs with no chance to pull up - most likely as conditioned and instructed. Would like to see some footage.

[RickyJ45 417]

yeah we also want world peace, stopping of global warming....

get some perspective....well done boys

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

1 minute ago, Skuit said:

I've noticed that Garlett is hitting the drop with some serious speed this season. A handful of times last week and this he was just a fraction off from collecting the ball in the clear. Maybe what you consider skipping over the ball is just the pace he's running the packs with no chance to pull up - most likely as conditioned and instructed. Would like to see some footage.

The most obvious (of a few) was the last quarter ball bouncing towards him in the middle of the ground, goes straight through. Clean bowled. Wasn't a crumb situation which can happen.

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

20 minutes ago, davo said:

Boring?Some 'supporters' are just never satisfied 

Now I think what he said about the players is just crap, for 1 if Garlett and Watts didn't play today we would have lost. However, today's performance was nothing to be satisfied about. Relieved is the word I would use. We got away with one.
I even feel a little for the blues supporters we have watched many a games just like that the last few years. Where we were just in it without being able to get over the line. Great we got over the line but I'm far from satisfied. Bring on the cats at our new favourite ground .

[Moonshadow 17,678]

Crapp thread. Throwing out haymakers left, right and centre. Even to guys who didn't play today. Poor form.

2-0.

Long time since we've done that. 

Perspective. 

[Sigil 1,002]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

 

 

I was yelling at the tele when Watts bounced those off the chest, but to me that was a skill error. Not shirking. Plus I think he played an important part in our win today besides those mistakes.

Jeffy...  I thought he played a great game and don't agree. Again (yeah it's a theme) I was yelling at the tele when they were kicking to Jeffy like he was a FF. He didn't shirk the contest, had a crack and took a crucial mark. Maybe it's a confirmation bias thing (from both our perspectives), but I don't geddit.

Jordy was tagged today and still did some nice things, young players stepped up to fill the void, which I take as a positive.

Each to their own I guess

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Watts was good today, but the dropped chest marks are a bit of a frustrating pattern.

The other calls are ridiculous, especially to go as far as to say they are "shirkers".

DS is usually a decent poster, but having a howler of a post game tonight.

[DeeSpencer 26,518]

6 minutes ago, Sigil said:

I was yelling at the tele when Watts bounced those off the chest, but to me that was a skill error. Not shirking. Plus I think he played an important part in our win today besides those mistakes.

Jeffy...  I thought he played a great game and don't agree. Again (yeah it's a theme) I was yelling at the tele when they were kicking to Jeffy like he was a FF. He didn't shirk the contest, had a crack and took a crucial mark. Maybe it's a confirmation bias thing (from both our perspectives), but I don't geddit.

Jordy was tagged today and still did some nice things, young players stepped up to fill the void, which I take as a positive.

Each to their own I guess

Ground balls are my  problem with Jeffy. If the bloke doesn't want to stand under a mark I can get that, he did a great job winning that one on one deep. He's a speedy small who doesn't want every footy on the deck, that's not great.

Lewis spent several games last year doing the same thing he did today where he slips and slide and doesn't open his body up to get the ball from the deck. If others don't see it that's fine, they will soon unless he changes it. I'm glad he was average and Vince was missing and we still won.

[titan_uranus 25,212]

Don't agree, at all, with the Garlett call.

The Lewis call is myopic and based on one game. No issue.

The Watts call is nothing new. He was a star in 2016 despite the same flaws so we know he can be a star in 2017 without necessarily fixing this problem.

Poor thread IMO.

[Chook 15,026]

[DeeZee 7,463]

Terrible post

[Bobby McKenzie 2,407]

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

Absolute shocker of a post. DeeSpencer you have let your credibility slip badly with this one. NO ONE who plays AFL lacks courage mate. 

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

 

 

All creditibility lost with this shocking post DeeSpencer. There is no one in AfL teams that lacks guts. They simply would never have reached this elite level. Back to the drawing board mate.

 

 

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Jack Watts: Looks behind him when leading, cops one in the head and then proceeds to attempt chest marks on his next 3 marks, getting them all spoiled. Finally held one in the last in the hands. Unacceptable to be doing that in the AFL, especially when they are your bread and butter as a leading forward.

Jeff Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

 

 

Garlett: Shortest bloke on the field, repeatedly skips over bouncing ground balls in fear of being tackled. Under 10's stuff.

Jordan Lewis: Loves the physical stuff, courageous in the air, but any time there's a ground ball to be won under pressure he looks like he's on ice skates and he gingerly chases it. Obviously doesn't want to hurt his media career by getting the bald spot exposed.

3 very skilled and important players but they are all guilty of having 'Pedersen' moments today and it's not the first time for any of them. How are we meant to set the standard to the young players if three experienced guys are afraid of contact? Goodwin's stated he wants to build from the contest out and these guys do not show that mentality.

 

 

 

[At the break of Gawn 4,463]

Terrible thread. Can you please just close it to save yourself from embarrassment? 

[Ron Burgundy 8,588]

I usually like your posts DeeSpencer, but this is a shocker. I don't agree with any of it. In particular, I loved Garlett's game today - he was fantastic.