Wow. Aren't we entitled to effort? That's the major point in this thread. Not where players are in their development but how can we after all this time go out and not put in, not do the basics? BASIC FOOTBALL.

The basics take endeavour, desire, effort and intent. Tackling, shepherding, running to space, picking up your man, getting back to the goal line to kill a ball through the goals (this alone has cost us 3 goals in two weeks)

Why don't we have these basics and why don't we have the desire, intent, effort etc. I get we don't hav eth skill of a lot of sides but what I am talking about isn't skill based. Its mental. And we are failing badly.

Thats the only sense of entitlement I have. What are you talking about?

To be fair I think the effort was there against Freo and Swans, we were just outclassed. Saturday was a different story though, it was a pathetic display, similar to the second half vs GWS which the players/club said they were adamant to put behind us - yet a month or so later here we are.

Many supporters said preseason that we'd be 0-7 due to our unfavourable draw. It shouldn't be overly surprising that we've struggled off the back of playing the best 3 teams 3 weeks in a row. Just as the absence of Wines has seemingly had a significant impact on Port, I reckon Viney's absence has been telling. I know some won't agree, but we don't have the depth to adequately replace a hard nosed contested ball winner who tackles to hurt.

Brereton made a salient point yesterday; we're still learning a game plan that's more focussed on scoring. Against a kicking team like Hawthorn we were opened up like a sardine can whenever we made a skill error. We haven't been punished like that previously.

I would like to see more freedom to take the game on, but not at the expense of defence and I recognise it will take a while to not sacrifice one for the other. Stay the course. Things will turn. And when they do it will have some meat behind it.

I'm not sure why some act as though Roos and his methods cannot be questioned. It is 10 years since he won his premiership - the game has changed several times over since then, and Roos was found out at Sydney in his last few years.

Agree.

I am over the defensive Malthouse/Roos mantra.

Even Rossy Lyon is daring with his kick-ins down the guts.

The game has changed. You have to have an ultra-attacking element to get through from D50 if it aint a stupid turnover. The only team that could possibly play Malthouse/Neeld boundary-philic footy is Hawthorn who can keep hitting up targets.

Where is some flair? How bloody hard is it for a guy to block the man-on-the-mark and for the guy with the pill to run his 10 steps..and possibly....just possibly create overlap.

We are slow, one paced and introvertedly undaring. The only guys who bounce the ball are imports (H and Garlett).

If we go down, we deserve a show that they are going down with dare, and courage....taking the game on.

I don't see it, nor do Carlton supporters.

Roosy FCS, give them licence to take the game on. I don't mind a 100 point lose, but I hate it with the mild meekness that is so Melbourne.

As usual mFC is behind the times what a joke like we trade Martin Just when gorrilas were out of favour the club follows never leads

Still the most unprofessional club in the league Run by professional tossers at board level who have no idea

Agree.

I am over the defensive Malthouse/Roos mantra.

Even Rossy Lyon is daring with his kick-ins down the guts.

The game has changed. You have to have an ultra-attacking element to get through from D50 if it aint a stupid turnover. The only team that could possibly play Malthouse/Neeld boundary-philic footy is Hawthorn who can keep hitting up targets.

Where is some flair? How bloody hard is it for a guy to block the man-on-the-mark and for the guy with the pill to run his 10 steps..and possibly....just possibly create overlap.

We are slow, one paced and introvertedly undaring. The only guys who bounce the ball are imports (H and Garlett).

If we go down, we deserve a show that they are going down with dare, and courage....taking the game on.

I don't see it, nor do Carlton supporters.

Roosy FCS, give them licence to take the game on. I don't mind a 100 point lose, but I hate it with the mild meekness that is so Melbourne.

Yes Yes Yes

Jones skills concern me, they have not been an issue on a consistent basis but even he is making basic errors now.

Jones is under an unbelievable amount of pressure every time gets the pill. There is no relief for him.

Every time I read threads such as these which are filled with people wearing rose-coloured glasses trying to defend the indefensible, I wonder if they were the same people talking up Neeld before he was moved on.

I'm not sure why some act as though Roos and his methods cannot be questioned. It is 10 years since he won his premiership - the game has changed several times over since then, and Roos was found out at Sydney in his last few years.

Should we be asking these questions now, or should we wait until we lose 10 games in a row, and another bunch of free agents walk out? What happens if Hogan decides he is sick of playing in a losing side and walks when his contract ends? Is that the time to ask questions, or do you think it might be a tad on the late side?

Do us a favour and explain this statement. Roos missed the finals in 2009 - that's once - and they bounced back strongly in 2010.

What do you think will improve us? A younger coach? An older coach? A coach with less hair?

Will that make Hogan want to stay.

Or maybe, just maybe, a guy who played 365 games and has coached a premiership + a losing GF knows more than whingers like you.

And no, I don't care how many years you have watched us be [censored]. We've all watched those years.

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

Clearly explained as usual ENYAW!

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

When?

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

Leave the club by all means, but Dland needs incisive posters like you EN -don't leave us.

We got flogged and still lost the tackle count 74-64. Too many passengers, too many not up to AFL standard.

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

What.. the actual FK was that

Hysteria is taking hold!

The longer the week goes on, the worse we played last weekend!!

Hysteria is taking hold!

The longer the week goes on, the worse we played last weekend!!

No not at all. Last time i looked we lost by over 17 goals after kicking the first 2 goals of the game.

So it is bad. Face up to it.

Hysteria is taking hold!

The longer the week goes on, the worse we played last weekend!!

Yeah, we are actually improving and Paul Roos is a very good coach.

You wouldn't think so hanging around Demonland this week.

Fans just need to start having some faith in Paul Roos.

Are you all feeling better?

Case closed, please close thread

If you take out our gimme wins over the expansion sides in their infant years, then yesterday's margin of 39 points was our biggest win since mid-2011 (pre 186) when we beat Fremantle by 89 points at the MCG.

I'm not sure about you guys, but I'm happy with where Roos is taking us. I'm glad I didn't embarrass myself with Neeld comparisons like certain other posters earlier in the thread.

Just further proof that to many on here over react on an all too regular basis. That goes for both ways as well.

Roos has us on the right path, regardless of the bumps along the way.

Or as Roos would say,

to Beveridge.

How would you like to be on a sinking ship with the likes of ENYAW?

Whatever you do don't get between him/her and a lifeboat.

Why didn't Roos drop Watts? instead, he dropped himself. Last year Watts was dropped by Roos only to become an emergency who couldn't play for the reserves. What sort of message does that send to other players especially those who

are playing for the reserves. Has Watts become the new Colin Sylvia F.cking untouchable. I am sick of Roos making illogical statement,we lost to Adelaide,they almost played in a grand final two years ago,we did beat them last year didn't we?

We played well against the Swans in the second half,last year we lost by 4 goals 7pts this year it was 5 goals 8 pts. nothing like making in roads is there! Good riddens to this sh.t club,after 50 years as supporter I am going to f.ck off.

Feeling a little better today Enyaw? Need a hug?

Let's not get carried away. Yesterday was a good win and in the context of where we had been it was a tremendous, even team performance. It was very pleasing for Demon fans that we beat a team that we have only beaten once in 10 previous games.

However the effort was first rate and we beat the dogs one on one all over the ground. We out tackled them, beat them in contested possessions and played for four quarters despite the dogs surging back. This was absent against the Hawks and our effort was really poor. If it was a one off then great. Time will tell.

Last week we employed no different tactics against one of the more powerful teams in the comp than we had in the rpevious two weeks against the Swans and Freo. This was my original criticsim in the OP. We allowed the Dorks to dictate terms and got pummelled. Now if the narrative is that we effectively conceded that game to get players focused on the bigger picture - and this turns out to be the case - then that will likely be seen as a masterstroke. But until we win two in a row and we see consistent efforts from players then I won't be celebrating too hard. If they bring the effort against teh dogs to our next three games then yes we can get excited that we may finally have turned a corner.

I hope so.