Melbourne asks for draft assistance

[old dee 23,792]

Maybe I am just a simple old fool, but a match day experience used to be called going to the game ... Give me pie, a drink and somewhere to sit, and that is all I need!

No you definitely are!

[Dr. Gonzo 24,226]

We need to create "exceptional circumstances" at the MFC instead of begging for scraps. If we have finally realised that we (the MFC) are the only ones who will deliver a turn around, then this will be a win.

Mate if you can't see the deck is stacked heavily against us due to the compromised nature of basically all aspects of the competition then I don't know what to say. I agree we can do things better than we have but it is a monumental task to turn us around compared to some other clubs with inherent advantages in the system.

[Cards13 9,117]

The justification detailed on the MFC website is actually infuriating for how much spin/BS/propaganda it contains. I didn't think we would receive a pick (as the AFL are a bunch of compromised wankers) but I am staggered at the reasons supplied and the fact they would put something like that in writing to us;

Their first point directly contradicts the supposed criteria they referred to when changing the policy. Initially they stated the decision would be based on on-field performance over a number of years not a single or consecutive years. We have been poor by any definition for 8 years now and although this season was an "improvement" on last season it is only due to the fact that our 2013 season was one of the worst seasons on record. Our performance over the last 8 years is worse than Fitzroy's last 8 years and one of the all-time worst periods for any club. Under the old criteria we would have qualified for a before first round PP last year AND this year.

Before we had played Fremantle, Hawthorn or Geelong, 3 of the top 4 teams.

So we fell over the line against Essendon and beat Richmond, both games in which the opposition had more scoring shots and dominated the inside 50's. Even in their worst seasons poor teams have upset wins, that doesn't mean they are necessarily "better" than the teams they beat otherwise we could say we beat Richmond, Richmond beat Sydney therefore we should be grand finalists. We were close in several other games, and lost. Only wins matter, getting close is irrelevant. And the win/loss column shows we have won 38 games in 8 seasons and 10 games in the last 3 seasons.

I have no idea who they're referring to here? Trengove? Had a very poor year in 2013, no evidence he will return to regular senior football. Hogan has never played a game. Clark "retired" and we will soon lose him for peanuts. Impossible to argue they are "key" personnel.

A couple of years ago we had Watts, Blease, Strauss, Morton, Gysberts, Tapscott how did that turn out? No guarantee any of these kids will make it and it is unfair in the extreme to lump the clubs hopes and future on them and actually NAME them in their justification. I was astonished they actually did this, amateur in the extreme by the AFL.

Michie and Riley are unproven and irrelevant to the conversation, just because we traded in some mature players who were on the fringe at other clubs doesn't mean anything in regards to the argument for a PP which is based on on-field performance. Similarly the fact we traded in 3 guys who were all top 5 in our B&F shows just how putrid our list is. Not to mention Cross is on his last legs and Vince is closing in on 30 and we had to give up pick 2 for Tyson - so basically we can bring in senior players other clubs are willing to lose and lose our best prime aged players to FA i.e. become a feeder club. The only real long-term "win" of that lot is Tyson and we need currency to get more players like him which is the reaosn for the request in the first place. Even with all these guys coming into the team we could still only win 4 games and finish 17th.

Again what an idiotic argument, any club can trade players or gain a compo pick through FA, this is a zero-sum game, it does not improve our list and due to the fact we will likely receive extreme unders for Clark and will lose an AA full back for a speculative pick we will more than likely be worse off not better.

Again this is all irrlevant to the on-field performance of the club which is what the criteria should be specifically assessing.

This doesn't even mean anything - so because we have appointed an untried assistance coach to be mentored by Roos and take over in two years we will magically improve? This more than any of their reasonings is pure spin/BS. Not to mention the "potential benefits" of the FD cap and luxury tax and not even identified let alone quantified.

Again ridiculous considering they are meant to be working by some "secret" yet "objective" criteria which specifically refers to poor on field performance over a number of years not to mention the fact that the AFL RULE BOOK ITSELF SPECIFICALLY REFERS TO ON-FIELD PERFORMANCE as the only factor specifically referred to in the rules. If this does not constitute "exceptional circumstances" then I fail to say what could.

Again I did not expect a pick so I am not surprised I am however infuriated at the BS and specious reasoning provided by the AFL.

Very well put Dr G, my take. The afl can go fa rk itself for screwing the little and hand holding the large clubs.

[PaulRB 6,375]

Mate if you can't see the deck is stacked heavily against us due to the compromised nature of basically all aspects of the competition then I don't know what to say. I agree we can do things better than we have but it is a monumental task to turn us around compared to some other clubs with inherent advantages in the system.

We've stacked it so that we are at this losing end of the way things are... no one did it to us but ourselves.

Over the past decades

• OUR development of players has been sub par,
• OUR nurturing and developing of an ongoing winning culture has been sub par,
• Our talent identification and drafting have been sub par,
• OUR management of the clubs membership has been sub par,
• etc...

Half the threads on this board bemoan this, yet we want the AFL to kick in another extra pick or two so we can continue not taking responsibility for these areas having been sub standard for years...

Edited September 23, 2014 by PaulRB

[Cards13 9,117]

Earl another poster said something along the lines

"Whilst the PP has been ruled out, other forms of assistance were still possible"

Perhaps in their minds that may mean something like 3 for Frawley and second rounder for Clark but you end up in therapy trying to figure it out.

IMO the flimsy motherhood attempt at justification ( at face value) simply doesn't stack up. Could it indicate the AFL's immediate preference for the quartile it likes to see the MFC operating in? Slowly suffocating until its ultimate demise and the ultimate objective of further freeing up the MCG for them.

Makes you wonder how they go about things and the real agendas.

Could be so easily avoided by disclosing how the real decision was arrived at.

The afl commission needs to have a good hard look at itself, why have the rule if it is not used in this case. We are rubbish, our own fault for having no money to hire a half competent recruiting team that f'd our low draft selections. To then back hand and say other forms of assistance are still possible after it has give Suns and GWS a free ride with top end talent rungs totally hollow.

The afl is fast becoming one of the worst run sporting comps that pledges the opposite.

[dees189227 12,394]

Hawthorn had so many top picks they had to get a few right, along with the likes of dud high picks in Dowler, Thorp and Ellis.

true but ellis did play in there premiership team. But they also got later picks right. Luke Breust at 47 in the rookie draft. sam mitchell at pick 36 and traded smartly to get gunston and hale. maybe they just had better development staff.

[Earl Hood 6,086]

Earl another poster said something along the lines

"Whilst the PP has been ruled out, other forms of assistance were still possible"

Perhaps in their minds that may mean something like 3 for Frawley and second rounder for Clark but you end up in therapy trying to figure it out.

IMO the flimsy motherhood attempt at justification ( at face value) simply doesn't stack up. Could it indicate the AFL's immediate preference for the quartile it likes to see the MFC operating in? Slowly suffocating until its ultimate demise and the ultimate objective of further freeing up the MCG for them.

Makes you wonder how they go about things and the real agendas.

Could be so easily avoided by disclosing how the real decision was arrived at.

Let us hope your theory is not true and that we are just dealing with club compromised imbeciles that make up the AFL commission of Drones and the Executive Management

[Tatu 416]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-22/demons-dont-deserve-a-priority-pick

GWS - "We would say that Melbourne doesn't deserve another pick, because then where does it stop?"

I think this quote says it all.. Imagine all the priority pics being handed out in the next few years because of us getting one.. Wait no other club has got a record like ours, they may in 5-6 years if they keep loosing.

I think it would've been more rationale to argue this: "where does it start?, Melbourne has been on the bottom for __ years and if anyone deserves one they do. If they don't get one then i can't realistically see anyone else ever getting one!"

wow... This is one the most annoying, hypercritical and arrogant comments from another team I've heard in a while, considering its their draft concession and tampering that has made it unusually difficult for us to rebuild properly... GWS and the GC17 have taken the last five years of top end talent out of the draft leaving us with pittance, and then they have the gall to sit back and smugly judge our club.... GET [censored]!!

[Dockett 32 1,239]

Sir Kenneth Luke built Waverley ( Arctic park and a huge success with no transport) and Spencer St is about to be sold for public housing or something isn't it?

[daisycutter 29,616]

Maybe I am just a simple old fool, but a match day experience used to be called going to the game ... Give me pie, a drink and somewhere to sit, and that is all I need!

i can remember when a good match day experience was thinking your team had a chance

and i didn't care if i was in a standing room area perched on a beercan

[Earl Hood 6,086]

wow... This is one the most annoying, hypercritical and arrogant comments from another team I've heard in a while, considering its their draft concession and tampering that has made it unusually difficult for us to rebuild properly... GWS and the GC17 have taken the last five years of top end talent out of the draft leaving us with pittance, and then they have the gall to sit back and smugly judge our club.... GET [censored]!!

Actually in that article it is not GWS but the Pies bleating about where will it stop? How about where will it start? Nobody is getting any draft help except of course the Suns, GWS and of course the Swans and their priority picks through their academy!

[beelzebub 23,380]

Again people are falling for the attempt to apply logic and reason , let alone fairness to the AFL..There simply isnt any.

Theres about as much bone fide to the AFL's supposed 'rule" as there are 11 herbs and spices in KFC...Its a myth....a ruse.

[Earl Hood 6,086]

Again people are falling for the attempt to apply logic and reason , let alone fairness to the AFL..There simply isnt any.

Theres about as much bone fide to the AFL's supposed 'rule" as there are 11 herbs and spices in KFC...Its a myth....a ruse.

Hey what no herbs and spices? What the.....?

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Priority pick won't be issued because of Jack Watts

Edited September 23, 2014 by jabberwocky

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

well im glad we didnt get one. Im sick of getting all these picks. We have had great picks in the past few years and buggered them up. its time to stand on our own 2 feet. Look at port. A rabble 2 years ago but they got the right people in and are flying. Other clubs have managed to work out there issues.

I think last year we recruited some good players and now we have the right people around the club. plaus i think PJ knew we wouldnt get one but just thought he'd try anyway.

Agree with this.

The club just has to work bloody hard at making the right decisions.

We had our chance with draft picks and failed completely. The strategy of charity is not the answer.

A PP will only be given out now if a plane goes down with an entire list of players on board.

[beelzebub 23,380]

Hey what no herbs and spices? What the.....?

just 4...not 11

(flour,salt,pepper,paprika)....and pressure fried

Edited September 23, 2014 by beelzebub

[beelzebub 23,380]

As Red would suggest we were correct and within our rights to ask. Supposedly the criteria were met , but the reality is its just a rubbery tool applied by rubbery tools

[Goodvibes 3,596]

Cynicism is our greatest enemy. I'm a little worried about the collective psyche of Melbourne supporters at the moment - many of whom I respect greatly.

We've spent much time discussing why we're so poor. Supermac on his superb blog listed all of our most famous low moments over the past 8 years, Redleg and WJ and others have summed up the case in favour of a PP in a really eloquent but very dire manner. Jackson refers to us as an impediment on the competition. Roos has made regular reference to our scars. The Ox has only today, labelled us a 'basket case'.

If we continue to link our past failures to this notion of needing or deserving compensation and priority picks we're never going to shake the loser mentality. Many have argued that it is our responsibility to utilize whatever mechanisms the AFL puts in place. Up until today I agreed but just as I had concerns about the impact of our blatant tanking a few years ago (an extremely unpopular view at the time!) I'm worried about the chip on the shoulder we as supporters are developing. I'm not going to label it the 'victim mentality' that others have but it's getting very very close. Every time we blame others for our own failures and every time we make reference to the AFL as corrupt or unethical, we become one step closer to becoming cynical. I've spent my life dedicated to the ideals of skepticism. I encourage all I come in contact with in my day to day job to question and challenge but when cynicism overtakes skepticism, we begin to give up. When we think there is no hope, we stop trying. Melbourne supporters are talking about refusing to buy memberships, walking away from AFL and even hoping for the club to fold. That's what happens when you don't think you can make a difference. And that attitude is contagious. And the time to challenge the AFL is when we're on top not when we're scrapping and fighting to get out of the bottom 4. And hopefully that time will come. Hopefully, in a Port Adelaide style revival we'll work hard to climb the ladder and then with the new found respect a higher placed and profitable club will create, people will listen. We cynically make references to the AFL merely following whatever Eddie McGuire says. Well he has his say and people listen because he has put in the hard yards and turned his football club around. Earn respect and your opinions begin to count.

In short, we need to rid ourselves of our recent past and focus on how we can contribute to our future. Ridiculing past boards, presidents and CEOs is futile. Whinging about the AFL serves no purpose.

I read with interest today, Billy Connolly's approach to dealing with his own demons. "I learnt the past doesn't exist. Once you get that into your head you can stop carrying that burden, especially if you've come through something bad". I'm not sure if it's that simple but I like the concept. The past doesn't exist! 2015 - year zero!! Now there's a membership slogan.

Sure, we need to learn from our mistakes but not dwell on them and certainly not publicly. Do the Patrick Dangerfield's of this world want to come to clubs who describe themselves as an impediment to the competition? I respect the enormous amount of positive Jackson and Roos have done for this club over the past 12 - 18 months but they need to be very careful not to continue to reflect on the damage done in the past. It adds to the chip on our collective shoulders and will very soon sound like scapegoating.

So good luck fellow Demonlanders. May the skeptics forever rule the cynics!

[SaberFang 7,151]

Thank god Eddie is so pure, and Collingwood would never tank nor rort the system to get those "tainted" priority picks. Clearly they're a better team who are totally above that kind of pathetic behaviour.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/did-collingwood-tank-its-way-to-a-flag/story-fncqi979-1226440468746

[Tatu 416]

Actually in that article it is not GWS but the Pies bleating about where will it stop? How about where will it start? Nobody is getting any draft help except of course the Suns, GWS and of course the Swans and their priority picks through their academy!

GWS CEO Dave Matthews was quoted in that article? He is opposed to us receiving draft assistance? And also believes that their draft tampering hasn't affect our rebuild...

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

Well said GV..Hard work is the only way out of this.

If Clark wants to go we must deal for a ready made player.

The mindset of supporters is a concern.

We have been given access to PJ and the best coach in the land.

It is time to fight

[SaberFang 7,151]

GWS CEO Dave Matthews was quoted in that article? He is opposed to us receiving draft assistance? And also believes that their draft tampering hasn't affect our rebuild...

Thank god GWS get a bonus first round pick still this year though. They really need it with those 6 wins, 2 clear of us!

God forbid we have one though.

[beelzebub 23,380]

GWS CEO Dave Matthews was quoted in that article? He is opposed to us receiving draft assistance? And also believes that their draft tampering hasn't affect our rebuild...

Dave Mathews is a comedian yeah ....??

Needs better material !!!

[Buffalo 203]

A lot of Melbourne supporters have been asking the question: "If we don't qualify for a priority pick, no club ever will."

Well....I have a sneaking suspicion the AFL think a certain pharmacological experimental workplace might be in desperate need of a priority pick or two in the near future....

[beelzebub 23,380]

A lot of Melbourne supporters have been asking the question: "If we don't qualify for a priority pick, no club ever will."

Well....I have a sneaking suspicion the AFL think a certain pharmacological experimental workplace might be in desperate need of a priority pick or two in the near future....

A similar incongruence has passed my cerebal.

As absurd as that would be I strangely can't rule out Dill & Co doing it