POST MATCH DISCUSSION

[beelzebub 22,271]

Its hard to reasonably suggest any other outcome Old

Do we persist with Watts in middle...even now ?

[angrydee 842]

The top four disposal gatherers in the terrible saints midfield all played in the drawn gf in 2010. It is much easier to replace three unavailable midfielders than three tall forwards.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Its hard to reasonably suggest any other outcome Old

Do we persist with Watts in middle...even now ?

are you kidding me? I don't ever want to see him play anywhere else

[Fat Tony 4,480]

You are having 50 cents each way. You suggest that after we front loaded Frawleys contract we should have adjusted other contracts to keep him an RFA but then you say we should front load contracts to get stars - this action is exactly why Frawley is a UFA.

So which one is it ?

On Frawley, I acknowledge it may not have been possible in this instance. Although I would find it surprising if Frawley was well outside our top 8 earners this season. And we have made a slight mistake in not understanding the rules fully if Vince, Tyson and Watts (all of which signed multiple year contracts and only Watts eventually becoming a FA) bumped Frawley outside the top 8 this year.

Going forward, we know the rules around FA and should structure our cap to front load players like Vince, Dawes and Tyson, who cannot become FA, and back load the last year on Watts, Trengove etc. Overall, our cap should be mostly front loaded and fully paid.

[jnrmac 19,265]

Come off it Junior. You asked six questions.

There hasn't been a plethora of players lining up, but front loading contracts gives us greater cap room to land a big recruit in future years. And by not paying the full cap we are a no go zone for quality recruits because they want to play in a successful side.

Our total football spend is well above the cap at the moment. All I am suggesting is we make sure most of that is running onto the ground on match day. Not in the box.

We have been front loading contracts since before $cully. Beemer, Jamar, Morton, Sylvia, Frawley etc - who were all on front loaded contracts. We have tried desperately to get quality players to come to the Dees. Number 1, there aren't that many that come on to the market every year. Number 2 they mostly don't want to come to the Dees.

The only recruits of significance have been Clark and Dawes. And they have never played a game together.

So talking about paying the full cap is garbage because we would if we could.

You simply haven't thought it through. I asked you what quality players have come on to the market that were interested in coming to the Dees? Luke Ball set his fee at $500k so as not to be selected. And yes we probably should have taken him before Luke Tapscott. But that's it.

What you are suggesting is simplistic, impractical and largely unachievable. Particularly as GWS and GC were in the market for the past 5 yrs paying ludicrous sums.

But if you have a list of fabulous players we could pay the cap to I'd like to hear it..

[Fat Tony 4,480]

Obviously we cannot recruit mid-season and I gave a list of players earlier I would have targeted last year. This season we should use the 2014 cap space on an option over Frawley’s future contract if we can convince him to sign and likewise Dunn and other lesser players we sign. Going back in time, Neeld should have obviously have not driven out Beamer.

I just think it is wrong to say we have no choice. We choose to spend resources on off field support, where the benefits to performance are overstated IMO. I am of the view that good players make good coaches, not the other way around.

[jnrmac 19,265]

Obviously we cannot recruit mid-season and I gave a list of players earlier I would have targeted last year. This season we should use the 2014 cap space on an option over Frawley’s future contract if we can convince him to sign and likewise Dunn and other lesser players we sign. Going back in time, Neeld should have obviously have not driven out Beamer.

I just think it is wrong to say we have no choice. We choose to spend resources on off field support, where the benefits to performance are overstated IMO. I am of the view that good players make good coaches, not the other way around.

FT you still don't get it. We haven't been able to attract players. Money has been irrelevant.

But thats enough from me. i;ll leave youto your opinion.

Cheers

[InVINCEable 358]

We seriously should have won...

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2014-03-26/by-the-numbers-round-one

[bing181 8,208]

What team in the AFL could win with 7 or 8 first-22 players out - including their entire key forward setup - and then lose 2 more key players in the first quarter?

Uphill battle.

[Ted Lasso 17,039]

What team in the AFL could win with 7 or 8 first-22 players out - including their entire key forward setup - and then lose 2 more key players in the first quarter?

Uphill battle.

Stkilda...

[beelzebub 22,271]

Stkilda...

appreciate the parody of events

[Deez 298]

Its hard to reasonably suggest any other outcome Old

Do we persist with Watts in middle...even now ?

watts going forward on his own is not going to solve any problems.

he is only just starting to look good, i think he should be left in the middle.

[Deez 298]

I think we can be competitive if our small forwards lead hard and out run their taller slower opponents.

nic nat might be difficult to out run, but the rest of their falls aren't particularly quick.

[beelzebub 22,271]

I think we can be competitive if our small forwards lead hard and out run their taller slower opponents.

nic nat might be difficult to out run, but the rest of their falls aren't particularly quick.

that would require absolute belief and unhesitant movement off the opponent combined with the mids delivering without second guessing anything..

we are nowhere near that yet

nice idea though

[monoccular 16,327]

What team in the AFL could win with 7 or 8 first-22 players out - including their entire key forward setup - and then lose 2 more key players in the first quarter?

Uphill battle.

Some will not accept that we completely ran out of forward options...and guess what, we couldn't conjure up a goal. (Ah...those bloody talent scouts..picking injured players like Clark, Hogan, Dawes, Fitzpatrick, McDonald, Kent....just hopeless)

[Deez 298]

that would require absolute belief and unhesitant movement off the opponent combined with the mids delivering without second guessing anything..

we are nowhere near that yet

nice idea though

thats true, they look so good until they get to 60m out and start second guessing.

see what roos comes up with, just hope its not a degrading hiding.

[Lordweaver 235]

It's easy to bag Pedo, he hasn't played all that well, so I see a big upside, he can only get better and if he has any pride in his performance I am sure he will improve, especially under the tutelage of Roos and co.

[RalphiusMaximus 5,993]

It's easy to bag Pedo, he hasn't played all that well, so I see a big upside, he can only get better and if he has any pride in his performance I am sure he will improve, especially under the tutelage of Roos and co.

Look on the bright side. We've had more use out of him than North got out of Gysberts.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Look on the bright side. We've had more use out of him than North got out of Gysberts.

yeah but we used pick11 to get Gysberts, which we traded for Brock McLEan, who we used pick 5 to get

so Pedo is a top 5 draft pick basically

[Akum 2,660]

Pedo will be needed down back. It will be a disaster to go in one tall defender short against WCE.

Seems there's some talk about going small and fast in the forward line. But that's what the Bulldogs tried, with better "small & fast" players than we can muster, and they got blown away. Admittedly that was at home, and Eagles may not be as comfortable on MCG, but they had no trouble countering small fast forwards.

Another option would be to go small and tough - I'm thinking Terlich, Clisby, Viney, M. Jones, Cross (who will surely tag Hurn), even Jetta or Tapscott. Many of these guys have played as defenders, and they'll know what it is that defenders hate their forwards to do against them. So that's how they should play - man-on-man, stick close, niggle & harrass, go in hard, tackle unnecessarily often - in other words, play their defenders as defenders would, not as forwards would. Remember that game we won against Essendon in 2011 (was it?) where we had a massive number of forward-50 tackles? So aim to kick into the spaces in the forward-50 - not to contests, but away from contests, and make their defenders have to turn and run - play the game at ground level as much as possible, and push our best contested ball winners forward.

We also really have to interrupt the flow of ball to their forwards. The mids too will have to collectively be really good defensively, and man up when they have the ball, because they won't be able to rely as much on the half-forwards coming back to help them. If we get smashed in the midfield, we'll lose badly whatever else happens.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Terlich, Clisby, Viney, M. Jones, Cross (who will surely tag Hurn), even Jetta or Tapscott.

If that's our forwardline the AFL will immediately launch another tanking investigation

[monoccular 16,327]

I have just had the opportunity to watch the first half.

Does anyone know how /when /where / who etc Fitzy suffered his concussion? I didn't notice any on ball incident?

[Demon Disciple 11,089]

Darren Glass, whilst a long-time quality defender, is more of a punch from behind or wrestling backman. He is not one who takes a heap of overhead marks in defence.

Put Pederson on him, as he's probably the biggest and strongest body we have in the side. Have him go toe to toe all day with Glass deep in the forward line, and chances are, there will be a lot of spoils and balls dropping to the ground. Get at least 2 crumbers to rove the pack, and who knows how many goals could come from this.

It's going to take a heap of forward pressure all day to keep the ball in our attacking half for as long as it can, the mids will need to help chase and congest and the backs will need to push up to at least the half back line, but almost flooding the forward 2/3rds of the ground when attacking, then moving/rolling that congestion to the defensive 2/3rds will probably be our best chance.

Not that we have much of a chance, but we can all hope like hell that the warm weather sapped the weagles last week, and they stop to a walk sometime in the 3rd, preferably sooner (some time in the first might be just a little too wishful).

Edited March 26, 2014 by Demon Disciple

[CHAMP 347]

I have just had the opportunity to watch the first half.

Does anyone know how /when /where / who etc Fitzy suffered his concussion? I didn't notice any on ball incident?

It was an inadvertent head impact with the turf in contest IIRC not much after TMac's corking IIRC. Bang bang.

[jackaub 1,402]

watts going forward on his own is not going to solve any problems.

he is only just starting to look good, i think he should be left in the middle.

If they move Watts forward it will be a retrograde step for the club and for Watts. Leave him there to develop and make play

There are so many panic merchants and reactive posters on here its plain scarey. It will take at least 2 years to make this into a relevent footy team again with losing some players sacking some, developing others and trading hard at the end of the seasons

It wont be easy and short term reactivity will not help.