Both MD Picks?

[dee-luded 2,959]

FFS we need players now, not in another 12 months time

do not go down this path Neeld and co

We do need a Lachie Whitfield type..

We need 'A' Class, but not at the expense of a Pea heart. We want go for it Class. The types the Hawks would chase.

And we need a Big Aggressive mobile forward.

If Neeld is worried about too many kids in the same area of age bracket, I can understand that. and I think this is what your saying as well, so I guess they're looking to get that Class on the Lay Bye System.

I think we will pay big dollars to recruit experienced & mature players to help us straight off the bat next season.

[dee-luded 2,959]

The Tigers have key players Trent Cotchin, Dustin Martin, Jack Riewoldt and Tyrone Vickery coming out of contract next year.

Next year is a gold mine.

This is why we shouldn't put all our $$ Eggs in one cloked basket.

We should go after some tough mature short term players who can help us Lift straight away, but won't hinder our salary cap past 2 - 3, or 4 years, allowing us to recruit Talent going forward.

As we climb the Ladder & start playing exciting footy, other free agents & other players will want to come the Melbourne.

[jnrmac 19,890]

We do need a Lachie Whitfield type..

We need 'A' Class, but not at the expense of a Pea heart. We want go for it Class. The types the Hawks would chase.

And we need a Big Aggressive mobile forward.

If Neeld is worried about too many kids in the same area of age bracket, I can understand that. and I think this is what your saying as well, so I guess they're looking to get that Class on the Lay Bye System.

I think we will pay big dollars to recruit experienced & mature players to help us straight off the bat next season.

We have the lowest i50 of any team in the comp. As well as that our delivery is shiite.

Exactly how are we going to get it to this new aggressive big forward we are targeting,

We need quality mids and plenty of em. We don't have one elite mid. FFS even Richmond have two.

[Guest King Cuthbertson]

I find myself agreeing with opposing camps on this thread. Basically we need a mixture of everything. Our current inside mids, save for Jones, are simply not good enough; and we desperately lack pace on the outside. It's about finding the right balance.

In my opinion the best players at most clubs, outside of gun key position players, are their big bodied inside mids. But how many do you need ? Essendon have only Watson and clearly that isn't enough and Adelaide have Thompson and Dangerfield and they're top 4. Hawthorn have Mitchell and Sewell and they're top 2, while Sydney have Kennedy and Jude Bolton doing the grunt work complimented by other excellent contested ball winners in Jack, McVeigh, Hannebery, etc.

So I agree that there's a need for quality big bodied mids, but we also need mids that can spread with hurt factor. Viney is a big bodied quality inside mid and will be ours, but ideally we need another. But you can't necessarily solve all of your ills in one draft. I'm going to assume that we get Viney in the second round and if so I'd like Toumpas, but if he's gone by pick 4, which appears likely, I'd go for O'Rourke. O'Rourke is a contested ball winning inside mid with pace, smarts, and a great kick. At AFL level he'd play outside, so he offers a great combination to a club like Melbourne. He'll win contested footy, but also provide class on the outside. If it was a choice between O'Rourke and Wines I'd choose the class of O'Rourke. Wines is a bigger bodied inside mid, but he doesn't have the class of O'Rourke. It will be interesting what we do with pick 13. Stringer may be there and he'd be that second bigger bodied mid who also goes forward and kicks goals. But Kennedy, Menzel, or Garlett may also be there and they provide more outside class.

I do want us to trade pick 3 for a mini-draft selection and choose Hogan, but I'd prefer not to trade both picks for a mini-draft selection, but ultimately I have to back the club. I have no doubt that Kelly will be a gun and have no concern about his body size. As I said, it's about finding the right balance.

I'm warming to O'Rourke at pick 3 and Hogan at 4 as well. I doubt Kennedy and Menzel will be around at 13. Garlett is too much of a risk imo. I don't know much about players outside the top 10, but other names that appeal from various reports and such would be Paul Marschall (Central Districts), Jacob Ballard (Northern Knights), Nick Graham (Gippsland), Tim Membrey (Gippsland), Jesse Lonergan (launceston), Nathan Wright (Dandenong) and Rory Atkins (Calder).

Edited August 30, 2012 by King Cuthbertson

[old55 22,778]

There's all sorts of rumour and innuendo ...

Initially it sounded like GC ND2 for MD1 Martin and MFC ND3 for MD2 Hogan. This gets us Hogan and Viney in the 2nd round.

That article suggests GC have cooled on their part (if they were ever warm!). In that case if we were happy with ND3 for MD2 above then the new opportunity is effectively ND4 for MD1. Maybe we think the player available at MD1 is better than the player likely to be available at ND4. The deal still prerevents GWS from nominating Viney - we'd have to be sure that GC wouldn't nominate him either for the deal to hold up. As AoB pointed out that's in GWS interests at least as much as it is in ours.

This trade is can't be assessed simpley on face value because of the Viney situation.

[7-UP 107]

This article is just another newspaper beat up like Travis Cloke with dees.

Those journos have no clue.

[Axis of Bob 11,161]

The alternative to dealing with GWS is to pick up Viney with pick 3. So......

- MD pick 1 is traded for pick 4.

- MD2 is traded for, effectively, pick 29 (or whenever our 2nd round pick is).

[PartyTimeJohnny 533]

SO, if we were to take both Mini-Draft Picks am i right in assuming we would be a whole other year without two drafts in our list?

[dee-luded 2,959]

We have the lowest i50 of any team in the comp. As well as that our delivery is shiite.

Exactly how are we going to get it to this new aggressive big forward we are targeting,

We need quality mids and plenty of em. We don't have one elite mid. FFS even Richmond have two.

Jnr you obviously misread my intent.

My intent re the big aggressive forward was about 'Hogan', who would be ready to play in 2 Yrs to 3 Yrs, (2014/15)...

The older players would instill some 'attitude' & fight & wisdom/direction to our younger players next year & 2014ish.

The mid 20's aged players would add depth, physical strength & more experience, causing our younger players to strive harder to get a Guernsey. They'd earn it.

Our first 4 or 5 picks in the draft should be used on U-18's from the national draft, or recent draftees wanting to come home.

Edited August 30, 2012 by dee-luded

[Its Time for Another 4,084]

This article is just another newspaper beat up like Travis Cloke with dees.

Those journos have no clue.

You've got to wonder where they get this stuff from. Neeld has just come out saying no offer was made to Cloke yet half the papers were full of the 5yr $5mill deal we'd offered. If you apply a bit of logic, the Cloke deal made no sense to where MFC's list is at and the idea of a young team desperately in need of some hard bodies giving up picks 3 & 4 for 17yr olds who can't play for another year and will take at least 2 - 3yrs of development to be contributors is just rubbish. I'd be very surprised given the state of our list if they participate in the MD at all. More likely to try to get a gun at pick 3 in the draft and possibly trade pick 4 for an existing player such as Boak or whoever.

Edited August 30, 2012 by It's Time

[Hannibal 5,814]

I'm warming to O'Rourke at pick 3 and Hogan at 4 as well. I doubt Kennedy and Menzel will be around at 13. Garlett is too much of a risk imo. I don't know much about players outside the top 10, but other names that appeal from various reports and such would be Paul Marschall (Central Districts), Jacob Ballard (Northern Knights), Nick Graham (Gippsland), Tim Membrey (Gippsland), Jesse Lonergan (launceston), Nathan Wright (Dandenong) and Rory Atkins (Calder).

I've highlighted a player that really took my eye for Vic Country. Tall, strong, good mark, played off a wing. Really liked the look of him. Looks the type that is born for AFL.

[drdrake 3,119]

October is going to be a long month, the best thing for our club is the F/S bidding starts the trading period at least the what do we give up for Viney will be a dead topic by October 8.

[ChaserJ 4,646]

I've highlighted a player that really took my eye for Vic Country. Tall, strong, good mark, played off a wing. Really liked the look of him. Looks the type that is born for AFL.

Yep, he's one of my favourites from this pool. He's probably widely rated as a late first round to second round player at this stage, but if we picked him at 13 I wouldn't be displeased.

He just reminds me of what Rendell said he saw in Dangerfield.

A halfback who can play midfield, brings pace and power, attacks the ball and brings a high work rate. Was injured earlier in the year, and was a late call up to the Academy after Garlett was sent home. Has figured in the bests for Dandenong on a regular basis since the Champs.

Can see him started in a small/medium defenders role (a position of need) before being able to run through the middle.

Look forward to seeing how he goes at Visy Park this weekend.

[Clark_Kent 315]

The Tigers have key players Trent Cotchin, Dustin Martin, Jack Riewoldt and Tyrone Vickery coming out of contract next year.

Next year is a gold mine.

None of those will be free agents and also it is unlikely any of them will want to leave as Richmond's future is looking bright.

[Jordie_tackles 354]

There's all sorts of rumour and innuendo ...

Initially it sounded like GC ND2 for MD1 Martin and MFC ND3 for MD2 Hogan. This gets us Hogan and Viney in the 2nd round.

That article suggests GC have cooled on their part (if they were ever warm!). In that case if we were happy with ND3 for MD2 above then the new opportunity is effectively ND4 for MD1. Maybe we think the player available at MD1 is better than the player likely to be available at ND4. The deal still prerevents GWS from nominating Viney - we'd have to be sure that GC wouldn't nominate him either for the deal to hold up. As AoB pointed out that's in GWS interests at least as much as it is in ours.

This trade is can't be assessed simpley on face value because of the Viney situation.

FS is done prior to trade week, so we would know the outcome anyway, we are in the best position to not get screwed in this way.

It is just a matter of getting GC and GGWS not to bid then trading with them after they let Viney slip

[The Chazz 4,077]

Jnr you obviously misread my intent.

My intent re the big aggressive forward was about 'Hogan', who would be ready to play in 2 Yrs to 3 Yrs, (2014/15)...

The older players would instill some 'attitude' & fight & wisdom/direction to our younger players next year & 2014ish.

The mid 20's aged players would add depth, physical strength & more experience, causing our younger players to strive harder to get a Guernsey. They'd earn it.

Our first 4 or 5 picks in the draft should be used on U-18's from the national draft, or recent draftees wanting to come home.

Dee, I'm just concerned what our expecations are on this Hogan kid, IF we were to get him. Yes, he will be on our official roster for season 2014. Yes, by the sounds of it he will be able to play senior footy in that year if warranted. Yes, by 2015 he will be a year older and bigger. But at what stage do we expect him to have an impact?

Patton looked good at times this year, and will no doubt be a star in years to come, but I'd imagine Sheedy won't be expecting him to be a game changer until at least 3+ years in the system.

I'm not against getting Higan, but if we get him, I'd hate to see us putting to greater expectation on him, especially in the initial couple of years of him being on our list.

[deeflog 679]

SO, if we were to take both Mini-Draft Picks am i right in assuming we would be a whole other year without two drafts in our list?

correct, just like o'mearo and crouch this year for their clubs

[Axis of Bob 11,161]

I've highlighted a player that really took my eye for Vic Country. Tall, strong, good mark, played off a wing. Really liked the look of him. Looks the type that is born for AFL.

I really like Wright, from the little I've seen. Really good power.

[King Kunta 97]

SO, if we were to take both Mini-Draft Picks am i right in assuming we would be a whole other year without two drafts in our list?

correct, just like o'mearo and crouch this year for their clubs

They wouldn't be playing for the Dees on the weekend, but they would be training and developing their bodies throughout the year: thus fast tracking their development.

[What 18,810]

Let me explain how this works since nobody seems to have a clue

First off, COMPENSATION PICKS CAN NOT BE USED FOR FATHER SON BIDDING

This means we cant take VIney at 4 or 13.

He will be taken at either 3 or 24'ish.

What does this mean?

It means that we can trade pick 3 to GWS for pick 1 in the Mini Draft, where we will pick up Jesse Hogan (this will 100% be happening). He is a man child who will be ready made for Round 1 2014.

It also then means we will have pick 4 free to use on whoever we like, most likely Jimmy Toumpas.

Pick 13 will also still be ours, and we will now be able to take Jack Viney in the 2nd round at about pick 24'ish as we arent allowed to tsaker him with the compo picks at 4 and 13.

So to recap -

Pick 3 - traded for MD pick 1 (Jesse Hogan)

Pick 4 - Jimmy Toumpas

pick 13 - hopefully Ben Kennedy

pick 24 ish - Jack Viney father and son

Hope that clears things up. We shoul all thank heavens for this mini draft, becuase its what is going to allow us to steal Jack Viney in the 20's.

Edited August 30, 2012 by hogans_heroes

[Hannibal 5,814]

Let me explain how this works since nobody seems to have a clue

First off, COMPENSATION PICKS CAN NOT BE USED FOR FATHER SON BIDDING

This means we cant take VIney at 4 or 13.

He will be taken at either 3 or 24'ish.

What does this mean?

It means that we can trade pick 3 to GWS for pick 1 in the Mini Draft, where we will pick up Jesse Hogan (this will 100% be happening). He is a man child who will be ready made for Round 1 2014.

It also then means we will have pick 4 free to use on whoever we like, most likely Jimmy Toumpas.

Pick 13 will also still be ours, and we will now be able to take Jack Viney in the 2nd round at about pick 24'ish as we arent allowed to tsaker him with the compo picks at 4 and 13.

So to recap -

Pick 3 - traded for MD pick 1 (Jesse Hogan)

Pick 4 - Jimmy Toumpas

pick 13 - hopefully Ben Kennedy

pick 24 ish - Jack Viney father and son

Hope that clears things up. We shoul all thank heavens for this mini draft, becuase its what is going to allow us to steal Jack Viney in the 20's.

I don't know what we'd do without you.

[Jordie_tackles 354]

I don't know what we'd do without you.

If he had any idea he would realise he is the 1000th person to explain this

[King Kunta 97]

Let me explain how this works since nobody seems to have a clue

First off, COMPENSATION PICKS CAN NOT BE USED FOR FATHER SON BIDDING

This means we cant take VIney at 4 or 13.

He will be taken at either 3 or 24'ish.

What does this mean?

It means that we can trade pick 3 to GWS for pick 1 in the Mini Draft, where we will pick up Jesse Hogan (this will 100% be happening). He is a man child who will be ready made for Round 1 2014.

It also then means we will have pick 4 free to use on whoever we like, most likely Jimmy Toumpas.

Pick 13 will also still be ours, and we will now be able to take Jack Viney in the 2nd round at about pick 24'ish as we arent allowed to tsaker him with the compo picks at 4 and 13.

So to recap -

Pick 3 - traded for MD pick 1 (Jesse Hogan)

Pick 4 - Jimmy Toumpas

pick 13 - hopefully Ben Kennedy

pick 24 ish - Jack Viney father and son

Hope that clears things up. We shoul all thank heavens for this mini draft, becuase its what is going to allow us to steal Jack Viney in the 20's.

Clearly you don't know what's going on Father Son bidding occurs before trade period, which is the period where GWS deals out it mini draft selections, meaning we can't simply dispose of our number 3 before the Father Son process

Edited August 30, 2012 by New Age Hipster

[binman 41,945]

We shoul all thank heavens for this mini draft, becuase its what is going to allow us to steal Jack Viney in the 20's.

This is flaky logic on a couple of levels. One we don't necessarily need the MD to allow us to take JV in the second round. My opinion is that neither GWS or GC are going to risk nominating JV for fear we'll call their bluff and they will miss their targets.

Secondly lets say we do trade pick 3 with GWS for Viney and i'm wrong about GC's position on Viney. In that scenario GC could simply select Viney with their 2nd pick (unlikely i know but possible)

[olisik 4,060]

Let me explain how this works since nobody seems to have a clue

First off, COMPENSATION PICKS CAN NOT BE USED FOR FATHER SON BIDDING

This means we cant take VIney at 4 or 13.

He will be taken at either 3 or 24'ish.

What does this mean?

It means that we can trade pick 3 to GWS for pick 1 in the Mini Draft, where we will pick up Jesse Hogan (this will 100% be happening). He is a man child who will be ready made for Round 1 2014.

It also then means we will have pick 4 free to use on whoever we like, most likely Jimmy Toumpas.

Pick 13 will also still be ours, and we will now be able to take Jack Viney in the 2nd round at about pick 24'ish as we arent allowed to tsaker him with the compo picks at 4 and 13.

So to recap -

Pick 3 - traded for MD pick 1 (Jesse Hogan)

Pick 4 - Jimmy Toumpas

pick 13 - hopefully Ben Kennedy

pick 24 ish - Jack Viney father and son

Hope that clears things up. We shoul all thank heavens for this mini draft, becuase its what is going to allow us to steal Jack Viney in the 20's.

WELCOME TO DEMONLAND!!!!