On the Couch - Brock talks about 'tanking'

[McQueen 17,864]

What is he saying that you disagree with? We all clapped and cheered when it happened.

Below comments..

"I knew what they were doing and why they were doing it, but I didn't have to watch it any more," Gardner said on SEN's Morning Glory program.

"As a spectator or observer, there were a number of games that were questionable about how hard they were trying."

[rpfc 27,662]

So, gardner is saying that Daniher was tanking?

This is certainly a new twist......or did I read it wrong?

I assumed early 08 before Stynes came in.

Certainly does give Schwab a pass...

Certainly couldn't have been an evil conspirator if someone else was in the job you were conspiring from...

My opinion is if he thought Bailey was tanking in 08 - he doesn't know what tanking is, we were crap, and we were crap because of the same reasons we are crap now - a coach trying to get a bunch a blokes to play a style of footy they are not used to.

Cam Bruce wasn't tanking when he gave hospital handballs, Paul.

Cam Bruce did that because Cam Bruce can't handball.

[jayceebee31 692]

Fair comments by Gardner IMO.

I agree. Furthermore, it would be incredible,if indeed, we were found tanking this year,re- changes to players playing in different positions, such as Rivers, Garland etc..

Also players such as Davey , being pulled early to have operation etc.

What I am getting it, this has happened for many years now. Carlton, Richmond, Collingwood, Port Adelaide, West Coast, and I think Brisbane under Walls did it also...they have all tanked.

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

Below comments..

"I knew what they were doing and why they were doing it, but I didn't have to watch it any more," Gardner said on SEN's Morning Glory program.

"As a spectator or observer, there were a number of games that were questionable about how hard they were trying."

Yep. I remember thinking the same things. And i knew it would come back to haunt us. Well here it is...

[rpfc 27,662]

Yep. I remember thinking the same things. And i knew it would come back to haunt us. Well here it is...

He said he left DURING his presidency. A reign that ended in 08.

We 'experiemented' to lose 1 game in 2009 - the rest we were just crap in.

2008?

lol

We were just awful then.

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

He said he left DURING his presidency. A reign that ended in 08.

We 'experiemented' to lose 1 game in 2009 - the rest we were just crap in.

2008?

lol

We were just awful then.

No rpfc the stones were in place during 2008 as well. Bailey was given directives.

[H_T 2,941]

So, gardner is saying that Daniher was tanking?

This is certainly a new twist......or did I read it wrong?

2003 was a horrid year. Remember Cameron Hunter. Was Gardner president then ? My memory is fading.

[Ouch! 2,093]

I think the most astounding thing from that article is the comment from David King, in so far as someone didn't use an opportunity to stick the boot into us when given the chance.

[rpfc 27,662]

No rpfc the stones were in place during 2008 as well. Bailey was given directives.

Directives? lol

From who?

The President who left early?

The CEO - STEVE HARRIS or the other one PAUL MCNAMEE?

The Evil Teddy Bear Chris Connolly?

Give it up, WYL.

Gardner has led you down The Gardner Path - he saw nothing because there was nothing to see.

We were crap in 08.

[stinga81 210]

Carlton, Melbourne, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Richmond and West Coast over the last 12 or so years at one point have tanked.

The AFL knows this, either they go after all of them and hand out penalties. Or they put in penalties for this day forward for any team that deliberately tanks in the future.

The AFL can't punish MFC,as they would be would doing a double backflip with a pike if they punish one and not the others, and not to mention a massive contradiction of what they've stated previously on the matter.

Edited August 1, 2012 by stinga81

[s-t-i-n-g-a 439]

I think the most astounding thing from that article is the comment from David King, in so far as someone didn't use an opportunity to stick the boot into us when given the chance.

I had to read that twice.

[Jonesbag 487]

Concerning to say the least, the main worry for me is if the AFL decide to sanction us due to pressure from the public. It probably wont happen, I just cant bare to think about where our club will be without being able to participate in the draft.

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

Directives? lol

From who?

The President who left early?

The CEO - STEVE HARRIS or the other one PAUL MCNAMEE?

The Evil Teddy Bear Chris Connolly?

Give it up, WYL.

Gardner has led you down The Gardner Path - he saw nothing because there was nothing to see.

We were crap in 08.

Believe what you will rpfc.

[Undeeterred 2,896]

I wonder whether, if we did lose our draft picks, Mark Neeld would actually break down and cry.

I would.

[rpfc 27,662]

Believe what you will rpfc.

What does that mean?

Explain yourself and why you agree that we were tanking in 08. And who implemented the decree to do this so-called tanking.

Remembering that this was before Stynes and Schwab.

[John Crow Batty 8,338]

To me it was obvious we tanked for two entire seasons. Not that I am against the principal of tanking. But it should be a short term thing like to finish off a bad season to best advantage Most other teams dont plan to tank. It is just a a mid season plan B to save something from a bad year and happens almost every season. Although Carlton would be an exception like us and they too now suffer a similar curse of unrealised expectations. What we done was shameful and akin to poisoning the well. What is so sick about all this is those responsible for this disaster are still at the club and their legacy continues. We cannot heal and move on while they remain. I am sure Neeld would not have come anywhere near us if he was aware of the terminal depth of our problems. He was conned just like the supporters and the rest of the football community.

Edited August 1, 2012 by america de cali

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

What does that mean?

Explain yourself and why you agree that we were tanking in 08. And who implemented the decree to do this so-called tanking.

Remembering that this was before Stynes and Schwab.

Explain myself...i think it is actually time the entire MFC stopped bending rules to try and get better, and rather start playing smart football without any compromise.

Dean Bailey said enough as he left.

We took the easy options but as usual did not capitolize on them. This is where we always fall.

I am glad all this is now coming out. This is the black cloud. We either start winning footy or we will die.

[rpfc 27,662]

Explain myself...i think it is actually time the entire MFC stopped bending rules to try and get better, and rather start playing smart football without any compromise.

Dean Bailey said enough as he left.

We took the easy options but as usual did not capitolize on them. This is where we always fall.

I am glad all this is now coming out. This is the black cloud. We either start winning footy or we will die.

No. People at taking pot-shots at your club and you are sitting there taking it.

We have plenty that we have done wrong, but 'tanking' in early 08 is not one of them.

A former President said it, it's crap and the old WYL wouldn't stand for it.

You take your medicine when you deserve it, but someone is trying to give us an enema with Tabasco Sauce and you shouldn't stand for it.

We did not 'tank' in 08 and Gardner should be ashamed to suggest it.

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

No. People at taking pot-shots at your club and you are sitting there taking it.

We have plenty that we have done wrong, but 'tanking' in early 08 is not one of them.

A former President said it, it's crap and the old WYL wouldn't stand for it.

You take your medicine when you deserve it, but someone is trying to give us an enema with Tabasco Sauce and you shouldn't stand for it.

We did not 'tank' in 08 and Gardner should be ashamed to suggest it.

No rpfc. WYL has been waiting for this issue to raise its head for a long time. The sooner it is dealt with the better.

Our ex pres is not saying anything we have not discussed here. The AFL did not go hard on us previously because Jimma was so ill.

Now it could be different. The only way to beat this is to go head down bum up.

We did the crime...

[rpfc 27,662]

No rpfc. WYL has been waiting for this issue to raise its head for a long time. The sooner it is dealt with the better.

Our ex pres is not saying anything we have not discussed here. The AFL did not go hard on us previously because Jimma was so ill.

Now it could be different. The only way to beat this is to go head down bum up.

We did the crime...

FFS.

Gardner has claimed that he left a game early IN HIS PRESIDENCY because of tanking.

Open your eyes and realise the difference between valid concern and outsiders 'piling on.'

You are witnessing the latter, and we shouldn't take it.

[daisycutter 28,709]

Carlton, Melbourne, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Richmond and West Coast over the last 12 or so years at one point have tanked.

The AFL knows this, either they go after all of them and hand out penalties. Or they put in penalties for this day forward for any team that deliberately tanks in the future.

The AFL can't punish MFC,as they would be would doing a double backflip with a pike if they punish one and not the others, and not to mention a massive contradiction of what they've stated previously on the matter.

OK

But the problem is how do you define tanking - I don't think you can

Player promotion?

Player demotion?

Playing in new position?

Slow rotations?

Benching players?

Early operations?

General soreness?

Resting players?

Failure to tag a player?

Giving players KPIs which impact their natural game?

and the list goes on and on

the only thing I think they can do is reduce the predictability of draft (tanking) rewards

[The Chazz 4,077]

RP - like you, I'm trying to work out where Gardner's comments can be taken seriously. The best I can come up with is;

Was Gardner invovled in any way with the recruitment of Dean Bailey? In that interview/recruitment process, could it have been mentioned that the best outcome for the Club would be to rebuild, get as many top draft picks as possible, which obviously meant finishing toward the bottom (which meant not winning). Is it at all possible that Gardner was fully aware of what the immediate future held for the Club? The fact that we have (generally) only beaten interstate sides in Victoria, these could be classed as games that we "had to win" so questions wouldn't be raised.

None of us have any idea what the truth is. Will the AFL expose the truth? I'm doubtful, but it is possible that some of it will leak. Will it spell the end of the Club? Again, I'm doubtful, but if they (the AFL) decide to strip us of draft picks, we'll be in a world of hurt. It probably won't happen, but there are a small few of us (WYL, Old Dee) that wouldn't be surprised, and could actually see Vlad acting in such a fashion. That doesn't mean we think the sky is falling, it's because we don't know what the AFL will do.

[Sir Why You Little 35,170]

FFS.

Gardner has claimed that he left a game early IN HIS PRESIDENCY because of tanking.

Open your eyes and realise the difference between valid concern and outsiders 'piling on.'

You are witnessing the latter, and we shouldn't take it.

Gardner is not an outsider. He knew what was going on.

Kruezer Cup...remember that one.

We took easy options. The hard realities may start soon

Pity none of our draft picks have got us anywhere. All this heat for nothing...

[rpfc 27,662]

RP - like you, I'm trying to work out where Gardner's comments can be taken seriously. The best I can come up with is;

Was Gardner invovled in any way with the recruitment of Dean Bailey? In that interview/recruitment process, could it have been mentioned that the best outcome for the Club would be to rebuild, get as many top draft picks as possible, which obviously meant finishing toward the bottom (which meant not winning). Is it at all possible that Gardner was fully aware of what the immediate future held for the Club? The fact that we have (generally) only beaten interstate sides in Victoria, these could be classed as games that we "had to win" so questions wouldn't be raised.

None of us have any idea what the truth is. Will the AFL expose the truth? I'm doubtful, but it is possible that some of it will leak. Will it spell the end of the Club? Again, I'm doubtful, but if they (the AFL) decide to strip us of draft picks, we'll be in a world of hurt. It probably won't happen, but there are a small few of us (WYL, Old Dee) that wouldn't be surprised, and could actually see Vlad acting in such a fashion. That doesn't mean we think the sky is falling, it's because we don't know what the AFL will do.

I think it is as innocent as not knowing what 'tanking' is.

We cleared out quite a few players at the end of 08 and tried to play a run and carry style of footy. It was a disastruous mix and we lost games - never looked like winning.

I think Gardner thinks that is tanking and I also think that he likes the sound of his own opinions on the radio.

As DC said - how do you define 'tanking'?

Some think of it as Gardner thinks of it, and others think of it as deliberately throwing a match with the players involved (those that think Whitnall missed on purpose in 07 are in this camp).

It is in the vast middle and it is undefinable and not worth trying to.

And nothing will come of this.

They may in the future look at a lottery, or possibly something more cerebral that I can get into but won't because it is so bloody hard to explain (it's in the Norm Smith UF League thread if anyone cares that much...you don't? Fine!).

[rpfc 27,662]

Gardner is not an outsider. He knew what was going on.

Kruezer Cup...remember that one.

We took easy options. The hard realities may start soon

Pity none of our draft picks have got us anywhere. All this heat for nothing...

lol

WTF?

We didn't tank in the Kreuzer Cup - we were the [censored] moral patsy in that little sh!tstorm!

(I will get a warning point for that)

Gardner saw no tanking while he was in charge, what he saw was his coach and his FD move from an old list to a young list and give them a gameplan that they couldn't play well.

That is nowhere near tanking.