I am a HUGE Grimes fan but agree his kicking needs work.

The most painful thing about it all is that I think he's a great kick, he just tries to spear every ball, low and flat onto a teammates chest (even when he doesn't need to) and when you do that there is always going to be an occasional spray.

He had a shocking 1st half today but got back into it and played a really good 2nd half. He saved us about 5 times in the 3rd term with his courage, contested marking and willingness to work hard. If he gets his kicking sorted out he could, and will be absolutely elite.

Jono Brown isn't the greatest athlete, Nick Riewoldt struggles with his kicking for goal and Dane Swan struggles to take pack marks.

Does anyone think Grimes doesn't work super hard on his kicking? Usually his problem is out on the fulls when close to the boundary. I'm sure he can improve it. It seems 8/10 of his kicks are perfect, but 2/10 are (often costly) turn overs. Frawley, Macdonald and Garland are similar.

In an ideal world we get more of the Blease/Straus/Tapscott's in the team.

The other thing that will really help is to get a CHF with a presence and an ability to read the play. Someone who can provide the contest for the bail out kick. Let's hope Watts or Cook bring that in soon.

To be honest, Jared Rivers' kicking into the man on the mark was 10 times worse than any kicking mistake Grimes made today, because Rivers has played 100 games and he still hasn't learnt to use the ball properly, and he got done by every opponent he had today.

There are very few <30 game players who are better than Grimes.

Tell me... when you have a backline that can include Rivers (what about that kick into the man on the mark!!!!), Bartram, Martin, MacDonald, Garland and Warnock ...who else is going to kick the ball out of defence?!! No wonder we put Tapscott down the back, and no wonder we use Davey in the backline. Even Frawley is not the greatest kick.

Grimes takes the kicks 'cos he gets it the most, and he's the best of an average lot.

hmmm, i've only been saying this for 2 years. He is very brave and can take a great mark, but I hate the ball in his hands.

Grimes is a consummate defender who must already be well out in front on 'marks from opposition kicks'.

He has played less than 30 games.

He has been given instructions to take the game on at every chance, and to try to move the ball across the ground if there are simply no likely options.

His kickng isn't elite, but at this point the key problem is that as a team we are still very poor at continuously moving to present options.

Anyone here not tear your hair out at kick-ins?

My point is, better leading and movement could push the whole team's disposal efficiency up by 10%.

Pathetic from an otherwise really good crowd today.

Bronx cheer a guy who has played 27 games and is constantly under pressure and constantly puts his body on the line for the team. What heroes!

He was hitting Swans players lace out on the chest. The bronx cheers are the least of his worries.

The sky isn't falling, but he is susceptible to these complete brain fades.

Oh yeah the 32 game player Jack Grimes.

Yeah, Dud.

Frank Grimes coughed the Ball up a few times, there was a couple of times in the 3rd Q that i lost it!! But his final Q was absolutely superb-so yes he just has to keep working on his kicking efficiency.

But ya gotta love the courage, our backline was superb in the 2nd half.

So once again we are smashing a guy with what 30 games to his name? Seriously, take a deep breath, his kicking is not awesome, but is usually above average, yes he had a shocker, yes it was the first game of the season too.

This board is extraordinary. When the chips were down and we were getting smashed most of the 3rd quarter, there were only a couple of blokes who really stood up for us, Moloney and Grimes. Maybe Garland.

When the going got tough he lead from the front. Why are we obsessing about his kicking. Collingwood are full of [censored] kickers especially across half back. Give me a pure footballer who can play any day of the week. We have got a gem here.

astonishing to hop online and he is the one getting bagged. might as well bag Tapscott, who by the way should be given a medal for injuring a Shaw.

Disagree, much of the time he picks the right option. When he goes sideways/backwards it's usually because the switch is on. Sometimes he picks the wrong one but I'm happy enough with his choices, what he needs is to improve the execution of the kicks. Too many off the side of the boot, too many are too long or too wide. It's not good enough for him IMO.

I agree.

As an aside, I reckon I got shouted down for mentioning this shortly after he made his debut (seen to be raining on the parade of the premature '300 gamer elite of the competition' talk, I think).

I also think his decision making is fine - it's just the execution. I think today was just a particularly bad kicking game, but in general it seems to be the easy ones he misses - perhaps a concentration thing, or a technique thing when kicking relatively short (not kicking through the ball, perhaps, or a slack ball-drop?).

Oh yeah the 32 game player Jack Grimes.

Yeah, Dud.

What a strawman assertion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Most of those who have noted Grimes' kicking issue are also on the record as fans of Jack (including me).

Grimes is a consummate defender who must already be well out in front on 'marks from opposition kicks'.

He has played less than 30 games.

He has been given instructions to take the game on at every chance, and to try to move the ball across the ground if there are simply no likely options.

His kickng isn't elite, but at this point the key problem is that as a team we are still very poor at continuously moving to present options.

Anyone here not tear your hair out at kick-ins?

My point is, better leading and movement could push the whole team's disposal efficiency up by 10%.

Agreed. As we grow our midfield and the defnce, the percieved pressure, on grimes and the other ball carriers will, IMO, taper off a little. I think we all cringe a bit up til now, as we, as a team, move the ball out of defence, in a sort of constipated way.

Experience and more talented & speedier players in front of the ball, imo will help, 'going forward'.

His kicking needs serious work.

I've said it for the last 12 months, but today really showed it. He is just unreliable by foot, and it can cost us dearly.

Don't get me wrong, he is a superb mark, reads the play brilliantly, is selfless and courageous, and usually picks a decent target. But he rarely hits his mark, and his turnovers are too high. It's an area of his game he must lift in if he is to raise himself to the next level. It's a killer.

I agree totally. I even suggested he may need to go to Casey to gain confidence in his kicking last year. I was scoffed at- he will continuer to loose us games if he is allowed to continue his situation of kicking backwards. Some one has to get into his head to give a player UP the ground not a shocking kick to a player backwards.I'm not a Grimes basher, but he needs to learn. Lacks discipline.

I agree totally. I even suggested he may need to go to Casey to gain confidence in his kicking last year. I was scoffed at-

And you will continue to be scoffed at for coming up with ridiculous assertions.

he will continuer to loose us games if he is allowed to continue his situation of kicking backwards.

Which games has he lost us?

This board is extraordinary. When the chips were down and we were getting smashed most of the 3rd quarter, there were only a couple of blokes who really stood up for us, Moloney and Grimes. Maybe Garland.

When the going got tough he lead from the front. Why are we obsessing about his kicking. Collingwood are full of [censored] kickers especially across half back. Give me a pure footballer who can play any day of the week. We have got a gem here.

astonishing to hop online and he is the one getting bagged. might as well bag Tapscott, who by the way should be given a medal for injuring a Shaw.

Wow, you really missed the point.

Who here said Grimes is a crap player? Maybe Freak, but he has no idea.

I, and everyone else who agrees, think that he has a significant issue with his kicking. That does not make him a bad player. Nor does it make his effort today substandard. I thought everything else he did was superb, and I said as much. But his kicking was atrocious.

He is a fine player, a potential captain of this club. But he is a poor kick of the football and I want to see him improve in that area.

Grimes may have had an off day by foot by lets not forget his mate Rivers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He needs time at Casey on how to man up and kick to a target (by that I mean a team mate not the opposition). He was useless today and has not been the same since his injury. Jones could also use some kicking practice too but love his aggression.

He's the new Jones.

Burst onto the scene, hard at it, everyone fell in love... but he can't kick to save his life.

The worrying part is he misses targets with all the time in the world.

Of course he has more tricks than Jones and is obviously valuable, but he'll lose fans at this rate. Got the bronx cheers when he finally hit a target today.

Was going to compare him with Bruce.

Could be anything but...

And you will continue to be scoffed at for coming up with ridiculous assertions.

Which games has he lost us?

Yes, quite.

Grimes was still a net-benefit today. He made some glaring decision errors but more than made up for it.

He'll be fine.

Which games has he lost us?

You understood that sentence??

The key issue with Grimes isn't his kicking it is he plays on before he knows what he is doing. This usually puts him under pressure and results in a rushed kick.

As good as his rebound can be I still think he would better serve us in the midfield.

The playing on into trouble was evident a number of times today. For mine he needs to be more conservative with his disposal. Kicking up the line rather than into corridor. Does not diminish him as a player. He reads the play well and takes great well judged contested marks.

Welcome to Demonland - Home of the perfectionist

Snap!

This thread is nit-picky at best, there are a lot more pressing "deficiencies" at the club than Grimes' kicking. He does a whole hell of a lot more right than he does wrong.

I agree totally. I even suggested he may need to go to Casey to gain confidence in his kicking last year. I was scoffed at- he will continuer to loose us games if he is allowed to continue his situation of kicking backwards. Some one has to get into his head to give a player UP the ground not a shocking kick to a player backwards.I'm not a Grimes basher, but he needs to learn. Lacks discipline.

45 has already responded in the vein I would have on a couple of points, but I wanted to note that I'm pretty sure no one - apart from you - is complaining about his decisions to sometimes kick backwards. Rather than 'lacking discipline' I imagine he is showing discipline when he looks to switch play.

It is a concern - along with Frawley he's the main attacking weapon in a backline that has a number of poor kicks. We need to address this area. I think Trengove is as strong overhead and about the same size - he may be a better option in that role. Good to see Tapscott making an impact. I'd like to see Wonna tried down there.

One great aspect of yesterday was how we denied the Swan's a goal in the death - great contested effort.

His kicking was ordinary. Not as bad as rivers though.