Possible legal action against Big Footy

[M_9 1,792]

Whilst I did not read the posts that have lead to this Geelong-based coach considering legal action, I have some idea what the gist of them would be as the club I'm involved with play in the same league.

From personal experience, forum moderators need to be on their toes 24/7, so D'landers shouldn't be upset if posts they consider innocuous are pulled.

http://www.geelongad...53031_news.html

[JACKATTACK 17]

I havn't been on BigFooty for a long time, but i'm not surprised, it is pretty loose. I would be a little concerned if this legal action got traction, I would hate to think that any clown could log on here, fabricate something that may not be picked up quickly enough and have the administrators here wsubject to legal action.

[the fork 357]

It's too late Demonland was gutted by an army of keyboard heros way back.

There's a reason clubs and players despise online forums. I'm sure some people are convinced that by posting on here you're actually supporting the club. On rare occasions we have banded together and done great things. But on the majority, online forums including this one are places for hysterical slander by people who puff their chests out the moment they log on.

Strausski anyone?

Watch how quick this conversation flops and this thread sinks to the bottom of the pile beneath an amateur tirade of premature assumption waiting for our young players under pressure.

[Nasher 33,166]

There's a reason clubs and players despise online forums. I'm sure some people are convinced that by posting on here you're actually supporting the club. On rare occasions we have banded together and done great things. But on the majority, online forums including this one are places for hysterical slander by people who puff their chests out the moment they log on.

That pretty much sums up my thoughts on internet forums as a whole too, sadly. Keeping them 'constructive' is an impossible task, you either under-moderate and you get a lot of people posting slanderous rubbish, or you moderate heavily and everyone feels like they are being oppressed. I think the happy middle ground in the middle is so fine that it's very damn hard to hit. In my earlier days as a moderator I copped a lot of flack for being too heavy handed; then there was the straussski incident. Damn.

That said, I like Demonland and I like being able to share my thoughts with like minded fans. Some of our members have some fantastic perspectives on footy and I've learned more from some members on here than I would ever learn otherwise, especially since I rarely get to games. I can't see any other medium that is going to offer the broad range of opinions that you're going to get on a forum.

By the way, I would never have even considered becoming a member of the club if it wasn't for online forums such as Demonland, as I get zero benefit from it. As an outsider, I had no idea of the importance of membership. I wonder how many other members the club has indirectly accumulated through other members and suppoters promoting club membership on footy forums.

[praha 10,358]

I disagree with you both. I think online forums, while in some instances can be a form of "social cancer", they are great environments for debate and discussion. Online communities do work - I've been a communication and community manager for a web-based publisher for three years now, and much of our success comes from our online forums.

An online community, just like society in general, needs monitoring and authority. An individual might be fine, but a group of people can cause trouble. You need order and rules, as well as strong etiquette, none of which BigFooty seems to have.

I visit another sports-based online community (Basketball Forums), which is US based, and it's a fantastic community. Why? Because it's monitored very, very well. I think the team here do a wonderful job, but that said, this isn't an overly populated community (compared to Basketball Forums, Big Footy etc.)

If someone wants to come here and give thoughtful, mature and intelligent opinions, no matter how negative they may be, they have a right to. It's only when a handful of morons come along to provide nothing but negativity in the most immature and moronic ways that they ruin the community. It's no different to one or two morons in a classroom of 30 students. Or 1 or 2 bad eggs in a work environment of 30. This is a community, whether you like it or not, and it should go by the same basic fundamentals of what makes a community work in real life.

Some of you might disagree with me on that, but I've seen online communities work very well, at my own hand. If you can implement the same rules and morals we use in life, an online community can work.

BigFooty may have already dug itself a hole too deep though.

EDIT: To add to this, I think AFL clubs should work a lot closer with some online forums. Much in the same way film studios and game publishers work with online communities. What it comes down to is we are a community of dedicated fans that give our own time and money to the club, and some people spend loads of money to get these communities up and running. The least clubs could do is support them.

Edited March 8, 2010 by calabreseboy

[Hobbits's 17]

But on the majority, online forums including this one are places for hysterical slander by people who puff their chests out the moment they log on.

Strausski anyone?

hysteria - undoubtedly occur post match at a time when temper's need to be tempered.

I think the mods here pretty much have their finger on the pulse for occassions like these. Some may want things seen to at a push of a button. not entirely sure if they can be seen to 24/7; they all may be attending a game or after game function in some cases.

i also think those who negatively put forums down, underestimate the tools of these forums such as analysing detail, opinions and healthy debate. so I agree with calabreseboy in this regard.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

It's too late Demonland was gutted by an army of keyboard heros way back.

There's a reason clubs and players despise online forums. I'm sure some people are convinced that by posting on here you're actually supporting the club. On rare occasions we have banded together and done great things. But on the majority, online forums including this one are places for hysterical slander by people who puff their chests out the moment they log on.

Strausski anyone?

Watch how quick this conversation flops and this thread sinks to the bottom of the pile beneath an amateur tirade of premature assumption waiting for our young players under pressure.

That's flat out garbage.

I have never felt more connected to my club, never cared as much and have never known as much as I do now. For our many fans interstate and overseas, this site is a dead-set necessity. I don't know what kind of fan I'd be if I hadn't stumbled on this site.

Saying it doesn't help the club is nonsense.

[Daz's Dee's 113]

That's flat out garbage.

I have never felt more connected to my club, never cared as much and have never known as much as I do now. For our many fans interstate and overseas, this site is a dead-set necessity. I don't know what kind of fan I'd be if I hadn't stumbled on this site.

Saying it doesn't help the club is nonsense.

I could not agree more... I have (and Always will be a fan of MFC) but since i discovered this sight i find myself almost living and breathing all that is RED and BLUE. I have so far attended the intra club match, Essendon v Melbourne match at Visy and am planning a trip down this weekend to the Game at Casey V the Eagles and the Family day on the sunday. To be honest i may have attended one of these events previous years but as previusly stated i am more interested this year as a direct result of this forum. Its interesting to hear so many diffirent views and opinions some of which i agree / disagree and occasionally altered my view. If i had to rely on info from the AFL website i honestly wouldn't bother one new article every now and than just doesnt cut it for me anymore. The information being it true / somewhat true or false keeps me coming back for more and more and as Dappa Dan said i have never felt so connected to my club. My mates and family come to me if they ever want to find out info about the dee's and or the afl.

Edited March 9, 2010 by Daz's Dee's

[the fork 357]

That's flat out garbage.

I have never felt more connected to my club, never cared as much and have never known as much as I do now. For our many fans interstate and overseas, this site is a dead-set necessity. I don't know what kind of fan I'd be if I hadn't stumbled on this site.

Saying it doesn't help the club is nonsense.

I agree that this site is a good thing amongst supporters, I would argue that it is not a good thing for the club.

Dan I understand you personally feel closer to the club, you feel more informed, importantly you are encouraged you to pay your membership and stay vocal. I too think that supporters banding together on here is a genuine positive.

Looking holistically however, the slander, the baseless rumors, innuendo , the bloodletting that happens often on Demonland and other online forums does more harm than good.

I know for a fact that the MFC players are encouraged not to read this site. As a member of this site how does that make you feel?

Is it not a contradiction that players that wear our jumper are kept from something you believe to be helping them?

If you a Melbourne Football Club player, the father or brother of a player, would you feel supported by the gutless slander that some players and coaches of our club receive on here?

These are the people at the core of our club, the ones that, along with the supporters, really matter.

The financial support we offer our club is vital, but I would say so is supporting it and it's players in a respectful manner.

Cheers.

[Roost It 1,434]

I agree that this site is a good thing amongst supporters, I would argue that it is not a good thing for the club.

Dan I understand you personally feel closer to the club, you feel more informed, importantly you are encouraged you to pay your membership and stay vocal. I too think that supporters banding together on here is a genuine positive.

Looking holistically however, the slander, the baseless rumors, innuendo , the bloodletting that happens often on Demonland and other online forums does more harm than good.

I know for a fact that the MFC players are encouraged not to read this site. As a member of this site how does that make you feel?

Is it not a contradiction that players that wear our jumper are kept from something you believe to be helping them?

If you a Melbourne Football Club player, the father or brother of a player, would you feel supported by the gutless slander that some players and coaches of our club receive on here?

These are the people at the core of our club, the ones that, along with the supporters, really matter.

The financial support we offer our club is vital, but I would say so is supporting it and it's players in a respectful manner.

Cheers.

Most posters think before they post, some don't. if you read it regularly you know which posters to read and which to avoid. I'd say more positive than negative.

I'd say the average AFL footballer's ego is strong enough to handle it.

Edited March 9, 2010 by Roost It

[Guest fatty]

I know for a fact that the MFC players are encouraged not to read this site. As a member of this site how does that make you feel?

Makes me feel a whole lot better. I wouldn't read these sites either.

The level of "preciousness" football players are afforded is unwarranted.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I know for a fact that the MFC players are encouraged not to read this site. As a member of this site how does that make you feel?

If you a Melbourne Football Club player, the father or brother of a player, would you feel supported by the gutless slander that some players and coaches of our club receive on here?

These are the people at the core of our club, the ones that, along with the supporters, really matter.

The financial support we offer our club is vital, but I would say so is supporting it and it's players in a respectful manner.

A tad precious I think

Telling players not to use social forums like Facebook, Dland etc is like telling a duck not to swim in water. Honestly, all players have a choice and they are warned about the impact of choices. Its their choice how they behave and they should be accountable fot it.

I think supporter forums provide a wonderful exchange of information which if properly controlled is fine. And I disagree about what is the core of the Club. Players are employees and they can come and go as their contract/careers end. Without paying members/supporters/sponsors what do you have??? They are both important.

[Sir Why You Little 34,855]

Well i think Demonland is a very important Forum & i truly hope that people inside the club keep a close eye on what we all say.

Sometimes i write things that get Lambasted, but i actually write them for the club to read.

Demonland Rules-Long May it Live.

[Supermercado 2,646]

Is it just me who flinches whenever a forum or live chat is called a "blog"? Even worse when a blog post is called a "blog".

That's the kind of frustration that you can't even write in to the papers about.

[DemonDan... 77]

I have never felt more connected to my club, never cared as much and have never known as much as I do now. For our many fans interstate and overseas, this site is a dead-set necessity. I don't know what kind of fan I'd be if I hadn't stumbled on this site.

Saying it doesn't help the club is nonsense.

Agree with everything here.

Demonland is the sh!t. This is the 2nd page I open, after the dees actual website - which incidently is nowhere near as good as this one.

..and I wouldnt even bother with 'ology.

If you a Melbourne Football Club player, the father or brother of a player, would you feel supported by the gutless slander that some players and coaches of our club receive on here?

The financial support we offer our club is vital, but I would say so is supporting it and it's players in a respectful manner.

Yeah, but 'the gutless' can slander players just the same on talk-back radio.

Wouldnt you think that would be of more a concern than a couple hundred hardcore fans here on 'land?

You can criticise players as long as its constructive.

If I was a player that read some unflattering thoughts from a poster, it would just make me want to prove them (or the general consensis) wrong and therefore

would have a positive effect.

[Whispering_Jack 28,089]

I know for a fact that the MFC players are encouraged not to read this site. As a member of this site how does that make you feel?

Well, it might be that you're right and when I read what some posters have to say I'm not surprised (I also read what the moderators consign to the trash heap which makes it even less of a surprise).

Nevertheless, let's give some credit to the players. Most are not brainless imbeciles and in fact they're a pretty savvy group who are fully aware that those who produce unhinged rants comprise the minority of supporters, that the majority who come on here are true supporters in the literal sense of the world and that constructive criticism and measured discussion aren't going to hurt anybody. I know for a fact that some of our players do read Demonland and enjoy it. They're not stupid!

[Rogue 585]

Regarding players being encouraged not to read Demonland, I'm sure they're also encouraged not to take to heart abuse from the crowd during games or 'advice' from Joe Blow down the street on a Saturday night. I accept there are some differences, but the principle is the same.

PS. I'm not sure why anyone would think posting on Demonland is directly 'supporting' the Club - does anyone think chatting to their Demon mates at a [non-affiliated] pub/venue 'supporting' the Club, 'the fork'? - but it's not the evil that some seem to be intimating.

[red&blue&true 0]

these sites are worth their weight in gold if the football club ever gets targeted like North did a few years back.

[demoniac 1,243]

Like most readers of 'land and 'ology I get frustrated by a minority of posters who repeatedly fail to respect their fellow demon fans. I'd be happy for a hard line on these posters who repeatedly seek to denigrate the views of other posters rather than discuss them in a constructive manner. I'd ban and ban and ban and ban until the message gets through.

[Mono 454]

It's too late Demonland was gutted by an army of keyboard heros way back.

There's a reason clubs and players despise online forums. I'm sure some people are convinced that by posting on here you're actually supporting the club. On rare occasions we have banded together and done great things. But on the majority, online forums including this one are places for hysterical slander by people who puff their chests out the moment they log on.

Strausski anyone?

Watch how quick this conversation flops and this thread sinks to the bottom of the pile beneath an amateur tirade of premature assumption waiting for our young players under pressure.

Sounds to me like you should quit this board. Your comments are damning of yourself.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Looking holistically however, the slander, the baseless rumors, innuendo , the bloodletting that happens often on Demonland and other online forums does more harm than good.

That's just not true. Yes there is SOME slander here, but since we saw the back of Yze_Magic (hopefully) and apart from a small blip with some bloke being "happy" Morton got hurt, there is almost no player abuse on here anymore.

I think perhaps you're guilty of lumping us in with bigfooty. They were for a long time a disgrace. They've tried their best to lift their efforts, and are still MILES behind demonland in terms of staying cocher, and being a good place for supporters to discuss what they're spending their $100+ a year on.

The club spends no money on this site, and gets a sensational, almost live feed of news out of us. It's win/win.

Just to let you know, I work in an industry that's fairly well in the public eye. There's a great deal of fandom involved, and as a direct result the companies I've worked for have had to deal with fan websites' speculation on the jobs and lifestyles of co-workers of mine. If football is the same as this industry (and I see no reason why it wouldn't be) then I would suspect the club would take the same philosophy and line as the companies I've worked for. That is, as long as you don't divulge information sensitive to the company to posters, then the sites are actively encouraged. It's really no different in theory from any supporter group. You wouldn't want players telling tales to these groups over the phone, by mail or in person.

This is, after all, a free country (more or less). We're allowed to express ourselves freely. Yes, there has to be moderation, and maybe one day that moderation will become more and more serious (legal ramifications), But it's no reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[Chook 14,613]

Out of curiosity, has there ever been a player post here?

[dreamin' man 0]

Yeah, but 'the gutless' can slander players just the same on talk-back radio.

Wouldnt you think that would be of more a concern than a couple hundred hardcore fans here on 'land?

You can criticise players as long as its constructive.

If I was a player that read some unflattering thoughts from a poster, it would just make me want to prove them (or the general consensis) wrong and therefore

would have a positive effect.

If you rang talkback radio & defamed a player they would use the dump button or temper your comments by disagreeing with you.

Sometimes I just can't read the running down of players that I see on here & 'ology. It's not the same as shouting from the bleachers. There's a premium on the written word, it is supposed to be considered & more permanent.

There was recently a case, damages awarded, I think, after comments posted on an investors/stockmarket forum. The bloke got a lawyer who was able to find the poster through the administrators & sue him. Defamation is a serious thing.

[dreamin' man 0]

I'd like to add that Demonland is v. important to me. I enjoy it & it's a great link to the club, especially since I've lived outside Victoria. & I feel a sense of community w. fellow Landers.

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

That's just not true. Yes there is SOME slander here, but since we saw the back of Yze_Magic (hopefully) and apart from a small blip with some bloke being "happy" Morton got hurt, there is almost no player abuse on here anymore.

True. The community takes care of it's own. Both of those posters were give short shrift by the rest of us and the kybosh by the admin. As for player abuse: There are ways to say things and then there are ways we shouldn't say things. I think this site is on the ball as to which is which and would never have to worry about the problems that the rabble that is BF are facing.

these sites are worth their weight in gold if the football club ever gets targeted like North did a few years back.

Not just that but I need this site to talk to like minded people about my team. I was the only Melbourne supporter in primary school and I don't think I met one one that wasn't part of my family or friends until I was about 16 and that was John Lord's daughter. This site has given me the sense that I am not alone in my suffering and that there are good people out there doing there all to make it a good thing to bleed red and blue.