TRAINING TODAY----22nd January

[damon the demon 57]

Miller will never be a world beater - but his biggest problem on the field has been between the ears IMO

agree - can mark sometimes, can kick straight sometimes - but cannot make the right decision under pressure.

[45HG 1,552]

Since when has that been an impediment to the attainment of superstardom? How, for instance, does Fevola rank on the evolutionary scale? It's a lack of instinct BM suffers from, rather than a lack of intelligence.

Even with his obvious failings, if he could kick a goal from 40 metres - something that many of the least professorial players have managed over the years - he would go from being a complete spud to a minor asset. Forty, even 35, goals in a season would probably - based on the mythical 'law of averages' - include a couple of small to medium hauls that made the difference between winning and losing close matches. He CAN get the ball enough times to do that. If he could only kick it through the tall sticks.

'Between the ears' in sport rarely, if ever, equates to intelligence. I think that many of Miller's issues stem from a lack of confidence and a lack of natural footy 'smarts'/awareness causing him to over-think a situation or second guess himself.

Edited January 26, 2010 by 45HG16

[jayceebee31 761]

'Between the ears' in sport rarely, if ever, equates to intelligence. I think that many of Miller's issues stem from a lack of confidence and a lack of natural footy 'smarts'/awareness causing him to over-think a situation or second guess himself.

Just maybe a problem with Miller's kicking and Newton could be lack of skill coaching.

Edited January 26, 2010 by jayceebee31

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,863]

All this talk about Brad Miller and our lack of forward options makes think we'll struggle to win many (if any) more games than we did in 2009.

[45HG 1,552]

All this talk about Brad Miller and our lack of forward options makes think we'll struggle to win many (if any) more games than we did in 2009.

LJ, Bate, hopefully if our midfield comes along Green and Sylvia could spend time up there, Petterd, Aussie and Watts hopefully improving should be the basis for a decent forwardline - plus, a better midfield can make the same forwardline much better. With that in mind, if both areas improve we should win more than last year.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

'Between the ears' in sport rarely, if ever, equates to intelligence. I think that many of Miller's issues stem from a lack of confidence and a lack of natural footy 'smarts'/awareness causing him to over-think a situation or second guess himself.

Agree.

Just maybe a problem with Miller's kicking and Newton could be lack of skill coaching.

I think alot of time has been put into Newton by the coaching panel. His issues are definitelty between the ears. Skills are there. Just not the maturity to use them them.

All this talk about Brad Miller and our lack of forward options makes think we'll struggle to win many (if any) more games than we did in 2009.

Nothing new has been put forward. All these issues are known and have been done to death. our forward lins is still W.I.P. Miller may have limited role in that for this year only.

[Allen Jakovich 516]

'Between the ears' in sport rarely, if ever, equates to intelligence. I think that many of Miller's issues stem from a lack of confidence and a lack of natural footy 'smarts'/awareness causing him to over-think a situation or second guess himself.

Spot on.

When he does play positively and doesn't 2nd guess himself he is a very handy player (Vs Lions '08, Vs Freo '06 Final).

The key is working out how to get him to play positively all the time. I believe as the team starts to perform better his form will improve in turn. If you look at his form line over the last 4-5 years it mirrors the teams (decent in 06, at his worst in 07, etc.)

[Roost It 1,434]

Spot on.

When he does play positively and doesn't 2nd guess himself he is a very handy player (Vs Lions '08, Vs Freo '06 Final).

The key is working out how to get him to play positively all the time. I believe as the team starts to perform better his form will improve in turn. If you look at his form line over the last 4-5 years it mirrors the teams (decent in 06, at his worst in 07, etc.)

Is Miller's role going to be to take the kick that comes out of defence and then give it off to any number of players running past. That was his role in the 06 final against Freo and I think he had 16 marks that night. Playing him solely in the forward line has proven ineffective. Once he has time to think he generally turns it over, as for set shots, just not his strength. Play him up the field where he can offer some protection to our young players and where he is able to simply lead, mark, handball. I think this might be his instinctive game.

[Keyser Söze 0]

Yeah, Miller does better playing up the field and taking those marks, but Bate plays that role more than him now, and probably does it more effectively.

I think Miller's game suffers as a result of playing a role for the team that goes largely unnoticed / underapppreciated.

[jayceebee31 761]

Yeah, Miller does better playing up the field and taking those marks, but Bate plays that role more than him now, and probably does it more effectively.

I think Miller's game suffers as a result of playing a role for the team that goes largely unnoticed / underapppreciated.

Good points- might even play him on the wing? I wonder if he used Pia as a goal stick if it would help his kicking accurracy.

Edited January 26, 2010 by jayceebee31

[drdrake 3,178]

Miller is a lead up forward, he is only as good as the players delivering the ball to him allow him to be. He will work and present all day and reads the play for his leads quite well. His main problem like all our forwards has been our ball movement and the ability to hit targets. The better we get at this the better player Miller will be.

[Axis of Bob 11,836]

Unfortunately Miller's problems stem from his promising performances early in his career, so a lot of supporters jumped on him expecting him to develop into one of the best key forwards in the competition. That he hasn't developed into that player isn't his fault - he just doesn't have that sort of talent. He's producing more now than what he did earlier, but supporters cannot accept that he is a role player rather than the dominant CHF that they wanted him to be. And because his performance isn't what they dreamed he'd be then these same people scream and call him a dud.

It's not a phenomenon that is specific to Melbourne either. Jordan Russell, Jared Brennan, Michael Newton, Jason Blake, Tom Murphy, Matthew Priddis, Scott Stevens, Travis Varcoe, Toby Thurstans etc are testament to supporters turning on a player when they don't turn out to be the player they dreamed they'd be. Often the problem is with the supporter completely misjudging the player early on, rather than the player not fulfilling their potential. Often people need a player (or coach) they can blame for a loss so that they can shield one of their own favourite players from any fault.

Miller is strong, hard working, team oriented and a leader. He's not skilful, and he's not a natural footballer. These were all on display early in his career and he's actually a far better kick now than he used to be. He can kick goals from 50 metres now. He isn't and is not going to be a superstar, but he has a role to play in the team and is rightly recognised in the leadership group for his leadership. He's in the best 22 at the moment because he's the only player we currently have that can provide enough of a contest to bring the ball to ground from a long kick forward. Hopefully someone will force themselves past him, because that means that we're improving.

[Viney Vidi Vici 148]

Is Miller's role going to be to take the kick that comes out of defence and then give it off to any number of players running past.

Saw him training in that role...

And Axis Of Bob, very good analysis, I agree.

[Allen Jakovich 516]

Is Miller's role going to be to take the kick that comes out of defence and then give it off to any number of players running past. That was his role in the 06 final against Freo and I think he had 16 marks that night. Playing him solely in the forward line has proven ineffective. Once he has time to think he generally turns it over, as for set shots, just not his strength. Play him up the field where he can offer some protection to our young players and where he is able to simply lead, mark, handball. I think this might be his instinctive game.

Don't know what game you were watching. Took some excellent contested marks at CHF in the Freo final.

[Sir Why You Little 37,052]

We will need a Big Mature Body in the forward line this year, if not to get the ball but create a contest.

I think Miller will play an important role.

He needs to play a Big Game at the 'G, maybe to remind himself he can do it.

This is the year he must do it though, otherwise he will be overtaken

C'mon Brad...

[Roost It 1,434]

Don't know what game you were watching. Took some excellent contested marks at CHF in the Freo final.

At least 8 of those marks were taken in the centre square or wings.

[DemonDan... 77]

Wasnt gonna bother with this.. but i could just stands no more!

BTW - If i was B. Millers best mate i would still state the following, to his face, with NO disrespect at all..

It is a perfect example of how low, absolute rock bottom depths (maybe the 2nd worst of all time) the MFC has hit in the past few years - that Brad miller is still on an AFL list.

THE most unaccomplished senior AFL player (to play more than a season or 2) i have ever seen.. ahead of B. Holland and S. Godfrey Weetra.. (yes, all MFC players!)

So i issue a challenge to anyone reading this:

Give me 3 games.. (was gonna say 'in a row..' but I'll make it easier and still make my point)

Give me 3 games in the course of a full 22 game season - where miller played 'well' - it may be a matter of opinion, so lets say 'well' - means 'in the top 5 - 7 players'..in or close to votes -sort of thing

I can only think of 3 games in his whole career he has played well: 3 times in 9 f*cking years!!

-Once against B. Hall.. such a surprise in his dismal career, that we are STILL talking about and referencing it!

-One game he took over a dozen marks and actually had some presence on the field.

-One final against Freo, he played ok (or was that the big kid with the blond mop playing his, or one of his 1st games for us??)..anyway

Miller might not be a lot of things, but in my opinion a leader is one of the things he is. And in a club devoid of leadership that is recognised by making him part of the leadership group.

Agree he's a leader, but what do we call a leader that is shite footballer?

A coach. (or trainer)

i think you are now taking away a bit from brad miller as a player. he may not be great, but he marks well and he throws the body around, where he lets himself down is his kicking for goal.

Every Afl player throws their body around, thats the intensity of footy. You cant highlight the fact and make a case for Miller when every player does the same thing.

Besides the fact that being a good mark in AFL does nowhere near make a complete, talented, competent footballer.. over the last couple of seasons, Millers marking on the lead (he has never been able to take a pack mark and is useless overhead) has noticably diminished.

Must have been about mid last year over a few weeks, he dropped about a dozen marks on the lead, no pressure, like he contracted Corey Mckernans bad eye sight problem from a decade back.. (he kept dropping marks and refusing to take shots on goal..so it may be?)

I remember thinking, 'great, he has NO discernible strengths now'

All this talk about Brad Miller and our lack of forward options makes think we'll struggle to win many (if any) more games than we did in 2009.

If Miller is not there, it will give Watts or Fitzpatrick more game time they'll otherwise have to wait for.

But he is: Which could mean your comment could also unfortunately be applicable this time next year as well..

When he does play positively and doesn't 2nd guess himself he is a very handy player (Vs Lions '08, Vs Freo '06 Final).

Oh, so you got 2 games in 9 years!

Thats brad Millers cv: 2 good games in 9 years. (L. Jurrah cv: 9 good games in 9 WEEKS)

..might even play him on the wing? I wonder if he used Pia as a goal stick if it would help his kicking accurracy.

one of the sillier comments Ive read on demonland. one of the smarter comments Ive read on demonland

That he hasn't developed into that (KPP) player isn't his fault - he just doesn't have that sort of talent. He's producing more now than what he did earlier, but supporters cannot accept that he is a role player rather than the dominant CHF that they wanted him to be.

It's not a phenomenon that is specific to Melbourne either. Jordan Russell, Jared Brennan, Michael Newton, Jason Blake, Tom Murphy, Matthew Priddis, Scott Stevens, Travis Varcoe, Toby Thurstans etc are testament to supporters turning on a player when they don't turn out to be the player they dreamed they'd be.

He's not skilful, and he's not a natural footballer.

These were all on display early in his career and he's actually a far better kick now than he used to be. He can kick goals from 50 metres now.

A: Except the 1st couple of lines in bold, Surely you couldnt believe the tripe you have printed here AOB?

B: You must be the only person here that thinks Miller can kick a goal from 50!!-

He has constantly shown over the past few seasons that not only can he 'not kick accurately' from 50 metres, but he is in fact to [censored], a majority of the time, to even attempt the shot! He ends up passing to someone in equal or worse position..

C: that list of names in the middle paragraph, they're just not good or highly skilled players!

No 'phenomenon' AOB, just a list of shite players that arent supporters favs because they arent that good!

Thats just life and natural reaction isnt it? If they were good - they'd be liked, favorites, and not on your list!

The MFC havent, and will never win a Grand Final with a player like Miller (add B Holland, S Godfrey and a couple others to the list)

on the team. Period.

Again nothing personal to brad the person, just brad the 'footballer'

(..and i should also add, none of the above would have even happened, to be able to be commented on and discussed, IF,

the powers that be at MFC had the NUTS to cut their losses and get rid of him YEARS ago..a HUGE black cross against those involved!)

Edited January 27, 2010 by DemonDan...

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Dan is an astute man.

from Dan

NB. A fit Bate plays Miller's role better. Fact is we do not have a gorilla marking forward. We need to accept it and structure accordingly.

[DemonDan... 77]

Dan is an astute man.

from Dan

NB. A fit Bate plays Miller's role better. Fact is we do not have a gorilla marking forward. We need to accept it and structure accordingly.

Yep nice one Dan..

Blood Watts, Fitzy, Martin or even as you suggest Bater there, as our 'bigs' down forward. Let miller 'lead' from the 2nds.

[jayceebee31 761]

Yep nice one Dan..

Blood Watts, Fitzy, Martin or even as you suggest Bater there, as our 'bigs' down forward. Let miller 'lead' from the 2nds.

If we were going to play our first AFL game this Saturday what would your forward line be ?

[jabberwocky 2,301]

If we were going to play our first AFL game this Saturday what would your forward line be ?

Mine would be something like in order of preference

-Jurrah/Watts (changing i/c) -Bate if fit/Miller -Davey (mid)/Trengove off i/c changing Mid

-Sylvia/Green/Petterd(changing mids/i/c) -Martin/Garland (tried when fit) -Wonna/Tapscott or Maric off i/c

The luxury of playing Sylvia and Davey in the forward line at the same time probably won't happen unless the midfield makes some major advances.

There is enough Height, mobility and strength there.

Edited January 27, 2010 by dandeeman

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,217]

NB. A fit Bate plays Miller's role better.

Correct. Bate will play first choice CHF for most of this year

[DemonDan... 77]

If we were going to play our first AFL game this Saturday what would your forward line be ?

For the 1st NAB Cup game i had:

hf: JURRAH MARTIN PETTARD

f: TAPPY WATTS TRENNY

and..

c: JETTA SLYVIA BATE - across the centreline, who can all rest forward.

We may throw Martin into the ruck (if he progresses and Jamar doesnt continue to do so) and Fitzpatrick, hopefully he's earnt his spot by then, can have a run at CHF..

Martin is huge, Pettard is 'all but' huge.. Trenny will be like Michael Voss soon.. and we've all know about Big Tappy!..

We DONT need Miller down there at Centre-half Bodyguard - who probably doesnt offer that much protection, cause he leads up the ground away from the action a lot of the time anyway..

all this IMO of course..

Edited January 28, 2010 by DemonDan...

[Redleg 40,978]

If I were a young & talented key forward at Melbourne, i'm sure i'd like Brad Miller as a person, but I would pay little respect to what he has to say about becoming an AFL player, because he's achieved virtually nothing in a 7 year career at the club..

I'd be looking elsewhere for role models to be honest...

Interesting. He has played 127 games ( and kicked 79 goals despite playing several games in defence ) since his debut in round 7 2002. Wish I had achieved "virtually nothing" too. I could brag about that for the rest of my life.

[Keyser Söze 0]

So so soooooo many ridiculously uneducated views on this thread.

Quite a few of you should hang your collective heads in shame.

Brad Miller, whilst not a champion has carved out quite a respectable career in spite of his rather obvious limitations.

He's not trying to pass himself off as a champion of the game - merely continuing to stick his head down and work his guts out to achieve the best he is capable of.

How is it his fault that we have always asked more of him than he is able to give?

With severely limited support he has played out of position and filled a role where no others were fit to do so.

His time with the club may be soon coming to an end, but he'll always be able to hold his high and I will always show him the due respect.

If it does come to an end, it will only be because the club is fortunate enough to have young KPP who will compete at a higher level.