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Ironic we are a basket case during the season with every man and his dog bagging us and now because we have applied for a pp suddenly we have great players and plenty of upside. Unbelievable.

He's a contested marking monster. But that's not what is going to make him a dominant AFL player - it's his running. He's got such a massive tank that he just works his opponent(s) into the ground. This helps him get into one on one contests where he can just monster his (exhausted) man. He's Jonathan Brown, but 18 years old and playing for Melbourne.

i personally doubt they ever watched.

Roos might like a coup, too, although that probably won't get you around town.

what's good for the goose is good for the gander if you don't like threads, post or posters then don't read them or respond. Its so simple

Nice revisionism. You got to give credit where credit is due. Balme inherited a "tough as nails" underperforming side that finished 11th in 1992 and Balme took us to PF in 1994. However from 1995 onwards the team's talent was decimated by LT injuries to Schwartz, Lyon, Tingay, G Lovett, Prymke, S Charles in addition to the usual BAU injuries that impair a team. In addtion it would not have been easy ot coach a team with the disruption of the 1996 merger going on either. Not a great coach by any stretch but not deserving of the revisionism applied.

Self interest friends, this is why I want a PP. I can't believe the people on this forum who don't, you fight for any advantage you can get.

How about we cut Lucas some slack? He didn't ask for our extremely inept recruiting department to select him with pick 12.

I've posted a couple of times on other threads that George Stone IS coming to the Dees, and now their season is dusted, I imagine it will be announced in the near future. Can't reveal source due to confidentiality.

So I just sat through most of the Eastern Rangers demolition job on the Dandenong Stingrays. Some quick notes as im on the mobile and typing is a pain. TOM BOYD - he the number 1 pick by a mile. Given he looked like he was underdone he did a great job kicking 4 goals and having a hand in about 3 or 4 others. But I am leaving here with small doubts on his ability below the knees and his speed but they are very small knocks. At any team apart from gws he would be given vfl time but he can play from rd1 if need be. MITCH HONEYCHURCH - really like this kid, takes the game on and kick goals but unfortunately I dont think he is what we need. BILLY HARTUNG - one of the stingrays best today with 3 goals and a few nice centre breaks. If we had a midfield that could win more of the ball then he would be an ideal pick up with speed, a nice kick but would need a season to put on a couple of kgs. ZAC JONES - its quite hard not to sound biased towards chunks little bro but he is what we need. Today I saw him in every part of the ground and he really looked best in the guts. Strong hips that break tackles, decent kick but needs some work, love it in the pack but the part that really impressed me was his willingness to spread. Although he needs to work on his tank like 75% of the tac cup kids, after his last month he would be firming for a top 30 pick now. Will be an interesting draft for us, if we managed to get an end of 1st round priority pick dont be surprised if we go for guys like Lloyd Perris, Zac Jones, James Tsitas and Patrick Cripps with that pick and our 2nd and 3rd round picks. Anyhow, now to watch the vfl.

GREED AND ALTRUISM RULES THE AFL OVER DRAFT ASSISTANCE by Whispering Jack Last month, Hawthorn's president Andrew Newbold accompanied Andrew Demetriou and others to the US on an AFL-equalisation study tour. On his return, one of his first public comments was to slam the idea that the cash strapped and success-starved Melbourne Football Club should be the recipient of any financial or draft assistance from the AFL. I don't believe he mentioned anything about Melbourne, the Bulldogs or even North Melbourne being offered better fixtures along the lines that his club and the other big boys currently enjoy; no extra Friday night games to attract more sponsorship and supporters and no reduction in dead fixture times such as Sunday twilight and the like. In fact, Newbold offered no solutions in respect of the equalisation problem at all. On that basis, it's not difficult to conclude that Newbold is a hypocrite and that the AFL trip was indeed a junket, as many suggested at the time. Instead of helping clubs in need, we are witnessing a flexing of muscles by the president of one of the stronger clubs seeking to maintain the status quo. All this, despite the fact that we are often told that it's in the AFL's interests for all clubs to be more competitive. The fact that Demetriou himself has highlighted that the clubs oppose Melbourne's application suggests that the AFL constituent clubs are reverting to the selfish, greedy partisan politics that prevailed before the AFL Commission was formed - Clubs oppose priority draft pick for Melbourne . The AFL (then VFL) Commission was created in 1985 to administer the competition and its constitution. In the main, it has retained its independence from the constituent clubs (which was its raison d'être in the first place) but the authority of the Commission and its independence is now under attack over the issue of whether the Melbourne Football Club should receive a priority draft selection as a result of its consistently poor performances over the period 2007-2013. During this seven year period, the club's best efforts have been 8½ wins (twice) and otherwise, there have been five seasons in which it recorded between 2 and 5 wins per year. In the season just completed, the club won two matches and finished with a percentage of 54.07. This would have easily qualified Melbourne for a priority pick under the AFL rules that applied in most years prior to the 2012 season onwards but today, clubs can only receive such draft assistance at the discretion of the AFL Commission. The specific criteria have not been announced but it is understood that "a more complicated formula will be used, which takes into account premiership points, percentage, finals appearances and injury rates for a club over several seasons". - AFL overhauls priority pick system The reaction of the opposition clubs to Melbourne's application for assistance has been worrying. The problem I have with the objectors is that they are based on slanted opinions about Melbourne's recruiting performance and ignore the substantive points which the Commission is supposed to take into account in making its decision on draft assistance. And, they place too much weight on the controversy resulting from the AFL's selective "tanking investigation" into events that took place at one club during 2009 even though several others have had their own practices questioned without any scrutiny or investigation. There is little doubt that the club's recruiting performance over the past decade or so has been disappointing (the application for assistance would be unnecessary if it were otherwise) but these assessments fail to take into account several factors. They ignore serious injuries to early picks - for example, of the 2008 draft crop, both Sam Blease and James Strauss suffered broken legs that kept them out for the length of a season and hindered their development. Tom Scully was headhunted by GWS with a $1m plus bounty which the player could hardly resist and Melbourne was never going to match. They ignore facts such as the information in a recent Herald Sun article that place Melbourne close to the bottom of the list of father/son recruits. Compare this with Geelong, the most successful club of the recent era, which received an enormous boost with its sons of former players. The coaches, boards and recruiting officers in place at the time of the club's "bad" recruiting decisions have now moved on. Why make the task of returning the club to competitiveness more difficult for those now in charge? Surely, the fact that the club is overhauling its coaching and recruiting systems and personnel today should bear more weight on the Commission's decision to help out than the fact that it picked Cale Morton at pick four ahead of Cyril Rioli in 2007? The suggestion that Melbourne must suffer again as a result of the events of 2009 for which it was penalised in February with heavy financial sanctions and penalties for officials is risible. The Demons' application is made because the team needs assistance in the here and now and it is inappropriate that it be penalised twice (or three times if you include the Scully fiasco) to feed the greed and altruism of rival clubs who claim that a priority pick would upset the integrity of the AFL draft. The argument of the so-called "objecting" clubs comes across as rather hypocritical coming from some of them. It was only a year or two ago that the new franchises gained a swag of early draft picks (and not just the one that the Demons are requesting) which pushed struggling clubs like Melbourne off the map when it came to securing good draft picks in those years. Hawthorn faces the prospect of losing free agent Lance Franklin at the end of the year but is it likely that Newbold will knock back a compensation draft pick (most likely in the first round) if Buddy takes the money and runs? The same thing will happen with Collingwood if Dale Thomas heads off to Carlton. Coincidentally, Thomas was a priority pick taken by Collingwood which lost its last eight matches in 2005 to snaffle that pick. The Pies somehow managed to avoid the scrutiny of an AFL investigation into that effort. All of this begs the question of the purpose of the AFL rules relating to draft assistance which are designed to help teams in need to become more competitive. Melbourne is such a team and if the Commission refuses the Demons' request for help then the rule must be scrapped because the AFL would be giving into the greed and altruism of its own clubs as it did in years gone past and, on that basis, no other AFL club will ever qualify again.

There are those on here who rail against others for a perceived victim mentality. We are treated the same as everyone else they say. Toughen up. I beg to differ. It seems to me that the media and other clubs delight in bagging us at every opportunity. We are perceived as weak and incapable of fighting back. If I just recall some typical examples to illustrate my point. Matlhouse nabs Buttifant and goes after Thomas, media reaction, he is a smart operator. Wellman is taken from us during an existing contract, Essendon smart operators. Roos approaches assistants who are uncontracted, he is a $1.5m AFL planted vulture and is out of line. We ask for a PP after the worst 7 years in modern footy history, all hell breaks out, though they have been given freely before, for 2 and even 1 poor year, to teams that were in the finals shortly before. Excuse given by the other clubs and the media, you wasted earlier picks and you have Roos. Other teams get advantages in the salary cap, 3rd party deals or with fixturing, the media report that as necessary and for us, that's what you get for being no good. We have been pilloried over the tanking saga, investigated for 6 months and clearly been disrupted, even though found not guilty and then even had it used as an argument against us getting a PP. On the other hand, other teams that did the same, have been dobbed in by former players and officials yet have been protected and not investigated by the AFL and escaped any media criticism. Our only number 1 PP we ever got, is poached/stolen from us, half way through his contract, with a sneaky rule created by the AFL and funded by AFL money. Result, we are derided for losing him and picking a person who would leave, albeit for the highest amount of money ever given to a young player. This player never even told the truth to us and obviously failed to give value in the second year of his contract, because his head was elsewhere. We get arguably the best Coach available in Roos and are attacked for destroying the game, for paying him $1.5m, even though Worsfold and Malthouse are believed to be on only slightly less and Roos will pay for himself easily, with increased memberships and sponsorship. All through the last few years our brand has been trashed by the media because of our poor on field performances. we have been called disgraceful and yet when we try and do something about it, we again cop it unfairly from that same media. Need I go on, there are countless other examples. IMO we toughen up and get as dirty and ruthless as possible, without breaking AFL rules and TO HELL WITH EVERYONE ELSE. I want success, I don't want to be a nice guy.

I took the opposite away. Fremantle have been perenially weak since joining the competition; they've had more than their share of years of being a complete basketcase on the field, and even when they've had decent sides, they were still prone to being flakey under pressure. Who could forget when Bailey's very ordinary 2008 Melbourne team ran over the top of them after being 50 points behind at half time? Ross Lyon has taken them from LOLmantle to one of the toughest, most well drilled sides I've seen. With the exception of when they put the cue in the rack for the last 15 minutes of the game, they crushed the reigning premiers as if they were nothing. This shows what a difference having a first rate coach can make. They set the bar for defensive pressure very high, but I took heart from watching them play after casting my mind back to the Freo of old.

I understand your thirst for info but one of the best things about the club since Jackson came on board is that we no longer leak like a sieve

If the AFL punishes us a second time for whatever did or did not happen at the club in 2009 by awarding us anything less than a # 1 draft selection then it will have set a precedent and should not be permitted to reward a club that was a drug cheat in 2012. They should either play short or be allowed to take only players from state leagues and within the usual salary cap restraints. I note Essendon has joined the other clubs in opposing our request for assistance. They should not receive our support or that of anyone else and I would not expect it of others if we are found to be involved.

That's astute of you to notice this fact but every year we do a player review starting from # 1 and onwards. Hogan happens to be the player who was allocated the #1 guernsey and we recognise him as a Demon in 2013.

I will take pick 19 but gee is this equalisation? They have just come back from their intense study tour into equalisation to the USA and all I have heard from the fat cat Presidents who got the invite is that it should not include priority picks, draft assistance of any type or monetary help. So it is a very subtle and sophisticated formula for success that we are yet to hear of.i wonder what it includes? Maybe condolences that "we feel your pain but trust us things will get better, you have had injuries and you have some good recruits, stick with it and accept your position as a second tier side to be reamed each season as required. We will take the points, the percentage and any kids you have developed in the meantime.

For Demonland? Ah well it was fun while it lasted.

Sylvia won't leave.

Because the Melbourne recruiters used to watch it on the TV and not go to the game.

Roos, this is an absolute disgrace and I can only hope there will be many more.

Of course not. The best player of all time tag belongs to Jesse Hogan but I'm sure Swallow would gladly accept second best and GCS will take a fourth rounder and Tom Couch in exchange.

I just spat coffee on my screen. I really, really hope we pick Swallow up and I'm prepared to pay a good price, but he ain't gonna be the best player of all time.

LOL Nothing thread

Wow... Colless reckons; - talking to an undrafted kid in an effort to convince him to enter the general draft (not some kind of direct poaching) rather than being committed to a single club where he would be behind ten other similar types of players would ruin the legacy of - transforming a club and driving it to it's first premiership in it's present incarnation, establishing a resilient high-performance culture and graciously stepping aside for a carefully developed assistant in possibly the smoothest coaching succession in the history of the game A-grade hysteria from a habitual sook. Moving on...

Just read this article in the Herald Sun about Paul Roos upsetting Sydney because of trying to lure young swans academy players. Lloyd Perris etc. Personally I love this, this shows to me Roos is 100% committed to the Dees and will do anything needed to make us a formidable outfit again. I know ppl will say of course he is 100% committed but I personally thought he still had a soft spot for the swans and would steer clear of them for that reason. Also shows he isn't afraid of poaching swans players, staff etc. Thoughts?? Personally, Thumbs up Roosy ??? Sydney chairman Richard Colless slams Paul Roos for trying to lure emerging Swans prospects

The only problem is if it means he can no longer play matches. He's not much use to us then.

So no-one here heard Andrew Leoncelli interviewed by the Coodabeens yesterday? It was pretty interesting in an historic sense. He was asked about the rise from wooden spooners in '97 to prelim finalists in '98 and put it down to the hatred of losing which Neale D brought to the club. Tougher training, harder running (no pushbikes). For me he confirmed what I have long thought about Neil Balme's coaching. 'Cells had been at Carlton briefly and not broken into their side (he said they were not interested in developing young players at the time) and he was plucked from the amos by Melbourne a couple of years later. He said Melbourne in '96 and '97 was about blokes enjoying themselves but not winning many games. Training was slack and losing was easy. Remember that Balme inherited a tough as nails mob from John Northey for the '94 season and we ran downhill steadily after that, aided by David Schwarz' dodgy knees for a distraction. The Coodabeens pointedly did not ask 'Cells who was coaching Melbourne when he arrived to discover its slackness, but he was full of praise for Daniher and how he hardened up the joint. Let's hope a similar conversion is possible now.

If a heart string was an injury. Certainly one of the better skilled ruckman of recent years. Just couldn't do any of the physical stuff - marks, hitouts, hard ball gets.

The Toumpas is soft notion makes me chuckle. He isn't a Jack Viney but he isn't soft. I am more confident in Toumpas than I am in most other 'potential' players, especially if his hips are ok. A rest for his body and a full pre season should give him the base he needs.

My first up close sighting of him was on the Gold Coast in one of the Nab games. In the related thread I commented that there was a moment where he'd been put under pressure and had his weight on the back foot and had to quickly regain his position and prepare for contact. I thought the opposition player was favourite to get to the contest first. Toumpas not only regained his balance, he committed his body low to the contest, got there first and then spun away untouched. He won't become Archer but he doesn't lack ticker.

Saw Smiley get absolutely smashed three times in the last quarter of a Casey match earlier in the year, one was just in front of me, wore a bump that made me cringe. On each occasion I saw him get up, groggy, shake it off and run for the next contest. It's why I have faith that Toumpas will be a gun and why I know you're as knowledgable on all things football as Bluey is

Always thought Bennell would make it. Talent and pace, which we don't have a lot of. His weakness for me was a very low possession count most games. He just didn't get his hands on it often enough.

I don't think you have understood. Try this - If Pravda writes extensively and critically about the US invasion of Vietnam but fails to write about the Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia, we conclude Pravda is inconsistent in its criticisms. And no, I'm not saying CW is evil enough to work for Pravda, or that this is a perfect analogy. I'm just making the point that we know from other sources what things she hasn't written about. Others have written, but she ignores. That's against what we assess her inconsistency. Cannot for the life of me understand why you defend her all the time. Just because some others attack her all the time? But why go overboard? Why not at least say 'she is good, but her approach to reporting her own club is not good'?

I have been using Freo as a benchmark for us to aspire to for over a year now. I tipped them to be the big team this year. If Roos is the coach we expect him to be then I can see no reason why we should not be to their level within three years. Freo for most of their history have been comparable to the Balme, Daniher sides. Sure to let you down after showing promise and never serious premiership contenders. Lyon changed the culture and mindset. More than half their best 22 come from lower draft picks, trash draft and rookies. If Roos is just as capable a coach I don't really care if we miss out on the priority pick because we will not need it.

Don't know if anyone's mentioned it but Mitch Thorp is back in this years draft. Mitch was taken in the first round by Hawthorn as a 17 year old but a combination of poor attitude and the usual injuries to young players saw him leave after 3 years. He returned to South Launceston, a poor performing team in the Tasmanian state wide comp, learnt his lessons and 2 years later took over as playing coach. 2 years on and South were minor premiers after recruiting from the local leagues. Yesterday Mitch won the Tassie medal for best player in the state wide league and his team won the premiership over last years premiers Burnie, who had our own Robbo and ex bomber Jason Laycock playing. Mitch is 194 cm, 94 kg mid / high forward who can go all day, take a good mark, kick bags of goals and has obvious leadership qualities. He is only 24 and would worth talking to at least.

he is a utility. he should be developed as a goodes or goddard or hird

don't like his attitude don't like his haircut don't like the way he trains don't like his kicking action don't like his left side handball don't like his smart alec way of talking to press don't like him in the forward line don't like him in the backline hes not a midfielder why play him in the ruck hes just no good waste of a pick really other clubs laugh at our development players any threads started about this player please feel free to use my quotes,and save me posting next year almost forgot hes great I think hes there for 10 years move him up the field told you we didn't need clark/dawes how good was his 3 touches though do you think he will poll in the chas he could be our next captain do you think he should be our next captain feel free to use these quotes next year,on a weekly basis

If the Eagles have promoted him to the senior list he has clearly earned it. He was developing ok under Bailey but failed under Neeld's regime. He's not the only one. Has all the skills. Has application. He could easily make it when he matures. Steven Motlop at Geelong was taken in the same year three picks later and had the advantage of a wonderful culture, surrounded by exceptional players, 4 years developing in the VFL and very good coaches. He's really only made it this year. With the same benefits who knows where Bennell might be now and I suspect if Motlop has been at MFC he'd be nowhere and accused of the same things as Bennell is now. I think he will be a fine player but he needs to be 24 years old to succeed in AFL footy not 18. Neeld made so many mistakes. Petterd, Rivers and Moloney stand out but Bennell could be another.

I must say I'm disappointed for my first post (which I swore I'd never make) to be about Jamie Bennell of all things. But I will not be surprised if he becomes a regular contributor at the eagles. Has enough skill and pace, and with confidence his creativity and hardness was there to see. But like a few others he quickly was bereft of confidence due to the fact that he was rotated between forward, back and reserves. And also because he played for Melbourne... When you're a young player trying to develop your game what hope does that give you? Not too surprising (albeit disappointing) he could only touch the ball 5-10 times a game! I wish him well at the eagles, I personally wish he'd done enough to be around for the Roos era.

Give us a spell. The bloke hasn't played an official game yet.

Dikchead!! Let me guess, you would have won a Brownlow if only injuries didn't stop you. LOL!

Tipped this matchup after Round 23. And after seeing Geelong get manhandled live at Simonds, I knew it was a good tip. The Geelong supporters were offended that someone in the crowd would even applaud a good mark by the opposition (especially when sitting near the wags, VFL players et al). Freo will obliterate Hawthorn. I've always felt the hawks gamestyle is NQR for finals, because it still heavily involves pinpoint kicking to moving targets. Whilst this works amazingly well during the season, under finals pressure, especially GF pressure, this has a habit of coming undone at inopportune moments. Freo's intense pressure will strangle Hawthorn, they won't be able to implement most of what they have spent all season practicing and they will be lost. I can't wait.

I just keep hearing from certain people that we are going to offer the kitchen sink for Rory Sloane and that he wants to come home. Wait and see but remember this post. Roos will want a coupe.

Robbo is surely the major media goose. Not only are his comments generally banal but he also has the ability to butcher the language in a way that makes you think his native tongue must be some obscure dialect of Xhosa. EDIT typo

Not you per se. I just get sick of Melbourne supporters spending their lives crying like little babies about the unfairness of it all.

I can't for the life of me understand why anyone on here would cringe! All long suffering Melbourne supporters hope for a brighter future, and Jesse Hogan is an integral part of that hope. Smart marketing I reckon!

It amazes me that even though there are clubs like Melbourne, GWS and the Saints, who all need a player of his caliber but reject him coming to their club, that there are still some on here that don't get it. The associated baggage, poor influences, and potential disruption to the building of a ruthless "team first" attitude are not worth compromising. It's about long-term culture and discipline, not quick fix answers.

You guys drool all over him all year, get excited by him, talk about him, think he's something that gives up hope... then complain because his photo is on a letter. Wow. I hope you go and rip his number off the back of all the little kids jumpers next year and then tell them there's no Santa.

In the last words of Ned Kelly, forever ruined by Ben Cousins; "Such is life" No point looking back on this and getting angry. Reality is that we are the worst club and the easiest target. The only way this will change is through an improvement on the field... until then wear it but remember it