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People acting like Davey is useless etc makes me so bloody mad... I want to meet all of you keyboard heroes and unleash on you. Yeah he had lost a step, yeah his career is coming to an end... but show some respect for someone who has given us many great memories. I swear, I hate 90% of MFC supporters, disloyal pack of sooks.

Such a shame, was in great form, showing great leadership.... Oh I can't even continue with this sarcastic jab... Good, clean out every softy from this club.

Personally, I would focus on the team that won last night's game and be trying to pick up one or two of their "fringe" players who can't break into that midfield but might really blossom in a new environment. Players like Ellis and Savage who might be considered up for trades perhaps? We seem to have an excess of key position defenders, one of who might be offered up for what could become a win/win trade. As for Collingwood I thought they went OK last night and it was just that Hawthorn is so much better drilled. I really can't see anybody beating them for the flag even at this stage unless Buddy does his hammy again. The bloke was pretty much subdued by Tarrant in the first half and still finished with four goals. If only we could get him? Cloke is still a big chance to go elsewhere unless he wants to drop a substantial amount of coin. On the basis that his old man is closer in kind to Phil Scully than Mother Theresa, I still reckon he'll be at Pricefixer Park next year helping Juddy with all that good work saving the environment in their never ending search for truth, justice and the almighty dollar.

Thanks KC and WJ for all your reports and summaries.

I love how all these cases are positioned that players are walking out on the MFC when in fact its more they have been told some hard truths.

Did he retire? If he had still been at Melbourne the Age would have reported that he had been pushed against his will, or been delisted while he still had experience to offer a young club, or been controversially dumped.

Loved watching him play, however think it is time to move on.

First of all, thanks to KC for his sterling efforts covering Casey from some of those cold windswept venues throughout the year. Secondly, I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that there's a critical mass of AFL players required to field a successful VFL finals team. The number you need is IMO an absolute minimum of 10 which is the number available a few weeks ago when it was announced who was eligible for the finals. Today, Casey had six Demons with Sheahan and Gysberts the only ones getting in the best players. I thought Davis was just reasonable and the other three had below par days. Tom Couch has been terrific all season but was well covered today. Josh Tynan just went and Lucas Cook was disappointing. The four players missing - Jake Spencer, Jack Fitzpatrick, Michael Evans and Leigh Williams would probably made the difference had they been available. Casey also missed a few of their more experienced players in McGough, Lees and Fieldsend (although the latter appears to be on the outer). Of course, it didn't help that they lost Matthews and ruckman Hill to injury or that they badly turned the ball over kicking backwards a few times which was a disaster in a low scoring game. Still, it's been a good year for Casey because they didn't recruit any names and relied solely on the limited number of MFC players available and local talent coming up through the ranks. It's a job that's been really well done by Brett Lovett. I'm glad Mark Neeld set the record straight on Gysberts and Cook but I suspect that Cook might be gone. Gysberts plugged away and I wouldn't write him off yet but I won't be surprised if he features in the trades. The highlight of the year at Casey for mine has been Jai Sheahan. He was highly touted in some quarters before last year's draft and missed out. He was rookied in the middle of that draft in December and I've been impressed by him every time I've seen him a Casey. He had a bit of a slump in mid season but he's come good again and I think that along with Rory Taggert, he could be the find of our draft.

Had a cushy job at a successful club. Could have stayed there for a few more years. Could have chosen an easier option like Adelaide or St Kilda but no he came to the basket case that was/is the MFC and has staked his entire fledgling coaching career on turning around the Titanic. He's been prepared to put self-satisfied noses out of joint, sack ineffectual leaders, drop soft no. 1 draft picks and most importantly completely dismantle a useless game plan that would have seen us fold under the first sign of trouble in a final. And he's prepared to get flogged week-in week-out, enduring the inevitable calls for his sacking by supporters fearful of change, in order to get the job done. Hard as f..!k this bloke and I for one stand up and applaud him for having the cojones to put his own future in the game on the line in order to turn this joint into what for most of the past 47 years it has only ever been masquerading as ... and that's a football club. I'm backing him in come hell or high water.

I will qualify now that I have played over 300games of this game called football....One season at the 2nd highest level (VFA)....I have captain/coached my own side at seconds level when I was 37......I loved football....You could play...have a drink after with the family and opposition and even the umpires after the game. I still have friends that I played against and with all that time ago. I even trained at under 19 level at the dees But the game has changed(Not for the better) these days the players are like robots.....every minute of every day is micro managed.... From the day you are drafted...what you do and what you eat...how you spend every minute is scrutinzed and managed...If you have a drink it is reported in the front pages of the papers....I know that players get a pretty good wage(the ones who make it) but it seems to me that the fun has gone out of it...I have just retired from a fairly public career but have never been under the scruiny that these young lads have to put up with.. I used to love going to the footy,even non Melbourne games....seeing champs do their stuff ...seeing the bumps and hits and the high scoring....Now I have trouble even watching nthe Dees..let alone other matches.....It's like watching robots...they are all the same...saying the same things...living the same lives...If you are different you soon get told to shape up or ship out You cant bump now....you cant tackle if the other bloke is hurt.(Jack Trengove) there are 36 bloke in packs that just follow the ball around like an under 10 match.....and I blame the so called great coachs like Roos, Lyon and Wallace who stuffed up this once great game. I see in the far future that this game will be played by robots (Real Steel) where players will be behind a control panel wired up to a robot and the robots will be out on the field where no player can be hurt...As this game will be too dangerous for humans to play.... The only thing that will not change is the jurnos who will still report on games from the bar and give votes to who ever gets the most kicks..... Sorry to be so negative but after this year footy sucks.....

A tad of hypocrisy in this thread by some. I honestly hope Aaron with one year left on a contract is not pushed. If Aaron wants one more crack at AFL we should do everything in our power to make that happen, either with us or somewhere else. However, the choice should be with Aaron. If we want loyalty from our players we must show loyalty to our players especially to players with contracts.

Jason Mifsud been talking to Seven?

The swans are the template the MFC should study hard. Recruit players to do a job.

So much depression in one sentence.

For the first time in years I'm actually excited about the direction the club is taking. Cutting spuds and seeing the backs of average veterans makes me happy. I just hope they keep on chopping as some of the deadwood is starting to get covered in ivy. Guys like Cook, Gysberts, Morton, Moloney, Bate, Bennell, Davey are just not good enough to play key roles in our future team. Neeld has my support as a tough and uncompromising coach. Something this club has needed for a long long time. As a player you need to be willing to extract 100% from yourself for the benefit of your teammates first, your club second and yourself third. That is what makes great players, COMMITMENT. If you haven't got it Fark off

I hope we can delist or trade some of our negative posters to bigfooty Just dream how great this place would be if that actually happens.

He's not a spud. He's not a superstar, but he does play a role as we'd need. I'm glad we didn't get him back then, as I thought he was overvalued, but that doesn't mean he is valueless.. He is a player we could definitely use. Dawes & Clarke IMO would be a good Foil for one another, especially when a watts possibly returns as a 3rd tall, after another year down back.

Well, he may or may not be a Magpie for life, but his price will sure as hell have gone up considerably. ADDENDUM: The Visy plant has just gone into overtime making extra brown paper bags in anticipation of a hectic free agent / trade period.

You are bleating on about how Talia wanted to play here, and thus we should have taken that into account. Naitanui wanted to stay in Perth, but you don't seem to have cared about that one bit in all your whinging about that decision.

The funniest part is that Craig Cameron has stuffed up with Addam Maric, twice!

Sorry but it's been my experience that an MBA is the most over-hyped piece of self approving garbage devised by humankind. I have not yet met anyone equipped with said certificate who had an original idea or anything useful to contribute. Common as muck, too, like a ticket of entry to some level of management but otherwise useless like many of the individuals who boast them. As for the psych testing shock, as an attack on the MFC by C Wilson, it was laughable. Norm Smith would have done badly out of psych testing on all but competitiveness measures. Empathy - had none. Judgemental - damn right. Elitist and punitive - yes, sir. Plenty of attributes that would not 'test' well but stood him in great coaching stead.

Watched the Crows/Swans game and I am so envious of the Swans supporters. They get their money's worth from an amazing TEAM of players, whose structures rarely fail, whose players would rather die than let the opposition get any free ball, they play for each other and so bloody hard at the ball. Super impressed. Players like LRT and Shaw are average players but in the Swans line-up they become major factors in the starting 22. PLEASE Dees, sneak into their training, hold them down, stick needles in their veins and steal some of their blood for our boys. And while I am it - how good is Goodes. Should we be speaking of him in the same tones as Ablett senior, Carey, Matthews? He is an absolute freak. Skilled, quick, huge heart, reads the play better than anyone in the modern game and runs all day. They reckon some women have penis envy - I have Swans envy.

I tend to agree. Back in 2004/5/6, Davey was one of the reasons people went to Melbourne games. He made defensive pressure for small forwards a requirement. He made chasing and tackling mandatory (and frightening, for half backs). He showed that a forward pocket can and should do more. Yes, his career didn't hit the heights it could easily have, but in the years we were playing finals, and even since, he's been a loyal servant to the club. He's struggled of late, and for that reason it's neither surprising nor terribly disappointing that he's considering not playing for us next year, but I think it's rather sad and insulting for us to just turn on him and say things like 'get lost' and 'useless' or whatever words people are using. Congratulate Davey on serving the club for 8 years (or however long), and just be at peace with him leaving.

It's our ground! One day we'll own it again.

Gysberts isn't perfect, but he clearly has talent. I am more than happy to get rid of players who have been in the system for ages and failed, but Gysberts has plenty of time on his side and with glimpses of usable talent, it would be a lazy and soft option to get rid of him. Neeld has to back himself to make something of these sorts of kids, otherwise what sort of coach is he?

Id be very impressed if he pulled the pin.

You met their coach?! Lol...

Psychic, this Prendergast fellow.

I'm in W.A watching the wafl semi final and dayle garlett has kicked acouple goals and Looks like a real player. I hope he slips to pick 12!

Jack Watts should spend the summer watching Adam Goodes at work. He could be that good if he really wanted to get there.

Just mentioned on the VFL finals commentary that Gys and Cook have not been exited from the club. Interesting.

The '88 GF was like a nuclear attack. Danny Hughes in the ruck against that Hawthorn side. Kill me now. I had to work that day, but i watched the entire game. I got most wasted later that day. Got lucky to, a very sweet girl took pity on me and my scarf that night. Remember that far better than the game.

This is simple, draft Kennedy and you have both a very good crumbing small forward as well as a quick midfielder. Bringing him to the club is just about as important as getting Toumpas here.

I believe we just need to build a good TEAM. Not just hope star players will come on. If we can build a huge emphasis on team play we will win more than we lose. It's not always about talent sometimes it's just about working for your teammates.

Nope. Compared to last nights game, battlers. Mitch Clark attacks the contest with authority. There is a huge if subtle difference.

If Hawthorn win the flag this year they'll be doing it on the back of roughly 8 core players. Those players being Mitchell, Sewell, Franklin, Rioli, Lewis, Birchall, Hodge, and Roughead. And those same 8 were major players in winning their flag in 2008. About half their side has changed since their last flag, which shows how you can keep turning your list over, but you need a solid core that determine your fortunes in a particular era. In 2008 their top 6 statistically were: Hodge Franklin Mitchell Sewell Young Lewis In 2012 their top 6 statistically are: Mitchell Franklin Lewis Sewell Roughead Birchall The first 4 are the same four years later and the other 2 (Roughead and Birchall) formed part of their top 10 four years earlier. Clearly there are other good players now, .i.e. Whitecross, Suckling, Shiel, Smith, while four years ago there was Crawford, Bateman, Dew, etc. And Rioli is better now than four years earlier. But if you're able to establish a strong core of 8-10 players you can build a finals worthy team, as they'll make others around them better. It also shows that you need stars. Franklin, Rioli, Mitchell and Hodge form a nucleus that you could build any team around. If you can develop a few players at your club to become elite and surround them with a few other bona fide A graders you'll compete well at the highest level. Last night Hawthorn had Puopolo, Murphy, Stratton, Hale, Schoenmakers, Savage and a couple of other serviceable players, but no world-beaters. In my view they form a list of what becomes "interchangeable players". I'm comforted by this because I know that you don't have to get everything right, you just need to nail some of it. We need to establish a core of 8 -10 players that can elevate their game to A grade status and have a few of them become elite. And another comforting fact is that Hawthorn really only have two genuine A grade mids in Mitchell and Sewell, who were both sensational last night. They're both quality inside mids, which once again proves to me that they're the most important mids in the competition, which is why we'll take Viney. Lewis has spent more time forward this year and Hodge is a real old-fashioned utility. Outside run comes from Smith, Breust, Whitecross, Savage, Rioli and other rotations. Shiel has been doing more of a lock down role. I did a similar exercise for Geelong's premiership teams in 2007 and 2011. Of their top 6 players statistically in those two premiership years 5 of the 6 were the same. And 7 of the top 10 were the same. It's about getting a quality core and they too had a few that elevated themselves to star status. Obviously a player like Scarlett is down the stats sheet due to the role he plays, but the basic analysis is sound. So who are presently on our list that could be considered core if we're to one day become a serious side ? It should be players like Clark, Jones, Frawley, Grimes, Trengove, and imo Viney, but the challenge is to develop these players - and others - already on the list to become A graders. I reckon this draft period will be crucial to our chances of developing such a list. But it can be done. It's interesting studying the makeup of the lists of this year's finalists. They'll have a core group, but in the main the rest become interchangeable. They're good solid citizens, but not absolutely pivotal to their teams fortunes. They may be pivotal in isolated games, or even in a year, but they're not absolutely required for on-going success. This is the domain of the stars and genuine A graders. I'm looking forward to watching our list evolve over the next couple of years and believe that if a few things go our way can still build a formidable side.

I loved watching the game last night. Tough, creative and team oriented footy. Agree watching Melb has sucked this year, but to paraphrase the great and wise RR, "We'll be back".

Not sure what Gys is thinking if he wants to leave Melbourne. If he's not happy with the workload and changes to training at melbourne i'm not too sure where he is going to go? Melbourne is only embracing training and intensity which is required and being completed at almost every other AFL club. If he thinks he can just switch teams and play 22 games a season he is kidding himself. Maybe MN has put out the ultimatum for Gys... work harder or you won't get a game and maybe that's the reason why rumours have come up about Gys leaving? I'm not sure whether it's a good idea to just drop him after a few injury prone seasons. I think it'd be a good idea to give him another preseason, see if he can change his attitude like blease and hopefully become a key to our midfield in years to come.

Sellar is woeful in the ruck and a crappy mark but he seems to have a good attitude. I reckon Stef is our most talented Ruck and has 100 games up soon . We are just about to see Stef become a top tier ruck. I would trade Spencer ,Gawn or Sellars before Stef. He is a good mover and user of the ball at ground level. If he gets traded I'm going to open a vein .

Fitzpatrick will be threatening for that role next season but I know what you mean. The price would have to be right for me to be wanting to trade Stef.

I wouldn't at all be surprised if we still snagged Cloke, even after what Neeld said on Fox last week, that we had not made a play and were not interested.

Embarrassing thread..

Unwatchable? I'd give anything to see our club playing that high intensity stuff for even 5 minutes during the game. That's what finals football is all about.

Bailey cut but didn't demand excellence from those that remained. That's not exactly a new thing around this club though, so I can forgive him that. He assumed - like many of us did - that all that was needed was to give the talent games and a couple of years growth, and success would follow. We found out the hard way that that sort of plan did more damage than good, and now Neeld has inherited a list that needs that mind set shaken out of it. I don't know if Neeld's approach will work. Maybe things are too far gone and maybe we won't be able to get the talent we need to become a powerful team again, but it's got to be tried. We won't get anywhere until the whole list is prepared to do whatever it takes every time they run on the field, and I'll back him as long as I think that is the message he is trying to send.

Get him. We need drive coming out of the backline, which is now top heavy. He provides a bit of pace and decent kicking skills. He's out of favor at Carlton because the two back flank rebounding roles belong to Yarran and Gibbs, Both are more talented and are persisted with despite inconsistent form. He's been in and out of the team due to that team balance. I think he'd be a good fit on a half back flank for us. We need some smaller defenders as we have too many talls down there. With Grimes moving into the midfield and Bartram injured and a ? on his return at this point, We are relying on Nicholson and Strauss down there. To add a 100+ gamer who's a proven small/medium size defender with decent pace, skills and ball winning ability can only be a big plus. We need senior experienced players. He fits the bill of what we need. I say we chase him.

You mean a pick 21 that we couldn't "develop" was also a dud at Richmond ? A club that has developed Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt, etc ? Or maybe he was just another [censored] pick. Nah, too simple. Must be the development.

This is a horrendous argument - 'We finished 16th, now we're clearing the dead weight...Why ARGH, Let's keep the crap that got us to 16th!' Neeld was appointed September last year, there's only so much you can do to a list in one off season, when you really have little knowledge of the players. Now Neeld has a true opportunity to put his stamp on the list and shape it in his image - give him 2013. One example: Colin Sylvia's second half of the season. While some may bemoan the fact he isn't kicking 5 goals a game, Sylvia transformed his game and played to the plan - this will bring dividends. Some real quality defensive work coming from no. 12, look for him to have a big year in 2013 after a lesson in what it takes to be an impact HFF in 2012

Well to be fair, attacking people with machetes isn't exactly the type of culture I'd like at a football club...